Ripa bags it's first victim

[the_leander]

But isn't this the same as opening your door when served with a search warrant?

Refusing to open your door will result in your door being taken off of its hinges by a dainty set of size 11s. It will result in a fine as the council either board up or replace the door or simply the cost of the door itself. It will result in the officers who deal with you being much more short with you.

It will not result in an automatic prison sentence.

I don't quite understand how you are being forced to incriminate yourself.

Really? Are you actually saying the threat of imprisonment and all that entails isn't a form of coercion?

"I do not recall"

It is a tried and tested legal defence. One this law specifically forbids. It also denies you the right to remain silent, even if that has been significantly weakened in the UK.

[Heiroglyph]

If you refuse a normal search warrant (a court ordered document), you are in contempt of court, which does carry a fine and potentially a jail sentence at the judges discretion.

That's why I don't see a difference on this particular point.

[Karlos]

If you refuse a normal search warrant (a court ordered document), you are in contempt of court, which does carry a fine and potentially a jail sentence at the judges discretion.

That's why I don't see a difference on this particular point.

Technically perhaps, but in reality, the police are far more likely to gain forceful entrance to the property and since they gained entrance, you are extremely unlikely to be prosecuted for denying it.

They can't take a battering ram to your hard disk. Well, they could, but it wouldn't be an effective way of recovering the data...

[whabang]

The European court of human rights says that this is a big no-no. I see a debate about EU's right to meddle in domestic affairs in the close future; elected officials are generally quite upset when the EU is used against them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saunders_v_United_Kingdom

[the_leander]

If you refuse a normal search warrant (a court ordered document), you are in contempt of court, which does carry a fine and potentially a jail sentence at the judges discretion.

As Karlos said, you'd be damned unlikely to get fine much less a prison sentence for not opening the door during a raid. To refuse access to your computer is an *automatic* prison sentence. That is one hell of a difference.

Worse, there a removal to the right to remain silent implicit in this law.

That's why I don't see a difference on this particular point.

I'll bet.

@whabang

Good.

[whabang]

The problem is that this conflicts with the famous "right to remain silent". If one can suddenly sentenced to prison for exercizing the rights granted by the European human rights charter, then there is a huge problem.

The next logical step would be to threaten suspects with harsher punishment if they don't confess.

[the_leander]

The problem is that this conflicts with the famous "right to remain silent". If one can suddenly sentenced to prison for exercizing the rights granted by the European human rights charter, then there is a huge problem.

Lets face it, it wouldn't be the first law brought in under the last lot that came a cropper due to it being incompatible with human rights.

The next logical step would be to threaten suspects with harsher punishment if they don't confess.

Well they got rid of the presumption of innocence and the right to a trial by jury, so yeah, that sounds about right.

[whabang]

Presumtion of innocence is also in the EU human rights charter, FYI.

[the_leander]

Presumtion of innocence is also in the EU human rights charter, FYI.

And yet, it didn't stop the digital economy act becoming law...