Hi-End audiophilia, myths, misinterpretations and...

[Hell Labs]

I'm so glad I'm unable to hear the difference between a bog standard cd changer and some rediculous super duper system. Probably because there isn't one, and you all need a reality check. A twenty quid 3-cd changer/twin tape deck/turntable/radio from a second hand shop is fine.

I'll give you an example. Once I was walking through the local shopping centre (I think the yanks call them "malls"), and there was a woman at a stand showing of some super duper £200 headphones, as compared to some 99p ones. This exchange happened:

"listen to this set of cheap headphones"

I put them on, it was playing some crappy nickleback song or something.

"now listen to this set of ultramegasupersecialawesomethings"

I put these on, same song.

"Now, isn't there a HUGE DIFFERENCE?"

I answer, perfectly honestly:

"no."

And left.

[koshman]

Well, it's true audiophiles tend to overstate the differences between audio equipment

[save2600]

Hell_labs - you're full of shit audio-wise. Your ears just need to be educated or trained. You (and anyone else for that matter) have always got an open invite if you'd like a demonstration someday at my place. To an extent, you simply don't spend big bucks on a nice system NOT to hear a difference. It's like anything else in life that way. Everyone I've ever auditioned my gear to has literally (okay, figuratively) shat themselves, especially when I spin an LP and then switch between the two sources. Audio and listening to hi-fi is an art form that people used to take more seriously and was a lot more popular before the advent of all this silly disposable shit people choose to occupy their time with.

Seriously - walk into a nice audio salon someday with your favorite CD or LP, spend some time, open your mind and your ears. You'll be surprised what you're likely to hear.

I have had a long standing joke regarding my audio obsession though... I used to say the blessed be that are half deaf as they don't need to spend as much as me! lol  I realize today that's BS. I'm proud and elated to know the difference between good and bad sound. It's a hobby (that isn't or doesn't have to be as expensive as you think) like most others in that you need to be dedicated to it. And that's probably the biggest reason why so many in the mainstream can't commit. They're not really into 'anything' refined, cultured or nice. They don't want to admit something is nicer, especially if they cannot or do not want to afford it.

If after you cannot truly detect and appreciate a good sounding hi-fi system, I'd recommend you go see an audiologist and then a psychologist because something is truly wrong with a) your hearing and perhaps b) your mental state of mind regarding the topic. I know most people have a "it's good enough" type mentality, but there's nothing wrong with saying: hi-end audio sure sounds great, but as someone that's not *that* into music, I am unwilling to devote that much money, space and time to it. That's a little more civilized than ignorantly writing it off...

My apologies to the OP for getting off topic. This will be all I have to say about the state of affairs of today's audio and the dispassionate mentality of the mainstream in this thread. If anyone cares to start a new one in the Coffee House or something...

[Hell Labs]

TBH I really, really can't tell the difference between by £20 stereo system and people in the same room as me, actually playing my favorate iron maiden song. I'm not trying to be a dick, I just can't. And there's nothing wrong with my ears, but there is with my eyes - both have been extensively checked.

I'm also tired seeing of people do dumb stuff like spend £££ on monster cables and the like, even after I, and a few others explain to them they are a scam, and this is the kicker : it was a digital stereo in the first place, so by definition you could have used paperclips and it wouldn't make a difference. And then there's those that swair up and down that (i'm not making this up): The first version of the sony playstation (SCPH-1001) is the best sounding cd player ever made, so long as you use it upside down, and let it warm up, valve radio style, for half an hour first. They actually believe this.

There's one thing I will say though, headphones are always better than speakers. Dunno why, but it's like you can hear "more" of the song, or something.:confused:

[Karlos]

The problem with audiophiles is they have a propensity to believe the absurd. For example:

http://www.aaudioimports.com/ShowProduct.asp?hProduct=37

Gold plated fuses for your amplifier power supply... :roflmao:

Clean power is, of course, important, but this is taking the proverbial. Any decent power supply should have proper regulation and ripple elimination on the DC output side anyway, so in high end equipment, these cannot possibly make any difference. Audiophiles will swear otherwise, of course, but a properly controlled double-blind test would almost certainly prove them wrong.

[save2600]

as promised, I didn't want to derail the thread any further, which is about the A1200 playing mp3's. So... in a nutshell to combat some of the statements:

I own Hi-Fi tuning fuses for all my gear and yes, they make a difference. I might not have been able to hear the difference in the power section of the DVD/SACD player I inserted it in, but there was a big difference in the stability of imaging when I rebuilt said power supply with BlackGate caps and FRED diodes. Hi-Fi Tuning fuses DO make a HUGE difference when they're placed within the audio chain - and that's their main purpose. Power Amp protection for your speakers for example - is not the same as the fuse in the power supply section. Good power amps have 3 or more fuses in them. Speakers with fuses also benefit from the silver filament fuses and big time!!

Monster Cable is not total crap, but they do represent an embarrassment to the term 'Hi-End'. These guys IMO ARE out to gyp nubiles, fresh getting into audio, off of their hard earned cash. Monster Cable *is* ridiculously overpriced for what they are, but are much better than the stock cables you get with some audio/video gear. Look elsewhere for better bang for your buck. Look at the geometry and the types of materials real high end cables talk about. Generally speaking, if it's expensive and you've never heard of it before - that's the stuff you should be looking into buying. Asking your audio dealer is always the best advice though. No, today's big box mass consumer audio/video/appliance "salespeople" are not qualified to even ask what the weather will be in a few hours  

Hell Labs - in your world, there is no such thing as "digital stereo". All digital sources on the levels you're used to listening to ALL get translated to analogue - which is why cables matter. 75ohm digital cables are not all equal either.

The Sony PSX people are off their frickin' rocker - that's all that's needed to say about that    Sorry they have tainted your view of the hi-end. What turds.

Headphones are NOT better than speakers. First off, no imaging to speak of. You do not listen to a live orchestra play with headphones, do you? Hi-end audio is often about reconstructing a live event in front of you. Room reflections play a big part in the design of the human ear. It's not [the human ear] all coiled up and nasty looking like it is without reason    Headphones CAN sound great - sure, but they are the antithesis of a live experience. I own a pretty expensive pair of Sennheiser headphones that I never 'listen' to. Only give 'em a quick listen to monitor a recording and that's pretty much it.

[Hell Labs]

I wonder if we can combine the audiophile and televangelist markets somehow. Perhaps some $10,000 "miracle monitors" quadraphonic speakers that will "inrease your chances of having god contact you, personally" the more you listen to the televangelist guy hawk his scams. Hell, both audiophiles and fundies will beleave any old crap, so it can't hurt to try.

[save2600]

Hey guys...  out of respect to the OP, I started this...

http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?p=544311#post544311

[Damion]

I must also be a nut, 'cuz I replaced the audio caps in my A2000 with Elna SILMIC-II series and I think Turrican 3 sounds awesome. :-P

[Karlos]

as promised, I didn't want to derail the thread any further, which is about the A1200 playing mp3's. So... in a nutshell to combat some of the statements:

I've moved the rest of the audiophile posts to this thread too. As the chronological order is maintained, that means it looks like Hell Labs started this thread but you might not worry about that

[save2600]

Karlos - you can do Magic!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxUGR8vc8NE

[Hell Labs]

Oh god, when I refreshed the page and saw all these posts from the other thread I thought I was having another stroke. Not fun at all.:hammer:

And I think headphones sound better than a live performace, atleast all the gigs ive ever been to. For some reason when you go to a rock gig they   almost always have everything up so it's nothing but blurry bass, it sounds shite. In fact the only gig i've ever been to that sounded as good live as on the CD was thunder, and either the singer was REALLY good (he's knocking on a bit) or they were miming. whitesnake and def leppard were playing the same night and they sounded a little bit worse than thunder too.

[save2600]

Not talking about hard rock or heavy metal concerts Hell Labs. Real concerts... orchestras comprised of human beings playing real acoustic instruments. But... the reason rock gigs suck today (and I'm a drummer btw) is because of shite gear played for the masses handled by a shite "engineer" or sound guy. MOST people are tone deaf and that's who the recording industry is now kowtowing to. It sucks for those of us that can appreciate uncompressed music - but really well recorded popular music pretty much does not exist today. You can thank the iPod, mp3's and clueless/classless (louder is not better) people for that. The use of compression in ALL pre-recorded music today is a horrible dirty little secret. I personally am outraged so many use the technique. Can hardly enjoy listening to any modern music today because of it. If you're lucky, a jazz or classical album will be released with little to no compression - but I guarantee you'd be hard pressed to find 'em. The Beatles latest releases all feature minimally compressed music and they're all quite proud of that fact for a reason. Steely Dan and Jamie Cullum are a couple of bands that still know how to record, but Jamie's slippin' big time. Hopefully he'll still care about how music sounds in another few years  

[save2600]

Some pics of my current 'main' 2-channel system. Getting tempted to add another amp/preamp combo and setup a pair of B&W's for rears though. NOT really for movies - for the multi-channel SACD's and DVD's I have of music concerts and such. There is a front projector in this room which fills the space between the speakers rather nicely. lol  

Tandberg amp you see sitting next to one of my Ascents NEEDS a matching preamp... Already have the B&W's  

[Hell Labs]

Not talking about hard rock or heavy metal concerts Hell Labs. Real concerts... orchestras comprised of human beings playing real acoustic instruments.

It can be both.

I don't actually think much good came out after grunge died, and that was a bit iffy. The only most of the talented musicians (apart from well, orchestras but w/e) that have come up in the past decade are all from scandinavian countries, germany, france or eastern europe, and as you can imagine they all have exactly bugger all mainstream attention (playing metal or house will do that too you :angry:).

Bringing it round to topic, have you noticed nobody actually records in stereo any more? I can put a steppenwolf album on from the 60s,listen to each channel sperately and they are completely different. I can listen to nirvana, and hear the guitar move across from left to right (messes with you if you use headphones). With modern music you might as well just save the trouble and chuck your left speaker under a train for all the difference it makes.

Thats if you're daft enough to listern to whatevers popular nowadays (I forget). after that whole late 90s-early 2000s girlband/boyband era I actually superglued my radio tuning dial to the classic rock station. I don't regret this.