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AuthorTopic: Two new µ-A1's models on the way  (Read 5682 times)

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Offline angrybrit

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #60 on: August 31, 2004, 12:09:11 AM »
@Waccoon

Quote
That's what many people don't realize about external USB2.0 hard drives. I was going to get one myself to replace my internal backup hard drive, until I realized that many external drives can suck between 25% to 50% CPU utilization. Ouch.

USB uses a client/server protocol (server is your CPU :-D ) while Firewire uses a peer to peer protocol.  One puts the load on your CPU while the other shares the load.

External Firewire HDs solutions are always faster and better.
 

Offline KimmoK

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #61 on: August 31, 2004, 06:23:11 AM »
@warface

>ain't XE's having those G4s running at 933 MHz, which makes this silly argument really moot?

That does not make it moot.
Because they are sold as 800Mhz systems for some reason.
One can not buy them expecting them to operate 100% reliably @ 933 untill Eyetech says so.

Other thing is that L2 size of G4 is not set/fixed to 512kt on A1 systems. There must be noticeable difference with 800Mhz G4 with 256k L2 and 800Mhz G3 with 1024k L2, especially if (but perhaps it can) Artisia does not manage to deliver 100% of the FSB bandwidth.


Yet another point to consider with the XE model is that, "more quirks" seems to be one of it's features when comparing to mini boards, according to Alan Redhouse.
- KimmoK
// Windows will never catch us now.
// The multicolor AmigaFUTURE IS NOW !! :crazy:
 

Offline Crumb

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #62 on: August 31, 2004, 10:42:06 AM »
@Kimmok
Quote
Because they are sold as 800Mhz systems for some reason.


The only reason is that Motorola didn't have 800Mhz parts in stock and they sent Eyetech 933Mhz parts for the same price. Eyetech doesn't want to sell them as 933Mhz because next batch will be 800Mhz and some users would complain of paying the same for a slower system.

So Eyetech avoids problems telling us that all their machines are 800Mhz models.

Quote
One can not buy them expecting them to operate 100% reliably @ 933 untill Eyetech says so.


If you set the voltage right and give the g4 a decent cooling system, you shouldn't get lock ups.

The first thing Eyetech should do is check what G4 revision the user gets and put the voltage jumpers according to the G4 revision. That would decrease the number of users complaining about lock-ups. And they should put a decent fan
The only spanish amiga news web page/club: Club de Usuarios de Amiga de Zaragoza (CUAZ)
 

Offline takemehomegrandma

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #63 on: August 31, 2004, 11:05:10 AM »
@ Rogue

I agree with you that the "G" labelling is unfortunate. It's not like there aren't several "G"enerations in each generation, right?

But while some people doesn't seem to like the "G3" mentioned in the same sentense as "A1", they certainly have no problems in proclaiming that "it is faster than the G4 anyway", like "G4" would be one CPU only! Well, the 750GX is indeed a very nice CPU (it will be interesting to see what frequencies will be available for the Pegasos2 BTW ;-)) and it may very well be faster than the old-timers 7451 and 7455 "G4's" for some general usage, but I believe that the Freescale 7447A certainly is up for a serious competition, *both* in performance *and* heat! IMHO, the 7447A is the best PPC CPU of all today (not counting the "G5" platform).

And there is this little "aber" in many peoples reasoning - they are for some reason leaving out the Altivec from the comparisons. The G4 has the Altivec, the G3 doesn't, and that *does* make a difference, even when comparing to the "old-timers" G4's.
MorphOS is Amiga done right! :)
 

Offline the_leander

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #64 on: August 31, 2004, 03:57:08 PM »
I must admit I am genuinely impressed with the Micro A1, the price is pretty good. To those who complain about price when pointing to mini itx X86, I would say this, a G3 will crap on from a great hieght any C3 or nemiah cored system, and is competitively priced with the more advanced big chip (P4-Geode-Dothan accepting as they are not mass produced boards in the same way that micro or standard atx boards are, they are industrial or engineering samples for the most part - read £1000+ just for the board)mini itx solutions out there, and has a similar power requirement as that of the C3 line. And this thing comes with 256Mb of ram, I mean just add hard disk and case and you've got a complete system! This is a KILLER bargain when you look at what its working against and its being offered to consumers (something that the P4-Geode-Dothan mini itx boards aren't) this is probably the fastest mini itx board out there for public consumption and offers in its consumer version more expandability then anything that the via epia's offer (a socketed CPU).

You folks comparing them to standard desktop PC's you miss the point entirely of mini itx. Its about size, noise and power requirements. ITs not about playing the latest games on!

But I'll go a little further, the onboard gfx is about the most advanced gfx I've ever seen in a mini itx board, certainly more powerfull then anything the epia's have on them and powerful enough to play all but the most demanding and advanced games currently available (Lets face it folks, if you want an all out powerhouse, you DON'T buy mini itx, micro atx or atx is where you folks need to go).

If I were on the market for a new system and had the cash, I'd be getting one of these. I would recommend anyone else interested in mini itx to do the same.
Blessed Be,
Alan Fisher - the_leander

[SIGPIC]http://www.extropia.co.uk/theleander/[/SIGPIC]
 

Offline ACE

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #65 on: August 31, 2004, 05:01:09 PM »
Hmmm!  Like the look of the Industrial System.  I hope they make it as low profile as possible.

256Mb on board with SODIMM expansion.  Don't know much about PCI-104

In my opinion the only bad thing is the GPU Unit, the R9200SE core is quite a way more advanced and not much bigger or more costly than the R7000 although don't know about liciencing issues.  A R9600SE would be even better!  Considering the GPU can't be upgraded should go for the most upto date possible.

Possible basic specs

a)G3/600MHz,    128Mb PC133,  Radeon 7000(ve)32Mb
b)G3FX800Mhz,   256Mb PC133,  Radeon 9200SE  64Mb
c)G4/G3VX*1GHz, 256Mb PC2100, Radeon 9600SE  128/64Mb

*G3VX Is my own invention IBM 90nm chip based on G3GX (without bugs!) and an integrated Altivec Unit.

Having established specifications allows S/W designers to have a firm base on which to program for.  Just like games consoles and the old A500 days (just make sure your APIs are future proof)
 

Offline Crumb

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #66 on: August 31, 2004, 05:36:43 PM »
A 9200SE is more or less like a 7000 due to his 64bit memory bus... A full 9200 would make more sense...

If ppc750VX was available now it would be a very good option. Imho the best option now would be a fanless 1Ghz 7447A.
The only spanish amiga news web page/club: Club de Usuarios de Amiga de Zaragoza (CUAZ)
 

Offline downix

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #67 on: August 31, 2004, 06:43:01 PM »
You know, this actually has me considering becoming an A1 dealer, providing that MAI has infact fixed the bugs found in the Articia-S chipset.  Anyone with a "fixed" A1 in southern florida willing to allow me to stress test your box to see?
Try blazedmongers new Free Universal Computer kit, available with the GUI toolkit Your Own Universe, the popular IT edition, Extremely Reliable System for embedded work, Enhanced Database development and Wide Area Development system for telecommuting.
 

Offline Crumb

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #68 on: September 01, 2004, 08:27:58 AM »
You won't find one, simply because IDE DMA is not enabled in the pre-release. You'll have to wait until the next update.

Regarding Linux you should wait too... I just hope MAI releases a DMA-stable kernel by november so industrial customers don't complain about slow hard disk access (if dma is disabled) or data corruption...

Anyway... If you go to an OS4 Show and find a Betatester he may allow you to stress the system (afaik they are testing the DMA enabled ide drivers). That would be a nice test while you wait for it to be released publically.
The only spanish amiga news web page/club: Club de Usuarios de Amiga de Zaragoza (CUAZ)
 

Offline Acill

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #69 on: September 01, 2004, 11:19:39 AM »
You know I am a bit upset over the price myself. When i was at Amiwest I did talk to the dealer showing a prototype of one of these and asked about princing. I was told $1000 range with OS4, but I didnt want to believe it. not that its official and the price is as hight as it is I cant get one. I was thniking of more in the line of $400 without OS4.

Not to start a flame war here, but the price needs to come down. With the Pegasos at less money for a G4 its a way better value.
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Offline Hammer

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #70 on: September 01, 2004, 12:00:01 PM »
Quote
AMD was insane for using the flip-chip design with their Athlons.

They fix that issue on the K8 generation i.e. AMD usually follow Intel in that particular area.
AmigaForever 2016 with AmigaOS 4.1 FE, AMIDuOS\'s Android 5.01, MS Windows 10 Pro X64
Samsung ATIV Book 8 880Z5E laptop with touch screen.
CPU: Intel Core i7-3635QM, 2.4Ghz base, 3.4Ghz turbo.
RAM: 16 GB PC3-12800 (DDR3-1600)
GPU: AMD Radeon HD 8870M (OC) 2GB GDDR5 VRAM.
SSD: 512 GB Samsung 840
 

Offline Hammer

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #71 on: September 01, 2004, 12:34:48 PM »
@the_leander
ITX Motherboard vs ITX motherboard,

LV-670 @ $175 USD
LV-670M @ $225 USD
---
For Motherboard: LV-670M
CPU:Micro-FCPGA Mobile Intel Pentium 4
Memory: One 184-pin DIMM socket
Chipset: Intel 845GV chipset with 82845GV GMCH and 82801DB ICH4
VGA:Intel Extreme Graphics, 266 MHz VGA core and 256-bit 3D engine
Rest of the spec reference no. 2.
---

Reference
1. 130.00 GBP =~ $233.740 USD, www.xe.com
2. http://www.silentpcreview.com/article111-page2.html
3. http://www.silentpcreview.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=111&page=1

www.lippert-at.com's Mini ITX CPU board(inc gfx,6xUSB 2.0,GigaE, 'etc') with Pentium M CPU @1.6GHz cost 674 Euro. Hardly 1000 GBP.

According to 3D Marks 2001, ATI Radeon 7000 is about same level as Intel Extreme graphics.
AmigaForever 2016 with AmigaOS 4.1 FE, AMIDuOS\'s Android 5.01, MS Windows 10 Pro X64
Samsung ATIV Book 8 880Z5E laptop with touch screen.
CPU: Intel Core i7-3635QM, 2.4Ghz base, 3.4Ghz turbo.
RAM: 16 GB PC3-12800 (DDR3-1600)
GPU: AMD Radeon HD 8870M (OC) 2GB GDDR5 VRAM.
SSD: 512 GB Samsung 840
 

Offline Waccoon

Re: Two new µ-A1's models on the way
« Reply #72 on: September 05, 2004, 01:30:05 AM »
Quote
USB uses a client/server protocol (server is your CPU  ) while Firewire uses a peer to peer protocol. One puts the load on your CPU while the other shares the load.

It makes that much difference?

I'll never understand why USB was built to be a server/client system.  Almost all high-speed USB devices I've used and my customers have used (such as printers and digital cameras), have enormous problems running on a hub and will only work if plugged into a USB root.  Believe me, I sell cameras, card readers, and other USB equipment, and deal with the USB hub problem ALL THE TIME.

It's such a widespread problem with so many different hubs, I can't help but blame the USB standard.

Quote
They fix that issue on the K8 generation i.e. AMD usually follow Intel in that particular area.

That's why I said "was".  I ended up getting a P4 before the FX came out, though, and I'm quite happy with it.