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Author Topic: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4  (Read 68563 times)

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Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« on: August 03, 2017, 06:47:28 PM »
Nice!

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2017, 02:51:37 AM »
Quote from: psxphill;829255
Exactly. He has always had a hatred for the FPU and MMU compatibility and the fan boys think he's the second coming because he added some opcodes that accelerate some software that doesn't exist yet.

The worst thing you can ever do is have someone with a strong opinion about things and a bunch of enablers.

You need to seek some professional help or at least a few sessions of anger management.  It's obvious that you're not being objective based on your strong emotional responses to anything connected to Gunnar.  Barring that, try a valium....sheesh buddy.

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2017, 10:56:44 PM »
Quote from: kolla;829282
Why is it that this happens to so many who have been in contact with Gunnar, do you think?



So far I only see you and psxphill acting that way.  You guys are an army of two.

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2017, 02:15:52 AM »
Quote from: Iggy;829309
Hmm, I don't always agree with kolla, but he and psxphill aren't the only two that Gunnar has rubbed the wrong way.
And as far as anger management goes, neither I myself nor you have been model examples of rational interaction.

But this could lead us back to my point about the eccentricities that seem inherent in our community.

A good friend of mine a few years back pointed out to me just what a high percentage a 'slightly off' personalities our community seems to attract. It made me, to say the least, a bit uncomfortable.

Yeah, I probably fall into the category your friend described.  I've been called a lot of worse things than slightly off too!  LOL!

But the vitriol that was used by psxphill to describe Gunnar was more than just over the top and more than just "slightly off".  I doubt that Kolla and psxphill have even met Gunnar.  They can't be objective about anything Apollo or Vampire related because their emotions are in the way.  I certainly don't agree with psxphill when he says
Quote
He has always had a hatred for the FPU and MMU compatibility and the fan boys think he's the second coming because he added some opcodes that accelerate some software that doesn't exist yet.

There have been several new and notable pieces of software that take advantage of the 68080's new instruction set.  And a core FPU does exist and until the kinks get worked out with it we can use Jari's softFPU.  The ability to run Linux or BSD or whatever other OS you can come up with that requires an MMU was never within the scope of the Vampire project and all his b@tching about it won't change that fact.  If he want's so badly to run a *nix variant he should buy a $10 Pi board or one of its clones and stop posting misinformation and throwing childish tantrums at the same time.

Here are just a few of the new programs written to take advantage of the the 68080 and the new instruction set:

Video game "194x Deluxe"  takes advantage of the AMMX instruction set:  https://youtu.be/M0PJHxVN5Ok

Mapparium:  https://youtu.be/mgFx6HwsHjI

CPU resource monitor CPUMon080:  https://youtu.be/jO0_SkHogrI

Mystic Image Viewer:  https://youtu.be/hLR64W_8v_8

Riva Player with AMMX:  https://youtu.be/TClfDy2NzJM

So psxphill's comments about accelerating software that doesn't exist are patently false.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 06:22:01 AM by ferrellsl »
 

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2017, 04:48:31 AM »
Quote from: Gulliver;829316
So then 4 pieces of software is a lot! :D

Its the second coming...

I'm surprised you can count that high. Well, actually you can't because it was 5 apps, not 4. That was just a sample of the new software that's out there for the Vampire. There's quite a bit more.  And you're obviously too lazy to even go and check out what's available at the Vampire forums so you should really just stop showing your ignorance now.  You're only embarrassing yourself, if that's even possible.

And yes, the five packages I listed ARE quite a lot when compared to what's been developed for NG Amigas in the past 10 years or so....and classics too.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 06:51:24 AM by ferrellsl »
 

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2017, 06:49:40 AM »
Quote from: Iggy;829324
My first inclination, on being asked to describe being "rubbed the right way"...well, I thought to reference you to my ex-wife, but it seemed a bit crude. :hammer:

I think the first step might be some consideration of the other party's divergent point of view.


I couldn't find an emoji to post that's blushing, but yeah, that was a good one!  LOL!

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2017, 07:10:03 AM »
Quote from: Gulliver;829327
So, you count as valid a 1 level demo of a game that hasnt been finished and is known to be that way since about 5 years. :D

If you havent noticed, there is a place called Aminet, that has seen quite a lot releases for the last 10 years for both Classics and NG. And then you have OS4Depot and the MOS repository, and besides that, there is more stuff that is only released on many developers personal webpages.

But hey, you are right, 4 is a lot! :D

Don't know where you're getting your info, but the 194x Deluxe game demo using AMMX was only shown 4 months ago.  It may have been based on the earlier non-Deluxe game but AMMX has only been out for about a year or less, so no, this AMMX game hasn't been a 5 year effort and it looks and plays significantly better than the non-Deluxe version you must be confusing it with.  This is the Deluxe version with AMMX:  https://youtu.be/M0PJHxVN5Ok

This is the non-Deluxe 68K SDL version you're referring to: https://youtu.be/Cnrr_lROyTo

I'm quite familiar with those repositories as well as with Aminet.  I even uploaded a newer version of the PLPLOT programmers library to Aminet a few weeks back for classic systems after a few tough days of coding.  See:  http://aminet.net/package/gfx/show/plplot68k-5.0.1  Have you done any coding lately or have all your efforts been restricted to the snide remarks dept?

Took me several days to rework the code and get it compiling on a real Amiga after a 24 year hiatus from Amiga development.  My point is that there is nothing new or exciting about PPC or OS4.  They are both dead ends and the Vampire is the most exciting thing to happen for classic enthusiasts in years.  I wouldn't have undertaken a project like PLPLOT had it not been for the Vampire.  OS4 is still stuck in 2003 and that won't change anytime soon if at all.  My latest endeavors require a 64-bit address space which takes OS4 out of the mix immediately.  So my future efforts will focus on AROS SMP x86_64 and the Vampire for any classic development.  I don't think Hyperion and A-EON can pull off a 64-bit version of OS4, maybe I'm wrong but how long have they been promising SMP and an office suite among other things?
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 07:33:57 AM by ferrellsl »
 

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2017, 07:57:49 AM »
Quote from: Gulliver;829332
So it is still a game demo that hasnt been finished.

I do code for the Amiga. But that doesnt make me or anyone else a better person, nor makes any arguments more right.

I dont care much about OS4, but where you are wrong is that the OS4 community, which I dont belong/identify with, has certainly released tons of stuff for their platform and some of it is interesting. And it is certainly more than 4 recompiled packages.

It is good that you are excited after 24 years, but it seems your passion is clouding your judgement.
Anyway it is your life, you seem to be a grown up man, and your entitled to believe in the second coming as you wish to.

You're still having problems with math.  I listed 5 of several applications that take advantage of the 68080 and AMMX instructions and CPUMon080 is not a recompile.  It is a new application and there are more.

See:  http://www.apollo-core.com/knowledge.php?b=4¬e=3044

But you stick to your false narrative since you can't count and can't deal with facts if that is what keeps your fragile ego intact.

And you're the one with the fixation on religion as you continue to speak of Jesus and a second coming.  You and psxphill must attend the same church.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 08:01:52 AM by ferrellsl »
 

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2017, 08:10:52 AM »
Quote from: Gulliver;829335
But, you are the "Cult Member" :D

I have no ego issues. I didnt need to belittle your arguments by separating coders from non coders. I am sorry colleague :D


I'm not going to waste any more time on you.  You're obviously not equipped to do anything beyond name-calling and snide remarks.

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2017, 05:33:23 PM »
Quote from: kolla;829341
Are you sure you are not joking? Considering how the author has been treated over at the apollo-core forum and IRC, I find it ironic to use mapparium as an example. Also, it is not using AMMX, it is just trying really hard to not use FPU.



https://blog.alb42.de/programs/mapparium/

Meaning - the version of mapparium that runs on Vampire is crippled by the lack of FPU.

No, you are incorrect.  A non-FPU version of Mapparium called MUIMApparium was created with the Vampire in mind.  The author also created versions for MOS and AROS.
 https://blog.alb42.de/2017/04/22/muimapparium-to-try/

And Mapparium is too slow to run on a bog standard classic Amiga anyway, so your point is moot.

And here is the author's thread about MUIMapparium over at the Vampire Forums:
http://www.apollo-core.com/knowledge.php?b=1¬e=5079


Quote from the author's YouTube page:

Quote
Published on Apr 21, 2017
New implementation of Mapparium in native MUI/Zune, finally it's fast enough to use on a real Amiga 600 (with Vampire). More informations on https://blog.alb42.de


And here is the video of the author running it on an A600 Vampire.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgFx6HwsHjI
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 05:50:53 PM by ferrellsl »
 

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2017, 07:50:08 PM »
Not sure if anyone here has seen this yet, but Gizmodo and The Register have picked up stories about the Vampire:

https://www.gizmodo.com.au/2017/08/theres-a-new-amiga-coming-out-this-year/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/08/09/new_amiga_to_land_in_late_2017/

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2017, 07:54:47 PM »
Quote from: kolla;829386
Define "bog standard classic Amiga", please.

It is not untrue that it is crippled by the lack of FPU.


Bog standard classic Amiga:  an unexpanded A500, A600, A2000, A1000, A1200

By your very own statement that makes every one of the above Amigas crippled by definition....simply incorrect.

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2017, 08:18:06 PM »
Quote from: ALB42;829389
Thats actually not true, the only reason I had "Vampire in mind" is because thats my only real Amiga with a GFX card. So to test the speed I only have that to try. UAE is very unreal :) and sadly there is no other GFX card for keyboard Amigas currently.
(This was my main reason to buy a Vampire, the GFX card)


I got response from people use MUIMapparium with 68060 and GFX Card (even one crazy guy use it on a 68030, notice also no FPU here).

The implementation was also not triggered by Vampire, I wanted to learn MUI/Zune and overcome some (speed and not speed related) problems on all Platforms. The initial implementation was done with ARM-AROS on a Raspi3 (on vacation, a little computer to take with me). The Video for it was just to show that it is even fast enough to make it run on a real Amiga, no relation to Vampire. (as I said just because its the only one with GFX card) so on the NG platform it will just be very smooth, but this is hard to show in a video.

I really like my Vampire (and MUIMapparium :lol:) but to take MUIMapparium as a example program for Vampire is a little bit strange. There is no special stuff inside for Vampire and will never be.

The thread you mentioned there is the MUIMapparium thread I guess, which was not opened by me, I just responded to it and later add some updates because some people asked for it.

But what I did especially for Vampire was testing the FreePascal compiler... There should be a thread as well from me. I even thought about to include some better support for it on the long run (AMMX,..), ... now... nah ... you you can guess how big my motivation is to do something on this topic.


You're actually helping me make my point because a couple individuals here keep stating that there is no real Vampire development occurring and that anything "new" being developed is simply a re-compile of some very old projects.  Mapparium is not an old project in Amiga terms.  And even you admit that it is crazy to use MUIMapparium on an 030 or lesser CPU.  So you obviously weren't developing this on a classic system for classic bog-standard 68K Amigas, but for accelerated 040/060 (which no one can afford or find anymore), WinUAE, or any other system that has more horsepower than an 030, including a Vampire.  The implementation may not have been triggered by the Vampire, but you say it was developed on one. There is almost zero development for classics on classics these days.  Most programmers use a cross-compiler paired with WinUAE for good reason, or a Vampire. I updated the PLPLOT programming library recently on a classic A1200 using Lattice C 6.58 and even with an 030 accelerator it was a painful experience.  Any further classic development that I undertake will be on a Vampire standalone when it's available and until then, under WinUAE and a Windows-based cross-compiler. Or on AROS and I will back port my AROS apps to OS3.

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2017, 08:25:47 PM »
Quote from: Wayne;829395
Please trust me when I say that I really hate being the A-hole in the room, but just as I spelled out on Whyzzat.com, "I don't  get it".

Without a solid, modern OS, hardware is irrelevant.  It doesn't matter  how fast it is, how much memory, or anything else...  That is, unless  the new hardware in question is/was never intended to be a serious  device, but more of a tinker box for hobbyists with money to spend...

Really, I would welcome something different, but unless you've got a new, user-friendly and powerful OS (which AmigaOS used to be, about 33 years ago), what could you possibly use it for that a $30 Kano kit can't already do?

Wayne


Wow, you mean there's someone here who actually understands that Amigas are a hobby, not a religion, and not something to obsess over?  You gotta be sh@tting me!  LOL!

You're a rare breed here.  I honestly think we have forum members here who haven't touched a non-Amiga computer since the 80's and who still believe that the hardware and the OS are relevant in 2017.  Rip Van Winkles of the computer world!  LOL!

That ship sailed around 1991.

Offline ferrellsl

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Re: Apollo Team announces the Vampire V4
« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2017, 08:30:54 PM »
Quote from: kolla;829399
Yes, they are indeed crippled in a whole lot of ways. Who would not agree to this?



Yes, I do agree with you on that point.  And I too am waiting for an FPU in the Vampire core, but an FPU isn't what I'd consider an urgent need.  I can wait and use the softFPU until then, or fire up WinUAE and run my FPU apps there.

I'm also waiting for an MMU but I can be patient there too.  These things will come in time.  The Vampire is a work in progress, but I also understand your frustration.  Nothing ever happens quickly in Amiga land.