First News about Pegasos 2

[amigamad]

But what kind of quality are the componants they are using as they say you get what you pay for and the cheaper something is the cheaper the componants will be after all a bmw cost more and is better than a peugot,just because something is cheap it does not make it any good. :-o

[DaveP]

Just speculating greenboy :-) Ill take your word for it. :-)

[Psy]

amigamad wrote
But what kind of quality are the componants they are using as they say you get what you pay for and the cheaper something is the cheaper the componants will be after all a bmw cost more and is better than a peugot,just because something is cheap it does not make it any good.

Yes your right just becouse somthing is cheaper doesn't make it better but just becouse something is more costly doesn't make it better either.

[JoannaK]

vortexau

That's one way of looking at it; though maybe a "rose-coloured glasses" way! How long can a business market its products when it's selling at a loss?

Selling at a loss? Dare to tell whos numbers are you using or are you knowledgeable enough to make that kind of claim on your own? I hope you have not listened some net-wandering lawers too closely .  :-D

Main issue here is that: IF Genesi is  ever going to target bigger markets than few remainig Amiga-loonies (me included)  they have to be able to make product that is both good and decently priced.  And looks like they have understood these hard realities a lot better than this another mentioned company ...

[AmiGR]

According to BBRV, they won't be selling at a loss,
that's how much the parts+production costs them,
plus a quite good added price to have income...

[bbrv]

Thanks Alkis and Joanna, you are right.

If you add up the cost of the components and the cost of assembly -- even at 299 Euros -- we still make money (and Resellers can too).  The SG&A (Selling, General, and Administrative expenses) are another subject.  But, this is done with our discretion and with a certain budget in mind.

The Pegasos is NOT a loss leader.  

The market has something in mind for the PPC because lots of *marketing* has put it there *and* IBM had a different strategy...

If there were PPC clones, the cost would be the same as the cheapest Win/Intel based solution you could find....think about it.

Have a nice evening.

R&B :-)

[greenboy]

amigamad  : But what kind of quality are the componants they are using

Instead of wearing Rolex, they are using Lolex ; }  Sheesh! Just as a ferinstance, the Marvel II is a considerably more expensive component than that Mai thing. And it will be a faster board with faster memory spec, so ... ... let's move on...
 

as they say you get what you pay for and the cheaper something is the cheaper the componants will be

Evidently the concept of buying the same parts in bulk from competitive suppliers that I mentioned did not make much of an impact. But I don't want to type it in bold caps, so I'll just repeat: buying in bulk from competitive suppliers lowers cost considerably.

There.  ; }

after all a bmw cost more and is better than a peugot,just because something is cheap it does not make it any good

Anybody want to buy a LOLex? I know I'm laughing now ; }

 
 

[Hammer]

If there were PPC clones, the cost would be the same as the cheapest Win/Intel based solution you could find....think about it.

The PPC clone market* may have to reach the ‘economic of scale’ similar to the X86 market before it reaches price equalisation with X86.

One of the cheapest X86 motherboard** I can find****  is $~39 USD (An MSI MS-6340-010, for the Athlon/Duron based CPU). That's around $80 AUD.

*Non-PPC 4xx class.
**Not factoring the 'obsolete' Socket 370 Class motherboard, since they could go down to $19 USD.
****With referable reference (i.e. pricewatch.com).

PS; This is just the motherboards.

IF PPC* platform market is as large as X86, it may attract Microsoft’s attention e.g. Windows NT 4.0 PPC edition (as an example) OR Softwindows 95 (uses a licensed Windows 95 code; for the PPC MacOS platform). Now armed with dotNET ecosystem; different native versions of their said products wouldn’t be a problem.    

Just a side note; Can MorphOS compete with a showdown battle with MS Windows XP PPC edition(speculation)?

[downix]

@Hammer

THat MSI board is also almost 2 years old, so it's EOL.  Right now, nobody has PPC clone boards that are that old.

So let's deal with boards that are currently being produced.  The cheapest I've found in an EPoX board, the EP-8KHAL, which is an old design they've kept in production.  That costs $79 on pricewatch.

Just the motherboard.

It is more than possible to get PPC down to that scale.

[DaveP]

@JoannaK

No. That looks like conjecture based on speculation so he doesn't need to produce numbers.

And it doesn't take a genius to realise that

IF company sells product at loss THEN it will eventually run out of cash reserves

I mean I could go to the bother of posting a whole bunch of case studies in related fields ( although apparently PhaseV is a good close to home example ).

[DaveP]

The SG&A (Selling, General, and Administrative expenses) are another subject. But, this is done with our discretion and with a certain budget in mind.

Well in business they are all part of the same subject. When stuff clears the sales ledger it is USUALLY used to pay towards all time on account as well as material and production costs.

That is, if commodity was single point of income, if something else is cross subsidising part of the expenses assotiated with admin and sales then it is arguable if you could describe that as a loss leader or a subsidised product.

Either way, risky game in this small market IF the expenses are not balanced by the income, but then you have already played that risk game with Peg 1 and "April" oui?

[Rudei]

So you think OS4 won`t be out before September then? I really hope you end laughing on the other side of your face

Er, by the way, I hope that didn`t come across as too aggressive - I forgot to add the smilie  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D  :-D

[bbrv]

Hi DaveP, everything is fine here.

Be good!

Write for PegPong!

;-)

[Warface]

So you think OS4 won`t be out before September then? I really hope you end laughing on the other side of your face

Which year? :-)

OS4 was in an imminent release state since 2001 july.  I remember sitting on the AmigaONE mailing list and listening  to "delays are out of question", "it will be released".

However, OS4 is maturing and will see the light one day. But setting timedates for that is still a very brave speculation. (However, having OS4 by september sounds realistic, just the past experiences...)

[vortexau]

greenboy admitted:

. . . the Marvel II is a considerably more expensive component than that Mai thing.

@greenboy, JoannaK:
We've already seen the prices that the FIRST Pegasos' (Pegasos1) were delivered to the initial developers!

Then, BB claimed to have developed April1 and April2. More cost!

Then, they decide to re-design their motherboard to use different 'bridges. More cost!

They now have to Develop (Software) for the different design. More cost!

A NEW production set-up for the NEW design to be manufactured.  More cost!

So -- if the sales price of the Peg2 is as advised --- what (if any) did they do about:
 «1» The money spent on April1 and April2?
 «2» The money spent on the re-design of their motherboard?
 «3» The money spent on Software design for their new motherboard?
 «3» The money spent on changing their production line?

Was THIS extra cost just covered by a Fairy Godmother?

When FORD comes out with a NEW car -- they have to recover the money spent designing it, changing the production line, and manufacturing new components and body-panels!

[Psy]

So -- if the sales price of the Peg2 is as advised --- what (if any) did they do about:
«1» The money spent on April1 and April2?
«2» The money spent on the re-design of their motherboard?
«3» The money spent on Software design for their new motherboard?
«3» The money spent on changing their production line?

But none of that comes under production cost that is R&D and setup cost.  As long as they have a profit per board what is the big deal?

For all you know they could be planning to make it up later with more sales.

What ever their plan it is pointless to argue about it since we don't have that info.