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Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga Hardware News => Topic started by: eliyahu on November 02, 2015, 04:34:42 PM

Title: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: eliyahu on November 02, 2015, 04:34:42 PM
Introducing Tabor and the A1222
A powerful, low cost, entry level PowerPC motherboard
San Francisco 19th October 2015

A-EON Technology Ltd is pleased to announce (http://a-eon.biz/news/News_Release_A1222.pdf) that Tabor, a new powerful, low cost, entry level PowerPC motherboard, which forms part of our A1200 series, is about to undergo beta testing.

As part of our drive to create more powerful lower cost, entry level hardware and expand the Next-Generation user base we commissioned Ultra Varisys to create a new PowerPC motherboard. The result is Tabor, a 170 mm x 170 mm mother-board based on a Freescale QorIQ P1022 32-bit e500v2 dual-core PowerPC processor running at 1.2 GHz. Prototypes have already been shipped to key developers and members of A-EON Technology’s Core Linux support team and, as a result, several Linux distributions are already up and running on the Tabor board. Working in cooperation with ACube srl, a beta test programme is about to commence, which is already over-subscribed.

The full system is designated the AmigaOne A1222.

Tabor specifications*

* (Subject to change without notice)

(http://amistore.net/images/a-eon_logo_sm.PNG) (http://www.a-eon.com)

Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: dschallock on November 02, 2015, 05:30:44 PM
Awesome!
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: ddniUK on November 02, 2015, 06:26:47 PM
@eliyahu, hopefully it will be well priced and accepted. I have wondered about the omission of the xmos chip.
@dschallock It just needs a paralell port and Rombo Vidi 24 drivers ;)
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Matt_H on November 02, 2015, 06:52:59 PM
A1200 "series"? There will be others? I'd be curious to know what those will be...

At any rate, it'll be nice to have a tiny OS4 companion to my MorphOS Mini Mac...
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: dschallock on November 02, 2015, 08:27:18 PM
Quote from: ddniUK;798655
It just needs a paralell port and Rombo Vidi 24 drivers ;)

hahahaha.  YES!
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: rednova on November 03, 2015, 12:28:54 AM
Will this system be able to run :

-moviesetter
-disney animation studio
-aladdin 4d
-deluxe paint 4
-brilliance
-amos professional

please let me know !!!
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Matt_H on November 03, 2015, 12:45:00 AM
Quote from: rednova;798671
Will this system be able to run :

-moviesetter
-disney animation studio
-aladdin 4d
-deluxe paint 4
-brilliance
-amos professional

please let me know !!!


It will run them as well as any other OS4 system. In other words, they won't work very well, if at all - those programs rely too much on the old hardware or quirks of the old operating system.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Rob on November 03, 2015, 01:46:27 AM
Quote from: rednova;798671
Will this system be able to run :

-moviesetter
-disney animation studio
-aladdin 4d
-deluxe paint 4
-brilliance
-amos professional

please let me know !!!


Aladdin 4D works fine as it is in OS4 but the other, not sure about Movie Setter, will need to be run via UAE.

There will of course be a native port of Aladdin 4D at some point.  You could substitute Dpaint and Brilliance with Ppaint and SketchBlock and there should be free tools that that can replicate what Movie Setter does but may require a little more effort, I can't say for sure since I'm not familiar with that program.

There's nothing similar to AMOS for OS4 and it's unlikely to change.  Also I don't think there are any animation programs with onion skinning, which I assume is one of the reason you like Disney animation studio, maybe something A-EON should consider for future updates to Ppaint.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: amoskodare on November 03, 2015, 03:07:18 AM
Quote from: Rob;798675
There's nothing similar to AMOS for OS4 and it's unlikely to change.

There is Hollywood, it's not Amos but good enough or even better in some areas :)
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: matthey on November 03, 2015, 04:51:41 AM
Quote from: Rob;798675
Aladdin 4D works fine as it is in OS4 but the other, not sure about Movie Setter, will need to be run via UAE.

Petunia, the 68k emulator for AmigaOS 4, is written in PPC assembler likely using the PPC standard FPU to emulate the 68k FPU. Petunia would need a major update to support the Tabor's non-standard FPU and a simple compile is not possible. Not updating Petunia and going through the FPU traps may work but could be slow.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: SACC-guy on November 03, 2015, 07:17:35 AM
Possible other thought...

UlimatePPC /040 project...everyone complained about this ppc chip issue at the time too. (no support and "wrong" ppc chip) so it didn't happen.

But after OS4.1 is ported over to the A1222, won't that mean the UlimatePPC project
would have the support it didn't have before and we with 4000/3000 could have "NEW"
ppc /040 cards???
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 03, 2015, 09:20:32 AM
Quote from: SACC-guy;798682
Possible other thought...

UlimatePPC /040 project...everyone complained about this ppc chip issue at the time too. (no support and "wrong" ppc chip) so it didn't happen.

But after OS4.1 is ported over to the A1222, won't that mean the UlimatePPC project
would have the support it didn't have before and we with 4000/3000 could have "NEW"
ppc /040 cards???

I am not a hardware expert and only guessing but I do not think that. The adaptions needed for Tabor would need also done for Ultimate if it uses different commands or also has FPU problems. And that means someone has to pay for it (and for the needed drivers).
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: matthey on November 03, 2015, 03:37:55 PM
Quote from: SACC-guy;798682

UlimatePPC /040 project...everyone complained about this ppc chip issue at the time too. (no support and "wrong" ppc chip) so it didn't happen.

But after OS4.1 is ported over to the A1222, won't that mean the UlimatePPC project
would have the support it didn't have before and we with 4000/3000 could have "NEW"
ppc /040 cards???


Yes, in theory, most of the huge amount of work to support the dual core P1022 would also support the single core P1013. I believe the non-standard FPU is the same for both.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 03, 2015, 04:00:02 PM
Quote from: matthey;798695
Yes, in theory, most of the huge amount of work to support the dual core P1022 would also support the single core P1013. I believe the non-standard FPU is the same for both.

if a-eon pays for it why should they give it for free? it would make the ultimate card more expensive
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Iggy on November 03, 2015, 04:01:13 PM
Quote from: matthey;798695
Yes, in theory, most of the huge amount of work to support the dual core P1022 would also support the single core P1013. I believe the non-standard FPU is the same for both.


Which would explain why Trevor reached out to that development team.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: LiveForIt on November 03, 2015, 05:05:20 PM
@rednova

-moviesetter

I don't think so, but database over compatible software is lacking.

-disney animation studio

I don't think so, but database over compatible software is lacking.

http://intuitionbase.com/ossoftware.php?category=2&letter=d

My guess is that it will hard to get it working, from time to time you find a gem that works, but most often you end up with UAE, as fallback.

If only the source code was available.

-aladdin 4d

I think A-EON, has that source code, don't know who is working on it or when it going to done.

-deluxe paint 4

With a lot hacks and tricks, you can get Deluxe Paint working somehow.
You are better off using PPaint that has native AmigaOS4 version.
Or if your desperate you can run it in UAE, this might be better way.

-brilliance

No

-Amos professional

There was project called XAMOS, to make AMOS for NG Systems, sadly the developer who worked on XAMOS died unexpected. I don't know if the source code is available or not.

I started on similar project many years ago; the source is a poor state, the project sort of died because I was really just interested in getting one of old program working. So I started re implementing AMOS, but as work progressed, it did not make sense to emulate AMOS, nor did it make sense to write my program in the same way as I did back then. So the AMOS idea was abandoned, as well, as original idea to port the program as it was.

One obvious issue I run into, is that does not make sense to emulate AGA on RTG system, at cost of lower resolutions, colors, and speed. And it did not make sense to make modern AMOS, that was not compatible. I guess that is way it died, as well as fact; it was never the end goal.

Anyway if the idea is make makes it easier to make games by using some simple commands, then there is SDL and Allegro. That do provided commands that easy to program to make games.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 03, 2015, 05:22:48 PM
Quote from: LiveForIt;798698
@rednova

-moviesetter

I don't think so, but database over compatible software is lacking.

-disney animation studio

I don't think so, but database over compatible software is lacking.

http://intuitionbase.com/ossoftware.php?category=2&letter=d

My guess is that it will hard to get it working, from time to time you find a gem that works, but most often you end up with UAE, as fallback.

If only the source code was available.

-aladdin 4d

I think A-EON, has that source code, don't know who is working on it or when it going to done.

-deluxe paint 4

With a lot hacks and tricks, you can get Deluxe Paint working somehow.
You are better off using PPaint that has native AmigaOS4 version.
Or if your desperate you can run it in UAE, this might be better way.

-brilliance

No

-Amos professional

There was project called XAMOS, to make AMOS for NG Systems, sadly the developer who worked on XAMOS died unexpected. I don't know if the source code is available or not.

I started on similar project many years ago; the source is a poor state, the project sort of died because I was really just interested in getting on of old program working. So I started re implementing AMOS, but as work progressed, it did not make sense to emulate AMOS, nor did it make sense to write my program in the same way as I did back then. So the AMOS idea was abandoned, as well, as original idea to port the program as it was.

One obvious issue I run into, is that does not make sense to emulate AGA on RTG system, at cost of lower resolutions, colors, and speed. And it did not make sense to make modern AMOS, that was not compatible. I guess that is way it died, as well as fact; it was never the end goal.

Anyway if the idea is make makes it easier to make games by suing some simple commands, then there is SDL and Allegro. That do provided commands that easy to program to make games.

XAMOS is opensource

http://sourceforge.net/projects/xamos/
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Iggy on November 08, 2015, 03:06:13 AM
Quote from: Niding;798867
Well, depends on your point of view.

Ive wondered why they went with PPC instead of x86.
Ssolie's explaination when it comes to his personal intrest in the OS seems fair enough, if not very efficient.

The original decisions that lead down that path do seem dated, don't they?
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: kolla on November 08, 2015, 04:41:33 AM
Was there ever an AmigaOne system with CPU slot?
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 08, 2015, 10:10:52 AM
Quote from: Niding;798867
Well, depends on your point of view.

Ive wondered why they went with PPC instead of x86.
Ssolie's explaination when it comes to his personal intrest in the OS seems fair enough, if not very efficient.

I have read 2 comments from Ben H. and one of the Friedens with the same justification... BeOS has failed because of running on X86 and there people compared it with Windows and did not use it. Their idea was when AmigaOS runs on a different hardware that would not happen. My view is different... BeOS did not fail because of X86 but because of missing software and people ALWAYS compare the alternatives, it is a illusion to believe that this not happens because of using exotic hardware. Now AmigaOS runs on expensive weak hardware and people still compare it and do not buy it. I do not think it was a wise decision. Perhaps PPC seemed a good thing around 1995 when all started but it was wrong 2003/2004 and is even more so 2015/2016. The problem is... because of no resources they cannot change direction anymore.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Kronos on November 08, 2015, 10:23:35 AM
@BeOS

- BeOS failed when they tried to ship their own HW (the BeBOX)
- BeOS failed when they tried to replace MacOS as the default OS on Macs shipping at that time
- BeOS failed when they tried to take MS headon by negotiating with OEMs over shipping PCs bundled with BeOS !!!instead!!! of Windows

Be never tried to slowly build up a userbase by just shipping a good OS at a reasonable price for easy to get HW and is therefore 100% irrelevant when discussing an x86 port of any legacy OS.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 08, 2015, 10:27:12 AM
Quote from: Kronos;798879
@BeOS

- BeOS failed when they tried to ship their own HW (the BeBOX)
- BeOS failed when they tried to replace MacOS as the default OS on Macs shipping at that time
- BeOS failed when they tried to take MS headon by negotiating with OEMs over shipping PCs bundled with BeOS !!!instead!!! of Windows

Be never tried to slowly build up a userbase by just shipping a good OS at a reasonable price for easy to get HW and is therefore 100% irrelevant when discussing an x86 port of any legacy OS.

I agree that hardware was not the reason but that is how Hyperion justifies PPC instead of X86 (if people interested I could search for the links, I read it two times, one from Ben H., one time from one of the Friedens)
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Blizz1220 on November 08, 2015, 10:29:38 AM
I think they were worried that if it can run on standard PC it would get
pirated as hell as I remember it.Seeing that's not the case with WinUAE
users of OS4 argument is now probably invalid but things were different
back then.

And "name" has it's good points.Somebody who just wikied Amiga may
end up buying AmigaOne before anything else even if 100x better just
because it's "AmigaOne".From my point of view when compared to classic
systems all three incarnations look and offer kinda same things :P
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 08, 2015, 10:32:49 AM
this is what I found:
http://anna.amigazeux.org/detail.php?category=forum&file=0996487745.msg

"Both Beos and Linux serve as a stern warning about what happens if you  try to compete with Windows on the same hardware: you become relegated  to a Windows add-on product without any native software to speak of."

"The reason is simple: why would a software company invest money in  porting its software to another x86 OS when  it knows people can also  boot into Windows or run an «emulator» like Wine or VMWare which allows  you to run Windows software under Linux x86 at near native speeds? The  costs could never be recuperated through sales."
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 08, 2015, 10:35:03 AM
Quote from: OlafS3;798883
this is what I found:
http://anna.amigazeux.org/detail.php?category=forum&file=0996487745.msg

"Both Beos and Linux serve as a stern warning about what happens if you  try to compete with Windows on the same hardware: you become relegated  to a Windows add-on product without any native software to speak of."

and now? Who develops now software for AmigaOS and not for Windows?
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Haranguer on November 08, 2015, 11:14:53 AM
Quote from: Niding;798867
Well, depends on your point of view.

Ive wondered why they went with PPC instead of x86.
Ssolie's explaination when it comes to his personal intrest in the OS seems fair enough, if not very efficient.


During the Amiga Technologies days, that idea was considered.  The backlash from the community was immediate and vehement.  It would not have been a popular choice.

Now, as far as I know, Hyperion only have a license for a PPC port.  If they wanted to do an x86 port, they would have to re-negotiate with Amiga, Inc, and I doubt that would be successful.

But if you want to run Amiga OS on x86, you can use WinUAE or run AROS.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: number6 on November 08, 2015, 01:46:30 PM
Quote from: Haranguer;798885
Now, as far as I know, Hyperion only have a license for a PPC port.  If they wanted to do an x86 port, they would have to re-negotiate with Amiga, Inc, and I doubt that would be successful.



May 18, 2006 - Hans Joerg Frieden before the lawsuit while he was still spokesman for Hyperion on AW.
Quote
Since I am also part of the anti-x86 lobby

Quote
Reason 1: Hyperion does not have a licence for x86, only for PowerPC.

Source (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=19063&forum=17&start=20&viewmode=flat&order=0#294497)

August 8, 2008 - Hans Joerg Frieden during the lawsuit:
Quote
I would really like to port AmigaOS 4.1 to x86.

Source (http://www.amigans.net/modules/xforum/viewtopic.php?post_id=23172#forumpost23172)

October 18, 2009 - Ben Hermans on settlement restrictions:
Quote
There is no limitation to AmigaOS 4.x.

Source (http://www.amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=29777&forum=2&start=100&viewmode=flat&order=0#514408)

June 12, 2011 - Ben Hermans after the settlement on PPC and ARM:
Quote
Then there are some legal issues like some licences being tied to PPC only.

Source (http://www.amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=33800&forum=25&start=40&viewmode=flat&order=0#618192)

August 9, 2014 - Well after the settlement and a theory based on the prior statements made publically by Ben Hermans:
Quote
The Ben Hermans quote about "some licences being tied to PPC only" most certainly refers to the licenses he has from the OS4 developers for their *new* code.

Source (http://www.amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=30303&forum=2&start=80&viewmode=flat&order=0#738671)

Sorry about the off-topic and please try to keep comments from contractors seperate from those made by Hyperion management if you want to understand this.

#6
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: nicholas on November 08, 2015, 02:01:49 PM
Quote from: number6;798892
May 18, 2006 - Hans Joerg Frieden before the lawsuit while he was still spokesman for Hyperion on AW.


Source (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=19063&forum=17&start=20&viewmode=flat&order=0#294497)

August 8, 2008 - Hans Joerg Frieden during the lawsuit:

Source (http://www.amigans.net/modules/xforum/viewtopic.php?post_id=23172#forumpost23172)

October 18, 2009 - Ben Hermans on settlement restrictions:

Source (http://www.amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=29777&forum=2&start=100&viewmode=flat&order=0#514408)

June 12, 2011 - Ben Hermans after the settlement on PPC and ARM:

Source (http://www.amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=33800&forum=25&start=40&viewmode=flat&order=0#618192)

August 9, 2014 - Well after the settlement and a theory based on the prior statements made publically by Ben Hermans:

Source (http://www.amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=30303&forum=2&start=80&viewmode=flat&order=0#738671)

Sorry about the off-topic and please try to keep comments from contractors seperate from those made by Hyperion management if you want to understand this.

#6

So basically in layman's terms when/if PowerPC dies then OS4 dies with it?

Is the licence for any Power ISA processor or specifically the PowerPC?  Mind you, I can't see it being ported to IBM Power 8 hardware but it would be cool if it was. :)
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 08, 2015, 02:06:32 PM
Quote from: nicholas;798897
So basically in layman's terms when/if PowerPC dies then OS4 dies with it?

Is the licence for any Power ISA processor or specifically the PowerPC?  Mind you, I can't see it being ported to IBM Power 8 hardware but it would be cool if it was. :)

X8000 - the workstation for the classes? You just need to make debts for it you need 20 years to repay?`:lol:
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: nicholas on November 08, 2015, 02:09:28 PM
Quote from: OlafS3;798899
X8000 - the workstation for the classes? You just need to make debts for it you need 20 years to repay?`:lol:

Sounds about right for OS4 hardware. ;)
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: eliyahu on November 08, 2015, 11:47:13 PM
@thread

ok, folks. all of the linux/BSD/UNIX discussion has been moved here (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?p=798932). please continue that part of your conversation in that thread, and keep this thread focused on tabor. thanks. :)

-- eliyahu
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Iggy on November 09, 2015, 03:40:46 PM
Quote from: eliyahu;798931
@thread

ok, folks. all of the linux/BSD/UNIX discussion has been moved here (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?p=798932). please continue that part of your conversation in that thread, and keep this thread focused on tabor. thanks. :)

-- eliyahu

That is a fabulous idea.
You guys can continue that one on your own.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: jj on November 09, 2015, 04:16:46 PM
Quote from: nicholas;798897
So basically in layman's terms when/if PowerPC dies then OS4 dies with it?

Is the licence for any Power ISA processor or specifically the PowerPC? Mind you, I can't see it being ported to IBM Power 8 hardware but it would be cool if it was. :)

Could try running it in work on the iSeries then :)
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: jj on November 09, 2015, 04:19:27 PM
This could be good if it really is cheap, need something close to elfika prices. I really want to get into AOS4 coding and got AOS4.1FE running on fs-uae, but its crash happy.  Don't know if its the version  of fs-use or what.  But I would like something stable to tinker on, but its only to learn , so don't want to spend more than a few hundred quid tops.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on November 09, 2015, 08:25:57 PM
I take no credit for this screenshot, it showed up on one of the Amiga Google+ forums:

https://plus.google.com/u/0/109112031330987449775/posts/ZsWGzzwL1f5?cfem=1
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Bennymee on November 09, 2015, 08:51:07 PM
Quote from: Oldsmobile_Mike;798975
I take no credit for this screenshot, it showed up on one of the Amiga Google+ forums:

https://plus.google.com/u/0/109112031330987449775/posts/ZsWGzzwL1f5?cfem=1


Thats is faster then a A1XE G4 933 according to an add on Amibay.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: nicholas on November 09, 2015, 09:12:10 PM
Quote from: Oldsmobile_Mike;798975
I take no credit for this screenshot, it showed up on one of the Amiga Google+ forums:

https://plus.google.com/u/0/109112031330987449775/posts/ZsWGzzwL1f5?cfem=1


That's all well and good running Linux with the whole OS and applications compiled specifically for the exact CPU and FPU.

Running OS4 on it with FPU emulation for the applications is a whole other story.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on November 09, 2015, 10:29:30 PM
Quote from: nicholas;798979
That's all well and good running Linux with the whole OS and applications compiled specifically for the exact CPU and FPU.

Running OS4 on it with FPU emulation for the applications is a whole other story.


I noticed that. Will wait to see what it does running native OS4...
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: wawrzon on November 09, 2015, 11:22:38 PM
45mips and 3mflops under linux euae?
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: BozzerBigD on November 10, 2015, 12:43:03 AM
In response to the the state of things and using PPC because of past decisions; it is what it is. AmigaOS is still developed BeOS isn't. PPC chips are available and new machines are being designed and made so it is a win of sorts. Would Amiga companies make Amiga hardware if Hyperion supported x86/x64? No. Would there be any money left to fund the AmiStore and 'Amiga' software development? No. Could this change in the future? Probably.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: matthey on November 10, 2015, 01:36:37 AM
Quote from: wawrzon;798989
45mips and 3mflops under linux euae?


3.4 FPU MFlops in SysInfo is about 3x the speed of the 68882. The Tabor trapping all FPU instructions would likely drop the MFlops below 6888x performance levels which is awful compared to the 68040 and 68060 FPU.

Quote from: BozzerBigD;798992
In response to the the state of things and using PPC because of past decisions; it is what it is. AmigaOS is still developed BeOS isn't.


Unsustainable. Hyperion was practically bankrupt which means its "state of things" is no more sustainable than for the Be.

Quote from: BozzerBigD;798992

PPC chips are available and new machines are being designed and made so it is a win of sorts.


Unsustainable. There is only one PPC manufacturer left for small quantities of PPC processors and the selection of embedded processors is currently limited as can be seen with the handicapped Tabor board's non-standard FPU. The last PPC manufacturer was just bought out so any manufacturing longevity promises are probably from different management.

Quote from: BozzerBigD;798992

Would Amiga companies make Amiga hardware if Hyperion supported x86/x64?


Unsustainable. Companies don't make new Amiga hardware unless they are partners with A-EON/Hyperion. The PPC Amiga market is too small for new affordable hardware and controlled by access and support for AmigaOS 4. There is new 68k FPGA hardware but it is unsupported by A-EON/Hyperion. Moving to x86_64 would transition to an all software company which has to compete with Windows and Haiku the BeOS descendant. Then we would see who would win an AmigaOS vs BeOS competition for most dead ;).

Quote from: BozzerBigD;798992

No. Would there be any money left to fund the AmiStore and 'Amiga' software development? No. Could this change in the future? Probably.


Unsustainable. Affordable standard hardware would generate more software development than subsidizing software development. I am highly skeptical that the Tabor board is a game changer but sells numbers will tell the story.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: kolla on November 10, 2015, 03:58:52 AM
Quote from: BozzerBigD;798992
AmigaOS is still developed BeOS isn't.


Haiku does not count?
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: apsturk on November 10, 2015, 04:04:01 AM
Quote from: kolla;798998
Haiku does not count?


I think Haiku is great and does count
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: nicholas on November 10, 2015, 09:25:01 AM
Quote from: kolla;798998
Haiku does not count?


It's not teh reel! ;)
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: wawrzon on November 10, 2015, 10:46:16 AM
Quote from: matthey;798993
numbers will tell the story.


we wont know any numbers i guess.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: psxphill on November 10, 2015, 11:57:15 AM
Quote from: matthey;798993
Unsustainable. There is only one PPC manufacturer left for small quantities of PPC processors and the selection of embedded processors is currently limited as can be seen with the handicapped Tabor board's non-standard FPU.

To be fair Freescale started using a standard FPU again in 2008.
The P2040 is considered low end, the P2041 is considered mid range.

It would have made far more sense to design a board around these as they are pin compatible with each other and also more powerful chips (including the 64bit chips from 2012), so the same board could target a wide range of cost points.

Quote from: Haranguer;798885
During the Amiga Technologies days, that idea was considered.  The backlash from the community was immediate and vehement.  It would not have been a popular choice.

Yes it was not so obvious back then that x86 would completely demolish PPC in terms of price to performance, so people stood up for their individuality. We are our own worst enemies. I'm not convinced that switching to another cpu now would have a vastly positive effect, although I am constantly surprised that AmigaOS 4 is still going anyway.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Erol on November 23, 2015, 10:50:50 PM
I have a few questions.

1.  Why call it A1222  and not  A1022?
2.  Will this run MorphOS?
3.  Will this Tabor board out perform Sam boards?

Its great news,  whats the price?
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: itix on November 24, 2015, 07:24:19 AM
Quote from: Erol;799489

2.  Will this run MorphOS?


No.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: F0LLETT on November 24, 2015, 11:44:43 AM
Quote from: itix;799497
No.

Hmmmm, How do you know?
Nothing is set in stone.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: OlafS3 on November 24, 2015, 11:57:50 AM
Quote from: F0LLETT;799507
Hmmmm, How do you know?
Nothing is set in stone.

because he is member of the MorphOS team and knows the internal discussions?
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: F0LLETT on November 24, 2015, 12:02:53 PM
Quote from: OlafS3;799511
because he is member of the MorphOS team and knows the internal discussions?


Maybe, but still, nothing is set in stone.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Yasu on November 24, 2015, 12:15:51 PM
Quote from: Erol;799489
3.  Will this Tabor board out perform Sam boards?

Its great news,  whats the price?

Yes, but only slightly on one core (Tabor is dual core). However, it has an incompatible FPU which has to be run in software mode, making all FPU intensive work a whole lot slower than the SAM (which is also the reason MorphOS Team isn't interested in porting their OS to this board). I also wants to mention that both lacks Altivec.

The price is unknown, but it's said to be cheaper than the SAM.
Title: Re: A-EON Technology: Introducing Tabor and the A1222
Post by: Yasu on November 24, 2015, 12:22:55 PM
Quote from: F0LLETT;799514
Maybe, but still, nothing is set in stone.

I talked to the MorphOS developers at Neuss and they _all_ confirmed that they are not even the slightest interested in porting MorphOS to this board. Not at all, nil, zit. I'm not a MorphOS developer but I am a beta tester and I have talked to these guys a lot. I think you can trust me here when I say: it's not going to happen.