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The "Not Quite Amiga but still computer related category" => Alternative Operating Systems => Topic started by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 08:20:00 AM

Title: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 08:20:00 AM
Hello all friends,

As I mentioned in one of my few posts I was waiting for my Pegasos to arrive, yesterday was the day for me the waiting was over! :-D

My configuration:
- Pegasos G3 600 MHZ (G4 1GHz on the way :-D)
- 40 GB 7200 rpm
- ATI Radeon 9000 64 MB
- Speakers with mini-subwoofer
- CD-Rewriter
- ICute tower (6 fans in it, no sound at all!! :-))
- Cordless keyboard and mouse (Cherry)

With these I also got the following:
- Paper explaining all connectors of the board
- Paper starting and installing MorphOS
- Paper with welcome message
- A t-shirt (now, don't go mad! I'm also waiting for everything I should get for my €50,- coupon)

Installation:
Installation was a piece of cake.
My dealer had already installed the drive.
So I only had to connect all wires.
Starting up is fast, from the moment you push the ON-button of the computer untill you can play with your mouse is only 23 seconds!!! :-D
All connections worked at once (great thanks to my dealer for that :-))

Later I installed a previously bought DVD-ROM in the case and started the machine and guess what: the drive was recognised and worked immediately in Ambient!!

Software:
There are 5 games with MorphOS to play with. Just check screenshots of MorphOS somewhere on the net.
I installed DirOpus 4.16 and it works. I'm doing all the stuff I want to do with it. It sees the drives and all.
As everybody knows, MorphOS isn't finished yet, so it is trial and error installing applications:
- DirOpus worked from first time
- Genesis (from OS3.9 cd) installs but won't start for now
- Miami3.2B works
- MakeCD works
- more to come after I've tried it... :-)

My general feeling is that MUI-oriented applications work "better" than other kind of applications.
I have to play more with it.
There is good support through mailinglists and FTP-server of MorphOS.

I partitioned my harddrive and could choose from various filesystems, incluiding SFS and PFS. I only checked SFS though.

If anybody wants to hear more...... :-)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on February 12, 2003, 08:36:25 AM
blah
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: DaveP on February 12, 2003, 08:43:34 AM
Sounds good.....

Quote

My general feeling is that MUI-oriented applications work "better" than other kind of applications.


What because they are MUI based or that MUI on MorphOS
is a lot more stable than the other gadget toolkits also
available on MorphOS?

Thanks for this, I think next months disposable income
goes on a Pegasos :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Quixote on February 12, 2003, 08:47:00 AM
Spidey suprised us::
Quote
As I mentioned in one of my few posts I was waiting for my Pegasos to arrive, yesterday was the day for me the waiting was over! :-D
;-) Glad to see that you're happy.  Hopefully, the AmigaOne and AmigaOS4.0 aren't far behind...

:-D And yes, do let us know how well other programs work; we're all curious.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: ikir on February 12, 2003, 09:09:32 AM
Interesting. Pegasos rocks. Hope OS4 + AmigaOne are good too.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: KennyR on February 12, 2003, 09:26:43 AM
For balance, let me mention some negative points of MOS at its current (unfinished) phase:

- No TCP/IP stack included. Getting software onto your Pegasos is a nightmare, unless you have an Amiga with a CD burner available. Also, using MiamiDX is problematic.

- Theres no support for the floppy drive at all.

- No 3D drivers yet. You can play those 3D games - but only in software mode.

- Ambient (WB replacement) is "years behind workbench".

- MOS is still not 100% stable. Stable enough for limited use (IRC, etc), but not nearly as stable as 68k AmigaOS.

If you think this is FUD, it's not. Consider it a little pressure on the MOS coders to get things right, for some friends. I'm sure they'll get it right soon, but they haven't yet.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Mr_Capehill on February 12, 2003, 09:56:46 AM
Would you please post some screenshots of MorphOS. I haven't seen any recently.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 10:09:26 AM
Hello KennyR,

Thank you for pointing out the negative side! :-)
I wanted to say something more about internet, but my first mail was long already so I was going to mention it later this day.

As you said, there isn't a TCP/IP stack yet, so you must do it yourself for now.
I tried Genesis and it will not run, because it can't find/open the resource.library. I put this lib everywhere, but still the same error-message.

Miami installed perfectely, but for now it doesn't recognises my built-in ethernetcard and the whole system freezes trying to negotiate with it.

About the 3D: I only looked  (and played) for a second QuakeII, it ran well, but I don't find this interesting. I've got my PS2 for games :-D
So I can't say much in this department :-)
I played a little bit Birdie Shoot, fun, and saw the intro of Software Tycoon. Sound works too.

Ambient is developing, and yes, it doesn't got all the functionalities of workbench.
Like I can't backdrop (Amiga) icons. The icon format is PNG, probably that's the problem. I didn't see the possibility to list in names rather than icons. CLI works. Also the usual commands like Avail, Info, Protect....
(very nice to see with Avail a Chip memory of 450 MB :-D)
But yesterday evening I saw there was a new boot iso with updates (dated 09 feb 2003) and I installed that (just a simple copying on the hd :-)) and presto! I have a lot more possibilites when I rightclick on an icon. So they seem busy enough updating the OS for me at this moment.

So far the system only malfunctioned (the picture of OS3.9 stayed on the screen and a few parse errors of NG) trying to install Genesis from OS3.9 with InstallerNG, after I replaced it with the installer of OS3.9 everything went alright.
The real freezing up I encountered until now only with Miami3.2B.
But ofcourse, I didn't try much so far :-D

I'll let you all know when I've tried more stuff, like Toolsdaemon and YAM.

Spidey

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 10:27:09 AM
Hello DaveP,

Quote
What because they are MUI based or that MUI on MorphOS is a lot more stable than the other gadget toolkits also available on MorphOS?


I really don't know. While trying to run Genesis I had SnoopDos(?) running and Genesis tried to get the gadgets and images from everywhere on the hd. With workbench it is in Classes/Gadgets and Classes/Images.

Miami worked rightaway, but unfortunately the negotion-error stands in my way with internet-connection :-(

I guess Genesis has something to do with Reaction of OS3.9??? I heard that there is a MUI-version too of Genesis? I'll know enough if that version works on my new system (for the MUI-theory :-)).

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Dagon on February 12, 2003, 10:29:55 AM
Keep us informed! We want input! :P give us, give us :-D

Quote
Starting up is fast, from the moment you push the ON-button of the computer untill you can play with your mouse is only 23 seconds!!!


I heard that wanted only 5 seconds but I think that this was after a reboot. How much time it takes to play with your mouse after a reset?

Do the icons have a second state when they are clicked?
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 10:32:13 AM
I am sorry Mr_Capehill,

But in the welcome message is written that the makers want to publish pictures of the Ambient screen.

But I can say to you that the few screens you can see on www.morphos.de (rightside for links) are exactly what I have on my computer, oh, direct link to one of them:

http://apollo.rsn.bth.se/~osnews/img/2337/morphos1.jpg

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Ami603 on February 12, 2003, 10:32:33 AM
Here!
At last,we have some Unbiased reviews of this product,hope this helps people to do the same,whatever product is reviewed.

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: JoannaK on February 12, 2003, 10:33:12 AM
@KennyR
Well.. it's still at works, and IMHO not fully suitable to be given to 'non adwanced users'.  But OS comes in price of system and updates are free, so it's a good start. :-P

One thing you and others here might not know is that  latest MOS version is from  sunday (9th Feb 2003).  And based  what I have heard from Non-developer MOS users, it's a lot better on that usability/stability compared to that older Pre-Xmas release.

There are actually many 3D drivers in package, but all are for those older cards (like woodoos), Radeon 3D drivers are not yet there.  Otoh, Q2 works faster on Pegasos using software render than on old wos-PPC Amigas with HW support.   :-D

I have heard same about networking... A bit sad but considering how long MIami has been abandonware it's a bit difficult to make them work together 100%.

IMHO Amiga Workbench was never any 'high usability tool'... Well, ofcourse if one add tens of hack to it it'll become much more usable, but compared to Plain WB I don't think Ambien has much to lose. And One thing Ambient definitely has better, it looks can be configured widely in system-friendly way.  
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 10:37:04 AM
Hello Dagon,

The main part of these 23 seconds are the initialising part of the hardware itself. The actual loading of the software (MorphOS) is just a few seconds. I'll clock it this evening for you :-)

Resetting is pretty long too, I clocked 25.53 seconds until I could play again with the mouse.

The second state for icons right now is a transparant different color. I guess you can change this with MUI preferences? (I'm not a expert with  MUI)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: KennyR on February 12, 2003, 10:37:07 AM
Quote
Thank you for pointing out the negative side!


You're welcome. ;-)

Quote
I tried Genesis and it will not run, because it can't find/open the resource.library. I put this lib everywhere, but still the same error-message.


OS3.9 on MOS needs some special setup to work (so I hear). resource.library is just a kind of "security feature" to stop anyone using OS3.9 system tools on lower OS versions. After the fix all OS3.9 software and ReAction will work with MOS. Go to #morphos on irc.vapor.net (or irc.vapor.com?) and they'll be pleased to help.

Quote
The icon format is PNG, probably that's the problem.  


This I didn't know! Urgh! Wrong tool for the wrong job IMHO.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: KennyR on February 12, 2003, 10:45:25 AM
Quote
One thing you and others here might not know is that latest MOS version is from sunday (9th Feb 2003)


I did know. I have spies everywhere. I even know about non-official releases. :-D

Quote
Otoh, Q2 works faster on Pegasos using software render than on old wos-PPC Amigas with HW support.


Yes, I know that too. I played a friend on Q2 with me on an Amiga and me on a Pegasos. He kicked my ass even when I was the server - my 18 FPS just made me fragbait. ;-) Not only that, but each level on Q2 took him mere moments to load from the pak, and me up to 40 seconds from unpacked files.

There's no doubting the Pegasos's power, that's for sure. But I'm sure everyone's dying to see what Q2 and H2 look like on a Radeon. :-)

Ambient...yes, reinventing the wheel. If Genesi have all the money to spend they say they have, why not cut a deal with GPSoft for the Dopus5.8 source? Its WB-emulation mode would cut years off of Ambient's development.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on February 12, 2003, 11:02:01 AM
>Ambient...yes, reinventing the wheel. If Genesi have all the money to spend they say they have, why not cut a deal with GPSoft for the Dopus5.8 source? Its WB-emulation mode would cut years off of Ambient's development.

I always wondered why there is no Cooperation with the Scalos Team.
I like Dopus but others dont. Scalos is a lot closer to Workbench
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on February 12, 2003, 11:02:50 AM
Quote
Otoh, Q2 works faster on Pegasos using software render than on old wos-PPC Amigas with HW support.


It might be faster, but I looks VERY bad in software mode.


Vidar
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Bodie on February 12, 2003, 11:05:24 AM
EEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWWWWW

Software mode is a horror...

The horror

The horror.... :shocked:
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Coder on February 12, 2003, 11:06:41 AM
Hi,

Looks your really happy with it. :-)

If the resources are there we will have a Pegasos too so that we can develop some software for it. Personally I am interested in a handheld device that will run MOS. :-)

Coder
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: KennyR on February 12, 2003, 11:12:33 AM
Quote
I always wondered why there is no Cooperation with the Scalos Team.
I like Dopus but others dont. Scalos is a lot closer to Workbench


Good point. Scalos uses MUI so it would be more suitable for MOS than DOpus, which would have to be rewritten not to use its custom BOOPSI stuff. It would also be a hell of a lot cheaper. :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: JoannaK on February 12, 2003, 11:29:32 AM
Quote
KennyR wrote:
Quote
One thing you and others here might not know is that latest MOS version is from sunday (9th Feb 2003)


I did know. I have spies everywhere. I even know about non-official releases. :-D


Ah.. Well, I'm quite sure many here did not know.

Quote
There's no doubting the Pegasos's power, that's for sure. But I'm sure everyone's dying to see what Q2 and H2 look like on a Radeon. :-)


Agree.. would be really nice to see those brand new gfx hardwares in real action.  Ambient is looking good and feels snappy, but real power of these graphics cards is on 3D side.

Quote
Ambient...yes, reinventing the wheel. If Genesi have all the money to spend they say they have, why not cut a deal with GPSoft for the Dopus5.8 source? Its WB-emulation mode would cut years off of Ambient's development.


Well..  What I seem to remember that Dopus was supposed to be part of OS4 system. Dunno what finally happened to that deal. But, not my headache, I don't work there  :-P
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 12:03:04 PM
Hoi Coder,

Yes, I'm happy to have at last something new as replacement for my dear A1200. I bought this in 1993 (the birth of my son bytheway :-)) and over the years I only bought a Blizzard40/40 with SCSI2 for speed and ofcourse a fix for connecting pc-monitors.
(and no, I still don't have any pc's at home)

And now I have something with great graphical possibilities, and most important, speed!
(oh, sound's nice too)

I just heard that MiamiDX works fine, so I'll try that later when I'm at home :-)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: zacman on February 12, 2003, 12:27:35 PM
>For balance, let me mention some negative points
>of MOS at its current (unfinished) phase

Funny, now even people that don't have Pegasos nor
the current MorphOS version write reviews...
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on February 12, 2003, 12:27:38 PM
Hey, you don`t have a Voodoo3 to test the 3D stuff ? i guess this will work fine.

I mean this is wath i will use with my Pegasos until the 3D for new cards is ready.

BTW how much time you wait for you Pegasos :), and where you buy your board ?

thanks for your informations.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: zacman on February 12, 2003, 12:30:38 PM
>If Genesi have all the money to spend they say they
>have, why not cut a deal with GPSoft for the
>Dopus5.8 source?

Wouldn't help because DOpus has some major
restrictions such as no fully multithreading through the desktop (example within listers). Ambient has.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: mahen on February 12, 2003, 12:56:30 PM
Here, MorphOS itself just takes 5 seconds. It includes also the launch of miamiDX, Toolmanager, audio mixer, mynotes. + a big user startup, backdrop.

However, before MOS begins to load it takes some time, but I guess it's due to some debug output. (and depends on your memory)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: mahen on February 12, 2003, 12:59:10 PM
Yep, I think 3D drivers are ready for voodoo, sis... But not for radeon yet.

The TCP IP stack and the other contributions will all be given as soon as they're ready (doesn't depend on the mos team but on the contributors)

BTW, there was an update a few days ago, make sure you use this one !

Here not a single crash since the update :)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 01:22:09 PM
Hello DDJPPC ,

I've got a ATI Radeaon 9000 64 MB and to be honest, I don't know how to check 3D stuff with and without 3D acceleration.
I just clicked QuakeII, played it a bit and stopped.
Oh, I played it on a 1024x768 screen and it looked nice.

The time I waited for my board?
Hard question, until beginning of this year I was going for AmigaOne G4 800 MHz, but after hearing of again a delay, I ordered a Pegasos. So I guess I waited a month for it.

I bought it in the Netherlands :-)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 01:27:20 PM
Hello mahen,

In the list of drivers updated was also ATI Radeon (till the 9000). ;-)

I installed the update but now saving the preferences crashes randomly!
I mentioned this in the mailinglist.

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: itix on February 12, 2003, 02:30:40 PM
Quote

My general feeling is that MUI-oriented applications work "better" than other kind of applications.


No wonder. MUI package itself offers better future compatibility than GadTools and MUI applications tend to behave better than non-MUI apps...
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: itix on February 12, 2003, 02:43:09 PM
Quote

- No TCP/IP stack included. Getting software onto your Pegasos is a nightmare, unless you have an Amiga with a CD burner available. Also, using MiamiDX is problematic.


Well, MiamiDX works. I have tried it on my A1200 and on Pegasos and no problems so far. Miami 3.x is very problematic if you are using GadTools interface... It makes GUI extremely unstable.

Quote

- Theres no support for the floppy drive at all.


It can't read Amiga floppies anyway... But could be useful sometimes, true.

Quote

- No 3D drivers yet. You can play those 3D games - but only in software mode.


Yup.

Quote

- Ambient (WB replacement) is "years behind workbench".


I don't agree... WB itself is years behind everything. At least Ambient implements "sort by name" AFAIR.

Quote

- MOS is still not 100% stable. Stable enough for limited use (IRC, etc), but not nearly as stable as 68k AmigaOS.


It depends. On BPPC/CSPPC you get far less problems than on Pegasos because you have all that old HW there. Many programs are triggering non-existant hardware registers causing troubles and slowdowns. Illegal tricks wont work any longer! It could be good judge compare OS4 vs. MOS rather than MOS vs. OS3 (or OS4 vs. OS3).

Quote

If you think this is FUD, it's not. Consider it a little pressure on the MOS coders to get things right, for some friends. I'm sure they'll get it right soon, but they haven't yet.


:)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: kolla on February 12, 2003, 03:19:02 PM
Quote
I don't agree... WB itself is years behind everything. At least Ambient implements "sort by name" AFAIR.


Are you suggesting that WB doesnt?

If so.. that is not true, WB (OS3.9) has sort by name, size, date and type.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: kolla on February 12, 2003, 03:24:02 PM
Quote
Wouldn't help because DOpus has some major
restrictions such as no multithreading through the
full desktop. Ambient has.


Nonsense.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Senex on February 12, 2003, 04:22:48 PM
Quote
Like I can't backdrop (Amiga) icons.


Although of course at least you can create a .backdrop-file with a text-editor yourself for that purpose.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: KennyR on February 12, 2003, 06:02:53 PM
Stop smiling at me and buy a damn pegasos so you can come back to #AmigaZeux, iti! ;-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: SlimJim on February 12, 2003, 07:08:16 PM
Nice to see some user's reviews of this thing. Good to see
people like the Pegasos and that MOS is in a reasonably
usable shape.
 
And above all,
This began as a pure MOS/Pegasos thread and was allowed
to stay that way
. An unusually mature touch (as opposed
to almost every AOS4/AOne thread I've seen lately).
.
SlimJim
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 07:37:30 PM
Hello Senex,

Unfortunately the system of backdrops on Ambient is a bit different than on workbench.

You're absolutely right that on workbench you can edit a file in which you note the path of the file.

I saw on Ambient a directory as ".backdrop" and in it you see all these PNG images! This is totally different than workbench.

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Senex on February 12, 2003, 07:59:02 PM
Hello Spidey!

Hm, then this has to be a new feature of the very latest BT2-release
(haven't integrated its newer parts in my BT1-setup yet). At least
here creating such a directory and adding something to it doesn't have
any effect - while of course the traditional way using a .backdrop
file still works and is used by me for a long time already.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Jupp3 on February 12, 2003, 09:31:47 PM
Well, thought, I could share some of my MorphOS experiences here aswell :-)

Note - I don't have newest version, in fact, my version isn't much newer than that public ancient 0.4...

And of course, I'm running that on my A1200 (for now)

But for hardware, as I was expecting, most "standard" hardware seems to work okay, like X-Surf Ethernet card, CD-drive etc. but bit of surprise, my Squirrel seems to work great aswell (I considered it always a bit "hacky" but don't need better one for just scanner...)
A2232 didn't work, but I don't use it that much anyway...
Oh, Midi playback thru Midi interface plugged into serial port works aswell...

And for software...
If it's "system friendly" it should work, so most likely any WHDload installed ECS game will refuse to work.
And about my own tests, some Amos programs of mine didn't work, some worked perfectly.
And those, that did, ran about as fast than on 060 (emulated on 175MHz PPC without JIT, yes, I was surprised too)

I guess, that "notworking" was coused by the way I was drawing gfx (using standard Amos commands, like Screen Open etc.), in short, using Amiga GFX chips directly.
(Hey - I'm not saying, that they should work - those commands shouldn't be used any way, just tried)

But using intuition screens seems to work well enough (with Amos)

Yep, I've done (lately) stuff with C aswell, progressing rather nicely with my newest project...

But trying Amos code seemed more like "test" as many consider that "really hacky" :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: sexton on February 12, 2003, 09:40:18 PM
Post screenshots of your systems please!  :-o
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Frodon on February 12, 2003, 09:52:53 PM
Hello,

Quote

Spidey wrote:
Hello Senex,

Unfortunately the system of backdrops on Ambient is a bit different than on workbench.

You're absolutely right that on workbench you can edit a file in which you note the path of the file.

I saw on Ambient a directory as ".backdrop" and in it you see all these PNG images! This is totally different than workbench.

Spidey


I use the latest update. And I can tell you that if you create a FILE .backdrop in the root of the partition(s) you want to have some of their apps on the desktop, it works.

Example of some entries of my DH2:.backdrop  file:

:Utilitaires/Internet/IBrowse/IBrowse
:Utilitaires/Internet/MiamiDX/MiamiDX

First line allow me to have IBrowse located in DH2:Utilitaires/Internet/IBrowse/ on my desktop.
Second line is he same but for MiamiDX.

Regards
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 12, 2003, 10:13:31 PM
Hello Frodon,

Thanks for this info.

I only saw this dir (.backdrop) when backdropping my DirOpus didn't work on Ambient.
I didn't had the time to dig deeper and today, unfortunately, I only have time to reply :-)

I'll get into it tomorrow!



@Senex:

Sorry for the misinformation :-(
I only saw that and assumed this was the only way to backdrop in Ambient.


@Sexton:

As mentioned before you can see pictures on www.morphos.de :-)



@Everyone:

Thanks for all replies friends!
Tomorrow I'll try more programs to run, but for now I'm off to bed :-D

Spidey

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: uncharted on February 12, 2003, 10:58:45 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:

@Sexton:

As mentioned before you can see pictures on www.morphos.de :-)


Just out of interest have any MOS users got ambient set up with a more amiga-like look (xen or something) and glowicons (I heard the icon sets are exchangeable)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 13, 2003, 12:32:10 PM
Hello uncharted,

I'll try to do that this evening :-D

I showed the computer to a friend of mine, who knows only about pc's and Windows.
He was impressed by the startup of the system.
I clocked it again, but it takes 25 seconds in total.
Resetting the computer takes the same amount of time. I forgot to clock only the loading of the software.
I'll do that this evening.
Further on I showed him the games and just simple clicking on the desktop was impressing enough for him to think about buying such a system! :-D

To be honest I told him to other wait until this platform has a real future in software (both OS4 and MorphOS) or to buy a pc now.
It is true you get a whole lot of programs already installed with Windows and for now it's more "user-friendly" for beginners.

I managed to find and download MiamiDX. So this evening I'll try that too.
It will a busy evening for me :-D :-D

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: B00tDisk on February 13, 2003, 01:02:53 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:
I am sorry Mr_Capehill,

But in the welcome message is written that the makers want to publish pictures of the Ambient screen.


Or else what?  Bill Buck will post a public message about how he's going to sue you for doing it?
 :-P  :roll:
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 13, 2003, 01:39:56 PM
Hello B00tDisk ,

Quote
Or else what? Bill Buck will post a public message about how he's going to sue you for doing it?


I don't think Bill Buck will do all these tiresome actions of starting a webbrowser, going to Amiga.org, logging in and then writing his message, and ofcourse previewing it, correcting it and at last submitting it.
And for what?
Just because some guy posted a picture of the same Ambient screen as is to be seen on his site?
:-D :-D

Seriously, if I had bought a AmigaOne with a beta OS4 on it and in the welcoming message was the same question, I would do it just the same as I'm doing now.

But it is funny to see that when I tell that the screen I see is exactly the same as the screenshots on morphos.de, people still wants screenshots.

Ofcourse I know why. That is why I started this thread. To simply tell you all what comes with this package.
I've read all replies and it is clear to me that some people are already very advanced with trying out (installed Toolmanager, have large user-startups and all). It's unfortunate that they didn't say that in some threads (or I've missed them :-)).

But for now for the interested I'll report my experience with this system, so stay tuned...:-D

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: itix on February 13, 2003, 02:57:12 PM
Quote

kolla wrote:
Quote
I don't agree... WB itself is years behind everything. At least Ambient implements "sort by name" AFAIR.


Are you suggesting that WB doesnt?

If so.. that is not true, WB (OS3.9) has sort by name, size, date and type.


OOPS. I meant cleanup option in WB. Sry ;)


Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: DaveP on February 13, 2003, 03:53:38 PM
@Everyone With MorphOS

Just how themable is MorphOS' Ambient? I was
never happy with the performance penalty of the
window theme patches on Workbench and I have
got used to the WM approach offered with X11 to
have the freedom to select my own WM ( firstly ) and
to use or create multiple themes.

My favourite theme is based on a patch I had for
WB1.3 ( long since forgotton what it was called ) which changed the borders and icons for "new look" and it was quite smart ( smarter than OS2+
for example! ). I now use it with IceWM.

Whats the story on this approach?
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Triumph on February 13, 2003, 04:29:52 PM
Nice to see there are users in Friesland.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: B00tDisk on February 13, 2003, 09:59:38 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:
Hello B00tDisk ,

Quote
Or else what? Bill Buck will post a public message about how he's going to sue you for doing it?


I don't think Bill Buck will do all these tiresome actions of starting a webbrowser, going to Amiga.org, logging in and then writing his message, and ofcourse previewing it, correcting it and at last submitting it.
And for what?
Just because some guy posted a picture of the same Ambient screen as is to be seen on his site?
:-D :-D

Seriously, if I had bought a AmigaOne with a beta OS4 on it and in the welcoming message was the same question, I would do it just the same as I'm doing now.

But it is funny to see that when I tell that the screen I see is exactly the same as the screenshots on morphos.de, people still wants screenshots.

Spidey


Your original statement:

Quote

But in the welcome message is written that the makers want to publish pictures of the Ambient screen.


Is what prompted my question.  I think it's ####ing ridiculous that you can't publish screenshots.  My dig was at the idea that if Buck can't (and let's face it folks, the way he (and Ainc) air out their dirty laundry in public is indicitave that they can't) behave in a professional manner then he'd probably publicly announce his intent to sue you for publishing screenshots of ****YOUR**** OS that's on the computer that ***YOU*** own.

That's all.

My ramblings aside, glad you got a good working stable system.  I'm even more glad you got a board layout sheet.  That's more than Eyetech shipped out with it's boards.  How fuggin' stupid.  "Someone on the mailing list can maybe tell you what the jumpers are..." :roll:
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: uncharted on February 13, 2003, 10:22:06 PM
Quote

B00tDisk wrote:

My ramblings aside, glad you got a good working stable system.  


Yeah, me too, nice to see that many people are enjoying thier new systems. :-D
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: B00tDisk on February 13, 2003, 10:34:54 PM
Quote

uncharted wrote:
Quote

B00tDisk wrote:

My ramblings aside, glad you got a good working stable system.  


Yeah, me too, nice to see that many people are enjoying thier new systems. :-D


No kiddin'.  If I had infinite money reservse I'd buy both just for ####s and giggles!

Well, wait.  I'd buy the A1 if OS4 ever came out.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 14, 2003, 10:41:08 AM
Hello B00tDisk and uncharted,

Quote
....nice to see that many people are enjoying thier new systems


To be honest friends, I'm already happy to have a new computer that has the same workbench-feeling as my beloved A1200! I just mean with this that I have a new computer which isn't a Apple or a pc with Windows or Linux running on it. No it's a computer which resembles more like my A1200, so I can do stuff with it  which I'm already familiar with. :-)

Allright,

Yesterday evening was a major panically disastrous evening for me!! :-x  :-x

To get internet working I have to switch to my A1200 and the Pegasos (long story about lack of multiple monitors and all :-)). In this process my A1200 just died on me :-( :-(
Fortunately I bought a A1200 motherboard last year when the messages told us all about the PCI bridge between the AOne and the A1200 (as you know I was going for a AOne until a while ago). So I had a spare motherboard and a major part of the evening I was busy with my A1200.

I clocked the startup of MorphOS though:

00:02:05 seconds! Incluiding a startup picture that takes also a second. :-D

As told before I upgraded with the boot image of 09 feb 2003, but I simply copied it on top of MorphOS.
Yesterday I saw the original User-Startup was also replaced with an empty one!
In the original User-Startup is the startup of the Amiga emulation and this startup was gone too.
BUT, my DirOpus is working correctly even without it?!!? How is this possible! :-)

There is one nice feature with the right mouseclick:
If you click it on an icon, you'll get options concerning that icon. Do it in a window and you'll get more options in that optionmenu for the window.
And If you right click it once (quick), the menu stays on screen, when you right click it and hold it, you can navigate through that menu and when you release the right click, the menu disappears too :-)
(ok, two nice features :-D)

(Until now I only was used to Magicmenu showing you the menu of the program or workbench you were in)

I didn't have the chance to install MiamiDX correctly on the Pegasos (see above for the reason). This weekend I'm gone, I heard I've got family and friends beside my computer :-D
So my experiment is delayed for now.


Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: itix on February 14, 2003, 03:36:32 PM
Here are screen shots for you:

http://www.isoveli.org/~ilkleht/WB.png
http://www.isoveli.org/~ilkleht/WB2.png

Those are screen shots from my MorphOS setup when my Amiga was still working. NewIcons were not working on desktop (I had no Ambient installed) but Intuition replacement was quite neat... *sniff*

--

Ok, got email about those screen shots... So I had to remove those. Sorry folks. Maybe next year! :)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: redfox on February 14, 2003, 03:52:14 PM
@Spidey

Thanks for your impressions of Pegasos and MophOS.

@others who commented

Thanks, this has been an interesting discussion.

------------------
redfox
 
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: lempkee on February 14, 2003, 04:50:37 PM
kinda weird this , but very honest post ...
stateing hyperion games and how much he wants (or they) to run em on the pegasos, if it had been a troll or zealot then it wouldnt have been mentioned.

i appriciate honests posts like this, keep the good work up! , also tell me more about the games u got with the pegasos and how they run, need to know more :)

names and how they act, if they crash etc (i know many of em crash allready but it would be nice if u posted it so we know if its ok or not.... )

thanx alot
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Targhan on February 14, 2003, 06:09:04 PM
@Spidey
You perked my intrest with the TCP/IP issues...  So, I checked with some of the old-time internet gurus.

I have been a long time user of NetConnect on my various Amigas, and even on OS3.5/3.9--I prefer the MUI version of Genesis.  So, I posed the question, "Is the Genesis issue with MOS tcp/ip related or ReAction related?"

Apparantly, the MOS guys I asked seemed to feel that the problem with Genesis was ReAction related. Dig around for the MUI version, and give it a try.

Okay, now to go annoy another thread...
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Loki1 on February 14, 2003, 06:18:16 PM
Quote
00:02:05 seconds! Incluiding a startup picture that takes also a second.


Just as a frame of reference I just timed my Work PC Boot process:

From power on:  00:00:42 (42 seconds) to a fully loaded WindowsXP Pro desktop ready to run applications (all disk activity finished).

My old Win2K computer took > 2 minutes

My Work System:
P4-2 GHz
GForce 4 Ti 4200 128Mg
512 Meg ram
Old 20 gig UXTA-33 hard drive
Old 10 gig UXTA-33 hard drive
JustLink 40x/12x/48x CDRW
Creative 58X CDRom
Dual 17" Micron Monitors


Loki :-D
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 18, 2003, 12:19:31 PM
Hello lempkee ,

Quote
kinda weird this , but very honest post ...

It's true I'm a bit weird and crazy as my friends say this too to me :-D :-D

Quote
...also tell me more about the games u got with the pegasos and how they run, need to know more :)

names and how they act, if they crash etc (i know many of em crash allready but it would be nice if u posted it so we know if its ok or not.... )


With this computer I got 5 games:

1. HereticII demo
This I tried yesterday with a 1024x768 screen.
It was a bit slow but everything worked fine.

2. Quake I
This one goes too quick on a 1024x768 screen and on a 1280x1024 screen the speed is about the same as with the HereticII demo.

3. Quake II
This is a bit slower than Quake I.

4. Software Tycoon
I only saw the intro screen and didn't do more with it.

5. Birdie Shoot
This takes more time to load. It works nicely with the mouse and everything. Sometimes you don't hear all sounds together, but that is a minor thing.

With all these games I could just close it and return to the Ambien screen without problems.
I didn't have any crashes while trying.

I'm curious how I can give you framerates, is there an option in Quake to see it?

I'll try some other games this evening :-)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 18, 2003, 12:28:39 PM
Hello Targhan,

I tried the net to find a MUI version of Genesis, but in the end I just tried MiamiDX again.

It works now and I discovered the problem I had.
It has to do with my ethernet connection or ethernetcard itself. MiamiDX sometimes can't see the MAC adress of the card. So that is why I have troubles getting connected.

Thank you for your advice :-)

I've installed IBrowse2.3 (fully registered ofcourse) and the speed is skyrocketing :-D
YAM works too.

My next step is installing MakeCD3.2C

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: lempkee on February 18, 2003, 12:44:28 PM
spidey:for quake 1 and fps counter... hit TAB (or go to console) and type : timedemo demo1
and let it finnish.

anyway i guess u aint running any w3d or such, as your card doesnt have a 3d driver yet right?, and thats why its slow.

on my a1260ppc i get 35 fps in quake 1 (800x600x16) and in quake 2 (read the doc in quake 2 to find fps counter)i get 25 fps, your pegasos should atleast give you 100 fps in both games with 3d support enabled.

the sound problems that you mention sounds like a driver issue, and i guess that will be fixed later on. (in later mos updates)

have fun
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: fortina on February 18, 2003, 02:52:54 PM
Anyone out there with MOS know if Octamed soundstudio runs ok as I don't know how much of the custom chips that package uses. Thinking of getting a Pegasos board and this could swing my desision of getting one or not.
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: Spidey on February 18, 2003, 03:11:25 PM
Hello fortina,

Do you have an URL to a demo or something of this program?
I could check it.

Spidey
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: minator on February 18, 2003, 03:34:31 PM
Quote
Anyone out there with MOS know if Octamed soundstudio runs ok as I don't know how much of the custom chips that package uses. Thinking of getting a Pegasos board and this could swing my desision of getting one or not.


I can't answer that for the current version but we do want OMSS running and have made arrangements to get it running.

: -)
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: fortina on February 18, 2003, 03:44:11 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:
Hello fortina,

Do you have an URL to a demo or something of this program?
I could check it.

Spidey


It's available from the following page:
http://www.med.uk.com/amiga/amigadownload.htm
If you could give it a try that would be great as I'm sure I'm not the only one who uses OMSS and is thinking about the Pegasos board too. Cheers! :-)  :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 18, 2003, 05:45:23 PM
Hello lempkee,

I guess I don't have a fast computer anymore.

Quake I
I got a framerate of 13 fps with a 1024x768x8 screen and with a 800x600x8 screen I got a rate of 20 fps!!

Oh well, it's fast enough for me! :-D

With Quake II I can choose something besides 'software' in the Options menu, but I don't know how to check it.
(no, I don't have a doc of this game)

I did buy Genetic Species of those EuroCD collection, that's my next try! :-)

MakeCD3.2C (with 3.2D installed on top of it) my burner works! (even 40x speed)

I've got to try my printer! (I almost forget that one)

Spidey
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: Spidey on February 18, 2003, 05:55:06 PM
Hello fortina,

I downloaded the file and tried it out.
OctaMED starts but it has problems locating the audio channels.

So I guess you have to wait for the new version?? (Perhaps somebody has tried it also and got around the audio channels)

Spidey
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: lempkee on February 18, 2003, 06:23:32 PM
quote:

Hello lempkee,

I guess I don't have a fast computer anymore.

Quake I
I got a framerate of 13 fps with a 1024x768x8 screen and with a 800x600x8 screen I got a rate of 20 fps!!

Oh well, it's fast enough for me!

With Quake II I can choose something besides 'software' in the Options menu, but I don't know how to check it.
(no, I don't have a doc of this game)

I did buy Genetic Species of those EuroCD collection, that's my next try!

MakeCD3.2C (with 3.2D installed on top of it) my burner works! (even 40x speed)

I've got to try my printer! (I almost forget that one)

Spidey

-----end of quote


spidey, something is not correct here, first of all you runned 8bit screen modes?====??=?=?=?? , dont u use GL QUAKE ? , it sounds like you are emulating it from what i can tell, maybe i am just tired.

you need to use GLQUAKewoS in 16bit . , maybe mos doesnt like it?,..hmm sounds weird.

Genetic species wont work on peagsos, pretty sure of that as it doesnt have 68k in it..and GS is a 68k only game...atleast last time i checked.

good luck spidey, and the speed results u gave me is not fast and i think u will be very HAPPY when u get this up and running properly.

as my system is from 92, and beats your fps counters, so something must be very wrong on your setup (software) , as soon as you have fixed that....well then you should be atleast 4 times faster than my sys... :)

keep the smile up and good luck.
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: Kronos on February 18, 2003, 06:27:55 PM
Quote
Genetic species wont work on peagsos, pretty sure of that as it doesnt have 68k in it..and GS is a 68k only game...atleast last time i checked.  


Heh ?  :-o

Ever heard that there is a 68k-emu in MorphOS ?
 ;-)


Haven't tried that game, but if it won't run it ain't because
of the CPU, but more likely a AGA-based prob
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: zacman on February 18, 2003, 06:29:58 PM
>as my system is from 92, and beats your fps
>counters

Well you compare hw accelerated to software
rendering.
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: Kronos on February 18, 2003, 06:40:14 PM
92 ?

You mean you run Quatsch2 on an A4000/40 with 6mb, 25mhz and just AA ?

 :-P
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: Spidey on February 18, 2003, 07:15:50 PM
Hello lempkee,

I've got a Radeon 9000 64 MB and when I start Quake, first I get a requester where I can choose the screen modes. These are all 8 bit screen modes. After the selection Quake just starts.
And I don't think I got 3D acceleration...yet.

The mainfile is Quake V2.00. More info I didn't see in the dir.

About Genetic Species. The programs loads and I see a lot of intro pictures, but after that the screen stays black.
The program produces a few errors: it wants to open on a AGA screen and something with audio.device.

Hmmm, I also got a EuroCD with Pinball games. :-)

Spidey
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: Spidey on February 18, 2003, 07:17:06 PM
Hello Kronos,

You're right. This games wants a AGA screen unfortunately.

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on February 18, 2003, 07:57:08 PM
@lempkee

Hi.

I did some testing aswell. And just for fun I also tested the old
Amiga Quake68k under emulation! :-) Lets start with that:

Quake68k (only software rendering, no sound)
320x200x8 - 8.0 fps
640x480x8 - 2.6 fps
800x600x8 - 1.8 fps (that was a real slideshow ;-) )

QuakeMOS (only software rendering, with AHI sound)
320x200x8 - 87.4 fps (!)
640x480x8 - 29.0 fps
800x600x8 - 19.8 fps

As I said, these numbers are all based on software rendering. I have
no supported 3D accelerator. :-(

I tested GLquake on my oldest PC with an old celeron @ 500MHz, 256MB
memory, Matrox Millennium G450, running WindowsXP Pro (!!), and I
scored just under 100 fps on that!
(EDIT) That was in 800x600x16 (/EDIT)

So I guess that a Pegasos with a lean OS and HW accelerated 3D will
score *well* above 100 fps! We will of course get modern performance as soon as modern 3D hardware gets supported.
Title: Re: Octamed Soundstudio
Post by: Jupp3 on February 18, 2003, 08:06:12 PM
Genetic Species DOES work with Graphics Cards, iirc, it uses RTGMaster, which lets you to select screenmode (and c2p module, if you select AGA mode)
BUT in any case, you might want to download for game engine, which is available at the home page:
http://www.marble-eyes.dk

It also adds support for 24bit screenmodes, which sure look better... ;-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on February 18, 2003, 08:23:41 PM
@Spidey

Me too is using MiamiDX (right now actually). What I like about Miami
is its simplicity, both in configurating it and using it.

The only issue I have against it, is that its a limited demo version
and that there obviously is no way to register anymore. :-(

(If only Holger Kruse would upload a keyfile to Aminet or
something ...)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on February 19, 2003, 08:51:44 PM
Hello takemehomegrandma,

What do you mean with limited demo version?

I downloaded mine from Aminet and the only thing I noticed it disconnects by itself after a few hours. Or do you mean this with limited? :-?


Spidey
Title: Genetic Species
Post by: Spidey on February 19, 2003, 09:59:04 PM
Hello Jupp3,

On the cd every update is present, also the RTG-Master. But it just don't recognises my RTG system. :-(

So I'll wait with this game until somebody else manages it to work.

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on February 19, 2003, 11:29:57 PM
@Spidey

I downloaded Miami Deluxe from Aminet too. Some of the "DeLuxe" features are not enabled, and at least my Miami disconnects after about 30 minutes I think ...
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 11, 2003, 11:05:48 AM
As promised I've made my review of the Pegasos after 6 days of experience. Sorry, it's in hungarian, but a), the pics are nice, b), I'll try to make an english one soon :-)

Review (http://snews.vim.hu/pages/200101/pegasos.htm)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Bodie on March 11, 2003, 11:10:15 AM
ALthough I haven't got a clue about Hungarian, I do like the screenshots of MorphOS.

Well done Warface
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 11, 2003, 11:47:46 AM
Hello Warface,

Very nice pictures! :-D
Like Bodie, I have to say I didn´t understand everything you wrote :-)

How did you take those pictures of Birdie Shoot and Knights&Merchants? They are very nice.

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 11, 2003, 11:50:20 AM
@ Bodie

You will find some more screenshots here:
http://www.morphzone.org/modules/gallery/ (http://www.morphzone.org/modules/gallery/)

 :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Triumph on March 11, 2003, 12:01:58 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:


How did you take those pictures of Birdie Shoot and Knights&Merchants? They are very nice.

Spidey


Just use SGrabppc 1.22 from Stephan Rupprecht
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 11, 2003, 12:04:05 PM
Hi Triumph,

I guess I can find it on Aminet or so?

Thanks!  :-D

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 11, 2003, 12:20:18 PM
Actually I used the 68K sgrab, but the rest is the same :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Dagon on March 11, 2003, 01:10:53 PM
Hi, very nice screenshots :-)
I have some questions about MorphOS. (It looks very interesting having an AmigaOS-like OS in a PowerPC G3 right now)

1> I see in a grab the icon preferences (http://snews.vim.hu/images/200101/pegasos/7.png). Is there an amiga style, selection effect? (change the icon when is selected)

2> Can MorphOS have AmigaOS style right mouse button menus? (not only pop-up) Its in the system that choice or with an add-on utility (magic-menu maybe)?

thanx ;-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 11, 2003, 01:18:54 PM
Quote

Dagon wrote:

1> I see in a grab the icon preferences (http://snews.vim.hu/images/200101/pegasos/7.png). Is there an amiga style, selection effect? (change the icon when is selected)


I'm not that experienced user of MorphOS, but you can use all "older" icon formats (original, magicwb, fantasticwb, newicon, glowicon etc.) which has 2 phases. It's not impossible that the MorphOS icons can have 2 phases, yet I only saw 1 phase+effect icons. Maybe a more experienced user can tell you the exact answer.

Quote
2> Can MorphOS have AmigaOS style right mouse button menus? (not only pop-up) Its in the system that choice or with an add-on utility (magic-menu maybe)?


When you click the right mouse button in the screen bar you get the usual Amiga menus, and in addition, magic-menu seemed to work when I tried it out. (I only used it for a few minutes though, I was just experimenting with programs)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: zacman on March 11, 2003, 01:35:40 PM
>2> Can MorphOS have AmigaOS style right mouse
>button menus? (not only pop-up) Its in the system
>that choice or with an add-on utility (magic-menu
>maybe)?

MagicMenu functionality is built into the system. You
can change it in the system preferences.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Triumph on March 11, 2003, 06:48:48 PM
Quote

zacman wrote:

>MagicMenu functionality is built into the system. You
>can change it in the system preferences.


And it should be standaard. (in the Amiga, but it is very usefull and logical to use the menu this way and not have them on the top left Workbench)
Ambient doesn't have a Icon and Windows menu, like the Amiga.
You can get these by right clicking on a Icon or Window.
And then you notice that it is built on AOS31, you miss the features from OS3.9
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: magnetic on March 11, 2003, 07:28:59 PM
Nice review! Too bad I dont speak Hungarian :(
Please, please post an English one. I have a Pegasos coming and am salivating for it!
TIA
magnetic
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Hammer on March 11, 2003, 08:58:58 PM
@takemehomegrandma

What you tried Quake 1 without a graphics card support (e.g. WinQuake or DOS Quake)?
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on March 11, 2003, 10:08:16 PM
Full boot time is 23 seconds? Including post? That's quite long if you ask me, how big is the MOS install?

I expected the boottime to be shorter, but then again, i have no idea what the hell it's doing under the hood

Amon_Re :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on March 11, 2003, 10:12:55 PM
"But yesterday evening I saw there was a new boot iso with updates (dated 09 feb 2003) and I installed that (just a simple copying on the hd ) and presto! I have a lot more possibilites when I rightclick on an icon. So they seem busy enough updating the OS for me at this moment."

So if i get this correctly, the OS itself resides in an ISO file that's being loaded at boot from the HD into ram?

Simular to amithlon then?

Amon_Re
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Triumph on March 11, 2003, 10:22:09 PM
Quote

Amon_Re wrote:

>So if i get this correctly, the OS itself resides in an ISO >file that's being loaded at boot from the HD into ram?

No you get a .tar file, unzip this and you get a ISO file which you brun to CD.
This is only for beta! In the future there will be another setup/install

>Simular to amithlon then?

No, Amithlon you have to install the linux kernal boot and then Install AOS, But yoou can use the small bootoption

Amon_Re
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on March 11, 2003, 10:35:28 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:

1. HereticII demo
This I tried yesterday with a 1024x768 screen.
It was a bit slow but everything worked fine.

2. Quake I
This one goes too quick on a 1024x768 screen and on a 1280x1024 screen the speed is about the same as with the HereticII demo.

3. Quake II
This is a bit slower than Quake I.



Nice to see they included some games, but are Quake & Quake II full versions or demo's?

Also nice to see that they've gotten a Hyperion game demo in that pack

Amon_Re
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on March 11, 2003, 10:43:02 PM
Well, with amithlon too you don't need to install anything, just stick in the CD & boot from it.

But having to burn an iso to CD & boot from that is abit silly if you ask me, can you transer it to the HD & boot from there?

Amon_Re
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 11, 2003, 10:50:13 PM
Quote
Full boot time is 23 seconds?


More like 2-3 seconds I would say.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 11, 2003, 11:02:37 PM
Quote
So if i get this correctly, the OS itself resides in an ISO file


Hehe, no, you use ISO files to burn CD's! It will not be possible to boot directly from the ISO CD images I'm afraid. You have to burn the OS to a CD first!

(Edit: I later learned that you actually CAN mount ISO images from *within* MorphOS :-))
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Piru on March 11, 2003, 11:08:39 PM
Quote
Also nice to see that they've gotten a Hyperion game demo in that pack

Quake2 is not a Hyperion game, it's id Sotware (http://www.idsoftware.com/games/quake/quake2/)'s. MorphOS quake2 has nothing to do with Hyperion.
 
Quote
But having to burn an iso to CD & boot from that is abit silly if you ask me, can you transer it to the HD & boot from there?

Of course you transfer the files to the HD! That's part of the installation process. You only need to boot from the CD once when installing or upgrading.

Also, you can mount the iso image directly from within MorphOS and copy the files from there. However, having a bootable installation CD around is a good idea, in case you need to do emergency repairs.

MorphOS works like any other operating system here. You don't need to use some weird boot-wedge cd at each boot, or anything silly like that.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 11, 2003, 11:13:40 PM
 
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 11, 2003, 11:20:12 PM
Quote
Also, you can mount the iso image directly from within MorphOS and copy the files from there. However, having a bootable installation CD around is a good idea, in case you need to do emergency repairs.


Aha! That was new to me! :-o
Well then I guess I have learnt something today too! :-)

Thanks!  :-D
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Bodie on March 12, 2003, 05:37:22 AM
@takemehomegrandma

Thanks for the link.  Although I'm going for the A1/OS4 option, I do really like those Ambient (? is that the word) screenshots.  Very nice indeed, Warface and other Peg owners enjoy  :-) .
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 09:12:05 AM
Hello Amon_Re,

"Full boot time is 23 seconds?"

Well actually it's 25 seconds.
I clocked it a few times afterwards and it was everytime 25 seconds.

But do you find a full bootup of 25 seconds long?
I clocked the time from exact the moment I pushed the power button until harddisk activity was over and I was able to play around on the Ambient screen.

I have to say I've got 512 MB of (registered, ofcourse :-)) Ram and this takes a lot of time of the initial startup.
The whole "post" startup takes about 23 seconds, the software startup is about 2 seconds.

I checked these figures with friends of mine (they own pc's). The fastest one is a friend with WindowsXP. His total booting time is 35 seconds.

Could you give examples of computer systems that have quicker startup times? (ofcourse games consoles don't count :-D).
I honestly don't know of a system that can startup quicker than what I have at home (with my hardware configuration) and that it is available for the consumer market.

Thanks in advance,

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 09:19:47 AM
Hi Amon_Re,

The gamespart:

"....Nice to see they included some games, but are Quake & Quake II full versions or demo's?..."

What I saw till now looked like full versions.
Nowhere notifications that it is a demo or so.
(I played all games a few times each)

From the 5 games, only HereticII is a demo (hence the name of the folder: HereticII-demo :-D)

I bought recently the new game Knights&Merchants and installed it on the harddrive.
I noticed immediately the quick loading time of the game and also when you quit the game, it (almost) instantly returns to the Ambient desktop.
I know for sure we'll see this kind of quick response times with OS4 too :-)

Spidey

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 09:23:40 AM
Hello takemehomegrandma,

Quote
Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Full boot time is 23 seconds?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
More like 2-3 seconds I would say.


Well, those 2-3 seconds are only the loading time of the software.

I forgot to mention when you reset the computer, this too takes in total of 25 seconds.
(but this ofcourse logical, I just pressed the reset-switch :-D)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 09:26:36 AM
Hi Bodie,

Quote

Although I'm going for the A1/OS4 option, I do really like those Ambient (? is that the word) screenshots.  Very nice indeed, Warface and other Peg owners enjoy  :-) .


Thanks Bodie :-D

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Zorro on March 12, 2003, 09:59:42 AM
Thanks to Spidey and "the others" for this kind of reviews...

We now have real info about the real speed of various features of the PegasOS/MOS thing...

25 seconds... wow ! Let's hope that also the AOne/OS4 thing is capable of this (or better  :-) )

When can we test this ? I can't wait !!!  :rtfm:
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 10:20:14 AM
Hello Zorro,

"25 seconds... wow ! Let's hope that also the AOne/OS4 thing is capable of this (or better :-) )"

I think it will be as fast or faster now we saw the announcement of not needing registered RAM anymore :-D.
Furthermore both OS's (OS4 and MorphOS) aren't blown-up like most other OS's (to just be able to run the desktop) so the main difference will come from the hardware bootup. (I think :-))

Spidey

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: JoannaK on March 12, 2003, 10:29:00 AM
That 25 seconds  sounds quite a long time for what I have seen Pegasos (at Alt-party). But it may well be dependent of some hardware you are having on your machine. I'll comment more when I have mine. :)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 12, 2003, 10:33:51 AM
I have made a hasty translation in the evening (dawn, to be precise), it's available at:

Review in english (http://snews.vim.hu/pages/200101/pegasoseng.htm)

Sorry for my poor english in advance :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 10:38:41 AM
Hello JoannaK,

"...But it may well be dependent of some hardware you are having on your machine. I'll comment more when I have mine. :)"

I'm curious if it has something to do with my RAM.
So if someone with a Peg with different hardware configuration wants to give their total boot times, we could compare it.
You can see mine configuration in this thread! :-D

The software bootup could be less because now I see the MorphOS boot logo too. If I turn this off the software boottime would be a bit smaller than the 2-3 seconds of now.
(only, how to turn it off :-?:-))

Spidey

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 12, 2003, 10:44:25 AM
Quote

Spidey wrote:

The software bootup could be less because now I see the MorphOS boot logo too. If I turn this off the software boottime would be a bit smaller than the 2-3 seconds of now.
(only, how to turn it off :-?:-))


Find the drawer with the ahi and the two cgx icons.  One is cgxmode, and you need the other one. I can't remember the exact name of the option, but it must be there.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: HAK on March 12, 2003, 10:50:03 AM
@ Spidey,

Quote

I'm curious if it has something to do with my RAM.
So if someone with a Peg with different hardware configuration wants to give their total boot times, we could compare it.


I only have 256 MByte but boot time is (more or less) the same.
I assume you also have the 5 seconds delay in the boot options enabled so you can stop booting and go into the OF part.

Quote

The software bootup could be less because now I see the MorphOS boot logo too. If I turn this off the software boottime would be a bit smaller than the 2-3 seconds of now.
(only, how to turn it off :-?:-))


Hm, how about "Bootlogo = NO" in the Monitor driver in devs?
(Haven't tried it myself, because it doesn't bother me).


Bye HAK
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 10:50:39 AM
Hi Warface,

Nice review :-)

You´ll do a review for OS4 too?

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: JoannaK on March 12, 2003, 10:56:56 AM
@warface

Great. Thankyou for making this translation. :-)  :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 12, 2003, 11:14:01 AM
Quote

Spidey wrote:
Hi Warface,

Nice review :-)

You´ll do a review for OS4 too?

Spidey


If I'll have the money for AmigaONE by then, or if it comes out for the Blizzard. If not, someone else here will surely make a review, I'm not the only article writer here :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on March 12, 2003, 07:45:03 PM
Well, considering the size of MOS (i'd estimate that the OS itself isn't much bigger then 50MB), how long does the hardware init take?

Speaking of hardware init, does the Peg have a POST screen? I don't recall from what i saw @ WOASE.

As for WXP booting in 35secs, that's actually quite fast considering all the stuff XP pulls at booting (and Windows in general), for example, booting in Amithlon on a simple Duron 1.2Ghz from HD takes aprox 45seconds (Excluding Hardware init).

25 seconds certainly isn't long, but i'd like to know just what MOS does while booting :)

Amon_Re
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: on March 12, 2003, 07:49:13 PM
I'm amased they included 2 full games, quake 2 is open source (the engine) but the game files are commercial, don't remember about Quake tho.

As for the responcetimes, what you describe their can be atributed to the fact that you get a fast controller, fast harddrive and a fast PPC native FS.

If you ever get the chance to play with amithlon (or Umimator) you'll see this largely here aswell.

Now to make some things clear, i am not an Emuhead, i'm just using amithlon as an example.

AOS4 should also have the same feeling in speed, for basicly the same reasons given here.

Amon_Re
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Leo42 on March 12, 2003, 08:56:53 PM
                       Hi,

Good review (and perfect English translation...) but:

Please stop making ugly screenshots :-(

I know MUI prefs could be changed so that it looks better (should I say "less ugly" ?) BUT there will still be the "coherence" problem common to AmigaOS/MorphOS...

MUI gadgets are *limited* to 16 colour MWB palette (you cannot use any brush (8/16/24 bit) as an arrow for example...)...

See this screenshot/customized gui to understand better what I mean:

http://nogfx.free.fr/morphos/gui_problem.png (~350kb)

NOTE: with this grab I'm trying to show how a coherent GUI should look like... You may like it or not but at least it is coherent...

Regards,
Leo.

(I'm not trying to say they did a bad job: until now, MorphOS team did a great job... But before adding shadows to cursors, menus,.. they should correct these GUI/MUI limits...)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 12, 2003, 10:20:25 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:
Hello Amon_Re,

"Full boot time is 23 seconds?"

Well actually it's 25 seconds.
I clocked it a few times afterwards and it was everytime 25 seconds.

But do you find a full bootup of 25 seconds long?
I clocked the time from exact the moment I pushed the power button until harddisk activity was over and I was able to play around on the Ambient screen.

I have to say I've got 512 MB of (registered, ofcourse :-)) Ram and this takes a lot of time of the initial startup.
The whole "post" startup takes about 23 seconds, the software startup is about 2 seconds.

I checked these figures with friends of mine (they own pc's). The fastest one is a friend with WindowsXP. His total booting time is 35 seconds.

Could you give examples of computer systems that have quicker startup times? (ofcourse games consoles don't count :-D).
I honestly don't know of a system that can startup quicker than what I have at home (with my hardware configuration) and that it is available for the consumer market.

Thanks in advance,

Spidey


You were right. Today I clocked my pegasos too. I pressed the timer button at the same time as I pressed the power button, and it took about 25 secs till I could use the system. That includes HD spin up etc. But I must say it looks longer on "paper" than it feels in reality. I hadn't reflected over the hardware init times before (mabye because I'm quite used to my PC (with a lot of SCSI units)). Anyway, it feels quite smooth!

The actual "boot" time (as in booting the OS) was still about 2-3 seconds though ...  :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 12, 2003, 10:24:22 PM
Quote
Could you give examples of computer systems that have quicker startup times? (ofcourse games consoles don't count ).


I don't feel that my PS2 is particularly fast in booting from a cold start. I haven't clocked it though. But I would not be surprised if the Pegasos will be faster!
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 12, 2003, 10:27:55 PM
Quote

Amon_Re wrote:
Well, considering the size of MOS (i'd estimate that the OS itself isn't much bigger then 50MB), how long does the hardware init take?

Speaking of hardware init, does the Peg have a POST screen? I don't recall from what i saw @ WOASE.

As for WXP booting in 35secs, that's actually quite fast considering all the stuff XP pulls at booting (and Windows in general), for example, booting in Amithlon on a simple Duron 1.2Ghz from HD takes aprox 45seconds (Excluding Hardware init).

25 seconds certainly isn't long, but i'd like to know just what MOS does while booting :)

Amon_Re


The biggest part of the startup time is the HW init, thats for sure. The actual OS boot does just take about 2-3 seconds.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 12, 2003, 10:29:09 PM
@ Leo42

Quote
Please stop making ugly screenshots


Beauty is in the eye of the beholder! :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 10:35:26 PM
Hi Warface and HAK,

Unfortunately I don't have enough time to play around with the Peg, I did notice we've got also a sort of toolbar in the Prefs-dir: Pixload.
Or am I wrong?

Oh, in Prefs I see only ModeEdit, CyberGraphX, Pixload-Prefs and AHI.

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 12, 2003, 10:49:56 PM
Quote
Please stop making ugly screenshots


I promised here on amiga.org to make a review when I get my peg. 5 days is not much time if you take into account that I worked 10-12 hours a day - and had only a few hours to play around with my peg. I haven't even touched the default look of the MUI part. Had no time for something like that.
Give me a few months and I'll have a more decent desktop. Besides, today I've managed to start UAE MOS :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 10:51:02 PM
Hello Amon_Re,

"Well, considering the size of MOS (i'd estimate that the OS itself isn't much bigger then 50MB), how long does the hardware init take?"

I checked the latest bootcd and the size of it is around 12 MB

"Speaking of hardware init, does the Peg have a POST screen? I don't recall from what i saw @ WOASE."

Well sort of, you don't see anything going on from the hardware, but I think there is a possibility to turn it on in the BIOS?

"As for WXP booting in 35secs, that's actually quite fast considering all the stuff XP pulls at booting...."

Yes that particular friend is a very happy dude! :-D

"25 seconds certainly isn't long, but i'd like to know just what MOS does while booting :)"

The first 22-23 seconds are reserved for HW startup/check/initialisation. Also a second or so plain waiting like HAK said. The user should have the possibility to push the F9-button to get in the BIOS! :-D
The last seconds are for SW startup.

Perhaps someone knows details??

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 12, 2003, 10:54:46 PM
As to the bootlogo removal: Go to Prefs drawer, then CyberGraphX, then the Tooltypes tab and there BOOTLOGO.

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 10:56:01 PM
Hi Amon_Re,

I too was surprised about the games.
Don't forget about TurboPrint. That one is also part of the package, but it's not finished yet or so?

Yes, I'm certain OS4 will have the same responsetime as MorphOS :-D

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 11:02:44 PM
Hi Leo42,

I don't understand your remark. :-?
On that picture I see you aplied one of the skins from the FTP-site. It is ofcourse nice, but...

I'm afraid I'm a bit confused here.

Spidey

ps: did you tried the other skins too? :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 11:05:57 PM
Hi takemehomegrandma,

So your total boottime is around the same as mine?
Didn't you have 256 MB RAM? (I've got 512)
This would mean the startup isn't affected by the amount of memory?????

Yes, SW boot time is quick ;-)

Spidey

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 11:10:53 PM
Wow!

You got UAE running?!
Please help me out with it!!!
I'm asking questions everywhere.

Please see the thread at MorphZone (http://www.morphzone.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=50&forum=9&9)

Thanks in advance!!!

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 12, 2003, 11:15:09 PM
@Warface

"As to the bootlogo removal: Go to Prefs drawer, then CyberGraphX, then the Tooltypes tab and there BOOTLOGO"

You know, I did see it but didn't think it would actually work!
I'll try this tomorrow.

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 12, 2003, 11:39:15 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:
Hi takemehomegrandma,

So your total boottime is around the same as mine?
Didn't you have 256 MB RAM? (I've got 512)
This would mean the startup isn't affected by the amount of memory?????

Yes, SW boot time is quick ;-)

Spidey



Hi.

I have a 512 MB registered samsung module in mine. A big RAM: disk it is! :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on March 12, 2003, 11:45:26 PM
Quote

Spidey wrote:
Wow!

You got UAE running?!
Please help me out with it!!!
I'm asking questions everywhere.

Please see the thread at MorphZone (http://www.morphzone.org/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=50&forum=9&9)

Thanks in advance!!!

Spidey


Wasn't this discussed on the beta2 mailing list a while ago?
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 13, 2003, 06:46:30 AM
Hello takemehomegrandma,

"Wasn't this discussed on the beta2 mailing list a while ago?"

Yes and also by me :-)
But the responsives weren't enough.
I saw an email adressing my question about UAE this morning, so'll look into it this evening when I0m home from work.

The problems with UAE I'm having now are:

- RX doesn't work, so I can't start UAEGui.rexx with that. I can only start it with "muirexx uaegui.rexx"
- What for is UAEWB.rexx? This one doesn't do anything except polling the dir (with SnoopDOS I see the command "changedir"
- I've extracted my 3.1 ROM but PPC UAE gets in a loop when starting. The 68k UAE does show the 3.1 kickstart screen.
- How to adress and get running a hardfile/partition.
- With UnDMS you don't need to change your DMS files into ADF files. Where to find UnDMS?
- If someone could give me an example ".uaesrc" for the PPC UAE with the available commands, I would be very happy!

Ok, I'll stop now :-D (I've got a few more actually)

About the memory, with us both having the same amount of RAM, it isn´t a surprise we have the same boottime! :-D

If I remember correctly HAK has 256 MB.
HAk, can you give the exact total boot time?
You did say something about the idle time, it was around 5 seconds?
I´ll see what my idle time is, but it isn´t 5 whole seconds though.
More of this "total boot time" this evening :-)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: bbrv on March 13, 2003, 08:20:17 AM
:-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D

Thanks Warface !!!

:-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D

Raquel and Bill   :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: olegil on March 13, 2003, 08:37:10 AM
Hmm, I forgot to clock it, but I would estimate my A1 boots into kdm (not kde, just to the login window in kdm. I don't have kde installed, because it takes so long to log in) in about 30 seconds. That's a linux file server setup with X. I somehow expect AOS4 to remove at least 15 of those seconds due to lack of X ;-) (X is almost as slow at starting up on the A1/Radeon 7500 as it is on the P4/Matrox G550. Almost). Logging in with afterstep takes about 3 seconds.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Zorro on March 13, 2003, 09:15:35 AM
Hi olegil,

How many seconds take the hardware testing (bios time) ?

(I think that we can add to this time about 5 seconds to boot the OS and then to be very happy amiga men ! ) :-D
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 13, 2003, 09:15:49 AM
Quote

Spidey wrote:

- If someone could give me an example ".uaesrc" for the PPC UAE with the available commands, I would be very happy!


Start UAE with the parameter "-h". It will list all available commands. (Yesterday I've managed to get UAE running :-))
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Leo42 on March 13, 2003, 09:39:04 AM
>I don't understand your remark.
> On that picture I see you aplied one of the skins from the FTP-site. It is ofcourse nice, but...

The problem is that ONLY window gadgets are fully skinnable and MUI has big limitations: you *cannot* use any 8/16/24bit brush as mui buttom, arrows,... and mui gadgets (up to now) MUST use the MagicWB 16 colour palette...

=> This results in a non-coherent GUI where you have:

 .new (nice) true color pictures as window gadgets
 .old (looks ugly in a 16/32bit desktop) 4bit brushes as GUI gadgets (in the best case: standard gadtools gadgets are even worst...)

=> new window gadgets + old gui gadgets=an ugly mixed GUI :-(
=> See bottom window in my screenshot...


=> in the top-window, I edited the picture so that the window theme MATCHES the GUI theme... (well, I tried, I'm not that good at 2D drawing ;))
=> A fully skinnable GUI could look like this...

Hope you'll see what I mean...

Regards,
Leo.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 13, 2003, 10:30:56 AM
Hello Leo,

I just took a closer look at your picture and I understand it now :-)

I have to make you a compliment, because the first time I thought the first window was the actual window after applying the skin. Well made! :-D

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 13, 2003, 10:38:27 AM
Hello Zorro and olegil,

My guess is that software startup will also be 2-3 seconds at most :-D
The main part of the startup will be determined by the hardware (unlike some other systems where the software startup takes ages and after that the harddisk "refuses" to stop spinning and loading something :-))

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Leo42 on March 13, 2003, 10:42:29 AM
>I have to make you a compliment, because the first time I thought the first window was the actual window after applying the skin.

Unfortunately: this is the first image we get when applying the theme ;(

(by playing with mui prefs you could have something better but still very far from the first window ;()

Leo.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Warface on March 13, 2003, 11:36:29 AM
Never the less, your mockup was very nice. Connecting window/mui themes into one theme was already discussed on the beta2 mailing list, however I can't recall anything related to MUI abilities. Maybe you 'd better tell it directly to the developers. I'm sure they will listen to you, if it's not already implemented in the next update.
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Zorro on March 13, 2003, 02:02:10 PM
Hi Spidey and olegil,

Then the speed of the hardware detection (the bios time) will be the crucial factor... olegil can you test the speed of the hw detection of the AOne bios ?

Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on March 13, 2003, 02:15:34 PM
Hello Zorro and olegil,

And if we want to compare it, give also the relevant hardware configuration.

I'm thinking: the type of RAM inside the Peg is of a registered one. Can anyone explain what's the difference between a registered one and unregistered.
Also, is it possible that startup with registered RAM takes more time than with unregistered RAM?

(oh, please help out with UAE :-D...somebody?? :-D check my questions :-))

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: HAK on March 13, 2003, 05:48:02 PM
@Spidey,

>If I remember correctly HAK has 256 MB.

Yes, that's correct.


>HAK, can you give the exact total boot time?

Just did some tests.
First, I cutted the delay-time during boot to 3 seconds (instead of the 5 I had there before).
Times given are *included* those 3 seconds.

Equipment:

Pegasos with 256 MByte RAM.
Voodoo3 (PCI)
Hauppage TV Videocard
Realtek 8029 based Ethernetcard
Harddisk and CD-Rom on 1st IDE-connector
Harddisk and CD-Writer on 2nd IDE-connector

Time for booting: 30 seconds.


I did a second test where I exchanged the Voodoo3 with a Radeon7000 (AGP).

Time for booting: 27 seconds.

Obviously the booting time depends on your equipment.

BTW, there was no difference between switching on the Pegasos or doing a reset.


HTH


Bye HAK
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: ple3003 on April 07, 2003, 08:38:47 PM
Quote
I'm thinking: the type of RAM inside the Peg is of a registered one. Can anyone explain what's the difference between a registered one and unregistered.
Also, is it possible that startup with registered RAM takes more time than with unregistered RAM?
@spidey

Normally all RAM with parity needs to be checked before booting process continues. That is usually 10-30 seconds. All RAM wich has ECC uses parity bits to find glitches in memory flow. If i'm not mistaken, Reg. memory sticks often use ECC as well...
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: magnetic on April 07, 2003, 10:09:56 PM
Hey HAK
 Do you have the Hauppage TV Videocard working with Peg? If so how? Does AMITHLON TV work? What about IO Spirit's VHI STUDIO 6?
TIA
magnetic
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Spidey on April 07, 2003, 10:11:07 PM
Hi ple3003,

So this would mean that starting up with registered RAM takes more time than starting up with unregistered RAM?

Thanks for the info! :-D

@everybody
A lot of people have received their A1's and Peg's. Perhaps a good idea to start a new thread with these people telling their experiences?? :-)

Spidey
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: Stom on April 07, 2003, 10:11:36 PM
Quote

Amon_Re wrote:

As for WXP booting in 35secs, that's actually quite fast considering all the stuff XP pulls at booting (and Windows in general

Amon_Re


(little bit of snipage here n there)

Anyway, ok, I know this aint the place topoint this out but compared to older version of the Windows OS, WinXP's boot times are dramatically faster than before! Using a little tool of M$'s site (bootvis) you can optimise your systems boot time. Afresh install of WiXP with SP1 takes about 34seconds to boot from cold, however after using bootvis a cold boot falls way down to 18 seconds on my system! (running a XP1700, 512mb ram, 2x40Gig RAID drives, 20Gig drive, DVD rom, CDRW)

Ok, sorry to go waaaaayy off topic but I tghought it was worth pointing out - damn good thread though I have got to say! its about time we heard some non-bitching news on the new systems!

Cheerio
Sam Thomas :-D
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: amigamad on April 07, 2003, 10:49:28 PM
Not much of a review sounds like a rush job to get this system out resulting in something which is near to crap at least os4 will be complete and working.If i want an unstable os ill use windows 98. :-D
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: takemehomegrandma on April 08, 2003, 12:30:51 AM
Quote

amigamad wrote:
Not much of a review sounds like a rush job to get this system out resulting in something which is near to crap at least os4 will be complete and working.If i want an unstable os ill use windows 98. :-D


Lets hope that OS4 will be 100% complete and working the day it arrives (if ever). I agree on that. It remains to be seen though.

MorphOS still has gaps and it's not 100% ready yet, but it's working and it's very much usable in it's current state. New updates comes on a regular basis. Any serious Amiga user will have no problem in filling many of the gaps themselves. I'm speaking out of my own experience. And MorphOS has a big advantage that is *very much* appriciated among us users. Do you know what it is? It's *here now*! :-)
Title: Re: My review of Pegasos+MorphOS
Post by: HAK on April 08, 2003, 11:46:28 PM
@magnetic,

>Do you have the Hauppage TV Videocard working with Peg?
>If so how?

I have both of my Videocards working with Visionary ATM.
However to use it I'll have to switch to the Voodoo3 (as this one
supports Overlay).


>Does AMITHLON TV work? What about IO Spirit's VHI Studio 6.

Sorry, no luck here.
The latest versions of Amithlon TV don't freeze or crash anymore, but
unfortunately, I also don't get a picture/sound either (only tested it
with the TV-in of the Hauppage).

Even less luck with VHI Studio (this one doesn't even recognize the
card at all).


Bye HAK