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Author Topic: MorphOS Milestone: 2000+ licenses sold  (Read 6791 times)

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Offline fishy_fiz

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Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2013, 12:58:22 PM »
It's the price of the license, not the hardware that's stopping the numbers being higher than they are. I know more than a few people who use MOS on occasion, but are unwilling to shell out $200-ish for a license (that's a full "modern" computer price).

And before the usual suspects get their panties in a twist, this isnt a criticism (I like MOS, and its much more attractive than OS4.x to me in regards to pricing), just a simple truth (from someone who has no interest in playing favorites). In reality there's more people using MOS than the registrations suggest, its just that not all are willing, or able to afford a license.
Near as I can tell this is where I write something under the guise of being innocuous, but really its a pot shot at another persons/peoples choice of Amiga based systems. Unfortunately only I cant see how transparent and petty it makes me look.
 

Offline takemehomegrandmaTopic starter

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Re: MorphOS Milestone: 2000+ licenses sold
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2013, 02:48:14 PM »
Quote from: kamelito;747255
Impossible to say since no new HW was available for Morphos so you can't compare it's just a guess :)  Kamelito


A few comments to that statement... ;)

  • Those "new" computers you must be talking about (Sam440, Sam460, X1000) is *still* of 2005 level (tops) performance, which is very "old" despite being "new".
  • The Sam440 was always *way* slower than the Pegasos 2, thus it would have been a major downgrade from what MorphOS users already had.
  • The Sam460 is also a bit slower than the Pegasos 2. Maybe not a major downgrade, but certainly not an upgrade either. At best it would serve as a replacement for dead Pegasos 2 systems, but at €1,000 EUR for a system, question is how many would actually care to do it or simply walk away altogether?
  • The X1000 performs similar (actually a little poorer) compared to a regular G4 mac laptop of later make. But the price tag is totally insane, especially considering its 2005 level performance. This makes it completely irrelevant.


Current ARM based mobile phones actually have more power than any of the above mentioned systems. That's how "new" they are. And none of them are as tight and small as the Mac Mini, as powerful as the G5 PowerMac or as mobile as the PowerBook. This diversity of the Mac platform has meant a lot for MorphOS growth rate, have a look at this picture:



What I want you to see is the angle on the various lines I have added to the well known graph. The tilt/angle represents the growth rate.

If the MorphOS team hadn't gone for Mac HW in 2009, then the growth would have followed the bottom red line. This represents Peg1/Peg2/Efika5k2. Of course it wouldn't mean that MorphOS would have reached 1000 licenses by now; more likely the growth rate would have flattened out because of market saturation (few would buy a second or third license for yet another Peg2 when they already had one) and limited/decreasing amount of available HW. So it would have landed somewhere inside that pinkish field, probably somewhere between 600-700 licenses sold. (EDIT: Why guess when we already have the answer? :lol: Peg1/Peg2/Efika5k2 together adds up to 740 licenses. Which means it was still a pretty good guess! ;)). Sam440 wouldn't add anything, Sam460 would possibly have added some, it would be a step sideways from the Peg2 but it's at least available as "new" (So 50? 100? 200?). X1000? Definitely not.

Luckily that's not the way the MorphOS team went. Instead they went the Mac HW route. And look how the tilt/angle (growth rate) increases as more and more diversity of HW options are added. The orange line is when they go Mac in the first place (Mac Mini). The yellow is the eMac/PowerMac G4. The green one is when MorphOS goes laptop on the PowerBook/iBook and G5 PowerMac.

  • Price does matter
  • Performance does matter
  • Diversity (many options) does matter
Given the obvious limitations you automatically have when being a PPC only OS, the MorphOS team has certainly made the most out of it. MorphOS currently supports 75 systems (seventy-five). MorphOS supports (almost) everything worth supporting of what PPC has to offer! That's what Mac HW strategy meant for MorphOS, instead of going for that "new HW" (cough cough) route that the "competition" went for. This is how MorphOS could reach 2000+ licenses (and counting).

:)
« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 03:22:35 PM by takemehomegrandma »
MorphOS is Amiga done right! :)
 

Offline takemehomegrandmaTopic starter

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Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2013, 03:15:33 PM »
Quote from: fishy_fiz;747261
It's the price of the license, not the hardware that's stopping the numbers being higher than they are. I know more than a few people who use MOS on occasion, but are unwilling to shell out $200-ish for a license (that's a full "modern" computer price).

And before the usual suspects get their panties in a twist, this isnt a criticism (I like MOS, and its much more attractive than OS4.x to me in regards to pricing), just a simple truth (from someone who has no interest in playing favorites). In reality there's more people using MOS than the registrations suggest, its just that not all are willing, or able to afford a license.


Sure, it sucks to pay money, and anything would "sell" more at $0.

But at least the price has come down considerably; at one time a MorphOS license cost €150. Today it cost €79 (~$105) to register a Mac Mini G4, eMac, Pegasos I, Pegasos II, or PowerMac G4. These systems cover 75% of all currently licensed MorphOS systems.

The MorphOS team does have the right to charge money for their licenses, I don't think anyone denies that. There has been a lot of work put into this. AFAIK some components has also been bought/licensed. Nobody is forced to pay, you can try it for free for as long as you want (30 minutes per boot), and you only pay if you like it and want it without that 30 minutes limitation.

MorphOS is the best Amiga NG OS in existence. It has the best Amiga compatibility, the best performance, the best stability, the best features, the most and fastest HW that comes in the most options at the best prices.

You can buy a system complete with a full, registered MorphOS license for (more or less) $200. If this is your hobby, you may find it worth it. If not, buy something else instead.

But at least it isn't $2,800+ more, for less. :p ;)

:)
« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 04:22:32 PM by takemehomegrandma »
MorphOS is Amiga done right! :)
 

Offline Duce

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Re: MorphOS Milestone: 2000+ licenses sold
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2013, 04:10:18 PM »
MOS is a great OS that's well worth purchasing - good to see the strong numbers.
 

Offline kamelito

Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #18 on: September 08, 2013, 04:38:38 PM »
Quote from: fishy_fiz;747261
It's the price of the license, not the hardware that's stopping the numbers being higher than they are. I know more than a few people who use MOS on occasion, but are unwilling to shell out $200-ish for a license (that's a full "modern" computer price).

And before the usual suspects get their panties in a twist, this isnt a criticism (I like MOS, and its much more attractive than OS4.x to me in regards to pricing), just a simple truth (from someone who has no interest in playing favorites). In reality there's more people using MOS than the registrations suggest, its just that not all are willing, or able to afford a license.

 +1 I should add that I expected more from Morphos for a first contact. For Amigans that left years ago I would have expected a better first experience. Papiosaur pack help after but now I'm wondering if I should pay that price, for now my powerbook is just not used. Might put Linux on it.  Kamelito
 

Offline takemehomegrandmaTopic starter

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Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #19 on: September 08, 2013, 05:10:59 PM »
Quote from: kamelito;747276
I expected more from Morphos for a first contact. For Amigans that left years ago I would have expected a better first experience. Papiosaur pack help after but now I'm wondering if I should pay that price, for now my powerbook is just not used. Might put Linux on it.  Kamelito


I don't really know what you did expect?

Some people, especially those who has been away from Amiga for a decade or two (and I'm not talking about "the Amiga online discussion club" but "the *really using* Amiga club") simply forgot how the Amiga 3.1 floppy brought you *nothing* but a grey, empty workbench, and that you had to spend much time (a process often going on years, never really ending) to customize it into your own personal Amiga system. No Amiga system was like any other.

This can be seen as a journey, and a strength of Amiga. This is what many are talking about when they say that "Amiga gives you control over your system"; when you have set everything up the way you want, when you have arranged everything according to your own personal preferences, when you have installed and configured all the applications and tools you yourself need and want, etc, then you are indeed in control and nobody knows your system as good as you. MorphOS (like any other Amiga OS) is kind of "empty" when freshly installed and it will require some work to set it up from scratch in order to get the system "you'd expect". Many people who migrated back then simply moved their HDD's from their old Amigas into their Peg2's or whatever, installed MorphOS and continued to use everything pretty much as before.

If you however have become used to Windows or MacOS during the last decades, you may have been so accustomed to having everything pre-configured and set up in a fixed structure with no need (or no possibility) to set things up the way you once did on Amiga, and then you may find out that you would "have expected a better first experience". Then you perhaps will look at this as a weakness. Personally I don't agree though. Only Fleecy's and McEwen's "Amiga" was about "using content". ;)

Papisaur's pack indeed serves a purpose here. It will get you going very fast. But IMHO it's not as fun, and the result will basically be "Papisaur's system" (not necessarily a bad thing ;))...

It's a good thing that you can try before you buy though!

:)
« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 05:18:47 PM by takemehomegrandma »
MorphOS is Amiga done right! :)
 

Offline fishy_fiz

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Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #20 on: September 08, 2013, 05:16:37 PM »
Sure, I didnt mean to suggest that the MOS developers shouldnt be making a few dollars back for their efforts, but nonetheless it is a lot of money for a license, which is a bit of a barrier for many people. It was intended more as a positive in regards to users though. There's more users (albiet some casual due to lack of a license) than the "number of registrations/2.5-ish" formula people seem to be using.

Also, not important, and I dont mean to instigate any sort of vs. nonsense, but the slight OCD in me cant refrain,.....

Quote
MorphOS is the best Amiga NG OS in existence. It has the best Amiga compatibility, the best performance, the best stability, the best features, the most and fastest HW that comes in the most options at the best prices.


Thats stretching it a bit. AROS "wins" in terms of available hardware, performance, and prices. It also has some nice features thus far lacking in MOS, so "best features" is in the eye of the beholder.
Near as I can tell this is where I write something under the guise of being innocuous, but really its a pot shot at another persons/peoples choice of Amiga based systems. Unfortunately only I cant see how transparent and petty it makes me look.
 

Offline takemehomegrandmaTopic starter

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Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #21 on: September 08, 2013, 05:28:54 PM »
Quote from: fishy_fiz;747281
AROS "wins" in terms of available hardware, performance, and prices. It also has some nice features thus far lacking in MOS, so "best features" is in the eye of the beholder.


While I'm sure AROS is nice and fun (especially for its developers), it's fundamentally different from both MorphOS and OS4, and obviously not really what the majority of the people who opts for either MorphOS or OS4 are looking for (had it been, then they simply would have used AROS instead).

Perhaps a bit off topic also...

;)
MorphOS is Amiga done right! :)
 

Offline OlafS3

Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2013, 05:36:44 PM »
Quote from: fishy_fiz;747281
Sure, I didnt mean to suggest that the MOS developers shouldnt be making a few dollars back for their efforts, but nonetheless it is a lot of money for a license, which is a bit of a barrier for many people. It was intended more as a positive in regards to users though. There's more users (albiet some casual due to lack of a license) than the "number of registrations/2.5-ish" formula people seem to be using.

Also, not important, and I dont mean to instigate any sort of vs. nonsense, but the slight OCD in me cant refrain,.....



Thats stretching it a bit. AROS "wins" in terms of available hardware, performance, and prices. It also has some nice features thus far lacking in MOS, so "best features" is in the eye of the beholder.


+1

We should not play the "my choice is the best in everything" game because finally people could realize that this is not the case. I could then talk about a platform that is dependent on PPC or it would loose many of its advantages (when it is ported to another hardware platform). I am excited to see what the MOS team decides, staying on a aging hardware or port it to ARM or X86/X64 (with all problems that this causes including the huge needed efforts to do it). Lets say MorphOS might be (I cannot judge that) best platform on PPC.
 

Offline OlafS3

Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2013, 05:39:02 PM »
Quote from: takemehomegrandma;747282
While I'm sure AROS is nice and fun (especially for its developers), it's fundamentally different from both MorphOS and OS4, and obviously not really what the majority of the people who opts for either MorphOS or OS4 are looking for (had it been, then they simply would have used AROS instead).

Perhaps a bit off topic also...

;)


Perhaps might be that they have decided for one platform and stick to it (MorphOS or AmigaOS). The most users have left all platforms over the years, the remainders have their favorite.
 

Offline takemehomegrandmaTopic starter

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Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #24 on: September 08, 2013, 06:39:06 PM »
Quote from: OlafS3;747284
Perhaps might be that they have decided for one platform and stick to it (MorphOS or AmigaOS). The most users have left all platforms over the years, the remainders have their favorite.


Maybe so, but it doesn't change the fact that there are two categories; MorphOS and OS4 in one, AROS in the other. The differences aren't cosmetic or a matter of "taste", they are fundamental, hence they can't really be compared. MorphOS could also be ported to x86, quite easily and fast I believe, if all legacy ties and backward compatibility should be dropped. If there would be no requirement to preserve binary compatibility and no requirement to run low level native on the HW, then it would be easy. But current MorphOS users didn't choose MorphOS to run their Amiga applications in UAE on some Amiga-like interface hosted on Linux or virtualized.

Please note that I'm not trying to flame AROS here in any way. I'm just pointing out that there are fundamental differences.

One day, probably when MorphOS breaks free from the PPC chains, it will probably move into the AROS realms (otherwise it would be difficult I guess). And if MorphOS would move into that category instead, even if such a release of MorphOS wouldn't be *properly* multithreaded/SMP enabled, 64-bit, memory protected, no max memory limit, etc, in other words — even if it basically would mean just the *current* MorphOS, minus the Amiga binary compatibility, then MorphOS would *still* beat AROS feature wise and bring an overall far better user experience. MorphOS is simply *way* more mature, regardless of CPU architecture, and this isn't really just an opinion.

Again, I am not trying to flame AROS, it's a great and very interesting OS that very much has deserved any recognition and appreciation it can get. And AFAIK it has played a part in MorphOS development as well, both inspirational (what to do, and what not to do), and also in actual code contributions. And I truly hope that there will be someone around to develop AROS forever. Long Live AROS! :)

Still off topic though!

;)
MorphOS is Amiga done right! :)
 

Offline vox

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Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #25 on: September 08, 2013, 07:54:23 PM »
Some notes:

Congratulations, even numbers aren`t exceedingly high, they show MorphOS team ability to survive in times left with no hardware company beneath. It would be natural to seek good, reliable and widespread hardware and Macs were great choice. For many reasons, from people simply still having them, to reliable and well designed hardware for its times.

On its price: Its great users can try it and then buy it. However you :should have a boxed one, with manual and a bit preconfigured for the machine (even its seen as weakness :-) - SAM 460 port could be first one for team to do so?

That will give presentable MOS product as such - not just Amigan geek thing. SAM 460 is not bad platform at all, limited in expandability but yet quite modern, quiet and fast for its class. How much SAM 460 Lite based system will cost depends on user and doesn`t have to be 1000 euros, specially if you do have most of components at you home.

Having cheaper Acube products needs only higher volumes - something MOS can contribute
 (hopefully not only in case Macs or Pegs die?) or eventually introducing some dual core
high end replacement (like it was speculated several times) that would bring SAM 460
as total OS4 low end, effectively replacing 440 (kind of what Flex did to integrated  EP niodel).
Eventually it might become only cheaper, it can hardly be more expensive (for end users).

It will end blue - red war in nice fashion, OS4 port for Peg2 did.
Enable people to use both if they want. In such regards until x86 or ARM transition is done also SAM 440 (not to hard to derive from SAM 460 port since CPU is same) and even X1000 should be kept as viable targets.
Even those systems are expensive, they already have some customers (250 OS4 users) that could be added, and offer PCI-E, SATA and other modern standards often beyond Mac and there aren`t 2005 performers. Test declassifying SAM 440/460 and X1000 to Macs in CPU performance clearly show way better performance in memory and disk drive transfers, as well as there is PCI-E as expansion that offers unlimited possibility to make drivers you could use later on in transition.

Not everywhere like in US PPC Macs are widespread, offered a lot and thus low priced. At least in East Europe there way few users (I kind of have seen them twice in life) and they still cost quite a lot. Pegs are history and Efika simply ins`t it.

Hope MorphOS can also have a great future, even its not official, nor has hardware vendor behind. In such battle, even OS4 users are somewhat allies that do know what do you talk about :-)

Hmmm ... which will come first (or ever?) MorphOS 4 or AmigaOS 5? :-)
« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 07:58:25 PM by vox »
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Offline kamelito

Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #26 on: September 08, 2013, 08:38:38 PM »
Quote from: takemehomegrandma;747280
If you however have become used to Windows or MacOS during the last decades, you may have been so accustomed to having everything pre-configured and set up in a fixed structure with no need (or no possibility) to set things up the way you once did on Amiga, and then you may find out that you would "have expected a better first experience". Then you perhaps will look at this as a weakness. Personally I don't agree though. Only Fleecy's and McEwen's "Amiga" was about "using content". ;)

Papisaur's pack indeed serves a purpose here. It will get you going very fast. But IMHO it's not as fun, and the result will basically be "Papisaur's system" (not necessarily a bad thing ;))...

It's a good thing that you can try before you buy though!

:)

 Exactly, I use Windows for work as many I suppose, Mac at home and while I did all the settings you spoke about in the old days (I even wrote the first program that remove borders around icons, because I didn't like them, check Aminet). Now I'm maybe too old to do that kind of things, it's the same as configuring computers, repairing them, same for the OS, I'm kind of lazy today, it doesn't interest me anymore. I just expect things to work well. Even a friend of mine tried the Amiga recently using a Raspberry PI and he didn't remember how to use one and was surprised that the UI didn't evolved since 3.1. (again first contact). One thing also that make me hold back buying Morphos and I can't explain it, is the fact that AmigaOS 4 is an evolution of the "real" Amiga OS. It's kind of important to me that code and design from Mike Sinz, RJ Mical, Andy Finkel, Dale Luck, Randell Jesup etc is present there because they were our gods.  You tend to minimize the importance of the first impression.   One more thing, developers are vital and good documentation is the first step, wiki.amigaos.net seems to be the way to go, it seems that http://library.morphzone.info/Main_Page is not as complete but I might be wrong. Kamelito
« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 09:00:52 PM by kamelito »
 

Offline nicholas

Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #27 on: September 08, 2013, 09:02:00 PM »
Quote from: kamelito;747295
Exactly, I use Windows for work as many I suppose, Mac at home and while I did all the settings you spoke about in the old days (I even wrote the first program that remove borders around icons, because I didn't like them, check Aminet). Now I'm maybe too old to do that kind of things, it's the same as configuring computers, repairing them, same for the OS, I'm kind of lazy today, it doesn't interest me anymore. I just expect things to work well. Even a friend of mine tried the Amiga recently using a Raspberry PI and he didn't remember how to use one and was surprised that the UI didn't evolved since 3.1. (again first contact). One thing also that make me hold back buying Morphos and I can't explain it, is the fact that AmigaOS 4 is an evolution of the "real" Amiga OS. It's kind of important to me that code and design from Mike Sinz, RJ Mical, Andy Finkel, Dale Luck, Randell Jesup etc is present there because they were our gods.  You tend to minimize the importance of the first impression.   One more thing, developers are vital and good documentation is the first step, wiki.amigaos.net seems to be the way to go, it seems that http://library.morphzone.info/Main_Page is not as complete but I might be wrong. Kamelito


:roflmao:
“Een rezhim-i eshghalgar-i Quds bayad az sahneh-i ruzgar mahv shaved.” - Imam Ayatollah Sayyed  Ruhollah Khomeini
 

Offline anglosaxonusa

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Re: MorphOS Milestone: 2000+ licenses sold
« Reply #28 on: September 08, 2013, 10:11:20 PM »
What a strange coincidence.  I was just pricing eBay for a cheap PowerMac G4 with which to run MorphOS.  Hopefully others are looking into the OS as well.

The wife and I do a bit of surfing, log on to our credit union, do word processing and spreadsheet work with OpenOffice, and watch Netflix.  Can MorphOS run Netflix?

We've been using Ubuntu for a while now and have never been completely satisfied with it, but it can run Netflix, albeit with occasional Silverlight upgrade issues.  It would be awesome to win the wife over to an Amiga OS after all these years, but I'm not sure if it will break our "television" or not.

Now if only the Amiga name was public domain.  It would be nice if MorphOS was named "Amiga MorphOS" or "MorphOS Amiga"; such a name would make it easier to brag about being an Amiga die hard.
 

Offline OlafS3

Re: MorphOS: Celebrating 2000 Registrations
« Reply #29 from previous page: September 08, 2013, 10:42:28 PM »
Quote from: kamelito;747295
Exactly, I use Windows for work as many I suppose, Mac at home and while I did all the settings you spoke about in the old days (I even wrote the first program that remove borders around icons, because I didn't like them, check Aminet). Now I'm maybe too old to do that kind of things, it's the same as configuring computers, repairing them, same for the OS, I'm kind of lazy today, it doesn't interest me anymore. I just expect things to work well. Even a friend of mine tried the Amiga recently using a Raspberry PI and he didn't remember how to use one and was surprised that the UI didn't evolved since 3.1. (again first contact). One thing also that make me hold back buying Morphos and I can't explain it, is the fact that AmigaOS 4 is an evolution of the "real" Amiga OS. It's kind of important to me that code and design from Mike Sinz, RJ Mical, Andy Finkel, Dale Luck, Randell Jesup etc is present there because they were our gods.  You tend to minimize the importance of the first impression.   One more thing, developers are vital and good documentation is the first step, wiki.amigaos.net seems to be the way to go, it seems that http://library.morphzone.info/Main_Page is not as complete but I might be wrong. Kamelito


that kind of "heritage" seems to be important to the "AmigaOS" community, as the used themes, icons and naming. But it is not important to the outside. I had contact to former amiga developers who were very disappointed about the direction AmigaOS took and left the community (one even warned me to start with amiga and said he is more happy now without). If these visual elements and old sources are all AmigaOS will have no future.