Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: VingtTrois on June 12, 2012, 09:46:14 AM
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Message on FACEBOOK by Petro T. Tyschtschenko:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4145449318964&set=a.1849105871813.110226.1365691299&type=1
"Soon I will have 500 units new Amiga 1200 Magic Pack.. If you are interested to buy let me know. Pricing 150 Euro plus 19% VAT."
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Message on FACEBOOK by Petro T. Tyschtschenko:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=4145449318964&set=a.1849105871813.110226.1365691299&type=1
"Soon I will have 500 units new Amiga 1200 Magic Pack.. If you are interested to buy let me know. Pricing 150 Euro plus 19% VAT."
I cant get to that page! :(
EDIT: but was able to send him a message via http://www.facebook.com/ptyschtschenko anyway.
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Link die!
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I so want at least one of those :)
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Just curious are these PAL or NTSC units..
Rich
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Apparently PAL
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Any way to get in touch with him if you're not a Facephuq member?
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Link not dead - you just need to be friends with Petro to be able to see his wall....
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Clever way to get a couple thousand new friends on Facebook!
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Apparently PAL
En..only interested if he had NTSC ..oh well..
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Most half-decent TVs and Monitors can display PAL and NTSC just fine. Ever since TFT/LCD TVs i've never had issues with one of them not being able to display PAL/NTSC.
In the worst case, there is always the option for an Indivision Mk2 (DVI => HDMI, or DVI => VGA, both usually found on new TVs and Monitors).
Unfortunately, i'am unable to see the issue :(
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@thread
500?
What happened to the other 1000?
source (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61762)
and what's the connection to this? (http://amigakit.leamancomputing.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=668)
#6
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Any way to get in touch with him if you're not a Facephuq member?
:bump:
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Scammer......save your hard earned cash and buy a Minimig or Replay board.
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:bump:
Yes I suppose that the link is only for friends of Petro!
Try this address:
http://www.power-service-gmbh.com/
Models are PAL (UK?).
Not confidential information:
Petro Tyschtschenko
Power Service GmbH
Bergweg 50a
D-63322 Rödermark, Germany
Tel: +49 6074 629747
Fax: +49 6074 5812
Mobile: +49 171-261 53 81
Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter/CEO/GM: Petro Tyschtschenko
HRB Offenbach 34724
Ust-ID: DE 2100107786
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Someone tell Petro we need a proper order form.
Not many people can/will buy this on the corner of Facebook and Shady street.
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It would be nice if a North American distributor could get some of these, so I could avoid that atrocious taxation.
Most half-decent TVs and Monitors can display PAL and NTSC just fine. Ever since TFT/LCD TVs i've never had issues with one of them not being able to display PAL/NTSC.
That doesn't seem to be the case in NTSC-land. Even some high end Samsung and Sharp displays sold here don't handle PAL signals. I'm sure the hardware is capable, but the firmware just doesn't allow it.
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^ That's really tough luck bro :( Finding a decent way to display our Amiga goodness is hard as it is, without having to add the PAL/NTSC headache.
On topic... can someone with a Facebook report what is going on on Petro's page ?
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Last comment of Petro:
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While I will have those in my warehopuse I will do an announcement and let you know details.. Please be patiant for the next 8 weeks.. Best regards Petro T. Tyschtschenko
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Autogramm ist natürlich kostenlos.. Aber ich habe die A 1200 noch nicht bei mir im Lager, also Geduld.. Herzlichst Petro T. Tyschtschenko
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That doesn't seem to be the case in NTSC-land. Even some high end Samsung and Sharp displays sold here don't handle PAL signals. I'm sure the hardware is capable, but the firmware just doesn't allow it.
Loads of good converters around. As an added bonus if the conversion is lousy you'll never notice on an NTSC set anyway (sorry, I just couldn't resist). :P
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What is the difference between PAL and the current standard of DVB-T? I've come to think of PAL as just SD DVB-T, but is that correct?
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What is the difference between PAL and the current standard of DVB-T? I've come to think of PAL as just SD DVB-T, but is that correct?
Main difference is that PAL (and NTSC) is analog, DVB-T is digital and has to be decoded.
greets,
Staf.
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So TVs sold in this country have DVB-T and support PAL, they seem to support NTSC, would they also support ASTC or do they choose the digital decoding in the manufacturing? In other words is digital decoding an either or situation where they either put a DVB-T or ASTC decoder but not both?
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Last comment of Petro:
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While I will have those in my warehopuse I will do an announcement and let you know details.. Please be patiant for the next 8 weeks.. Best regards Petro T. Tyschtschenko
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Autogramm ist natürlich kostenlos.. Aber ich habe die A 1200 noch nicht bei mir im Lager, also Geduld.. Herzlichst Petro T. Tyschtschenko
Thank you very much for the information. Hope you can bring us the news whenever there is some. We appreciate it greatly.
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What I'd like to know is where he's getting them from. There is that whole shenanigan where he apparently sold off all the left over Amiga stock at some way low price. Did he miss a few?
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On FACEBOOK:
"Es sind natürlich Pal.. Herzlichst Petro T. Tyschtschenko"
A1200 are PAL model!
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If I buy Petro's amiga 1200, can I make it work in the USA ?
And what do I need to make it work ?
Thank you !!!
rednova
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If I buy Petro's amiga 1200, can I make it work in the USA ?
Yes
And what do I need to make it work ?
You need a USA (110V) PSU (from a 1200 of 500 is fine).
Then you need a display.
If you have a 1084s or similar monitor, you're good.
If you have a scandoubler, you're good.
It won't output to your NTSC television.
desiv
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@ desiv
Thank you for your prompt reply.
I do have a working a1200 PSU (us)
and also a good and working 1084s monitor.
So I guess I am good to go.
I really appreciate your help.
Thank you !!!
rednova
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Last comment of Petro:
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While I will have those in my warehopuse I will do an announcement and let you know details.. Please be patiant for the next 8 weeks.. Best regards Petro T. Tyschtschenko
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Autogramm ist natürlich kostenlos.. Aber ich habe die A 1200 noch nicht bei mir im Lager, also Geduld.. Herzlichst Petro T. Tyschtschenko
All right now, 8 weeks long gone, any news from Petro ?
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Sounds like testa di chenko..
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Come on guys, could someone with facebook poke him...
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July 5: "Visiting Ed Goff, the lawyer from Commodore, close to Westchester on 29 June 2012".
August 4: "I am sitting in St. Louis (USA). Best regards Petro T. Tyschtschenko".
No more news about his 500 units new Amiga 1200 Magic Pack :huh:
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How come Petro don't advertise the A-1200 on all Amiga sites?
Tony
wa9yoz
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Oh man, I was so hoping to get one of these :(
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Any news from Petro???
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Any news from Petro???
According to Patric Klöter (http://translate.google.de/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amiga-news.de%2Fde%2Fnews%2FAN-2012-09-00037-DE.html&act=url), he will be taking orders this weekend at "Classic Computing" event in Germany.
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always kool with new old stock :)
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According to Patric Klöter (http://translate.google.de/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.amiga-news.de%2Fde%2Fnews%2FAN-2012-09-00037-DE.html&act=url), he will be taking orders this weekend at "Classic Computing" event in Germany.
Oh man, will he ever put an online order form...
Not all of us can go to "Classic Computing" for one.
AmigaKit, please react :) Are you considering buying a stock ?
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I'm calling vaporware as Amigakit would have prolly confirmed something by now if petro was for real!
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They all have rats nesting in them by now. Just you wait and see!
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Hmm Petro is an honorable guy. And to be honest, if it wasnt for him there would have never been os 3.5, 3.9, or 4.0 for that matter!
However, this whole thing seems "funny" to me.
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Hmm Petro is an honorable guy. And to be honest, if it wasnt for him there would have never been os 3.5, 3.9, or 4.0 for that matter!
However, this whole thing seems "funny" to me.
You are correct on both accounts, Sir!
http://www.facebook.com/ptyschtschenko
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I wonder if Amigakit has made an offer for the lot?
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Come on AmigaKit, say something :)
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Come on AmigaKit, say something :)
AmigaKit's silence in on this subject is interesting... :sealed:
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Looks like he's been doing some vacationing from the photos on his Facebook page. I got an app request from him this morning: "Petro invited you to play CastleVille"!!! :-P
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AmigaKit's silence in on this subject is interesting... :sealed:
Amigakit has always been very good at not saying anything unless they are sure they are getting stock.
So, even if they were planning on trying to talk to Petro about this, they probably wouldn't say anything until they we sure stock was on it's way..
I appreciate that, even if, in the past, it has led to lots of people saying "Well, Vesalia has it on their website!!" ;-)
desiv
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Petro T. Tyschtschenko The A 1200 magic Pack will be available on 15 Nov 2012[iminent=hbSmBMeUWfOB]
Petro T. Tyschtschenko Please order under amiga1200magic@gmail.com[iminent=wVGMsLeUWfOB]
Petro T. Tyschtschenko order quantity only 1 !!! Price 150 Euro + Tax + shipping = 200 Euro
Petro T. Tyschtschenko Procedure: After receiving your order, invoice will be issued. Please inform: Invoice adress and shipping adress. After TT and funds are received, A 1200 Maghic will be shipped!!!
Petro T. Tyschtschenko Orders are limitede to 1 unit only... Petro T. Tyschtschenko
Petro T. Tyschtschenko Of course those Amigas have their age. manufactured 1995. I can not take any warrenty or guaranty.. Please understand. Petro
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can someone ask petro if he can make New batches, the way he did last time for Escom ?
Does he have the AGA chipset diagrams to make new models ?
If anyone has the diagrams it would be Petro
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can someone ask petro if he can make New batches, the way he did last time for Escom ?
Does he have the AGA chipset diagrams to make new models ?
If anyone has the diagrams it would be Petro
I think all diagrams are copyrighted by AMIGA Inc and make new batches must be also approuved by the owner of the licence.
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I think all diagrams are copyrighted by AMIGA Inc and make new batches must be also approuved by the owner of the licence.
I doubt that'd be financially viable anyway - we're talking about making a small batch of almost 20 year-old hardware.
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So orders are via email ? How does that work ?
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can someone ask petro if he can make New batches, the way he did last time for Escom ?
Does he have the AGA chipset diagrams to make new models ?
If anyone has the diagrams it would be Petro
The problem with the old chips, is that even I you have the die masks... There aren't any fabs that could make them anymore... Best just to recreate them with FPGAs... Jens did that for each of the chips in turn. But 5v FPGs are old, expensive and difficult to source now :)
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So orders are via email ? How does that work ?
Yeah, some more information would be nice. Fe. where are the units shipped from? Germany?
I sent a query to the mail mentioned above. I received a reply from Petro himself, saying that he will "receive on 15 November 60 units A 1200 Magic Pack". That didn't really answer my original question if he takes pre-orders/reservations or not. I just sent him a reply and asked some more questions.
Are there any more details on his Facebook page?
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can someone ask petro if he can make New batches, the way he did last time for Escom ?
Does he have the AGA chipset diagrams to make new models ?
If anyone has the diagrams it would be Petro
It would be easier to use something like the FPGA Arcade instead and put it in an off-the-shelf case. In theory you could use the FPGA Arcade's expansion port to provide additional expansion slots (although the upcoming daughterboard takes care of almost all of your expansion needs).
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Petro T. Tyschtschenko Of course those Amigas have their age. manufactured 1995. I can not take any warrenty or guaranty.. Please understand. Petro
Just as I suspected; full of rats.
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60 sounds like not much! Wonder if the caps have leaked.... sent an email but got no response so far :(
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I have just received my order confirmation (ordered one just yesterday).
No 44 of 60.
A lifelong dream is about to become reality.
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I have just received my order confirmation (ordered one just yesterday).
No 44 of 60.
A lifelong dream is about to become reality.
May I ask how you did that? :o
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May I ask how you did that? :o
Did what?
Get a reply?
Easy. I first wrote him, asking for a shipping quote and whether those machines came with an HDD or not (he never answered that one though). A few minutes later, because I was nervous and actually forgot to include my address, I wrote another email and mentioned that he should consider it an order.
3 hours later I received a reply and Presto! no 44 was mine.
From:
Petro Tyschtschenko
Sie sind Nummer 44 es sind 60 Stück zu vergeben.. Herzlichst Verfügbar ab 15 Nov. Sie erhalten dann eine Rechnung.. Petro
Too bad other Amiga originals aren't doing something similar.
I could really need a 060 or PPC accelerator and one of those massive (256MB) RAM upgrades for that lovely machine ;)
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@Blinx123
Thanks for the email address!
BTW, are you in the US or the UK or other?
Did you provide Petro a Paypal address to invoice you?
From:
Petro Tyschtschenko [/I]
They are number 44, it must be awarded 60 pieces .. Sincerely Available from 15 Nov. You will receive an invoice .. Petro
[/I]
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@Blinx123
Thanks for the email address!
BTW, are you in the US or the UK or other?
Did you provide Petro a Paypal address to invoice you?
Other (currently residing in a small patch of land less than a mile off the Swiss border)
I didn't provide a Paypal address, as I didn't even know he was accepting Paypal.
As far as I understood, he issues invoices and people will have to pay by wire.
BTW: Kinda off topic, but whatever became of Underground Arcade (the game company Cammy used to promote a few years back)?
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Other (currently residing in a small patch of land less than a mile off the Swiss border)
I didn't provide a Paypal address, as I didn't even know he was accepting Paypal.
As far as I understood, he issues invoices and people will have to pay by wire.
BTW: Kinda off topic, but whatever became of Underground Arcade (the game company Cammy used to promote a few years back)?
Well, I don't know if he accepts Paypal either... I was just wondering how he was going to invoice you.
(currently residing in a small patch of land less than a mile off the Swiss border) - Which country? Liechtenstein? And you have hi-speed internet? I'd say that maybe as much as 30-40% in the US still have no broadband internet!
Awesome stat! - Liechtenstein has the highest gross domestic product per person in the world when adjusted by purchasing power parity,[9] and has the world's lowest external debt. Liechtenstein also has the second lowest unemployment rate in the world at 1.5% (Monaco is first).
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Well, I don't know if he accepts Paypal either... I was just wondering how he was going to invoice you.
(currently residing in a small patch of land less than a mile off the Swiss border) - Which country? Liechtenstein? And you have hi-speed internet? I'd say that maybe as much as 30-40% in the US still have no broadband internet!
Awesome stat! - Liechtenstein has the highest gross domestic product per person in the world when adjusted by purchasing power parity,[9] and has the world's lowest external debt. Liechtenstein also has the second lowest unemployment rate in the world at 1.5% (Monaco is first).
Hehe. I wish I was living in Liechtenstein.
Nah. It's actually still Germany, though it used to be cut off from the rest in earlier days.
It's kind of the last small dot on the most detailed map you can find.
Where I live, we don't even have a police but we have border control everywhere. The nearest outpost is just a few hundred feet from my house.
I also wish I had broadband internet, but I'm still sucking on a 458KBit connection which drops out several hundred times every day from 5PM to 1AM.
I'm moving to the next town in just a bit more than three months. By then, I should have 2MBit internet + 10MBit Satellite
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BTW: Kinda off topic, but whatever became of Underground Arcade (the game company Cammy used to promote a few years back)?
We're trying to work on a few games still, but the team only consists of Rebel and I now. We have no forum and all the other team members drifted off and found other things to do.
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We're trying to work on a few games still, but the team only consists of Rebel and I now. We have no forum and all the other team members drifted off and found other things to do.
Do new team members have to be located in Australia/Oceania?
As soon (or even while I'm still on it) as I've wrapped up my current Sega Dreamcast/PC productions, I'd be happy to assist you guys.
I actually dream of coding a claymation point and click adventure ever since I read about Douglas TenNapel's new book, so perhaps my first Amiga game could be just that (utilizing INGA or Graal)
EDIT: Concerning the Amiga 1200's expandability. Do all Amiga 1200s come with an ATA interface already installed? If I acquire Amiga OS 3.9, is there any upper limit as to the size of an HDD? E. g. could I install a 300GB HDD and get it initialized without doing any changes to the underlying hardware or software?
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There aren't any requirements to joining Underground Arcade other than an enthusiasm to make fun, new games for Amigas and other retro systems.
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In that case, I'd definitely like to join.
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Do new team members have to be located in Australia/Oceania?
As soon (or even while I'm still on it) as I've wrapped up my current Sega Dreamcast/PC productions, I'd be happy to assist you guys.
I actually dream of coding a claymation point and click adventure ever since I read about Douglas TenNapel's new book, so perhaps my first Amiga game could be just that (utilizing INGA or Graal)
EDIT: Concerning the Amiga 1200's expandability. Do all Amiga 1200s come with an ATA interface already installed? If I acquire Amiga OS 3.9, is there any upper limit as to the size of an HDD? E. g. could I install a 300GB HDD and get it initialized without doing any changes to the underlying hardware or software?
Yeah, IDE already there, but it is the larger 44pin interface, not the 40pin one.... A simple cable adaptor is used to ignore the extra pins (which are just power lines).
AmigaOS 3.1 wasn't happy with partitions over 2gig... But that is a simple software fix.
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Ok. Thanks.
I guess I'll need to read up on the subject.
I was going to buy Amiga OS 3.9 ASAP. This and a fast turbo card (wish PPC was more common or, at the very least, Jens was producing 040 or 060 turbo cards).
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Ok. Thanks.
I guess I'll need to read up on the subject.
I was going to buy Amiga OS 3.9 ASAP. This and a fast turbo card (wish PPC was more common or, at the very least, Jens was producing 040 or 060 turbo cards).
In all honesty, I find doing Amiga dev work easier using UAE than real hardware. Obviously, you should have a real machine to test it on though.
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Good point.
I'll probably use my Amiga 1200 for mostly testing.
Even then, it's still nice to have a small machine I can power up every now and then, rather than relying on my beastly PC I can't easily transfer from one room to the next.
For stuff like Graal II, I'll definitely use the Amiga exclusively.
Speaking of which: Anyone got a recording of a talkie Graal II game? Would really like to know how this sounds.
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Anyone else heard from petro?
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It would be nice to have some feedback from ppl who actualy GOT their Amigas from Petro. You know ... "Oh my GOD, it finally arrived ! Look at the pictures !" or something like that. Will watch this thread carefully to see how this story unfolds.
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I don't know why is it so hard to set up a web page with a proper online order form ?
People would be able to get all kinds of information that way.
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Because maybe it's a scam?
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Hehe. I wish I was living in Liechtenstein.
Nah. It's actually still Germany, though it used to be cut off from the rest in earlier days.
It's kind of the last small dot on the most detailed map you can find.
Büsingen? :)
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Büsingen? :)
Close but no cigar.
Lottstetten.
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Do you guys think that there are some of these Amiga 1200 or is it just wishful thinking?
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Because maybe it's a scam?
Fair point, you can easily generate good looking invoice and get some cash of ppl. Hopefully that won't happen.
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Fair point, you can easily generate good looking invoice and get some cash of ppl. Hopefully that won't happen.
While you're at it I'm still waiting for my $50 back, or a t-shirt & coupon. ;)
Would certainly like to believe these A1200's are real!
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If he used paypal or google wallet then nobody could get scammed. Can anybody prove this is real?
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Sooo nothing ? Still... ?
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A scam? In the Amiga world? Surely you jest.
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I sent an order email a couple of weeks back, and messaged him on facebook. No reply to either. Would be nice to know what's going on.
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Got friends on FB and observed his fat and ugly daughter ride a horse in a clowns outfit.. Unfriended.. Moved on!
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Got friends on FB and observed his fat and ugly daughter ride a horse in a clowns outfit.. Unfriended.. Moved on!
How is this relevant or necessary?
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Got friends on FB and observed his fat and ugly daughter ride a horse in a clowns outfit.. Unfriended.. Moved on!
How is this relevant or necessary?
A "bit" offtopic but still I laughed :D
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Got friends on FB and observed his fat and ugly daughter ride a horse in a clowns outfit.. Unfriended.. Moved on!
Damn, I would like to see a horse in a clown outfit carrying a fat kid.
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Got friends on FB and observed his fat and ugly daughter ride a horse in a clowns outfit.. Unfriended.. Moved on!
I went to his Facebook just to see these pictures, but couldn't find them. Rats! ;-p
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So has anyone actually recieved one of theses 1200's or a trackable confirmation e-mail or is it all just a BS hoax?
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So has anyone actually recieved one of theses 1200's or a trackable confirmation e-mail or is it all just a BS hoax?
Unless he starts selling them through a semi-reputable outlet (amibay, ebay, Amigakit) I wouldn't put my money down.
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Unless he starts selling them through a semi-reputable outlet (amibay, ebay, Amigakit) I wouldn't put my money down.
Yeah me neither.Sounds dodgy. Nigerian scam?:furious::laughing:
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Yeah me neither.Sounds dodgy. Nigerian scam?:furious::laughing:
No, it's legit. I was sent a money order for $15,000 and deposited it into my bank account, then returned the cash minus the $150 plus shipping. Should have it any day.
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Come on guys. Get with the program. This thread started 4 months ago, not a single product has been verified to exist, and you're still speculating as to whether or not this is a scam. You're a little slow on the draw as they say down here in Texas.
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No, it's legit. I was sent a money order for $15,000 and deposited it into my bank account, then returned the cash minus the $150 plus shipping. Should have it any day.
Waaaaaaaat??
:p
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Soon I have 5000 liters of finest Russian wodka just recovered from imperialist sunken Romanov yacht. If you have interest to buy, let me know. Pricing 150 Euro plus 19% VAT. Skol!
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:D why didnt u keep the 15000 :D
Lol
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I have just received the following email from Petro. It seems that the offer is going work out after all. :)
Here are some quotes from the email:
Dear Amigian friend:
First of all many thanks for your order dated x.xx.2012.
I am very happy that I am in the situation to supply to you 1x A 1200 Magic Pack.
At this time the shipment arrived Germany on 1st Nov 2012 is under custom inspection and will be after transported to our warehouse in Germany. After a short quality inspection, all units are manufactured in 1995, I will release the individual shipments.
Please be informed that this project is a NONE PROFOT ROJECT which I personal handle to make sure that my beloved Amiga Community will get some benefit and support.
Please be aware that all A 1200 Magic Pack are original packed and manufactured in 1995. This will be not a normal sales and A 1200 is only for your Retro computer Collection. Therefore I cannot take any risk or warranty for those A 1200. Of course all units are brand new and original packed, but all of them were stored in a warehouse since 1995 and in addition they just finished a long sea freight transport. So boxes could be also have some transportation signs… I guess all are working proper, but as described electronics are from 1995.
I am sure you will understand this circumstances. Just in case there are a lot of AMIGA Clubs and Retro computer Clubs around the world, which can support you, if you really have a problem.
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It's always nice to see a NONE PROFOT ROJECT in Amigaland.
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The lucky people should save them for under the Christmas tree along with some goodies from Amigakit, how many times in this day and age do you get to unbox a new A1200! :)
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If there were more NONE PROFOT ROJECT, the world would be a better place.
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If there were more NONE PROFOT ROJECT, the world would be a better place.
Social commentary... okay, I'll bite. If nobody worked for profit, then everyone would have to work until the day they die as they would have been unable to accumulate wealth necessary to subsist after his or her own working age or ability to work comes to an end. Additionally, since profit is part of the process which creates wealth, a profiting entity can therefore provide for others if he or she desires (charity,) including worker compensation beyond the actual value of the labor provided if so desired (extra wages, bonuses, parties, etc.)
While evil profiteers exist, profit in and of itself is not evil. No more than the hammer which builds the house is evil because of its ability to be used as a lethal weapon.
In Petro's case I believe the correct characterization of this scenario is to say he is taking a loss, without knowing if whether he is being compensated for his time or the costs of freight and customs.
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Social commentary... okay, I'll bite. If nobody worked for profit, then everyone would have to work until the day they die as they would have been unable to accumulate wealth necessary to subsist after his or her own working age or ability to work comes to an end. Additionally, since profit is part of the process which creates wealth, a profiting entity can therefore provide for others if he or she desires (charity,) including worker compensation beyond the actual value of the labor provided if so desired (extra wages, bonuses, parties, etc.)
While evil profiteers exist, profit in and of itself is not evil. No more than the hammer which builds the house is evil because of its ability to be used as a lethal weapon.
Profit is that amount of labour that the worker has stolen from him :swords:
Whether an item is sold for profit or not has nothing to do with whether the worker can retire or not.
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Profit is that amount of labour that the worker has stolen from him :swords:
The is the standard buffet. If a worker deems his labor worth $10 per hour, and he is thus paid, it is not theft if the item is sold for $11. Should the worker decide that his labor is worth more but that is unattainable in his current situation, then he has the right and the ability to change his situation by taking his assets (his experience and his labor) to another producer or to begin producing on his own.
Whether an item is sold for profit or not has nothing to do with whether the worker can retire or not.
Sure it does. Profit does not occur just at the point of final sale but at all points of production. This is partly what a value-added tax is meant to curtail. If a worker needs $10 an hour to make his expenses and he earns $10 per hour, then he possesses the ability to save up for neither charity nor retirement. If he makes $11 per hour then he has $1 to put aside for his own purposes, be it immediate involvement, charity, or retirement. To accommodate this the widget he produces would be sold at an amount more than the value of his labor. Additionally, the widget will incur an added value to facilitate profit at the level above his, and so on up the supply chain.
Contrary to over a hundred years of ideological thinking, profit is not evil. I will go even further to say that profit is what allows us, all of us, to maintain our own personal lives and hobbies. For if we never made profit on our labor or production, if we lived to provide only for our needs and the needs of others, then we would do nothing but labor from the time we wake until the time we rest.
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Whether an item is sold for profit or not has nothing to do with whether the worker can retire or not.
It does, actually.
Without profit, chances are the company wouldn't exist long enough to make it's employees make ends meet
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Who said anything about profit? He sad NONE PROFOT ROJECT.
Social commentary... okay, I'll bite. If nobody worked for profit, then everyone would have to work until the day they die as they would have been unable to accumulate wealth necessary to subsist after his or her own working age or ability to work comes to an end. Additionally, since profit is part of the process which creates wealth, a profiting entity can therefore provide for others if he or she desires (charity,) including worker compensation beyond the actual value of the labor provided if so desired (extra wages, bonuses, parties, etc.)
While evil profiteers exist, profit in and of itself is not evil. No more than the hammer which builds the house is evil because of its ability to be used as a lethal weapon.
In Petro's case I believe the correct characterization of this scenario is to say he is taking a loss, without knowing if whether he is being compensated for his time or the costs of freight and customs.
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The is the standard buffet. If a worker deems his labor worth $10 per hour, and he is thus paid, it is not theft if the item is sold for $11. Should the worker decide that his labor is worth more but that is unattainable in his current situation, then he has the right and the ability to change his situation by taking his assets (his experience and his labor) to another producer or to begin producing on his own.
He can. Of course this assumes he can go without a job while finding another, that unemployment is not 9-10%, that his skill set permits this, and that there are other employers in his field that he can apply to.
It is never a free interaction, when one man must work to avoid starving, and another man lives off the work of others.
In a "good" economy, the interaction is more fluid and approaches freedom to a higher extent (for example, near universal employment, or when there's aggressive competition between employers).
In "bad" times (high unemployment or monopoly of employers), it's merely serfdom with a human face.
Think the people who make our shoes and shirts have the freedom to go work another job?
Contrary to over a hundred years of ideological thinking, profit is not evil. I will go even further to say that profit is what allows us, all of us, to maintain our own personal lives and hobbies. For if we never made profit on our labor or production, if we lived to provide only for our needs and the needs of others, then we would do nothing but labor from the time we wake until the time we rest.
"Evil" is a nonsensical term. In economic and social situations, there's class interest and material realities.
It is not in the interest of the worker to have food sold at a profit from giant companies, when it could provided at virtually no cost to every citizen.
It is not in the interest of the corporation to have food available for free, as that would reduce the dependence of the worker on the corporation.
Neither is "evil" or "good", they are simply serving their respective class interests, as they must.
As far as whether we labour all day, ask in your average Foxconn plant. I imagine they'll have some answers that are different from our cushy western vantage point.
Without profit, chances are the company wouldn't exist long enough to make it's employees make ends meet
A publicly traded company must generate increasing profits, or it will be sued by it's shareholders.
A privately owned company can operate at a level where it can continue operations and pay it's workers, and many do.
Absence of profit does not indicate that losses are incurred.
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It does, actually.
Without profit, chances are the company wouldn't exist long enough to make it's employees make ends meet
Non profit organisations can make more money than their expenditure, it's just not allowed to be syphoned off by it's owners & instead has to be used to preserve the operation in a down turn or for expansion.
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Milan Lukac:
Great news Petro! Would it be possible to post some photos? Are those Amigas completely white, or some yellowing appears?
- Yesterday
Petro T. Tyschtschenko:
Still not in my warehouse...Petro T. Tyschtschenko
- Yesterday
Milan Lukac:
Thanks for info. Not a problem, we will wait :)
- Yesterday
Petro T. Tyschtschenko:
Thank you for understanding.. Best regards Petro T. Tyschtschenko
- Yesterday
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A 1200 Magic Pack Manaufactured 1995 in good conditions arrived today!
http://www.facebook.com/ptyschtschenko
Amiga A 1200 Magic Pack just arrived today, Shipment starts today
Amiga A 1200 Magic Pack sind heute angekommen. Ab heute wird ausgeliefert
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I think that should shut up a few people who were giving him a hard time!
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"new" amigas in 2012. Amazing stuff :)
There'll be some unboxing videos Im sure.
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How to buy one Amiga Magic Pack from mr. Petro?? Where to send e-mail? I want one :)
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Wow!
Thanks, VingtTrois, for posting the pictures here. For one, I don't use Facebook and can't really get any updates on what's going on.
Must be quite a feeling to have that load of brand-new A1200's around! :) This is getting very exciting!
Robert1234: there is an email address on page 4 of this thread.
Edit: I have now received my invoice from Petro!
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Woohoo ! Go Petro :)
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So it's either not a scam or someone's REALLY good at using photoshop!!
Im gonna say not a scam. It's cool that petro is selling these to the amiga community.Im tempted but I have just bought a cdtv and then there's the fpga arcade...
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How about timing fixes on these Amigas ? I mean in relation to use with ACAs.
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So, how much $$$ ? When? More info please . . . .
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500 new Amiga's in the market...pretty awesome. Would be cool if Amigakit could buy some of these in bulk.
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Ok, screw the small talk, I want one, maybe three right now. What do I do before I miss this train?
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Can someone tell me the measures of a Magic Pack box ?
Is it the same as A500 box (I have that one, so I can measure) ?
It's important to know in order to organize the transport...
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I have the exact same Magic Pack at home, can measure it - but afaik the width is smaller than my A500 cases, but the magic pack is then a little bit thicker.
Can someone tell me the measures of a Magic Pack box ?
Is it the same as A500 box (I have that one, so I can measure) ?
It's important to know in order to organize the transport...
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Thanks a lot man :)
I am eagerly awaiting the numbers !
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I think that should shut up a few people who were giving him a hard time!
I did post a bit of a jibe. Apologies in advance of the 60 new old A1200's. But it did take 5 months...
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Thanks a lot man :)
I am eagerly awaiting the numbers !
In centimeters:
60x47x14
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Thanks again :)
Much appreciated !
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Petro's been posting a bunch more photos on Facebook. Oh man, it's a beautiful site. :)
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"
Petro T. Tyschtschenko I sold in 1995 around 10 K A 1200 Magic Pack to a dealer abroad, and he still is my friend and we make a deal without any profit just for fun for the community.. I am 70 years young [iminent=R54eAMeUWfOB] now and love my Amiga from the first day on.. I am happy to make the community happy.. But it is not easy this time and in my age.. Anyway
"
At least we now we know how many 1200s made it to India :-).
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Obviously 60 units have already been sold or reserved (60 units and not 500???).
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"
Petro T. Tyschtschenko I sold in 1995 around 10 K A 1200 Magic Pack to a dealer abroad, and he still is my friend and we make a deal without any profit just for fun for the community.. I am 70 years young [iminent=R54eAMeUWfOB] now and love my Amiga from the first day on.. I am happy to make the community happy.. But it is not easy this time and in my age.. Anyway
"
At least we now we know how many 1200s made it to India :-).
I wonder where the rest are.
Also I apologise for my earlier cynical attitude and thank Petro for this.
Those NOS Amigas look beautiful I can smell the magic.
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I wonder where the rest are.
Also I apologise for my earlier cynical attitude and thank Petro for this.
Those NOS Amigas look beautiful I can smell the magic.
Well there was a market for these machines when they were sold there as Scala units for example, there is even still at least one company in india that are supporting them and has even made an accelerator card for it as can be seen here:
http://www.jonaphoto.com/amiga.php
http://www.jonaphoto.com/amiga-scroller.php
.
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Obviously 60 units have already been sold or reserved (60 units and not 500???).
Whee nead moar !
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That`s great!
I have no facebook account, how can I order one?
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Just sent an email with your address and a written statement (i. e. "I'd hereby like to order one Amiga 1200 Magic Pack for personal use") to amiga1200magic@gmail.com.
Could someone remind me again, btw? Do we have to pay upfront or will Petro fiercely hunt down whoever doesn't pay the invoice included with the package?
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Can anyone confirm how much they are?
PS. wanders off to eat some humble pie (sorry Petro for calling this vaporware).
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Yes you have to pay up front, they are not shipped until you pay. The total cost for mine (in GBP) was £171 which includes a £10 fee by my bank to send money abroad.
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Just ordered mine!
My collections of boyhood computers is complete!!!!!!
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I tried emailing amiga1200magic@gmail.com but I have received no response. Is this the UK version (QWERTY)?
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I tried emailing amiga1200magic@gmail.com but I have received no response. Is this the UK version (QWERTY)?
No.
It's the German version (QWERTZ).
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Mine arrived today. It is in fact a UK version - well mine is anyway. QWERTY keyboard and UK power supply. Overall I'm very happy with it - it all smells new and has obviously never been used. The software box is still sealed. Things to bear in mind if wanting to buy:
- There is discolouration to some of the cables (but NOT the Amiga - perfectly white.)
- The warranty seal on the bottom of the Amiga is broken (I assume to void the warranty.)
- Petro has not only signed the box, but also the Amiga. I would have preferred he hadn't personally, as I don't think it will come off :(
- It has obviously been moved around over the years, so don't expect the box and inserts to be perfect.
Overall, very happy with it though. Nice to open up a new Amiga for the first time since 1994 :)
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Mine arrived today. It is in fact a UK version - well mine is anyway. QWERTY keyboard and UK power supply. Overall I'm very happy with it - it all smells new and has obviously never been used. The software box is still sealed. Things to bear in mind if wanting to buy:
- There is discolouration to some of the cables (but NOT the Amiga - perfectly white.)
- The warranty seal on the bottom of the Amiga is broken (I assume to void the warranty.)
- Petro has not only signed the box, but also the Amiga. I would have preferred he hadn't personally, as I don't think it will come off :(
- It has obviously been moved around over the years, so don't expect the box and inserts to be perfect.
Overall, very happy with it though. Nice to open up a new Amiga for the first time since 1994 :)
Pictures ! Give us some pictures ! Now ! : )))
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OK here you go, don't want to unpack it all so just the one :)
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More pictures pretty please!
I am thinking of buying this, where I live A1200s go for near the same amount used with slight yellowing ^^
I would just use the case tho, since I got a NOS keyboard and my internal parts are from a C= miggy.
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Surely cheaper to Retr0bright your old case?
http://retr0bright.wikispaces.com/
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So I fired off an e-mail to amiga1200magic@gmail.com (amiga1200magic@gmail.com) about purchasing one of the magic packs. fingers crossed petro still has some left.
If some of the mooted hardware projects pan out then I could beef this a1200 up a lot. Anyone get a response from this e-mail address recently?
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I could have sworn this one was a myth.
Like the one about Ozzy Osborne having a freezer full of Rorer Quaaludes stashed away somewhere.
Damn.
That IS neat.
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Although Id REALLY like one or two of these - I just cant buy another unexpanded Amiga, seeing there was so much debacle about getting timing fixes done etc to use Jens otherwise probably excellent ACA accellerators - Id much prefer to buy these from a reseller already checked and expanded !!! But I guess thats not going to happen .. I wonder though where the other Amigas have gone, this initial batch seemed to be only 60 ? Good Amigas should really not go to waste in this PC world ! I say buy em all Vesalia or someone else :-) And let them ease out into the market before everyone forgets about Amigas and only use tablets :-/
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Mine arrived today.
- Petro has not only signed the box, but also the Amiga. I would have preferred he hadn't personally, as I don't think it will come off :(
If he used a Sharpie or something similar to sign the case, then rubbing alcohol applied with a cotton ball or Q-tip might remove it. If any of the ink is trapped in the embossed texture of the case, then using a alcohol and a soft tooth brush on it might get that out.
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Is this first batch (60) sold out ?
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^^^^^Well I have not yet got a response to my e-mail but it's only been 36 hours.
Maybe petro will respond when he has more a1200's.
He's supposed to have 500 so he must have plenty more.
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Well i just sent an email to Petro...hopefully he still has some new Amigas!!!
P.S
New here...nice to find an amiga community!
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Well it looks like I've missed out :-(
I emailed Petro straight away expressing my interest. I was on the list... I got an email asking for my shipping address, invoice address etc... I replied.... but not heard anything since...
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Well i just sent an email to Petro...hopefully he still has some new Amigas!!!
P.S
New here...nice to find an amiga community!
Welcome hellraiser.
Im just getting back into all things amiga myself.
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Surely he will transport more if those 60 sold out this quickly.
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Welcome hellraiser.
Im just getting back into all things amiga myself.
Thanks for the welcoming friend...
Was a proud owner of an amiga 500 with an 1084s monitor myself!Then was dumb enough to give it to a cousin of mine!
Hopefully I can get my hands on one of those unused amigas and start my collection too!:biglaugh:
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Must say i'm a bit disappointed with mine. It worked fully, but.
* Tape and autograph on the box and on the amiga.
* My can't be new. Box inside were open, Amiga has been opened for sure (guarantee sticker broken, missing a screw underneath).
* Box in not that good condition, yellowed psu.
Obviously, it could have been in better condition. or in worse. Was hoping for one in better. Just remember that when you order this it's a chance. (And the tape and the autograph i could have done without...)
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What's with the autograph? Does petro think he is some kind of hero to Amigan's or something?
Talk about ego!
I can't afford one anyway as I've spent too much on my 500's lately. :P
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The reason the machines are opened is so that Petro could install limited edition toenail clippings in each one.
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Despite being no. 44 on the list, I haven't yet received any word from Petro.
Emailed him twice now. Didn't hear back once.
Clearly, he can't have that much else to do.
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Clearly, he can't have that much else to do.
Why not?
desiv
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Why not?
desiv
Well. I don't think he works much those days.
And even if he does, answering an email takes no more than 5 minutes.
Oh well. Guess my dream of ever owning an Amiga 1200 will not fulfill itself after all :(
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Come on AmigaKit, contact Petro and buy the lot :)
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Come on AmigaKit, contact Petro and buy the lot :)
You mean, contact Petro, wait for the approaching of the year 2020 and buy a, by then, very dusty and probably leaked lot.
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Apparently Petro is on holiday ( according to his facebook page), the man is in his 70's for Christ sake, give him a break!
You spent the first half of the conversation thinking he was a con man and now you've spent the last part of the conversation crying because he's ignoring you!
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Apparently Petro is on holiday ( according to his facebook page), the man is in his 70's for Christ sake, give him a break!
You spent the first half of the conversation thinking he was a con man and now you've spent the last part of the conversation crying because he's ignoring you!
Errm, what?
I was one of the first to order on here. Why the heck would I call him a con man?
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Hey,
I wasn't dissing you specifically, just the general peevish nature of this thread, its so cynical on here some times. I don't know when you ordered yours but here's a run down of when I had contact from Petro.
7 Oct, contacted him asking to purchase one.
8 Oct, He replied saying I need to supply my address.
8 Oct Replied with my address.
24 Oct, He told me I will be invoiced on 15th Nov.
4 Nov, He emailed me from a different email address (Power service gmbh) asking me to confirm ,my address.
4 Nov I replied.
7 Nov, he sent me a scanned invoice
12 Nov, I replied that i had sent the dosh.
13 Nov, He replied with a thank you.
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Oh well. Guess my dream of ever owning an Amiga 1200 will not fulfill itself after all :(
Don't give up on your dream...
Believe it or not, most people here with Amiga 1200's didn't get them directly from Petro, so there are other options.. ;-)
desiv
(Took me months and months (more than 6, less than 12) of looking before I got my 1200)
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Surely cheaper to Retr0bright your old case?
http://retr0bright.wikispaces.com/
Wher I live I can not get my hands on what's needed for retrobright.
My case is not yellow but since I got a NOS keyboard I want the case to be just as bright :)
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I have just received my unit! :banana:
I sent my first email 3.10, got my order confimation on 4.11, receipt 7.11. I paid on the same day and the parcel was sent 12.11. I must say the ordering process was NOT the easiest and best-informed I have seen. I don't use Facebook so all information I got was thrue this thread.
Anyway, back to the Amiga itself. The parcel was huge! The Magic Pack itself was inside another box with lot of bubblewrap. The Magic Pack box itself was in quite nice condition.
I don't know if Petro had been the first person to open the box. The floppies are still in sealed and cables still tied. Both warranty-stickers are broken (the one on the bottom of the machine and one in the software package). Workbench disks were still sealed, too. There was some strange browning on the PSU's cables, not quite like yellowing from sun. Also the paper-backed manuals had some strange spots on them. Could be that the plastics and parts have somehow reacted to each other during the time the box has been in storage. Also the mouse had some goo on it, perhaps a rubber-band having melted in contact with the plastic.
During the ordering, I asked Petro if he could sign the box for me. I mentioned only the box and was surprised to see others here mentioning that also their Amigas were signed. So was mine. I concluded that I prefer to have my machine clean and tried to clean the signature off the machine. It went out easily with a paper towel and some IPA. No markings left on the machine. See pictures below for before-after.
The machine is in mint condition. Keyboard is totally clean and every connector really shines. I don't know if this means anything, but here is what the sticker on the Amiga says: A1200 GR. Model A1200 ID No.530318. Made in France. Keyboard is of QWERTY type (not QWERTZ as suggested in earlier pages of the thread).
The PSU (small, light 25W version) had a correct plug for me to just plug it in. I first plugged the PSU to mains and switched it on to see if it exploded (it didn't) but it did make a clicking noise. I decided to try the Amiga with a known-good PSU first. Cables in... monitor on... and power on! First, grey screen. After some seconds, still light gray screen. Hmm, oh well, no then... But hey, after some more time, there was the Kickstart screen! It's Kickstart 3.1, 40.068, by the way. The machine was alive! Further tests showed that even the original PSU works. While connected, it doesn't make any clicking sounds.
I tried couple of disks and the floppy drive works. It's also very silent. I played couple levels of Super Methane Brothers and everything seems to be working, audio is loud and clear and picture is as good as on my other A1200. As I write this, the machine has been running for about half and hour and is playing some MODs on the background.
After a couple of restarts, the machine still takes around 15-25 seconds to boot, which is much longer than my other A1200. Having seen only one A1200 before, I don't know if this is normal or not.
I haven't yet decided how I am going to equip this machine, at least a CF-hard disk should be put in and some RAM expansion.
With the tests I have done so far everything seems to be working. Opening a brand new Amiga was great experience and I really like to have the whole packaging and software.
All I can say is thank you, Petro, for making this possible. I hope more of these units are about to be put to sale and that as many Amiga fan as possible could get one of these. As Petro gets this thing running, who knows what other stuff is still waiting to be found?!
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Can someone help me understand the proper way to get one? Do we go through him only or is there a 3rd party that is going to handle further distribution?
If anyone bought a bunch, are they willing to sell one? I'm just a little confused and could use some guidance.
Thanks in advance
-Alex
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You have to send him an email, I think its mentioned somewhere earlier. You need to send him a request and your address and I imagine when he is ready he will reply in theory. According to his facebook he seem to be on holiday at the moment.
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Kickstart 3.1 takes almost 30 seconds to boot without a HD.
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Kickstart 3.1 takes almost 30 seconds to boot without a HD.
Yeah wasnt that due to checking for a HD on startup and not finding one ?
I believe the email is amiga1200magic@gmail.com
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Hi guys,
I've been reading this forum for a couple of years, but registered just a few days ago. I owned Amiga 500 and Amiga 1200 when I was young, but I sold them. Now, when I am almost 40, I decided to buy one again from Petro, as I missed a chance to buy NOS from Amigakit longer time ago.
Mine arrived on Thursday. For 17 years old machine it is in really great condition. I opened it and checked the capacitors, all looks like they would be made just yesterday, perfectly clean, no leakage whotsoever, the same PSU.
I had also some strange browning on the PSU and mouse cables, I just thought it was yellowed from sun, but then I tried with my fingers if it gets away, and it seems it was just some sort of dirt. I just cleaned them with towel and water.
I didn't have a time to check if everything works, I need to buy and install some HDD in it, but it boots without problems with provided PSU.
As for Petro's signature on the Amiga, it got away simply with pencil eraser.
Here are some pictures:
[ATTACH]2519[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]2520[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]2521[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]2522[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]2523[/ATTACH]
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Some more pictures:
[ATTACH]2524[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]2525[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]2526[/ATTACH] [ATTACH]2527[/ATTACH]
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Kickstart 3.1 takes almost 30 seconds to boot without a HD.
Ok, so it is normal then. Thanks. :)
lumi: Nice pictures. Also good to know that the caps are still looking good. I haven't yet opened my machine but will do it soon (as I install a hard drive).
I wonder why your kit has a different type of mouse. Mine is of the newer(?) type (see pic).
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I wonder why your kit has a different type of mouse. Mine is of the newer(?) type (see pic).
Yes, it seems yours is a newer one. I don't really know, maybe there were some different versions of Amiga 1200 Magic packs, or Petro exchanged it :)
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I'm not getting one of these A1200's (already have a couple of real Amigas), but it's really nice to see new-old-stock Amigas being opened again after all these years. It's also nice to think that the Amiga community might be growing a (very) little bit with these.
Savour the moment, folks! This is unlikely to ever happen again!
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Finally got an answer from him on Facebook.
Couldn't be angrier than I'm now.
Quote:
"I do not actively ignore people, neither on Facebook nor in emails. But he who comes too late is punished by life."
WTF?!
How can he even claim that way when I still have his freaking email saying otherwise?
How can he be so dishonest?
EDIT:
October 7, 2012:
Sie sind Nummer 44 es sind 60 Stück zu vergeben.. Herzlichst Verfügbar ab 15 Nov. Sie erhalten dann eine Rechnung.. Petro
Today (November 19, 2012) :
Hier wird keiner aktiv ignoriert.. Wer zu spät kommt bestraf das Leben.. Diesmal die Amiga 1200 Verteilung...
I guess I'll have to leave the classic Amiga community for good.
Programming a game on WinUAE only to later find out that what I've just developed will not run on a real Amiga is just no fun.
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Buy an original Commodore one, they work better.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Commodore-Amiga-1200-Boxed-800Mb-HDD-lots-of-games-/230883317810?pt=UK_VintageComputing_RL&hash=item35c1b7d832
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He just replied a second time.
Apparently, he confused me with someone else when he replied to me earlier that day.
Sent me an apology and is now trying to find me an Amiga 1200.
@tone007
Those things are hard to come by on the continent, unfortunately. Most of those seem to have ended up in the Americas and Britain.
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So not 500 then? Ah well he never responded to my e-mail but i can always get one later secondhand. I have a lovely cdtv and an fpga arcade board coming in the future so im good for now.
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Well, first report said 1,500 units. Then, 500. Now, 60?
Maybe they are melting during transport :D
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Well, first report said 1,500 units. Then, 500. Now, 60?
Maybe they are melting during transport :D
First report said 500 units!!!
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Pretty sure it was 1,500 :)
http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61762&highlight=petro
1,500 is the number Petro quoted to me.
EDIT: 1,500 units, not 15,000.
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Dear amiga community: as there are alot of wrong information around about the inventory of amiga1200magic pack, i would like to inform you:
1. I have started with one of my friend a none profit project on amiga 1200 magic pack manufactured in1995.
2. First action was to import 60 units of a1200 magic pack. This action is performed and 60 units are arrived in my warehouse.
3. Order could be placed on amiga1200magic@gmail.com
4. I received more than 100 orders
5. So i started my allocation according the date of order income
6. All 60 units now allocated and 53 are also shipped after payment.
7. Price was 150 euro plus tax, shipping and packaging.
8. As it was alot of work on logistic and administration, i am very happy this project is over.
9. I am very relaxed and satisfied to have done this action for my beloved amiga comminity
10. Even for no profit, i am happy and just thinking to continuing a new non profit project.
11. Product availability will be in january 2013.
12. If you are interested to buy, please place your order under amiga1200magic@gmail.com.
13. As soon as a1200 are available iwill start a new allocation according dates of order entry.
14. Oders could onky be accepted when name with full adress is shown on mail.
Best regards from germany, petro tyschtschenko, former president of amiga international
21 nov 2012
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No doubts from now on :laugh1: thanks Petro.
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Woohoo !
Go Petro go :)
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Thanks petro, I think I'll place an order to Sweden I January :)
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Petro I always believed you would deliver, and you did ! Today! woo B)
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Great news...Petro thank you for all the effort you put in supporting Amiga and its community.
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iirc I read somewhere that there was some minor issue with the floppy drives "on post Commodore" A1200's is this true of the 1995 vintage units and do these require "timing fixes" to run Jen's acceleration boards?
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iirc I read somewhere that there was some minor issue with the floppy drives "on post Commodore" A1200's is this true of the 1995 vintage units and do these require "timing fixes" to run Jen's acceleration boards?
Thats correct.
From memory the AI A1200 used a higher capacity PC drive where as the C= A1200's used a regular double density drive.
AI A1200's are revision 2B which from what I can gather nearly always require timing fixes.
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Thats correct.
From memory the AI A1200 used a higher capacity PC drive where as the C= A1200's used a regular double density drive.
AI A1200's are revision 2B which from what I can gather nearly always require timing fixes.
So what's the actual issue with the FDD's and is it a simple mod to fix?
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So what's the actual issue with the FDD's and is it a simple mod to fix?
I'm not sure but as you'd probably be using WHDload for gaming it shouldn't be an issue. According to the A1200 wiki page ESCOM released a circuit that fixed the issue, I'm not sure if there is another work around.
Are you thinking of getting an A1200 from Petro's next batch? ;-)
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I'd luv to buy one, not sure if I can afford it tho.
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Things have stabilized on my end, so Petro has my order in his queue. I'm hoping I can snag one.
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Is Petro the new redrumloa?
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Is Petro the new redrumloa?
+1 :D
The Truth: answer received today by Petro T. Tyschtschenko himself!
I gave him this Amiga.org (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=61870&page=13) link!
"I do not know what they are TALKING; BUT IT IS NOT TRUE! I received 60 units that is all.. Not even one unit more.. All 60 are allocated except 7, because i have not received the funds for those. If I do not receive the funds untill Monday, 26 Nov. I will cancel those 7 orders and ship to other Amigioans which are in the pipeline.. Maybe I order for January 2013 another 50 units.. That is all.. No stock with brand new A 1200 which I supplied worldwide any more.. Can you please stopp the forum to spred things which are not the facts.. Thank you and best regards Petro"
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That phrasing is interesting..
(And we have to consider how much 2nd hand reports and the language barrier is playing here...)
But Petro apparently said:
Maybe I order for January 2013 another 50 units
Hmm..
So, is it possible that someone found/has the XXXX number of A1200's, and Petro knows him and ordered 60 of them to resell??
Both stories could be true...
Why the person who has them is only selling to Petro and only in small batches? If true, who knows. At least the last part could be cost of shipping and up front money.
Still, good to see "new" Amigas in the eco-system. ;-)
desiv
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Can you please understand that I have only 60 units received.. There are no fivehundert around.. So please understand my situation.. Best regards Petro
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No, sir.. I only would like to do sum good things for our community.. Sometimes I have my doubts if I should do this.. Petro
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If I read your comment, I think I should stop my activity..
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Hi Petro!
A true honor to have you around. The machines you helped bring to market are loved so much that people can be nasty sometimes, do not let this get to you.
Thank you for all your contribution to the amiga, and for doing this community a service. Take good care.
(and please stay around)
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If I read your comment, I think I should stop my activity..
Not sure to whom you were talking, but NO, please don't stop! :-)
More Amiga's in the community is a great thing, and you've been great for the Amiga world!!!
Thanx again for all you've done, and thanx for stopping by an posting..
desiv
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Mr Petro
I'm an amiga user since my childhood, and it's a very special machine to me (specially Amiga 500 and 1200 wich have been with me since 1989 and 1993 respectively).
I'm not seeking to buy one of your units: I have 7 unused Amiga 1200 myself already, wich will keep me well served until I die (far, far in the future I hope!).
However, I want to THANK YOU, from the bottom of my heart, for what you're doing for us, informatic sons of the best desktop computer mankind has engineered. Please, DON'T allow the few bad educated persons who try to offend you damage your good intentions.
Please, keep the machines coming, if you can, AND if you enjoy doing it. It's probably the last time these machines are going on sale totally new! Keep it special!
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Can you please understand that I have only 60 units received.. There are no fivehundert around.. So please understand my situation.. Best regards Petro
I don't think anyone really doubts that, but there is some confusion about whether or not you are able to get more from the same source.
You could sell many more I think, even at a higher price.
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Petro,
Thank you. we all appreciate the hard work it takes to get something like this happening.
Cheers!!
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So, is it possible that someone found/has the XXXX number of A1200's, and Petro knows him and ordered 60 of them to resell??
The original post is called "Petro: 500 units new Amiga 1200 Magic Pac". So there are 500 of them then? I'm wondering about the economics of shipping from India to Germany for shipping again worldwide. Let's ask McEwen if he remembers where the last of the AI stock went and maybe we can just order them directly and cut out the middleman.
.edit.
I suppose I could read the whole original post because the quote in it from Petro on facebook is "Soon I will have 500 units new Amiga 1200 Magic Pack". 440 to go!
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500 may be the entire stock some company in a far away land is hoarding in a warehouse, and maybe they want far too much for them AND all the money up front.
I could go out tomorrow and get 10,000 Sony laptops at trade price but because the profit margin is so low and the money needs to be invested up front I would never do anything like that.
So for that reason Petro is to be commended for doing what he is doing.
(apart from signing the boxes...please stop doing that if the box is in mint brand new condition lol)
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Another possibility is that when Petro was first contacted he was told that there were 500, the folks who owned the warehouse saw a big pallet and thought it contained more than they though it did, but when they looked closely there were only 60.
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I've been tasked by Petro to inform you about a possible second shipment of another 60 machines due in early 2013 (late January, early February)
So yea. There will be another 60 machines.
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The original post is called "Petro: 500 units new Amiga 1200 Magic Pac".
It was the name of the original post on FACEBOOK, by Petro!
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I'd luv to buy one, not sure if I can afford it tho.[/QUOTE
Not to worry, I just picked up my brand new Amiga 1200 today from Petro! Sorry but I could not wait to open it. If I can make it to the next meeting I will bring it around:)
It fired up straight away without a hitch. All my software works that came with it, including some from the 80's. It was well packed and every thing was in pristine condition. There was only a bit off fading on book work and cords but who cares its the main unit itself that is important.
Finally I have upgraded from my A500 I bought when I was 14 to an A1200 at the age of 38!
Thanks Petro!
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Nice, I really should have bought a 1200 instead of my second 500! :p
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I bet your A500 runs rings around an A1200 by now. You have probably increased the turbo boost to 28 psi putting it on the edge.:sword
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Lol, I doubt it! :D
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Finally got my invoice. Thanks Petro. You're the best!
Now I only have to end this freaking business trip and get home in time to wire the money. :(
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I think I have the key of the broken warranty sticker enigma.
The sticker says mine is an A1200 FR but it doesn't have the French layout keyboard (AZERTY) but the UK one (QWERTY + 2 blank keys).
I therefore think the Amigas were open by some third party to switch the original keyboards to UK layout keyboards.
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Mine says A1200 GR on both at the bottom of the A1200 and on the sticker at the top of the floppy disk drive. And my warranty sticker was broken.
One point of interest, what are the serial numbers of your A1200s? Mine is "Model A1200 ID No. 530318" and the sticker says:
A1200
GR
5640696530318040068402
Btw; inside my unit there is a stamped date inside the top-cover (next to the LED-board) saying 05 DEC 1995. Only a couple of more days until the 17th birthday of my A1200! :knuddel:
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Well maybe yours was originally a GReek A1200 :)
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Well maybe yours was originally a GReek A1200 :)
He better watches his back or it will rob him blind :grins:
@topic
Seems like Petro is in full force since he returned from the US.
Already replied to my Facebook message, saying it was ok for the payment to go out a bit later.
Can't wait to hold that little masterpiece in my arms. For me those old computers are really akin to the 8th Wonder of the Ancient World. Amiga did a tremendously fine job. Especially when compared to today's hardware, which seldom lasts two years.
Anyways. Can't wait to create my first game on it. It will either be a classical point and click adventure or a pre-rendered game like Myst (I've really got the 3D itch lately. Especially after finding out about that early Cyan masterpiece, The Manhole. 3D really can be another form of art. Except of 3D animation. That's just a huge pain in the butt ;) ).
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He better watches his back or it will rob him blind :grins:
Maybe you should own too a Greek amiga so it can teach you manners and stop you from making racist comments like a moron...:whack:
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Over 25000 views for this thread.
The new Gangnam style? :D
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Let's ask McEwen if he remembers where the last of the AI stock went and maybe we can just order them directly and cut out the middleman.
Doubt he'd know. Mcewen claimed all stock of Amiga's were missing/stolen from the warehouses when he arrived in Germany to collect them.
http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost.php?p=695237&postcount=77
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Maybe you should own too a Greek amiga so it can teach you manners and stop you from making racist comments like a moron...:whack:
Talk about being oversensitive.
Can't take a joke, can you?
Racialist? When did Greek become a race?
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Only a moron like you could think that calling Greeks thieves is a joke...maybe you could tell us your ethnicity so we can make similar jokes!I am sure you'd fancy those!
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Thanks petro, I think I'll place an order to Sweden I January :)
Yes it could be cool to get a brand new Amiga 1200 :) I hope that there are more on the way.
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Greeks are good people, like anyone !
Its the banksters that are the problem ! If the banking cartels in the west werent so desperate to avoid losses there would be no problem with all these "saving plans". Its the western banks that the saving plans are for.
And I can understand Greeks being a little touchy with the serious situation there now.
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Talk about being oversensitive.
Can't take a joke, can you?
Racialist? When did Greek become a race?
While there's no scholarly consensus on whether or not racism per se extends to groups other than distinct races, we're not scholars. I believe any form of derogatory ethnic stereotyping would fall under "racism" as far this forum's rules are concerned and as a moderator, our judgements on the guidelines we have are final. It's says so in the T&C.
So, consider this a friendly warning. Joke or not, it's not cool and not welcome.
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Only a moron like you could think that calling Greeks thieves is a joke...maybe you could tell us your ethnicity so we can make similar jokes!I am sure you'd fancy those!
Dude. Chill out.
It was a f reaking joke. Nothing like other cultures don't do regularly.
And robbing someone blind is just a saying. It doesn't mean someone's a thief per se.
If it meant that, I'd better go and think about sueing my bank, my employer and my government.
As for my whereabouts: I'm an English residing in Germany. A large part of my ancestry is from different parts of Europe. Including but not limited to the Netherlands, Germany and Sicily. Nothing you could ever possibly say about any part of my ancestry is going to shock ,let alone hurt, me.
I don't even want a share in all this bloody national pride silliness. In the end, national pride is only serving the wealthy and powerful. It's a means of controlling the ignorant masses. That wholly unnecessary talk about cultural sensitivities you started pretty much proved this. Intellectual proficiency went wasted and you took precious time (time that could've been spent dealing with more severe -- not to say factual -- issues) not only from me but yourself as well.
@Karlos
Understood.
I'll try to stay away from the more "British" form of joke and mockery in the future, since it apparently does not sit well with everyone.
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Mine says A1200 GR on both at the bottom of the A1200 and on the sticker at the top of the floppy disk drive. And my warranty sticker was broken.
One point of interest, what are the serial numbers of your A1200s? Mine is "Model A1200 ID No. 530318" and the sticker says:
A1200
GR
5640696530318040068402
Btw; inside my unit there is a stamped date inside the top-cover (next to the LED-board) saying 05 DEC 1995. Only a couple of more days until the 17th birthday of my A1200! :knuddel:
Model A1200 ID No.530318
A1200 GR 2641296530318040084587 on bar code sticker
Made in France.
I guess there are various brand new Amiga parts all over the world.
Usually there are requirements by law in various countries that you have to warehouse spare parts for a certain amount of years for warranty purposes etc.
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Considering Sony stopped stocking Blu-Ray drives and mainboards for first generation 60GB PS3 consoles only 3 years after the initial introduction, this time period can't be that long.
So at this point there's only one acceptable explanation for all this: Petro is a god/wizard. :)
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Considering Sony stopped stocking Blu-Ray drives and mainboards for first generation 60GB PS3 consoles only 3 years after the initial introduction, this time period can't be that long.
Sony is still a functioning company (just about) and only needed to keep parts around until the end of the warranty period (then sold remaining parts to third party repair companies I imagine) - Commodore died, leaving warranty parts festering around the world that were never used to fix/replace dying A1200s (or A1200s turned out to be very reliable).
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Sony is still a functioning company (just about) and only needed to keep parts around until the end of the warranty period (then sold remaining parts to third party repair companies I imagine) - Commodore died, leaving warranty parts festering around the world that were never used to fix/replace dying A1200s (or A1200s turned out to be very reliable).
My post was in response to cameng's.
If there are indeed such laws, companies like Sony are either breaking them or the period as marked in those is rather short.
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Quick question: Will the picture quality on a 28" CRT TV connected to the Amiga over an RGB Scart cable be any good (comparable to other devices -- like the Sega Genesis or the original XBOX -- connected that way)?
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Quick question: Will the picture quality on a 28" CRT TV connected to the Amiga over an RGB Scart cable be any good (comparable to other devices -- like the Sega Genesis or the original XBOX -- connected that way)?
Ive tried and its pretty good by my standards :-D Atleast in the default resolution.
I had some problems with such a cable on a LCD TV and my A500 though.. White screen and audio filters smoked. Dont know if it was just the computer or something wrong with the cable. Had to replace mobo until I get the skills to solder new components on the A500 board.
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Delighted to say mine arrived this afternoon....
I don't think I have been this excited since I bought my first A500
:banana:
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Commodore died, leaving warranty parts festering around the world that were never used to fix/replace dying A1200s (or A1200s turned out to be very reliable).
Commodore didn't do their own warranty repairs in the UK, I don't know how many spares they carried but they were still offering repairs and extended warranties after commodore went bankrupt.
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Petro is about to dispatch my device.
Can't wait to write my first Amiga app in a long time.
Look out folks: fresh trashware coming your way in 2013 ;)
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Well, Petro still hasn't replyed to my email for the January order. Maybe he's waiting for the new batch to arrive.
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I am also on the list for the January order... haven't heard from him sense.
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Mine arrived just a few days ago.
I dunno how Petro did it, but it really is in pristine condition. That big white Amiga box (the one containing the software bundle) is pretty much the only thing that looks like time wasn't quite kind to it.
The mouse, computer and PSU (I've got the white one. Made in India) and everything else looks astonishingly good though.
I still haven't had time to set it up though, so it's currently sitting on my table waiting for someone to power it on.
On another, unrelated note: I found out my local dump was basically hoarding old computers. A friend of my former boss told me he saw a bin full of C64s, C128s and all kinds of Amiga computers.
This was a couple of weeks ago though. Still gonna call them tomorrow. Hopefully, they didn't get rid of them yet. Would be a pleasant surprise if I could not only get some spare replacements and/or upgrades for my new baby but also save some of those computers*
*It just makes me sad to think that some people would just throw them away like they were a bunch of no good laptops. Those things have a soul. They ain't the throwaway stuff people buy today only to get rid of them them again 1-2 years later. Throwing such precious little computers away is like child abuse, if not worse.
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On another, unrelated note: I found out my local dump was basically hoarding old computers. A friend of my former boss told me he saw a bin full of C64s, C128s and all kinds of Amiga computers.
This was a couple of weeks ago though. Still gonna call them tomorrow. Hopefully, they didn't get rid of them yet. Would be a pleasant surprise if I could not only get some spare replacements and/or upgrades for my new baby but also save some of those computers*
*It just makes me sad to think that some people would just throw them away like they were a bunch of no good laptops. Those things have a soul. They ain't the throwaway stuff people buy today only to get rid of them them again 1-2 years later. Throwing such precious little computers away is like child abuse, if not worse.
I hope you manage to save them. Test them, stick them on eBay and find them a new home. :)
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I hope you manage to save them. Test them, stick them on eBay and find them a new home. :)
Well. If I manage to save them, I'll probably keep some (would be great to have an original C64 again. Especially as I never managed to mod my C64DTV) and sell the rest on here.
Never been much of a fan of Ebay.
Sure. Would be nice to find a sucker on Ebay who'd pay me a fortune so I could stock up on expansions for my Amiga and perhaps a MorphOS machine. But is it really worth the hassle? I mean, how many Ebay sellers actually end up earning that kind of money? The great majority probably loses money to Ebay.
EDIT: Will ZorRam/BigRAMPlus actually be recognized by an Amiga 1200 with a Z3i busboard? Would be quite cool to have that sort of RAM in an Amiga 1200. Furthermore, do you guys think it would be difficult to place a modern mechanical keyboard inside an Amiga 1200 desktop case? I consider towerizing mine in the future which, in return, would leave the original case an empty shell.
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As it's another identical sized nice round figure of 60 arriving I am pretty confident it's a case of piece-meal selling and the upfront costs of 60 at a time are what Petro is happy with in order to run this operation.
I'm not sure I really want a new A1200. I have a Commodore A1200 from the very first day of launch in UK and well, it ain't really my thing for collecting. I think the disappointment in the AGA games has made me lose interest in the machine two decades later.
However, I know how happy this would make other people who DO like the A1200 enough. I picked up a beautifully preserved Commodore PET that looks brand new and I have been as happy as a spliffhead all day even though it still needs some tinkering to fire it up.
Petro is doing humanitarian work AFAIAC because ANYTHING is better than an X86 PC OR Mac as far as charm/character/fun factor goes. Who wants to run a load of balls like Win8 or OSX apart from weirdos? ;)
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Well. If I manage to save them, I'll probably keep some (would be great to have an original C64 again. Especially as I never managed to mod my C64DTV) and sell the rest on here.
Never been much of a fan of Ebay.
Sure. Would be nice to find a sucker on Ebay who'd pay me a fortune so I could stock up on expansions for my Amiga and perhaps a MorphOS machine. But is it really worth the hassle? I mean, how many Ebay sellers actually end up earning that kind of money? The great majority probably loses money to Ebay.
I get a lot of stuff off there (picked up a PET and a C128D this year). There are some bargains and a lot of fair sellers. I mainly suggested it because it does reach a wide audience and if you save some machines and test them then I think you deserve some pay for your time and effort. Just start the bidding low, be realistic on the shipping and don't "BUY IT NOW - $3000!". :D
EDIT: Will ZorRam/BigRAMPlus actually be recognized by an Amiga 1200 with a Z3i busboard? Would be quite cool to have that sort of RAM in an Amiga 1200. Furthermore, do you guys think it would be difficult to place a modern mechanical keyboard inside an Amiga 1200 desktop case? I consider towerizing mine in the future which, in return, would leave the original case an empty shell.
There are some internal A1200 keyboard adapters that allow for a PS2 keyboard. You'll just need to hunt for one that you can fit in the existing space with minimal cutting and run the cable inside.
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I got my 1200 last weekend and that baby looks pristine. Nothing to complain. The psu cable and mouse cable are a little darkened, probably due to heat and age, but with isopropanol that layer comes off. Some screws missing, but thats no big deal. The software package is sealed, the books look nice and white.
Now i am playing with the thought of getting this one expanded. Anyone has experience with bvision and the ppc without needing to upgrade to a tower? And how much slower will it be than the cyberstorm/cybervisionppc in an a 4000?
Had a 4000t with ppc in the 90s, remember live preview raytraced renderings, forgot to name of the program...
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I get a lot of stuff off there (picked up a PET and a C128D this year). There are some bargains and a lot of fair sellers. I mainly suggested it because it does reach a wide audience and if you save some machines and test them then I think you deserve some pay for your time and effort. Just start the bidding low, be realistic on the shipping and don't "BUY IT NOW - $3000!". :D
Ok. I'll consider it.
Probably gonna open up a thread and link to Ebay from there.
As for pricing: If I can find an Amiga 500 and decide not to keep it, it will go for $100US buy now. If that's not too much.
If I can find an Amiga 1000 though, people will have to dump my dead body in a lake before I'll leave my hands of it (I wanted one ever since finding out about Jay Miner's and Mitchie's signatures). ;)
There are some internal A1200 keyboard adapters that allow for a PS2 keyboard. You'll just need to hunt for one that you can fit in the existing space with minimal cutting and run the cable inside.
I'd rather get rid of the internal keyboard components.
It's actually the only thing I don't like about my new Amiga 1200. The handling is just really bad. Worse than that of many modern keyboards. I get like zero response.
I kinda imagined it to be clicky.
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Ok. I'll consider it.
Probably gonna open up a thread and link to Ebay from there.
As for pricing: If I can find an Amiga 500 and decide not to keep it, it will go for $100US buy now. If that's not too much.
If I can find an Amiga 1000 though, people will have to dump my dead body in a lake before I'll leave my hands of it (I wanted one ever since finding out about Jay Miner's and Mitchie's signatures). ;)
Sounds like a plan :)
I'd rather get rid of the internal keyboard components.
It's actually the only thing I don't like about my new Amiga 1200. The handling is just really bad. Worse than that of many modern keyboards. I get like zero response.
I kinda imagined it to be clicky.
My main machines (Minimig, FPGA Arcade, A4000 (tower) and A1200 (tower)) all use PC keyboards so I'm kind of used to them now. My wedge A1200 is on a shelf. Only the A2000 and A3000 have their original keybaords in use and I think they're a better quality than the A1200 or perhaps it is just the design.
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Sounds like a plan :)
My main machines (Minimig, FPGA Arcade, A4000 (tower) and A1200 (tower)) all use PC keyboards so I'm kind of used to them now. My wedge A1200 is on a shelf. Only the A2000 and A3000 have their original keybaords in use and I think they're a better quality than the A1200 or perhaps it is just the design.
I don't know about the Amiga 3000, but at least the Amiga 2000 keyboard was available with Cherry MX switches which were quite tactile.
Personally, I'd love to own an Amiga with IBM style buckling springs. If it's even possible to fit those inside an Amiga 1200 case.
So to sum it all up: The Amiga of my dreams would be a towerized Amiga 1200 with a 80MHz 68060, several hundred MB RAM (recently read about people adding more RAM by adding Radeon 9000 series cards to their Amigas), two 1TB HDDs and a Voodoo 5 5500 (my favourite GPU of all times) all snugged inside an oversized Amiga 1000 replica case with the signatures of Jay Miner and Mitchy glued to the front. Lol.
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Did anyone else find his NOS Amiga 1200 to be a POS?
Mine won't boot from any floppy and a guy in another forum complains about his Amiga not recognizing any accelerators*.
Makes me wonder if I shouldn't have bought a used Amiga on Ebay for about the same price instead. Now I might end up spending several hundred euros on repair bills (I do hope mine will accept accelerators, but if it doesn't, I'm probably sol? No way to fix this without investing in a new mainboard, right?)
*Replacing the Elcos seemed to make matters worse for this guy, as the machine will now crash on the Kickstart screen whenever he's got an accelerator installed.
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No problems with mine, the accelerator not working could be due to timing problems with AT A1200 motherboards possibly.
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No problems with mine, the accelerator not working could be due to timing problems with AT A1200 motherboards possibly.
I thought this only applied to Jen's expansions and not the ones from Phase5/DCE/GVP?
So would this prevent the Amiga from booting altogether? I thought it just made the system unstable but still bootable.
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I had an Amiga Tech A1200 back in the day, and it wouldn't work with a BPPC card I had, oddly it did work with an apollo 040 / 40 mhz card.. From what I can see its always been an issue with 1D4 and 2B motherboards.
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I had an Amiga Tech A1200 back in the day, and it wouldn't work with a BPPC card I had, oddly it did work with an apollo 040 / 40 mhz card.. From what I can see its always been an issue with 1D4 and 2B motherboards.
Ok. So it will need the timing fix then, right?
Makes me somewhat happier again. Really feared it would be a busted mainboard.
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Maybe have a chat to AmigaKit if you are in the UK, they did mine for me.
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As I've said before, sorry but anybody buying one of his NOS Amigas has no right to complain. He said they had been sitting in a warehouse for 15 years, and that they were untested. If you wanted one to play with, you should have bought a used tested one for a fraction of the price from eBay.
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True :)
That said, I would still take a risk with one of the NOS Amigas.
But no, I would not complain if they didn't work.
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The worst case scenario probably the caps have dried out and need replaced.
Is probably about time these motherboards are serviced anyway.
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As I've said before, sorry but anybody buying one of his NOS Amigas has no right to complain. He said they had been sitting in a warehouse for 15 years, and that they were untested. If you wanted one to play with, you should have bought a used tested one for a fraction of the price from eBay.
Why is everyone so protective about Petro?
Sure. Good work at bringing us NOS Amigas and I think most of us who purchased one did read the disclaimer.
Here's the thing though.
He never mentioned that these supposedly NOS Amigas came with a whole bunch of retroactively fitted parts. I mean, just from looking at the manuals inside the Magic Pack software bundle you can tell those have been thrown in used (lots of stains on them). The Amigas have also been taken out of their package at least once before being shipped (the seal on the back has been broken and the case looks like it has been cleaned).
Lastly, what I (a former student of European economics) find rather disturbing is the fact that he (as a CEO of a company) doesn't really seem to know a lot about EU consumer laws.
If someone was willing to sue him, I'm sure this person would've a good chance to win the case.
The disclaimer that could be found on any of his invoices is very much at odds with EU directive 1999/44/EC, which outlines a seller's obligation to take returns on faulty items for 2 years (due to some technicalities, it actually comes down to only a six month period upon which the consumer may return faulty items at all times with no penalties applied. But that's a different story altoghether).
Worse still, some national laws (including the law of the country Petro has set up business in) grant consumers a 14 day right of withdrawal on any physical good bought online*.
What I basically want to say with all this is that while I'm certainly grateful he made this possible, he should try to learn a thing or two about today's business laws before getting his current company into legal troubles.
*What makes this the worse part (from a sellers point of view), is the fact that his inability to inform costumers of this right lead to an extension to 30 months (German law) or one year (if that EU directive is already in place. I'm admittedly a bit rusty myself).
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I believe he even charges Vat which makes the sales "official" and liable to European consumer laws.
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I believe he even charges Vat which makes the sales "official" and liable to European consumer laws.
Yes he does.
He even sold these under his company name.
Power Service GmbH could get into serious trouble because of this, as the whole practice could be understood as money laundering by some.
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He never mentioned that these supposedly NOS Amigas came with a whole bunch of retroactively fitted parts. I mean, just from looking at the manuals inside the Magic Pack software bundle you can tell those have been thrown in used (lots of stains on them). The Amigas have also been taken out of their package at least once before being shipped (the seal on the back has been broken and the case looks like it has been cleaned).
Well you have certainly changed your tune since post #245 when you were praising Petro for the computer being in such pristine condition.
The packaging manuals, floppies sitting in a warehouse for 15+ years I would imagine should look a little worn by now.
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Well you have certainly changed your tune since post #245 when you were praising Petro for the computer being in such pristine condition.
The packaging manuals, floppies sitting in a warehouse for 15+ years I would imagine should look a little worn by now.
That was before I unpacked the rest of the unit, actually.
The Amiga itself is in pristine condition (even though I've now found out that this may be due to aforementioned modifications). However, everything inside the Magic Pack bundle looks extremly dirty.
Shockingly, neither the outer packaging nor the Amiga/Amiga Workbench manuals look anywhere near as bad.
Which bears the question: How can the interior look that much worse than the packaging, if everything is, supposedly, NOS.
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Don't go there people. Seriosly. You will ruin the second batch deal for us who do want them.
We all understood what these unearthed Amigas were, and nobody claimed otherwise. Petro even emphasized that he could not guarantee anything. So it's a risk. Take it or leave it. If someone expects brand new Amigas with 2 year guarantee in 2012/13 then he should think again.
Don't act like brats.
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Don't go there people. Seriosly. You will ruin the second batch deal for us who do want them.
We all understood what these unearthed Amigas were, and nobody claimed otherwise. Petro even emphasized that he could not guarantee anything. So it's a risk. Take it or leave it. If someone expects brand new Amigas with 2 year guarantee in 2012/13 then he should think again.
Don't act like brats.
No one is acting like a brat.
Fact is, there never was a risk for anyone of us. The only one who claimed otherwise was Petro and he, quite frankly, has the obligation to offer two years of sales warranty (effectively six months, as pointed out earlier) and accept returns for a minimum of 14 days.
Personally, I don't care what some weird disclaimer says, knowing full well my rights as a citizen of the European Union.
The disclaimer could, as well, have asked me to agree to live a life of servitude and it wouldn't have made much of a difference.
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Come on man, this is Amigaland. You know how stuff are. And these are 15 years old machines.
If you really don't like the agreement then you should have cleared it with Petro before buying. And not make the purchase if he stands firm. We don't need more hate in the ever small community.
I can understand this purchase hasn't met your expectations, but please take the time to think a bit about it.
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Perhaps he should have doubled his price to cover himself? Would everyone have been happy then?
And where exactly can you find 1200s for a "fraction of the price" on eBay?
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Perhaps he should have doubled his price to cover himself? Would everyone have been happy then?
And where exactly can you find 1200s for a "fraction of the price" on eBay?
I don't know what you're unto with that, but
a) There are things other than pricing to cover oneself. Otherwise, how would you explain the prosperity of smaller electronic stores in Europe?
b) It wasn't that cheap. In fact, three mint bundles were sold on Ebay.co.uk the very same day I paid for mine, all going for just as much (if not less) than the ones he sold.
Perhaps that stuff is simply more expensive in the US, but here in Europe (especially in the UK) we can have Amiga 1200s for quite a bit less than the 200 euros he asked for.
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I don't know what you're unto with that, but
a) There are things other than pricing to cover oneself. Otherwise, how would you explain the prosperity of smaller electronic stores in Europe?
It's not rockets science. If he's going to sell 15 year old hardware that's been sitting in a warehouse and has to warranty it for 2 years and offer a return policy, he has to increase his price to cover himself. If not pricing, how exactly does he do that?
As far as I can see he was very honest about everything, and though I doubt he is making NO money on it I doubt he is making much. And good for him if he is making some.
Was it a risky purchase? Yes, but he was very upfront about the risk. That's why I certainly didn't order one. But you can't take a gamble like that and then cry if things don't come out perfect.
b) It wasn't that cheap. In fact, three mint bundles were sold on Ebay.co.uk the very same day I paid for mine, all going for just as much (if not less) than the ones he sold.
Perhaps that stuff is simply more expensive in the US, but here in Europe (especially in the UK) we can have Amiga 1200s for quite a bit less than the 200 euros he asked for.
It wasn't "cheap", and I can't speak for UK prices, but in the US 1200s sell for decent money - $150+ for non-working ones, and $400+ for working ones with a couple accessories. Sounds like a fair price. And if it's NOT a fair price, why in the world would you order one to begin with?
I understand ordering one, and I understand not ordering one - but what I don't understand is ordering one then complaining about things that were very much expected. Sour grapes I guess.
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Just leave it be, Kremlar.
You obviously don't understand enough about European consumer laws.
If everyone else has to cover 15 year old electronics (and much older stuff, as well), I don't see why he wouldn't be forced to either. After all, he wasn't shy when it came to VAT*.
Furthermore, I didn't say the price wasn't fair. It certainly would've been fair for a working NOS Amiga with warranty (used ones I've seen that day were actually going for 90-120 quid, albeit most of them only included Kickstarter 3.0, hence I didn't buy one. Out of the three bundles, two came with a EU sales warranty though. The last one being sold privately).
And again. It wasn't a risky purchase. Not by a far stretch. Not by any EU consumer law.
He will have a liability to his customers for at least the next 5 months. No matter what he says or does. Nothing can change that. The law is very clear on that.
*You simply don't charge VAT when you are trying to sell something privately.
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You obviously don't understand enough about European consumer laws
You obviously don't understand basic math. If he needs to provide that kind of warranty, his selling price has to go up to cover it. What would you prefer? A dramatically increased price, or a much lower price and more of a gamble? Pick your poison.
I'm not saying what he did was right or wrong by EU law, what I'm saying is that as far as I can see there was no deception. Everyone knew what they were buying, he was very up front, and if they cry sour grapes afterwards and press him to warranty something he sold "as-is" that's pretty ****ty. If nothing else it will ruin it for people who want him to provide more units in the future.
Doesn't matter to me either way, not something I was interested in buying - all I know is I see an awful lot of happy people buying these systems and lots of people wanting more.
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If the invoice/sales docket says the item is 2nd hand then all consumer law relating to new items is rendered moot, only any laws covering sales of 2nd hand gear applies.
Euro consumer protections are very similar to Aussie ones, we have 7 days (14 in some states) to return a defective item even on 2nd hand gear - only exception is if was sold in unknown or not working condition, then it's buyer beware.
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If the invoice/sales docket says the item is 2nd hand then all consumer law relating to new items is rendered moot, only any laws covering sales of 2nd hand gear applies.
Almost correct.
Our consumer laws also cover used items.
The only difference between a used item and a brand new one is that the seller may reduce the warrany time-window to a 12 month term (which doesn't really alter anything, since it's almost impossible to return something after the first 6 months anyways*).
He will have to outline this before the sale is conducted, otherwise the usual 24 months apply.
*You'd have to pay an expert to prove that the good already showed signs of this fault during the first 6 months, which almost never works and costs more than most standard consumer good.
Euro consumer protections are very similar to Aussie ones, we have 7 days (14 in some states) to return a defective item even on 2nd hand gear - only exception is if was sold in unknown or not working condition, then it's buyer beware.
We have 14 days to return an item, regardless if it's defective or we simply don't like it anymore (postage is paid by the buyer, if the product is either bulky or cost less than 40 euros).
The not in working condition clause is also renderered mood by the fact that VAT was applied. Defective goods are tax exempt.
@Kremlar
I would prefer no 3
- Not behaving like an ignorant sheep, selling something in a way that is against the very law of the country he set up shop in.
I wouldn't even complain, had he not charged VAT and, in all certainty, written off expenses.
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This is hilarious. Seriously, if you're the kind of person who even considers playing the 'consumer laws' card when dealing with 20 year old computers that have been sitting in a warehouse for 15 years, retro computing probably isn't for you.
FYI, the warranty seals on the bottom of all of the Amiga's were broken YEARS ago when the company went bust and the units were resold as dead stock, because a company that doesn't exist cannot offer a warranty. There is no scam or conspiracy here, they're just a load of old odd Amiga's, and some of them are bound to have issues after so long. If you're not willing to take that risk, buy a tested one from Amibay or something.
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While I don't expect to get a warranty, I would expect that at least these are checked before shipping (just switch the thing on, and boot a disk, that's all). Not having a warranty I find acceptable, DOA I don't.
Edit: Also, why is he charging VAT?
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FYI, the warranty seals on the bottom of all of the Amiga's were broken YEARS ago when the company went bust and the units were resold as dead stock, because a company that doesn't exist cannot offer a warranty. There is no scam or conspiracy here, they're just a load of old odd Amiga's, and some of them are bound to have issues after so long. If you're not willing to take that risk, buy a tested one from Amibay or something.
And what's the explanation for the missing screws under the Amigas, for the UK keyboard layouts which don't match the stickers under the units, for the rubber pads which are dirty, for the open software boxes inside... ?
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Yeap its confirmed...Petro is a fraud.
People don't buy any Amigas from the second batch so me and other suckers can get our hands on one of those.
P.S
Today he posted on facebook that the second batch and its allocation will start on the 20th of January...let's hope that Petro sells them this time to people who can appreciate them.
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People don't buy any Amigas from the second batch so me and other suckers can get our hands on one of those.
This :)
Has he confirmed how much of them are coming ?
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@edd_jedi
FYI. I'm not talking about a guarantee (which is what you're obviously referring to. Not sure if you know the difference, but thought it was worth pointing out) but about a basic (sales) warranty.
It doesn't matter if the company which manufactured the units still exists or not. A warranty is extended from the trader towards the costumer. Every basic good purchased on a non-private level (i. e. not sold from one individual to the next but through a legal body such as a company is) comes with 24 months of warranty and, if purchased online, the basic right to return it within 14 days.
@Everblue
I'd agree to the stance of not offering any warranty, had he sold these units himself.
Instead, he charged VAT, wrote them off and whatnot.
Considering the many ways he and his company have of making some money of these units, he probably made at least double of what he sold them for (if the company is just as thorough as I think every company would be in such an economic climate and with the many loopholes in place).
@mc68070
Exactly.
These units were either refurbished years ago or Power Service GmbH (the legal body which sold them under orders of Petro, the current CEO) did indeed check them (and even replaced a few, cheap basic parts) but dispatched broken units nontheless.
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@Lord Aga
He didn't say but previously he mentioned that the second batch would consist of 50 Amigas.
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@Blinx123
Ok I have heard enough of this, what exactly are you going on about here? You know that he sold them as is, and you know they the hardware is ancient. One thing is coming on here and trying to get ideas about how to fix your hardware another thing is coming on here and complaining that the hardware that was sold to you 'as is' 'is as'.
I also do not like the way you have constantly been on petros case over this, this guy who has basically done many of us a massive favour when he could have just not given a s**t about the amiga community.
Good luck with taking him to the european court of human rights!
PS All the caps on my Petro 1200 were fine.
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And what's the explanation for the missing screws under the Amigas, for the UK keyboard layouts which don't match the stickers under the units, for the rubber pads which are dirty, for the open software boxes inside... ?
I suppose what you were expecting was a vaccum packed freeze dried A1200 complete with a certificate of authenticity from mehdi ali himself?
You asked for a NOS A1200 is that not what you received? If not exactly what form of 17 year old computer did you receive?
Have you analysed the dirty rubber pads? maybe its been sitting in an indian school all these years.. or maybe its a natural aging of rubber, I havent done the tests myself..
Yes your amiga has been opened and a UK keyboard put in..
It all points to a criminal conspiracy if you ask me!!
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I suppose what you were expecting was a vaccum packed freeze dried A1200 complete with a certificate of authenticity from mehdi ali himself?
There are people in this world who are just that stupid, and then are stupid enough to sue and pay lobbyists to pretend that such activity (selling 15 year-old equipment without a warranty or guarantee) is such a horrendous offense to the consumer that there MUST, ABSOLUTELY MUST be legislation to protect stupid -- or perhaps impulsive or overly romantic -- people from themselves.
That notwithstanding, I am *not* saying that people plonking down $150 are stupid for not expecting a gamble; the opposite, actually. But what I am saying is that people who ignore the old "caveat emptor" wind up ruining opportunities like these 1200s when people become unwilling to sell because of legal requirements and just dump them in a bin, instead. Though the latter might also be subject to some ridiculous taxes (excuse me, environmental impact charges,) as well.
What I haven't seen in this thread, and forgive me if I missed it amongst some of the noise, is Petro refusing to replace defective units. I haven't seen an invoice, so if it's on the invoice then I withdraw my claim. I'd be disappointed to drop $150 on a gamble of whether the equipment works or not and cannot be replaced if it doesn't.
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The tone of some of these replies suggests that if you open up a new,old stock box and find an old cheese sandwich instead of a computer, you still have no right to complain.
If the units are used and refurbished then it should have said so in the sales description.
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They are not used, and they are clearly not refurbished.
They have however been sat somewhere for the last 17 years, I expect they opened the components to ensure they are in one piece, which is nice of them don't you think?
And as for the keyboards not matching the stickers, ( mine is a UK keyboard but a PL poland? A1200) this could have been a simple case of AT ( who were probably on there knees towards the end) scavenging parts to fill orders... who knows..
I guess if people will insist on thinking the worst of Petro then they will find a way!
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The tone of some of these replies suggests that if you open up a new,old stock box and find an old cheese sandwich instead of a computer, you still have no right to complain.
If the units are used and refurbished then it should have said so in the sales description.
You wont find that bit of information in the sales description because the criminal mastermind Petro has been coning us all along, what he's actually been doing is driving around Europe in his big van collecting as many used and dirty Escom packs as possible, in order to bring back to his secret layer in Germany for a quick clean up and then flogging them on!
The discoloration to some of these Escom packs has got nothing to do with them sitting in a warehouse enduring changes in climate over a 15 year period, absolutely nothing at all!
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I expect they opened the components to ensure they are in one piece, which is nice of them don't you think?
Not as nice as powering up the units to see if they actually worked.
We have all had to replace drive belts on old computers, did they even do that?
From what I have read here, they did not even blow the dust off the boxes, never mind "opened them up".
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what he's actually been doing is driving around Europe in his big van collecting as many used and dirty Escom packs as possible, in order to bring back to his secret layer in Germany for a quick clean up and then flogging them on!
That's why it took 17 years to find these units.:)
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We have all had to replace drive belts on old computers, did they even do that?
Really? All of us?
I've had computers for a long time and I haven't had to replace a drive belt..
Not saying it hasn't happened for people, but "We've all had to..."??
And I would be INCREDIBLY surprised if he went to that effort..
But that's just me.. (.. and apparently a lot of other people here..)
But a few of you expected more...
C'est la vie.. (as they say..)
desiv
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So much untruth! I have one of these units. They are NOS. This is what you got back then in the "Magic Pack"
THERE ARE NO SCREWS missing. Those that claim that simply just don't know what an a1200 looks like.
The discoloration and other imperfections are from storage. They have a smell.
THEY WHERE TESTED! I can tell because the date was set on my unit (2012) Somebody turned them on and checked them before shipping. Also yes somebody swapped out the keyboards, presumably to sell the units in a different market... Heck Amiga technologies was still using old commodore stock for parts and power supplies... The negativity is displaced. My unit kicks ass, emulations is still not as good as the real deal. Whats wrong with you guys? Petro is an old guy and he wants to do some nice things... don't you guys get it? Order one already!
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I also do not like the way you have constantly been on petros case over this, this guy who has basically done many of us a massive favour when he could have just not given a s**t about the amiga community.
So exchanging musty old computers for money is philanthropy now?
What an abused lot "the amiga community" must be for that to be considered a favour.
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And it's just a box of rain, I don't know who put it there,
Believe it if you need it, or leave it if you dare.
And it's just a box of rain, or a ribbon for your hair;
Such a long long time to be gone, and a short time to be there.
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hmmmmm. Mine worked well, out of the box. While it looks very nice and new, there were some screws missing, but so what ? And the rubber feet were dirty... that doesnt mean it was used! It even smelled of new Amiga ! The cardboard box looks very used, but so what ? Hey, it works, the Amiga is nice and white, and thats what counts ! 150 Euros is not much, compared to what the Amiga cost once, compared to PPC and 68060 Hardware prices nowadays !
Thank you for your efforts and honesty Petro ! I appreciate you doing what you did, for a lot of happy Amigans!
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You wont find that bit of information in the sales description because the criminal mastermind Petro has been coning us all along, what he's actually been doing is driving around Europe in his big van collecting as many used and dirty Escom packs as possible, in order to bring back to his secret layer in Germany for a quick clean up and then flogging them on!
The discoloration to some of these Escom packs has got nothing to do with them sitting in a warehouse enduring changes in climate over a 15 year period, absolutely nothing at all!
You got it right mate...not only does he collect them with his van but he also sells them so that the EU bureaucrats cannot arrest him for including VAT and not giving 50 years technical support and lifetime return to seller guarantee.:banana:
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Guess it's a matter of perspective.
If I was buying one under the impression it was NOS, in plastic wrap in a pristine box just like it would have been in the 90's had I bought it new and it showed up and was not that to a tee, I would be very ticked off.
He's not charging a fortune for them, and he's not billing them as the second coming of Jesus. They are old A1200's that were sitting God knows where for nearly 20 years. If it works and the only gripe is that there's a screw missing, it could be worse.
I've never had a problem finding cheap A1200's locally, and I've lost interest in the legacy machines, but if I hadn't I probably would have ordered one of these and rolled the dice.
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I suppose what you were expecting was a vaccum packed freeze dried A1200 complete with a certificate of authenticity from mehdi ali himself?
You asked for a NOS A1200 is that not what you received? If not exactly what form of 17 year old computer did you receive?
Have you analysed the dirty rubber pads? maybe its been sitting in an indian school all these years.. or maybe its a natural aging of rubber, I havent done the tests myself..
Yes your amiga has been opened and a UK keyboard put in..
It all points to a criminal conspiracy if you ask me!!
Actually the invoice mail I received clearly says "Of course all units are brand new and original packed, but all of them were stored in a warehouse since 1995".
So yes I was expecting an aged but brand new unit (in my mind brand new meaning without broken seal, keyboard transplantation, dirty pads, open software box, missing screw (?) etc) as I bought for half price on e--y a used C= A1200 which was in better overall condition (including the rubber pads).
IMHO Petro tried to do something nice for our community but he made the mistake not to check by himself the state of the packs before importing them to Europe. I bet that for the next A1200 batch he's not going to say anymore that they are brand new.
And yes he should accept the returns for those of us who are not satisfied with the condition of the pack they received (obviously not brand new). As it seems to be lots of people on this forum who would be happy with a pack in that condition, he wouldn't have any problem to resell them to them...
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So much untruth! I have one of these units. They are NOS. This is what you got back then in the "Magic Pack"
THERE ARE NO SCREWS missing. Those that claim that simply just don't know what an a1200 looks like.
The discoloration and other imperfections are from storage. They have a smell.
THEY WHERE TESTED! I can tell because the date was set on my unit (2012) Somebody turned them on and checked them before shipping. Also yes somebody swapped out the keyboards, presumably to sell the units in a different market... Heck Amiga technologies was still using old commodore stock for parts and power supplies... The negativity is displaced. My unit kicks ass, emulations is still not as good as the real deal. Whats wrong with you guys? Petro is an old guy and he wants to do some nice things... don't you guys get it? Order one already!
Your A1200 doesn't have a battery backed clock. The date couldn't have been set on your unit.
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As it seems to be lots of people on this forum who would be happy with a pack in that condition, he wouldn't have any problem to resell them to them...
Add me to the list of "if you're unhappy with your purchase and you want to get rid of it"... I'll gladly take it off your hands. Geeze! :-/
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Hi, I registered just to let you know that I too had ordered an A1200 from Petro, it arrived in early december. The box is in very good condition w/o damage, the unit itself looks brand new and does not have a single scratch or any yellowing on it.
As far as I'm concerned, I'm totally happy about my purchase and would highly recommend others to order one. In my eyes Petro is an honest person who just wanted to do something good for the community. That this is very difficult with 15 year old stock should be no surprise.
Anyway, if there's really a problem with your unit I'd suggest contacting him, nicely! To assume he is trying to con people is just horrible and won't get you anywhere :(
Last year, Petro had given interviews on a german radio station about these A1200 units and shared a great deal of insider information about his ex-days at commodore and Escom/AT.
Anyhow, just my two cents. Good luck and Happy New Year! :)
SunSpire
---
SunSpire Records (http://www.sunspire-records.com)
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Hi all,
Hope you are well today. As a new/sealed collector nothing annoys me more than used hardware being passed off as new, let me clear though I have no idea if this is the case here and am not suggesting it. Out of interest, did anyone ask for any pictures before ordering as you can tell in 2 seconds if its real or not. I have some brand new mint 1200's so if anyone would like some pics to compare etc. I am more than happy to provide (i am not selling them btw).
Let us be really clear though, 150 euro for a factory fresh 1200 would be ludicrously low.
cheers,
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Let us be really clear though, 150 euro for a factory fresh 1200 would be ludicrously low.
I completely agree - I also collect new/sealed games and consoles, and the difference in price between new and used is often 300% or more (sometimes much more) and almost always significantly more than the original retail price. People are crazy if they think they are getting a bad deal here.
Mine was definitely brand new, you can just tell.
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I just had a look at the pics posted. I will dig one of mine out and take some pics in the next few days although it may make some people cry so I apologize in advance. although hopefully helpful.
cheers
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I'm not so sure about that. New doesn't always mean perfect. I buy and sell 'new' games consoles, I have had nearly 100 this year alone, and from the many I've seen over the years you just know whether one is new or not. You can't fake the smell, or the freshness of the plastic etc. But new computers definitely can have marks, scratches etc on them. These were boxed up by people in hot sweaty factories, not by robots in a dust free environment. And they've been sitting in warehouses and shipped around the world for nearly 20 years.
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I'm not so sure about that. New doesn't always mean perfect. I buy and sell 'new' games consoles, I have had nearly 100 this year alone, and from the many I've seen over the years you just know whether one is new or not. You can't fake the smell, or the freshness of the plastic etc. But new computers definitely can have marks, scratches etc on them. These were boxed up by people in hot sweaty factories, not by robots in a dust free environment. And they've been sitting in warehouses and shipped around the world for nearly 20 years.
Totally agree, you know instantly. I have been collecting for 15 years and like your friend Petro work in the industry. I am only commenting on the pictures of the two I looked at, have a look at the pics I will post and then see what you think.
cheers,
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Well i am a very happy Amiga retro user right now!Just checked my email and saw that Petro sent me an invoice for an amiga 1200 magic pack from the second batch!!!
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Received my email today as well.
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<= has not received one :(
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Hi,
I really didn't think that it would happen since Petro sold us out back in 92. This guy was in it only for the money. This was brought up in 2009, did any one hear anything else since then?
Probably not.
If Petro would have stood up and said this wasn't right back in 92/95 maybe the Amiga wouldn't be dead.
The only thing I have for Petro is the one finger salute.
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Hi,
I really didn't think that it would happen since Petro sold us out back in 92. This guy was in it only for the money. This was brought up in 2009, did any one hear anything else since then?
Probably not.
If Petro would have stood up and said this wasn't right back in 92/95 maybe the Amiga wouldn't be dead.
The only thing I have for Petro is the one finger salute.
Its very clear You have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. So you should refrain from speaking of things you know nothing about. As most Amiga "insiders" reading your comments make you look foolish.
If it wasnt for Petro there would be NO AMIGA NG, NO OS 3.5+ etc. Petro has done more than most for the amiga platform.
Next time you go to slander people (which didnt the mods warn about on another thread?) do your research first instead of grabbing theories out of your you know what.
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Email from Petro today! =)
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One more here :)
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Hope you are well today. As a new/sealed collector nothing annoys me more than used hardware being passed off as new,
It's tricky, I wouldn't sell it as new on ebay if I'd opened it and tested it. But that is an auction, if it's old and sealed then the buyer is taking that risk.
With the way that petro is selling them then he should be testing them, so I'd expect the box to be opened. You don't know what has happened to them in the warehouse they've been sitting in though.
If they turn up and look good and have the right keyboard then I don't see the problem. AFAIK they are the uglier amiga technologies badged ones though.
The price is better than I picked up a NOS magic pack for that had been sitting in a shop for a year after AT went under.
We have all had to replace drive belts on old computers, did they even do that?
3.5" drives don't have belts. The spindle is directly connected to the motor.
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Hi,
I really didn't think that it would happen since Petro sold us out back in 92. This guy was in it only for the money. This was brought up in 2009, did any one hear anything else since then?
Probably not.
If Petro would have stood up and said this wasn't right back in 92/95 maybe the Amiga wouldn't be dead.
The only thing I have for Petro is the one finger salute.
Seriously dude you need to quit what you are smoking...:quickdraw:
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Its very clear You have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. So you should refrain from speaking of things you know nothing about. As most Amiga "insiders" reading your comments make you look foolish.
If it wasnt for Petro there would be NO AMIGA NG, NO OS 3.5+ etc. Petro has done more than most for the amiga platform.
Next time you go to slander people (which didnt the mods warn about on another thread?) do your research first instead of grabbing theories out of your you know what.
Hi,
If you know so much about the events at that time, then name me one thing that Petro did that was good. I can't think of anything.
By the way magnetic "Did he ever show with those 500 Amiga's?"
All Petro was --- was another moocher mooching off the death of the Amiga.
smerf
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Hmm Petro is an honorable guy. And to be honest, if it wasnt for him there would have never been os 3.5, 3.9, or 4.0 for that matter!
However, this whole thing seems "funny" to me.
If I remember right Billy M. did a lot to develop 3.5, 3.9 and 4.0, the only trouble was he ran into trouble with 4.0. I mean correct me if I am wrong, but Petro had made his money selling off old left over Amiga parts from Commodore, and helped Gateway collect any other trade secrets at that time. Petro worked hand in hand with Collas giving us a bunch of BS about a new Amiga that they developed but supposedly Gateway closed out. We all fell for that bunch of lies didn't we.
Anybody ever hear from Collas again. I think not, but we did hear from Billy M. didn't we, but he turned out to be another disappointment too!!!
Petro helped develop OS 3.5, 3,9 and 4.0, come on, the only thing that vulture did was hang around to see what other bones he could pick off of Amiga Tech.
smerf
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Hi again,
I wasn't the only one who thought Petro mooched on Amiga, this was taken off an interview during the time he was selling 3.5:
PTYSCH> We have sold so far around 5600 units...of our OS 3.5....unfortuneately the breakeven is to get profitable 25.000....please support us and buy the OS 3.5 so that we can invest in other projects...for the future..ga
Petro sucks... Amiga is dead due to bad "marketing"... I think I gonna get kicked now :))) Tom Schmidt doesnt care about ANYTHING concerning the classic amiga... Bye dudes & dudettes...
That is because the only thing Petro ever marketed was the last remaining bones of Commodore.
Remember boys and girls I used to work for Commodore, and as a salesman I got a little more info.
To see how the Amiga was treated by everyone, was a downright sin!
I mean it wasn't all Petro's fault, he was just doing the things he was being told to do as a general manager. He had to eat too!! but I sure wished he would of stood up to some of those JA's
smerf
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I got my e-mail too. Looking forward to get an Amiga again :)
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I got a mail with the bill. Here I can read in the thread a price of 150 €...
It is not. It is almost 194 € vat, post included!
Written on the bill "Cash in advance, no return, no refund"
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Vote for petro
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Is he still advertising them as "brand new"?
Could somebody post the content of his e-mail?
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I got a mail with the bill. Here I can read in the thread a price of 150 €...
It is not. It is almost 194 € vat, post included!
Written on the bill "Cash in advance, no return, no refund"
What you forgot to mention is that in this price shipping costs are included which for such a heavy package should be at least around 30-40€!
I will write this again if you don't like the deal step aside and let someone else who can appreciate it grab it.
There is also the alternative to buy "NOS" amigas from unknown ebay sellers who after almost 20 years remembered that they had them unopened in their cellars for TONS of money!
That would make some wise guys happy...
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I got a mail with the bill. Here I can read in the thread a price of 150 €...
It is not. It is almost 194 € vat, post included!
Written on the bill "Cash in advance, no return, no refund"
+ bank transfer fees!
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Is he still advertising them as "brand new"?
Could somebody post the content of his e-mail?
What advertising ?? He is not advertising anything, its an email with an invoice. Interested people like me sent an email of interest months ago and got in the que. I am very happy i got mine, sending money today.
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Is he still advertising them as "brand new"?
Could somebody post the content of his e-mail?
The content of his e-mail :
Dear Amigian Enthusiast:
The A 1200 Magic Pack arrived in our warehouse. Please find attached the respective Invoice.
You are kindly requested to TT by bank transfer the funds to our account listed on the invoice and under “AMIGA”and the order Number 2012Axxx in the next two days.
After receiving the funds on our bank account we will ship by DHL your Amiga 1200 Magic Pack to your address.
Please be aware that this again a NONE PROFIT PROJECT special for our Amiga Community! No refund and no return shipments are accepted.
Those Amiga 1200 Magic Pack are originally manufactured in 1995. Original Amiga Packaging are in retro condition and could show small transport and storage, as well as aging marks. The retro computer should be in good working conditions.
Die A 1200 Magic Pack sind in unserem Lager eingegangen. Sie erhalten heute als Anlage die entsprechende Rechnung.
Bitte überweisen Sie den Rechnungsbetrag mittels Banküberweisung an das auf der Rechnung genannte Konto und als Betreff „AMIGA“ und die Auftrags Nummer 2013Axxx in den nächsten 2 Tagen. Nach Eingang auf unser Bankkonto werden wir per DHL Ihren Amiga 1200 Magic an Ihre Adresse schicken.
Wir wollen nicht unerwähnt lassen das es sich hier wiederum um ein NONE PROFIT PROJECT geht, speziell auf die Amiga Gemeinde ausgerichtet!
Die Ware ist von jeglichem Umtausch und Rückvergütung des Rechnungsbetrages ausgeschlossen! Es handelt sich um original Ware die 1995 hergestellt wurde und seit der Zeit im Ausland eingelagert war. Die original Amiga Verpackung kann aus diesem Grund durchaus kleine Einlagerungs-und Transportspuren enthalten. Das Gerät sollte aber voll funktionsfähig sein.
Best regards
Mit freundlichen Grüssen
Petro Tyschtschenko
Power Service GmbH
Bergweg 50a
D-63322 Rödermark, Germany
http://www.power-service-gmbh.com
Tel: +49 6074 629747
Fax: +49 6074 5812
Mobile: +49 171-261 53 81
Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter/CEO/GM: Petro Tyschtschenko
HRB Offenbach 34724
Ust-ID: DE 2100107786
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AFAIK they are the uglier amiga technologies badged ones though.
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Hmmn how are the Amiga Tech models uglier? They're identical to the Commodore ones.
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Hmmn how are the Amiga Tech models uglier? They're identical to the Commodore ones.
The badge is uglier. Commodore badge was much nicer.
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I'm sure the commodore units were very slightly darker too, a Mongolia rather than the stark white of the AT units... Though it could be my imagination :-/
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The badge is uglier. Commodore badge was much nicer.
Ah, thought he meant the whole appearence. Well the AT ones don't have a badge as such, it's just a paper sticker, but it doesn't look bad.
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I'm sure the commodore units were very slightly darker too, a Mongolia rather than the stark white of the AT units... Though it could be my imagination :-/
Nah, I'm sure most of the cases were actually stock just left over in the Commodore warehouses, the Commodore ones are just older so probably more yellowed.
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Ah, thought he meant the whole appearence. Well the AT ones don't have a badge as such, it's just a paper sticker, but it doesn't look bad.
I'm sure mine is plastic, but I need to have a sort out as it's not where I thought it was.
Nah, I'm sure most of the cases were actually stock just left over in the Commodore warehouses, the Commodore ones are just older so probably more yellowed.
It would be interesting how much was spares left over and how much was newly created. I'm sure there was a company building pcb's for them.
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What you forgot to mention is that in this price shipping costs are included which for such a heavy package should be at least around 30-40€!
I will write this again if you don't like the deal step aside and let someone else who can appreciate it grab it.
There is also the alternative to buy "NOS" amigas from unknown ebay sellers who after almost 20 years remembered that they had them unopened in their cellars for TONS of money!
That would make some wise guys happy...
Sorry, but I have the bill in front of me. 7 Euro Shipping, 6 Euro package... It is really far from 30-40 Euro!
And, who told you that I do not appreciate ?????????? I bought it because I wanted it.
It was just an informative post as it seems here people do not really know what they are talking about in this thread.
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I think if you are in the EU, you need to pay VAT, if you are outside of the EU, Petros company doesnt charge you VAT but your own country customs could. My invoice is just 150e Amiiga + 12 shipping + 6e packaging, 168e total.
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Tako je Djole :)
Mine is 150 Amiga + 17 shipping + 6 packaging. No VAT oustide of EU.
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For me: 150 + 11 + 6 + 31.73 (VAT)! => 198.73 EUR
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Nah, I'm sure most of the cases were actually stock just left over in the Commodore warehouses, the Commodore ones are just older so probably more yellowed.
Yeah, it's been so long, my memory is probably flawed :-/
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I am very disappointed about the private message that I just received from Petro :(
Dear Amigian Friend:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
I was visiting the warehouse today and checking the A 1200 Magic Pack, which I received from India.
I would like to inform you that the shipment was not in the condition I expected this.
Unfortunately the Amiga Software box is complete missing with following diskettes:
• Digita Worworth
• Digita Organizer
• Personal Paint
• Turbo Calc
• Whizz
• Digita Printmanager
• Digita Datastore
• Photogenics
• Pinball Mania
I am also missing the Amiga Instruction Manuals in the Magic box.
All other items, the A 1200, the workbench 3.1, Power Supply, Amiga Mouse, TV Cable, are complete and in good condition.
The A1200 is really not used and very nice and packed in a plastic bag and is working.
The Amiga Magic box (outer carton) are sometimes due to the transport and warehouse storage not in a brand new condition.
As you may know I received those units from India were those Amiga A1200 Magic were stored since 1995..
For your further information I have attached some pictures.
I am very sorry about this and I only can apologize. Maybe you can contact alk.org or the Forum-64 for some support ?
Also, it is a suggestion to contact your local Amiga Club. I think the community will support you.
As I have invested already a lot of money for transportation, import duty, warehousing, handling cost and cost of sales I appreciate if you can accept our beloved A1200 in the described condition..
If not, dear Amiga Enthusiast.. Tell me your bank account and I will return you the fund you have already spent.
Please let me know..
If you accept the described condition:
I will put my autograph on the A1200 and the box and will ship the box to you as promised by DHL.
Best regards
Petro Tyschtschenko
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I am very disappointed about the private message that I just received from Petro :(
Big deal, the important items are there!
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Hi,
Well looks like Petro pulled one over on me and actually had the Amiga 1200's .
I and the Amiga Community thank you for this contribution. I really thought you left us high and dry after Gateway. Don't know what the full story was with Collis, but it really looked like a hit and scat tune.
Well anyway Petro, thanks, you have instilled confidence back in this old Commodore Salesman from the 88 - 93 era.
smerf
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Big deal, the important items are there!
@djos +1
@smerf +1
Yes, but incomplete. Too bad but I'm happy nonetheless. Thanks Petro!
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Hi,
Well looks like Petro pulled one over on me and actually had the Amiga 1200's .
I and the Amiga Community thank you for this contribution. I really thought you left us high and dry after Gateway. Don't know what the full story was with Collis, but it really looked like a hit and scat tune.
Well anyway Petro, thanks, you have instilled confidence back in this old Commodore Salesman from the 88 - 93 era.
smerf
How about actually fully APOLOGIZING, which I dont see any of in your post. As a matter of fact you manage to hurl another insult in there (about gateway) I hope this teaches you a lesson not to talk about things you dont know about it.
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I got the same e-mail from Petro but i dont care about the magic pack software its crap anyway. The important thing is the Amiga is working and unused. He replied he will send it out on monday. Cant wait to receive it.:crazy:
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Yeah he sent me the same email and i immediately told him that i dont give a damn!!!
He was decent enough to apologize and ask me if i want a complete refund!
Of course for a bunch of disks that are crap anyway i would not cancel my order!
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Dear Amigian Friend:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.
Well, Petro did not curse in my mail, but the rest is the same :D
Anyway, who cares about Turbo Calc and stuff.
I am a bit sad about the manual though. Was hoping to get one since I have none :(
But it is definitely not a deal-breaker.
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Since most people think the software packs are useless. If anyone on here got one of the first batches and wouldn't mind parting with the software box and manuals I would really like to purchase them.
I've got one of the 2nd batch A1200's, but I really wanted a complete as new Magic Pack, so I am somewhat disappointed I won't be getting a complete unit.
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No mail from Petro.. hmm.. Xon = Lucky one.. ? =)
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Mine just arrived from petro .... Doesn't work.
Well the lights turn on ... but no drive sound.
Pressed ctrl+a+a, and resets, the caps lock key goes on, and I get a green/black screen.
Oh and no bootrom either in the tv .... :(
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Mine just arrived from petro .... Doesn't work.
Well the lights turn on ... but no drive sound.
Pressed ctrl+a+a, and resets, the caps lock key goes on, and I get a green/black screen.
Oh and no bootrom either in the tv .... :(
Did you leave it on for 30 seconds - 1 minute? They don't like to boot up quickly if there's no hard drive installed, depending on the ROM version.
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Did you leave it on for 30 seconds - 1 minute? They don't like to boot up quickly if there's no hard drive installed, depending on the ROM version.
Yes I did :(
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Open it up and inspect the motherboard. Caps first of all...
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Open it up and inspect the motherboard. Caps first of all...
Hi will do so, thank you for the reply. Any tutorial around? Which caps should I check and how? hehe I don't have a clue. Tried again to turn it up, this time nothing happens, not even light up, so I think it's really the PSU. could it?
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Mine just arrived from petro .... Doesn't work.
Well the lights turn on ... but no drive sound.
Pressed ctrl+a+a, and resets, the caps lock key goes on, and I get a green/black screen.
Oh and no bootrom either in the tv .... :(
Try re-seating the roms. Use a large flatblade screwdriver and just prise them up slightly each side, and then push them down again firmly. Just might work...
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Hi will do so, thank you for the reply. Any tutorial around? Which caps should I check and how? hehe I don't have a clue. Tried again to turn it up, this time nothing happens, not even light up, so I think it's really the PSU. could it?
It could be the PSU plug at the Amiga end. Try wiggling the power connector a bit at the back of the Amiga whilst switched on. I have a PSU that only works when I gently push up or push down on the connector (can't remember which). My other PSU's don't have this problem though. In my case, I'm not sure whether it's a broken wire near the plug, or a malformed plug (looks to be okay though). It's worth checking anyway. ;)
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Hah, I have one wiggly PSU as well :D What's the deal with that ?
csxlab, measure the voltages on your PSU's pins. That way you can establish whether it works or not. I don't suppose you have another one near by ?
As far as the motherboard is concerned, inspect eevveerryytthhiinngg in detail. For any signs of burns, leaks or other deformities.
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Hah, I have one wiggly PSU as well :D What's the deal with that ?
csxlab, measure the voltages on your PSU's pins. That way you can establish whether it works or not. I don't suppose you have another one near by ?
As far as the motherboard is concerned, inspect eevveerryytthhiinngg in detail. For any signs of burns, leaks or other deformities.
Hi, good morning, actually I dind't say anything about wiggling, just not giving enough power. Well I don't have any way to measure the output, and I don't have any other Power source to try, So today I will disassemble a take some photos of the MB :)
Btw, the PSU last night was not working at all, and I'm living in Maastricht but I'm Portuguese, came to live here 3 months ago, so I actually don't know anyone in this city, or specialized stores yet.
will research more. thank you all for your input.
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Hi, good morning, actually I dind't say anything about wiggling, just not giving enough power. Well I don't have any way to measure the output, and I don't have any other Power source to try, So today I will disassemble a take some photos of the MB :)
Btw, the PSU last night was not working at all, and I'm living in Maastricht but I'm Portuguese, came to live here 3 months ago, so I actually don't know anyone in this city, or specialized stores yet.
will research more. thank you all for your input.
If you live in the Netherlands, try www.marktplaats.nl (http://www.marktplaats.nl) there is always some amiga stuff on it. Good luck!
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Anyone know if Petro still has any A1200's for sale?
I wouldn't mind picking up a couple spare units.
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To all:
=> test: AMIGA A1200 MAGIC PACK with original PSU= it don't work! :-(
=> test: AMIGA A1200 MAGIC PACK with my own A1200 PSU= it work! :-)
Anyone know if Petro still has any A1200's for sale?
I wouldn't mind picking up a couple spare units.
I will ask him for you in few minutes!
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here are the photos http://www.csxlab.org/Amiga/1.1/hd01-gallery.html
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Hi guys, here are the photos :D
http://www.amiga.org/forums/album.php?albumid=176
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Hi guys, here are the photos :D
http://www.amiga.org/forums/album.php?albumid=176
Good God, I'm salivating. I will happily sell off my extra units if Petro finally gets to my request and sends me an invoice. Why? Because it's not often you can get a fresh-out-of-the-box old piece of equipment, retrofit it as necessary, and have a working unit 18 years after its production that you and only you have ever owned. The rest of my stuff all works, yes, but they're not mine out of the box.
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Mine should be showing up any day now! :pint:
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I believe I ordered the 2nd to last one, got my invoice this morning. :)
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This bad boy is now officially mine! (paid for today!) :D
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/71121999/Amiga/Sale/Amiga%20Magic%203%2025.1.2013.JPG)
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Wow.... this is amazing... This reminds there was a similar FRENCH stock, if I am not mistaken of C64s... wow....a blast from the past !!
Does anyone know if one little unit is still available for sale ?
Thanks and Shabat Shalom :-)
---------------------
The Godfather
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Message from Petro:
Sorry I am sold out... best regards try via amiga1200magic@gmail.com
No other units available, so I suppose you must register via the email above to be next in line if one deal is failed.
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Hi guys, here are the photos :D
http://www.amiga.org/forums/album.php?albumid=176
Did you get it working with a replacement PSU?
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Did you get it working with a replacement PSU?
Hey, still didn't find anyone near me with a PSU to test. It will take some time for me, because only in one month or so, I'lll go home and can bring the A500 PSU. But untill then I will try to get some expert to do the recaps here in the Netherlands. :)
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Did anyone manage to remove the petro signature form the 1200 casing? It seems pretty well stuck to me.
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You can use 99% isopropanol which washes it off like a charm, even off the cardboard.
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Thanks for the tip, i'm fine with the box; the case would have been ok too if he'd signed the bottom.
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hrmmmm with everyone removing the signature, maybe sometime down the line in the future mine (if I ever get one :cry:) will be more valuable. hehehehe
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He could also have signed inside the lid, like the original a1000.
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Just learnt that mine arrived in Athens!Too bad i will get my hands on it on Saturday!!!Will post photos then!!!
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Mine arrived a few days ago.
Although not perfect, the box was in much better condition than I expected.
The computer shows absolutely no signs of use whatsoever. No missing or stripped screws. Not a spec of dust anywhere inside or out, no perceivable wear on the motherboard ports. The top section plastic is actually slightly darker than both my original C=1200 and other Amiga Tech 1200 I bought new sometime around '01 or '02. Not yellowed in the slightest, maybe just a different batch of plastic. I'm pretty fussy about cosmetics, and thought the condition was just fine. :pint:
There are a few leaked capacitors on the motherboard, no big deal as I pretty much expected it. I'll replace all the caps and play a few games before returning it to its box for some later date. :-)
Only real downer for me was the lack of polys for the sides of the computer.
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That`s great!
I have no facebook account, how can I order one?
Seems everybody got his A1200, and no Pack left for me :-(
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Mine arrived today! :)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/71121999/Amiga/2013-02-26%2013.19.54.jpg)
I had to clean the cables and remove Petro's Sig from the top of the case but the a1200 is in spectacular condition!
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/71121999/Amiga/2013-02-26%2013.38.47.jpg)
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Nice! Looks like you got the good mouse left over from the C= era... mine came with the craptastic Amiga Technologies mouse... :p
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It's branded as an Amiga Tech Mouse so maybe they made several types?
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It's branded as an Amiga Tech Mouse so maybe they made several types?
Interesting. I have 2 that style, both made in Malaysia and C= branded. I attached a pic of the one I got - most frustrating/useless/etc POS ever. The other type is actually pretty decent IMO.
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Yeah mines made in Malaysia and quite nice to use. Lucky me eh!
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Message on FACEBOOK: Amiga + C64 Szene Intros + Demos (https://www.facebook.com/groups/335407219854956/) group
Petro T. Tyschtschenko
I will get a new shipment A1200 Magic Pack in June.. Please order in time via a1200magic@gmail.com. Price 150 Euro plus shipping plus tax and packaging.