Amiga.org
Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga Software News => Topic started by: chris on February 22, 2016, 08:31:14 AM
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NetSurf (http://www.netsurf-browser.org) is a small, fast CSS capable web browser for AmigaOS and other platforms.
NetSurf 3.4 features many optimisations to improve performance over previous releases. It also contains many bug fixes, including improvements to page layout. This is also the first release to contain the Duktape JavaScript engine. While our JavaScript bindings have seen a lot of development for this release, JavaScript remains disabled by default as the support is incomplete. We recommend all users upgrade to NetSurf 3.4.
*** Download (AmigaOS 4) (http://aminet.net/comm/www/netsurf.lha) ***
Additionally I have released a beta version of an AmigaOS 3.5+ build based on the AmigaOS 4 native frontend. I need help to improve this. Download (AmigaOS 3.5/9) (http://aminet.net/package/comm/www/netsurf_os3)
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NetSurf (http://www.netsurf-browser.org) is a small, fast CSS capable web browser for AmigaOS and other platforms.
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Additionally I have released a beta version of an AmigaOS 3.5+ build based on the AmigaOS 4 native frontend. I need help to improve this. Download (AmigaOS 3.5/9) (http://aminet.net/package/comm/www/netsurf_os3)
How is the speed of this "beta version of an AmigaOS 3.5+ build" on an Amiga 4000 with CSPPC (MC68060@50mHz/PPC604e@200mHz; 128 mB ram) under OS 3.9/WarpOS 16.1?
Is an PUP/WarpOS version available or planned?
Is my hardware setup (see above) sufficiently fast, or does Netsurf only run fast enough on an AmigaForever/UAE environment on a fast WIntel box (i.e. Core i5 quadcore@3.2 gHz)?
If my hardware is sufficient, how can I help to improve Netsurf?
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Chris, since it's you're now able to setup WinUAE with a CSPPC I would love to see you compile builds for WarpOS too. I'd be glad to test them for you.
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How is the speed of this "beta version of an AmigaOS 3.5+ build" on an Amiga 4000 with CSPPC (MC68060@50mHz/PPC604e@200mHz; 128 mB ram) under OS 3.9/WarpOS 16.1?
No idea, try it. It should run OK.
Is an PUP/WarpOS version available or planned?
Nope.
If my hardware is sufficient, how can I help to improve Netsurf?
Report bugs, fix code :)
Chris, since it's you're now able to setup WinUAE with a CSPPC I would love to see you compile builds for WarpOS too. I'd be glad to test them for you.
That's not the problem, I need a compiler which can build for WarpOS and have absolutely no idea how to set one up (and I really, really, don't want to have to set up a third build environment to do this - ie. I'd like my gcc to build both 68k and WarpOS code if possible).
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Chris: Test build is still unavaillable.
Dandy: Test build is quite much faster than aminet build, but it requires guicfx and render libraries from aminet. It has color problems with AGA
RTG systems you need to edit user/choises file manually and add friend_bitmap:1 to get colors displayed correctly.
Problem with both builds is memory fragmention / memory leak wich slows down surfing after few pages.
Generally saying, it is fast amiga.org is displayed less than 20 seconds.
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Chris: Test build is still unavaillable.
Turns out Virgin Media have closed down webspace without telling me.
Try here: http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3
That could be an old or broken version, I didn't look.
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Dandy: Test build is quite much faster than aminet build, but it requires guicfx and render libraries from aminet.
O.K. - I downloaded and extracted Netsurf 3.6 dev and copied the ENV-content to envarc:. Then I rebooted. I also have the guigfx.library_68060 and the render.library_68060 in Libs:.
But when I try to start Netsurf, nothing happens. Tried it via DOpus and by clicking the icon. Nothing.
But I made SnoopDos logs of both approaches. If anone can see from the logs what goes wrong I can mail them. Just send mew an PM with e-mail address.
It has color problems with AGA
No problem - I use a Voodoo 4 in my Mediator in my towered A4k with CSPPC. 128 mB RAM, OS 3.9 with BBs 1 & 2/WarpOS 16.1.
RTG systems you need to edit user/choises file manually and add friend_bitmap:1 to get colors displayed correctly.
Hmmm - I cannot find this file in the extracted directory.
Problem with both builds is memory fragmention / memory leak wich slows down surfing after few pages.
Well, my problem is to get it running first...
Generally saying, it is fast amiga.org is displayed less than 20 seconds.
As I said - I have to get it running first...
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You need to rename those libraries. Remove _68060 from end.
New version :
http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3
Didn't you use installer?
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O.K. - I downloaded and extracted Netsurf 3.6 dev and copied the ENV-content to envarc:. Then I rebooted. I also have the guigfx.library_68060 and the render.library_68060 in Libs:.
But when I try to start Netsurf, nothing happens. Tried it via DOpus and by clicking the icon. Nothing.
But I made SnoopDos logs of both approaches
Run it with -v, it might give some clues. ("netsurf -v")
But try what utri007 suggests first!
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You need to rename those libraries. Remove _68060 from end.
Thanks for the hint! I will try this tonight...
New version :
http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3
Thanks for this info as well!
Didn't you use installer?
Ummm - which installer?
There was no installer included in the 3.6 dev Archive.
All there was was the instruction in the readme to copy all the content from the archive's ENV: Folder to Envarc: and the advice to edit a file (that I'm unable to locate in the achive) manually for the use with graphics cards.
No information on how to install NetSurf.
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Run it with -v, it might give some clues. ("netsurf -v")
But try what utri007 suggests first!
Thank you - I will try both!
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Ummm - which installer?
There was no installer included in the 3.6 dev Archive.
All there was was the instruction in the readme to copy all the content from the archive's ENV: Folder to Envarc: and the advice to edit a file (that I'm unable to locate in the achive) manually for the use with graphics cards.
No information on how to install NetSurf.
That's not my version.
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Ummm - which installer?
There was no installer included in the 3.6 dev Archive.
All there was was the instruction in the readme to copy all the content from the archive's ENV: Folder to Envarc: and the advice to edit a file (that I'm unable to locate in the achive) manually for the use with graphics cards.
No information on how to install NetSurf.
You have tested Arhurs fork, wich is based Framebuffer / SDL / version of Netsurf, wich is meant to be used to debuggin and with no GUI systems ie. DOS. It uses ixemul libraries etc. It is hevily modified and original Netsurf team has asked that could it be renamed to something else than Netsurf. It works nicely with emulators.
Chris version is targeted to real Amigas.
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@utri
could you stop bashing arturs work on each and every occasion just because you are involved with another option? it really doesnt make one want to help with it.
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edit:sorry, post in a wrong thread..
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@utri
could you stop bashing arturs work on each and every occasion just because you are involved with another option? it really doesnt make one want to help with it.
No bashing, everything I said is true. You are too sensitive with this. Arthurs fork works very nicely with emulators.
I'm not involved Netsurf any way, my opinion is just what I have read and based experience with both versions. Even very early versions of Chirs port feels much more "amigish", than arthur's version. Arthur's version locks Computer for long time, wich hasn't happened ever with Chris version. With emulator Arthur's version fast as wind, no problems at all. Memory requirements of Arthur version are now decreased, wich is good, but it is still unuseable with 32mb ram. I could make a Chris version to start with 16mb ram, but it would be unuseable.
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simply dont let it sound like a broken record.
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simply dont let it sound like a broken record.
Problem is that there is certain confusion now and then, you have followed prety much every thread about this. Seems that Dandy is't.
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you can simply tell him that it is a wrong version in this context and point him to the right one. isnt that enough?
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That's not the problem, I need a compiler which can build for WarpOS and have absolutely no idea how to set one up (and I really, really, don't want to have to set up a third build environment to do this - ie. I'd like my gcc to build both 68k and WarpOS code if possible).
The last, probably ancient compared to what you are using, version of GCC for WarpOS
http://aminet.net/package/dev/gcc/ppc-gcc-2.95.3-base
There are WarpOS compilers on that link for compiling on 68k or PPC.
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That's not my version.
O.K. - it's a bit confusing with two different forks of Netsurf for Amiga.
May I suggest to rename both?
Chris's version could be called e.g. HW-NetSurf_v3.x_OS3.lha
and
Arthur's version could be called e.g. UAE-NetSurf_v3.x_OS3.lha.
"HW", as Chris's version is aimed at real Amiga Hardware, and "UAE" as Arthur's version is aimed at Emulators.
Both suggested filenames should necessarily include the actual version number of the build!
This way users could already see from the filename the targetted Amiga system, browser-name, actual version number and targetted OS version(s).
Which is the version number of the "New Version" linked by utri007 in his posting #8?
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No bashing, everything I said is true. ... I could make a Chris version to start with 16mb ram, but it would be unuseable.
@ utri007 & wawrzon:
Guys, please don't start a 'war' on this!
I think both forks have their right to exist.
But as I want a "modern" browser on my old, real Amiga hardware, I think Chris's Version is what I'm looking for.
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You need to rename those libraries. Remove _68060 from end.
Did that - my system no longer crashes partially when I try to start Arthur's Netsurf.
New version :
http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3
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Already downloaded it. Will try to install tonight.
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O.K. - it's a bit confusing with two different forks of Netsurf for Amiga.
May I suggest to rename both?
Actually there are three, as there's a version built for AmiCygnix too!
You'll find Artur's version is called NetSurf68k.
The main factor which tells them apart is the frontend. Artur's is "Framebuffer-SDL", mine is "Amiga", the AmiCygnix version is "gtk". Once you've seen them all it's easy to tell which is which. Before then, read the readme files.
Which is the version number of the "New Version" linked by utri007 in his posting #8?
3.6dev. It's equivalent to CI build 3602, I think.
Once you have it running, "about:testament" will tell you exactly which Git commit it is built from (and by whom, and when)!
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Actually there are three, as there's a version built for AmiCygnix too!
You'll find Artur's version is called NetSurf68k.
The main factor which tells them apart is the frontend. Artur's is "Framebuffer-SDL", mine is "Amiga", the AmiCygnix version is "gtk". Once you've seen them all it's easy to tell which is which. Before then, read the readme files.
3.6dev. It's equivalent to CI build 3602, I think.
Once you have it running, "about:testament" will tell you exactly which Git commit it is built from (and by whom, and when)!
LOL. Well that's about as clear as mud. :lol:
Kidding, kidding. But it's really challenging for anyone who's not already intimately familiar with all the different versions to make heads or tales of all this. I haven't had much time for playing around these past few months, but I know it felt like I downloaded about 30 different versions before I found one that worked on my A2000, back when I started playing around with this. ;)
I'd go one step further. Put them all on one website, or on Aminet. Make it as "dumbed down" as possible. E.g.,
"Click here to download NetSurf for classic machines with a graphics card"
"Click here to download version for classic machines with AGA"
"Click here to download version for WinUAE"
"Click here to download version for OS4"
"Click here to download version for MOS"
Etc. Doesn't have to necessarily be in that order, just a clear differentiation between which version is for which system, lol. :p
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Chris's version could be called e.g. HW-NetSurf_v3.x_OS3.lha
and
Arthur's version could be called e.g. UAE-NetSurf_v3.x_OS3.lha.
i doubt anyone will accept your proposal, especially that its based on imho incorrect information, that chris version is better suited for real amigas and arturs for uae. right, artur develops on uae and with uae in mind, but i have run his browser on an amiga too, including aga version.
right. it woukld be better to join the forces and have on e binary for all. even if i would prefer to build the gui against mui instead against reaction in this case.
so, have you got arturs netsurf running on your system, by now or what? i might check current version here on uae/aros68k, but usually it works out of the box.
then you can test chris his version, which is a bit more fiddling with as i remember. because it is still in experimental stadium. i cant test it here currently, since it isnt compatible with plain 3.1 plus class act and i dont have a 3.9 setup with me.
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I'd go one step further. Put them all on one website, or on Aminet.
http://aminet.net/search?name=netsurf&path=comm/www
I count two versions for 68k, although admittedly it's not immediately obvious what the difference is between them.
My test builds aren't on Aminet as I try to keep that for release versions (the latest there is 3.5, next one will be 3.6).
Also: http://www.netsurf-browser.org/downloads/ contains the *official* builds (no 68k versions on there yet)
I do understand the confusion and try to be very clear in my news articles about which version I'm refering to.
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Actually there are three, as there's a version built for AmiCygnix too!
Wow! Even more confusing...
You'll find Artur's version is called NetSurf68k.
That's most likely the reason why I confuse them all the time:
My Amiga System is both - 68k AND OS3.x (and furthermore PPC and OS4).
So - no matter what I read (NetSurf OS3 or NetSurf 68k) - I always think it is the right version for MY system (aside from OS4 Version)...
The main factor which tells them apart is the frontend. Artur's is "Framebuffer-SDL", mine is "Amiga", the AmiCygnix version is "gtk".
I see. But excuse my ignorance - could you please explain to me what "Framebuffer-SDL" means in this regard?
Once you've seen them all it's easy to tell which is which. Before then, read the readme files.
For now I'd be happy to get one of them running...
3.6dev.
Arrgh - to top it all both versions (Arthur's and yours) have the same version number! The SDL version I tried to run is also 3.6 dev...
It's equivalent to CI build 3602, I think.
Once you have it running, "about:testament" will tell you exactly which Git commit it is built from (and by whom, and when)!
What does "CI build 3602" mean?
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I see. But excuse my ignorance - could you please explain to me what "Framebuffer-SDL" means in this regard?
Yes, it's the frontend. NetSurf is split into the "core" - which is the bit which does all the layouting, fetching, etc - and the frontends - which are the OS-specific bits, so the GUI, rendering, input handling etc.
Framebuffer is a non-GUI interface, it basically just writes the browser direct to the screen. All the fonts and graphical elements are built internally and the OS has little involvement. Framebuffer has some other outputs built on top of it, so there's Linux Framebuffer (I assume this will run from a command-line without X, never tried it) and SDL (which uses the SDL libraries to create the display and handle input).
As you can see, the Framebuffer frontend isn't really designed for running on a multitasking windowed operating system.
Arrgh - to top it all both versions (Arthur's and yours) have the same version number! The SDL version I tried to run is also 3.6 dev...
Yes, it's NetSurf internal numbering :)
Anything between releases gets the next version+"Dev".
Release versions don't have the "Dev".
My versions also have a standard version string, so you can run "version" on them and see the build date (the version number there wil be 3.60006 I think)
Most people run the CI builds, which have the next version number plus their own numbering...
What does "CI build 3602" mean?
It's literally a sequential build number. The auto-builder builds NetSurf after every commit, build number 3602 occured at around the time I manually built the current "3.6dev".
The version command there will show 3.3602 (which is why release versions are +.60000)
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Great explanation Chris! Thank you for thanking the time to do that.
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i doubt anyone will accept your proposal, especially that its based on imho incorrect information, that chris version is better suited for real amigas and arturs for uae.
O.K. - ist juist a minor difference, but at least it is a difference: I did not propose, I just suggested...
And as far as I understood utri007, he didn't say "better suited for", but "works nicely with emulators" and "is targeted to real Amigas"...
right, artur develops on uae and with uae in mind, but i have run his browser on an amiga too, including aga version.
Very good.
In case you also tested Chris's version on the same "real Amiga", you should be able to tell us which of them feels more responsive on a "real Amiga"...
right. it woukld be better to join the forces and have on e binary for all.
Yeah - why not.
even if i would prefer to build the gui against mui instead against reaction in this case.
Why not support both GUIs and let the user decide which one he likes more ("skins")?
so, have you got arturs netsurf running on your system, by now or what?
It turned out that I tried to start Arthur's version with no success. Confusingly enough, his version also has the version number "3.6 dev".
No, I have not succeeded yet to get it running.
And to be honest, after learning that it doesn't have a GUI and will only run from a command-line I don't feel very inclined to test it.
i might check current version here on uae/aros68k, but usually it works out of the box.
Here I have to contradict.
The "3.6 dev" version CANNOT "work out of the box", as SnoopDos clearly showed me that some files were not in the drawer where they should have been according to SnooDos, e.g. the file "Resource.map" is in "Resources" - not in "Resources/de/" and "Resources/en/", where the system is looking for it upon start.
I had to copy it over manually in order to get an "O.K." instead "Fail" in SnoopDos.
then you can test chris his version, which is a bit more fiddling with as i remember. because it is still in experimental stadium.
???
"More fiddling"? "Experimental Stadium"?
I would only expect a "dev" version to be in "experimental stadium", e.g. "netsurf 3.6 dev".
All other, earlier versions should run stable, or did I get something completely wrong?
i cant test it here currently, since it isnt compatible with plain 3.1 plus class act and i dont have a 3.9 setup with me.
I have all OS versions - ranging from 1.2 up to 4.0 classic.
I mainly use 3.9 - 4.0 is just an "experimental Installation", as 4.x classic doesn't support my hardware configuration sufficiently (just USB 1.1 instead of 2.0, just 10 mBit NIC mode instead of 100, limited Mediator support and so on).
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Yes, it's the frontend. ... I manually built the current "3.6dev".
The version command there will show 3.3602 (which is why release versions are +.60000)
Thanks for explaining!
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Dandy: Arthur's fork has GUI, he made one for it. I ques thats why Netsurf team is not so keen about it. It is hevily modied to different product. It doesn't have MUI gui, just custom build GUI. How ever it has a MUI gui for preferences window.
About Chris' Netsurf it doens't have any fiddling. Download it and install it. Only thing is those render and guigfx libraries to sys:libs. It uses standard amiga intuition so just one version for all systems. Minium AGA or RTG
Known problems :
-Tabs are unstable and closing them most likely crash browser.
-Iconify button doesn't work.
-Memory framention / leak. Slow down effect after few pages. Some simplier sites works like charm like http://amigahistory.co.uk/
-AGA has color problems at least with some jpg images.
-Reaction GUI doesn't always refresh.
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[On Reaction and MUI]
Why not support both GUIs and let the user decide which one he likes more ("skins")?
You can't just "plug in" MUI instead of Reaction. If you wanted to use both you're re-writing at least 50% of the code, and if you want to switch between them you have an additional layer of abstraction. It could be done, but it's certainly not something I'll be doing.
It turned out that I tried to start Arthur's version with no success.
[...]
And to be honest, after learning that it doesn't have a GUI and will only run from a command-line I don't feel very inclined to test it.
That's not what I said :)
The "3.6 dev" version CANNOT "work out of the box", as SnoopDos clearly showed me that some files were not in the drawer where they should have been according to SnooDos, e.g. the file "Resource.map" is in "Resources" - not in "Resources/de/" and "Resources/en/", where the system is looking for it upon start.
I had to copy it over manually in order to get an "O.K." instead "Fail" in SnoopDos.
Please, no, don't do that. Those fails are correct and normal. If you copy files around like that NetSurf is going to start looking for other files in places where they aren't and there's no telling what will happen.
That resource structure should not be fiddled with, it is searched in a specific manner and missing files in certain locations are expected and dealt with.
???
"More fiddling"? "Experimental Stadium"?
I would only expect a "dev" version to be in "experimental stadium", e.g. "netsurf 3.6 dev".
All other, earlier versions should run stable, or did I get something completely wrong?
My build is somewhat experimental but 3.5 is pretty stable, and anything marked "dev" is as stable as you'd expect (ie. wavering between fine and entirely non-working).
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@dandy
i have tested chris version quite a while ago and at that time it was magnitudes slower than arturs one. according to what im reading here, it has changed, which i hope. still there seems to be a performance problem related to clib2 it is usually linked against. also there are other open issues as mentioned by utri. therefore it should be considered experimental development version. you shouldnt get disappointed if something doesnt work at this time.
what concerns frontend, arturs version has a gui and doesnt usually need to be started from shell. as i said id prefer mui to have it easily portable between amiga platforms, but as chris said its a lot of work starting over and i dont expect him to pic up this task, nor anyone else to be honest. so id try to support reaction frontend at this time.
what concerns arturs netsurf, you likely need to assign netsurf to the directory you have put it in. that would excplain snoopdos reporting resource files problems. i will try to confirm this in a while.
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okay.
im downloading arturs version 3.6 dev
https://dl.orangedox.com/E9aVebH0KVgPZ8C4jR
linked from here:
http://ami-soft.blogspot.com/2016/07/netsurf-36-development.html
it appears that at least the rtg binary is ixemul dependant.
you ll find ixemul v63.1 here:
http://amiga.sourceforge.net/
no assign necessary as it seems. netsurf open window and the local start page, however i didnt get it to go online. may be that i need to edit some setting since im using aros. it might expect amitcp or something like that.
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About Chris' Netsurf it doens't have any fiddling. Download it and install it.
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I did.
Then I tried to start it - system crashed!
I rebooted and started SnoopDos before trying it again.
The last action SnoopDos recorded before the system froze was reading "FONTS:helvetica/15" with result "O.K.".
Furthermore a nice picture appeared on the screen before the crash telling: "NetSurf Initialising" or something along those lines - but it said it is the OS4 version???
Do you have an idea what could could be going wrong here?
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you might try to run chris' netsurf executable from shell wit option -v for "verbose" iirc:
netsurf -v
and post here, where it crashes in debug output.
btw. the splash telling you its os4 version is simply because it is still in beta and none took care of it, i dont think you might be able to run a ppc executable on 68k even half a way;)
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Where / wich version you downloaded?
run netsurf from shell netsurf -V forward log to somewhere so that you can send it to Chris.
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FPU? It shouldn't need one, but I've not figured out how to stop GCC from insisting on building for it. I need to force it to use -m68020-60 -msoft-float.
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FPU? It shouldn't need one, but I've not figured out how to stop GCC from insisting on building for it. I need to force it to use -m68020-60 -msoft-float.
I have removed -m68020-60 and it worked.
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I have removed -m68020-60 and it worked.
Something not quite right there, then. I don't really want to build for plain 68000, which is what that will do.
(it has just made me realise the other libraries are probably 68000/nofpu and NetSurf is building 020-60/fpu rather than the other way round though)
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Where / wich version you downloaded?
The one you linked in your posting #8 in this thread.
run netsurf from shell netsurf -V
Did that.
Lots of text lines appeared and disappeared very fast in the Shell - too fast to read anything, followed by a system crash with black screen.
forward log to somewhere so that you can send it to Chris.
How can I save a logfile?
SnoopDos writes into a buffer (RAM), which can be copied to clip, pasted into an editor and then can be saved to disk.
But as soon as the system crashes, everything is gone - before I get to the point where I can copy the log buffer to the clipboard, paste it into an editor and then save it to disk.
I was thinking of redirecting the shell messages to HD - but then the system would crash in the middle of the writing process, which might kill my HD.
Obviously I do not want to risk that!
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No bashing, everything I said is true. You are too sensitive with this. Arthurs fork works very nicely with emulators.
I'm not involved Netsurf any way, my opinion is just what I have read and based experience with both versions. Even very early versions of Chirs port feels much more "amigish", than arthur's version. Arthur's version locks Computer for long time, wich hasn't happened ever with Chris version. With emulator Arthur's version fast as wind, no problems at all. Memory requirements of Arthur version are now decreased, wich is good, but it is still unuseable with 32mb ram. I could make a Chris version to start with 16mb ram, but it would be unuseable.
Artur makes a great job offering something at all... there are not many coders left you know, bashing the few remaining ones is not very helpful. I could also say Chris version is useless because based on reaction that was only available on 3.5/3.9. Many people use more plain systems and do not want to install 3.9
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I was thinking of redirecting the shell messages to HD - but then the system would crash in the middle of the writing process, which might kill my HD.
Obviously I do not want to risk that!
you might launch a resetfest RAD: and redirect the output to a file there.
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I will try building a plain 68000 binary when I get chance. Pretty sure that's the issue here.
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Artur makes a great job offering something at all... there are not many coders left you know, bashing the few remaining ones is not very helpful. I could also say Chris version is useless because based on reaction that was only available on 3.5/3.9. Many people use more plain systems and do not want to install 3.9
With all respect to you. I disagree about bashing, there is no bashing. There is a critisim and opinions. You have all there rights say so, I woun't mind and I'm prety sure that Chris wouldn't either. You see there are different point of views and they are all equal. Your point is based to facts, that is always OK, but that would be just yours and some other people point of view.
About a Wawrzon's opinion about this. I woun't change record, but I have listen to him. I do try to remember say not just crisisim, but also say something positive. Like Arthur's fork works very nicely with UAE, surpricingly fast. I have had very bad luck with those build with real Amiga, they are unuseable and behave very "unamigish way".
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I was thinking of redirecting the shell messages to HD - but then the system would crash in the middle of the writing process, which might kill my HD.
Obviously I do not want to risk that!
I have forwared logs to HD.
Is it just Netsurf -V >DH1:netsurf_log.txt ?? or do I remember wrong?
My system partition uses ffs, but others use pfs or sfs. No problems with those.
I think that it woun't kill you hard drive, maybe it will validate it but there is no ffs problem without cure.
What kind of hardware you are using? Cyberstorm with what graphicscard and rtg software?
Do you have any patches running from startup-sequence? Like TLSF? You are using Amiga OS3.9 with BB1&2?
-
Dandy, please try the version I've just uploaded: http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3
-
I have forwared logs to HD.
Is it just Netsurf -V >DH1:netsurf_log.txt ?? or do I remember wrong?
My system partition uses ffs, but others use pfs or sfs. No problems with those.
I think that it woun't kill you hard drive, maybe it will validate it but there is no ffs problem without cure.
Ok - will try that next week.
Currently I'm spend my weekend at my "main home". My Amigas are in my apartment in Cologne, where I stay during the week, when I'm working.
This is the fate of a commuter...
;)
B.t.w. - I use registered version of PFS3 on System3.9 and FFS on the other partitions, IIRC.
What kind of hardware you are using? Cyberstorm with what graphicscard and rtg software?
I use a Voodoo 4 with Picasso 96 in my Mediator (in Zorro III, with Buster 11) in my towered A4k with CSPPC (MC68060@50mHz/PPC604e@200mHz; 128 mB ram), OS 3.9 with BBs 1 & 2/WarpOS 16.1.
Furthermore:
Terratec 512i digital soundcard, 10/100 mBit NIC in Mediator PCI busboard.
Deneb USB 2.0 highspeed in Zorro III.
CD-Rom, CD-Ram, DVD-Ram. tapestreamer and scanner on the UW-SCSI.
2 HD floppydrives.
Do you have any patches running from startup-sequence? Like TLSF?
Not that I knew...will have to check...
What is TLSF, btw?
You are using Amiga OS3.9 with BB1&2?
Yessir!
-
Dandy, please try the version I've just uploaded: http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3
Ok - will download and try it when I'm back in Cologne tomorrow night!
Is this build compiled for plain 68000?
As I use 68060...
-
Regarding the "Miracles we do at once, the impossible takes a little longer" in your signature - we have a similar saying here in Germany:
"The impossible we do at once, miracles take nine months..."
:biglaugh:
-
What is TLSF, btw?
http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=47129
Build for 68000 would be interesting for minimig users. OS3.5/9 Requires 68020, but it is possible get it running with plain 680000
-
Ok - will download and try it when I'm back in Cologne tomorrow night!
Is this build compiled for plain 68000?
As I use 68060...
Yes. Keep hold of the previous one in case that's not the problem.
Regarding the "Miracles we do at once, the impossible takes a little longer" in your signature - we have a similar saying here in Germany:
"The impossible we do at once, miracles take nine months..."
:biglaugh:
:)
-
you might launch a resetfest RAD: and redirect the output to a file there.
Ummm - the last time I set up a RAD: is ages ago. It was back in my A500 days (pre 1998)...
It seems I have forgotten something about RAD:.
I looked in my OS 3.9 book, but could not find anything regarding RAD:.
Then I looked in my OS 3.1 books and copied RAD and RAD.info from "storage:dosdrivers" to "devs:dosdrivers", as described there.
I rebooted, but no RAD:.
I also double-clicked the RAD.info - but all I got was a system crash.
RAD version is 40.1.
What am I doing wrong?
-
...
Do you have any patches running from startup-sequence? Like TLSF?
...
Just checked it - no.
-
Dandy, please try the version I've just uploaded: http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3
Just tried it - it also crashes.
Will try it now from shell with -v option...
EDIT:
Starting from shell with -v also freezes my system.
Now I hope someone can enlighten me how to get my RAD running...
-
Just tried it - it also crashes.
Will try it now from shell with -v option...
EDIT:
Starting from shell with -v also freezes my system.
Now I hope someone can enlighten me how to get my RAD running...
Do you get any output before it freezes?
-
Do you get any output before it freezes?
In the shell - yes.
But as the system freezes (mouse pointer not movable) I have to make a reset - and all is gone.
So I have to redirect the output to a RAD: - then I can copy the output from there after the reboot.
-
In the shell - yes.
But as the system freezes (mouse pointer not movable) I have to make a reset - and all is gone.
So I have to redirect the output to a RAD: - then I can copy the output from there after the reboot.
for the time being, you might look what is the latest entry in your deubug log at least and post it here.
what concerns RAD, yes copying to devs and double clicking should activate it afair. maybe there is something wrong with the mount list.. simply google after questions you have, usually they have been asked before.
another solution is to have a spare small partition on your drive that doesnt contain essential stuff, in order to redirect the output there. or redirect the output to serial device, and caught it with another computer, but that is probably too complicated for you.
-
In the shell - yes.
But as the system freezes (mouse pointer not movable) I have to make a reset - and all is gone.
So I have to redirect the output to a RAD: - then I can copy the output from there after the reboot.
Try statram from aminet.
-
...
what concerns RAD, yes copying to devs and double clicking should activate it afair. maybe there is something wrong with the mount list..
Hmmm - yesterday I was also thinking that I might have to start RAD by typing "Mount RAD: from Devs:mountlist" in a Shell, but it told me it could not find "Devs:mountlist". So I checked Devs: for the mountlist - no mountlist in Devs:.
simply google after questions you have, usually they have been asked before.
O.K. ...
another solution is to have a spare small partition on your drive that doesnt contain essential stuff, in order to redirect the output there.
I can try that.
or redirect the output to serial device, and caught it with another computer, but that is probably too complicated for you.
Its not too complicated for me, but currently the A4kPPC is my only machine here in Cologne (aside from non-networked A1200 and A500s in the cabinet that I haven't fired up since over a decade).
-
Try statram from aminet.
Will try that at home.
-
Hmmm - yesterday I was also thinking that I might have to start RAD by typing "Mount RAD: from Devs:mountlist" in a Shell, but it told me it could not find "Devs:mountlist". So I checked Devs: for the mountlist - no mountlist in Devs:.
Usually you just double-click the RAD icon in SYS: Storage/DOSDrivers
-
DEVS:Mountlist is a relic of the past, the move to DEVS:DOSDrivers and SYS:Storage/DOSDrivers happened like... 25 years ago. :p
OS3.x comes with RAD in SYS:Storage/DOSDrivers, just go there and double click it, or just type "mount RAD:" in shell.
-
Its not too complicated for me, but currently the A4kPPC is my only machine here in Cologne (aside from non-networked A1200 and A500s in the cabinet that I haven't fired up since over a decade).
the question is at what baud the output be. otherwise you would just need to use null modem cable conecting serial of your a4000 to a serial of either of your spare amigas, run a terminal program there and save the output to a floppy. than restart the a4000 read the log from the floppy and post it online here, if this is the machine you are (or may be) using for internet.
-
Usually you just double-click the RAD icon in SYS: Storage/DOSDrivers
Yeah - I know.
Just that this crashes my system...
:confused:
This is aggravated by the fact that my A4k currently has his occasional contact problems and refuses to boot.
Now I first have to open the box and clean the CPU board connector with off-the-shelf electronic sprays like KONTAKT 60 (http://www.kontaktchemie.com/KOC/) and Kontakt WL (http://www.kontaktchemie.com/KOC/KOCproductdetail.csp?product=KONTAKT%20WL).
But currently it is far too hot for me here in Cologne to do that - cannot concentrate on it when it is so hot...
-
the question is at what baud the output be. otherwise you would just need to use null modem cable conecting serial of your a4000 to a serial of either of your spare amigas, run a terminal program there and save the output to a floppy. than restart the a4000 read the log from the floppy and post it online here, if this is the machine you are (or may be) using for internet.
I think I will try it with RAD: or statram first...re-activating one of my old Miggies for this seems to be too laborious...
-
Yeah - I know.
Just that this crashes my system...
:confused:
In that case you have bigger problems.
-
imho, the first stage of testing should happen in winuae anyway. especially not on a flaky hardware. my problem is, i dont have amigaos 3.9 here, only aros, otherwise i would have done this by now. but surely there are more people around who could do that.. i wonder that everybody is asking for a browser, yet when it comes to help testing then there is none..
-
imho, the first stage of testing should happen in winuae anyway. especially not on a flaky hardware. my problem is, i dont have amigaos 3.9 here, only aros, otherwise i would have done this by now. but surely there are more people around who could do that.. i wonder that everybody is asking for a browser, yet when it comes to help testing then there is none..
I am new to the netsurf evolution and this thread, but I would be happy to do some testing and help. Should I just read through this whole thread to get caught up and understand what testing is desired?
-
I am new to the netsurf evolution and this thread, but I would be happy to do some testing and help. Should I just read through this whole thread to get caught up and understand what testing is desired?
The information is rather fragmented around several threads. Short version: download http://cy2.uk/netsurfos3 and see how you get on.
-
I am new to the netsurf evolution and this thread, but I would be happy to do some testing and help. Should I just read through this whole thread to get caught up and understand what testing is desired?
encountering problems, might be enough to read the previous page of this thread, about how to catch the debug log and post it here. :)
btw. thanks for your offer.
-
Do you get any output before it freezes?
The last operation listed in the shell is:
"(3.503184) frontends/amiga/gui.c:5354 ami_gui_splash_open: Attempting to open splash window"
Then the system freezes.
Tried to save the SnoopDOS log to statram SD0:, as well as to HD, both with no result.
SD0: is empty after reboot, although before starting NetSurf there is an empty "snoopdos.log". So I assume that SD0: is lost during system freeze/reboot and freshly started after the reboot.
On the HD, the directory for SnoopDOS logs is also empty after reboot - so no SnoopDOS log.
-
The last operation listed in the shell is:
"(3.503184) frontends/amiga/gui.c:5354 ami_gui_splash_open: Attempting to open splash window"
Then the system freezes.
Do you see the splash window?
If not:
Are you running at least AmigaOS 3.5?
Do you have a PNG DataType installed and active?
Do you have any weird 3rd party patches or replacement components?
How much RAM do you have free when you start NetSurf?
If you do see the splash, then I'd have expected a little bit more output.
-
Do you see the splash window?
If with "splash screen" you mean the window saying "Initialising NetSurf - OS4 version"
then yes.
If not:
Are you running at least AmigaOS 3.5?
Although "yes" above: I`m running OS 3,9 with BBs I & II/WarpOS 16.1.
Do you have a PNG DataType installed and active?
Yes.
Do you have any weird 3rd party patches or replacement components?
Nothing of this kind in the Statup-sequence.
But I have things like "NetClockCron" in WBStartup.
How much RAM do you have free when you start NetSurf?
Currently I have 1.876.672 Bytes CHIP and 79.745.448 Bytes FAST available (IBrowse and YAM running).
If you do see the splash, then I'd have expected a little bit more output.
As I already pointed out, there are a lot of text lines rushing through the shell window. I just wrote down the content of the last line on a sheet of paper to be able to post it here after the reboot.
-
Any ideas, anyone?
-
...
Is it just Netsurf -V >DH1:netsurf_log.txt ?? or do I remember wrong?
...
This way just an empty file "netsurf_log.txt" is generated in statram SD0:
(solved the statram issue meanwhile)
-
As I already pointed out, there are a lot of text lines rushing through the shell window. I just wrote down the content of the last line on a sheet of paper to be able to post it here after the reboot.
That line is in the function here:
http://git.netsurf-browser.org/netsurf.git/tree/frontends/amiga/gui.c#n5551
What you can do is add some more LOG() lines in that function, and in the function I've linked to to try and determine where it is crashing.
The next line in the log should be "User:" on line 5599. ami_gui_commandline might output something too (line 5593)
Including ami_gui_splash_open(), that only leaves four function calls where it can be crashing, and none of them do anything exciting. If you're getting the "initialising" and version number text on the splash screen, then that can pretty much be eliminated as well.
edit sorry, I thought I was talking to DNADL!
-
Any ideas, anyone?
I think that you should reinstall Boing Bags 1 & 2. You should propably skip romupdates of BB2.
There is issues with you OS install wich should solved before.
You don't have loadmodule command in you startup-sequence?
-
I think that you should reinstall Boing Bags 1 & 2. You should propably skip romupdates of BB2.
I`ll try that.
There is issues with you OS install wich should solved before.
What issues could that be?
I`ve had no problems with my System since 15 years or so...
(Last time startup-sequence was edited was in Aug 2005...)
You don't have loadmodule command in you startup-sequence?
As far as I can see the only "loadmodule"-entry in my startup-sequence is by Poseidon for early USB mouse and keyboard support:
"PsdLoadModule DEVS:input.device QUIET ;Added by Poseidon-Installer
; $VER: Startup-Sequence_HardDrive 45.1 (25.11.00)
; Startup-Sequence for hard drive systems
If Exists C:IDEFix
C:IDEFix
EndIf
C:SetPatch QUIET
C:Version >NIL:
C:AddBuffers >NIL: DF0: 15
FailAt 21
C:MakeDir RAM:T RAM:Clipboards RAM:ENV RAM:ENV/Sys
C:Copy >NIL: ENVARC: RAM:ENV ALL NOREQ
Resident >NIL: C:Assign PURE
Resident >NIL: C:Execute PURE
Assign >NIL: ENV: RAM:ENV
Assign >NIL: T: RAM:T
Assign >NIL: CLIPS: RAM:Clipboards
Assign >NIL: REXX: S:
Assign >NIL: PRINTERS: DEVS:Printers
Assign >NIL: KEYMAPS: DEVS:Keymaps
Assign >NIL: LOCALE: SYS:Locale
Assign >NIL: LIBS: SYS:Classes ADD
Assign >NIL: HELP: LOCALE:Help DEFER
BindDrivers
C:Mount >NIL: DEVS:dOSDrivers/~(#?.info)
C:LoadMonDrvs
; IF EXISTS DEVS:Monitors
; IF EXISTS DEVS:Monitors/Voodoo5
; DEVS:Monitors/Voodoo5
; EndIF
; C:List >NIL: DEVS:Monitors/~(#?.info|Voodoo5) TO T:M LFORMAT
; "DEVS:Monitors/%s"
; Execute T:M
; C:delete >NIL: T:M
; EndIF
SetEnv Language "english"
SetEnv Workbench $Workbench
SetEnv Kickstart $Kickstart
UnSet Workbench
UnSet Kickstart
C:AddDataTypes REFRESH QUIET
C:IPrefs
C:ConClip
Path >NIL: RAM: C: SYS:Utilities SYS:Rexxc SYS:System S: SYS:Prefs SYS:WBStartup SYS:Tools SYS:Tools/Commodities
SYS:System/REXXMast >NIL:
IF EXISTS S:User-Startup
Execute S:User-Startup
EndIF
Resident Execute REMOVE
Resident Assign REMOVE
C:LoadWB
EndCLI >NIL:
"
-
...
I You should propably skip romupdates of BB2.
...
What does that do with my system?
I backupped an old startup-sequence from OS 3.9-BB1, which included this line:
"SetPatch SKIPROMUPDATES "scsi.device" QUIET"
But I seem to remember that it caused an issue with the UW-SCSI on my CSPPC, which I use exclusively...
-
...
On the HD, the directory for SnoopDOS logs is also empty after reboot - so no SnoopDOS log.
Finally I managed to get a SnoopDos logfile:
"SnoopDos logging started on Dienstag, 26-Jul-16 at 19:02:32
Count Process Name Action Target Name Options Res.
----- ------------ ------ ----------- ------- ----
1 [5] rx Open NIL: Write OK
2 ARexx Open * Read OK
3 ARexx Open NetClock.rexx Read OK
4 ARexx Open System3.9:S/NetClock.rexx Read OK
5 ARexx Open System3.9:S/NetClock.conf Read OK
6 « ConClip » Open CLIPS:0 Read OK
7 [7] work:internet/ Open SD0:netsurf_log.txt Write OK
8 [7] work:internet/ Open CONSOLE: Write OK
9 ramlib Load LIBS:version.library OK
10 ramlib Load LIBS:Picasso96API.library OK
11 ramlib Load LIBS:guigfx.library OK
12 ramlib Load LIBS:render.library OK
13 [7] work:internet/ Open ENV:guigfx/autoditherthreshold Read Fail
14 [7] work:internet/ Open ENVARC:guigfx/autoditherthreshold Read Fail
15 [7] work:internet/ Open ENV:guigfx/usescalepixelarray Read Fail
16 [7] work:internet/ Open ENVARC:guigfx/usescalepixelarray Read Fail
17 [7] work:internet/ Open ENV:guigfx/usewpa8 Read Fail
18 [7] work:internet/ Open ENVARC:guigfx/usewpa8 Read Fail
19 ramlib Load LIBS:images/bitmap.image OK
20 ramlib Load LIBS:gadgets/fuelgauge.gadget OK
21 ramlib Load LIBS:gadgets/getfile.gadget OK
22 ramlib Load LIBS:gadgets/getfont.gadget OK
23 ramlib Load LIBS:gadgets/getscreenmode.gadget OK
24 ramlib Load LIBS:datatypes/WarpPNG.datatype OK
25 [7] work:internet/ Open SYS:Classes/Datatypes/WarpDT.key Read OK
26 [7] work:internet/ Open ENVARC:datatypes/WarpDT.prefs Modify OK
27 [7] work:internet/ Open PROGDIR:Resources/splash.png Read OK
28 [7] work:internet/ Open FONTS:ruby.font Read OK
29 [7] work:internet/ Load FONTS:ruby/12 OK
30 [7] work:internet/ Open FONTS:helvetica.font Read OK
31 [7] work:internet/ Load FONTS:helvetica/15 OK"
Does this tell you something?
-
Finally I managed to get a SnoopDos logfile:
27 [7] work:internet/ Open PROGDIR:Resources/splash.png Read OK
28 [7] work:internet/ Open FONTS:ruby.font Read OK
29 [7] work:internet/ Load FONTS:ruby/12 OK
30 [7] work:internet/ Open FONTS:helvetica.font Read OK
31 [7] work:internet/ Load FONTS:helvetica/15 OK[/i]"
Does this tell you something?
It means it has crashed at the same point the NetSurf log was pointing to.
Does the text "Initialising" (at the top) and the version number (in the box, bottom-right) appear on the splash screen?
-
It means it has crashed at the same point the NetSurf log was pointing to.
Do you mean the last of the lines scrolling fast through the shell?
Does the text "Initialising" (at the top) and the version number (in the box, bottom-right) appear on the splash screen?
The text "Initializing..." appears at the top, but the field for the version number (bottom-right) remains empty.
EDIT:
The "I" at the beginning of "Initializing..." looks abit strange, as it isn`t fully visible.
-
Might be obvious / stubid question, but did you run fixfonts with installer?
-
Might be obvious / stubid question, but did you run fixfonts with installer?
Not sure if I understand what you mean...
-
Netsurf installer asks "do you want to run fixfonts"
-
Netsurf installer asks "do you want to run fixfonts"
Ah - O.K.
Luckily I choose the option "Logfile = yes" when I installed Netsurf.
A quick look at this logfile revealed:
">...Installer will run FixFonts after NetSurf is installed. Unless you have
>a *very* good reason you should not skip this step.
Yes-/No-question: Result was "Run FixFonts"...."
So yes, I ran fixfonts.
-
...
Does the text "Initialising" (at the top) and the version number (in the box, bottom-right) appear on the splash screen?
See my reply in posting #85. Does that help?
Do you have an idea what could be going wrong?
Please advise!
-
I don't know how to help you.
I have doubt that you system has unkown failure, because a RAD problems. RAD should work, memory error? or what?
Does AWeb work? It also uses reaction. Could it be a font problem?
When you start Netsurf first time, it creates choises file, path is something like program folder / users / user - > choises.
Maybe you could try to create it manually and put somethin like this to it?
use_diskfont:1
font_sans:Topaz
font_serif:Topaz
font_mono:Topaz
font_cursive:Topaz
font_fantasy:Topaz
-
I don't know how to help you.
I have doubt that you system has unkown failure, because a RAD problems. RAD should work, memory error? or what?
Does AWeb work? It also uses reaction? Could it be a font problem?
When you start Netsurf first time, it creates choises file, path is something like program folder / uses / user - > choises.
Maybe you could try to create it manually and put somethin like this to it?
use_diskfont:1
font_sans:Topaz
font_serif:Topaz
font_mono:Topaz
font_cursive:Topaz
font_fantasy:Topaz
That's unlikely to help, because the font used on the splash is hard-coded. I think it uses helvetica/15 (if not, it's ruby/12). Maybe try that in DPaint or something.
There's some unnecessary string copying too, which I'll get rid of, but I'd be surprised if that is causing the crash.
The options above only apply to browser rendering.
-
...
I have doubt that you system has unkown failure, because a RAD problems. RAD should work, memory error? or what?
I just checked the rad version - it is RAD 40.1.
Is that the correct version for OS 3.9 w. BBs I & II?
Does AWeb work? It also uses reaction. Could it be a font problem?
Yes - my registered version of AWeb II v3.4 works.
What do you mean with "font problem"?
Once there was a so called "Euro-Update" for OS 3.9 by H&P, which I installed back then.
When you start Netsurf first time, it creates choises file, path is something like program folder / users / user - > choises.
Maybe you could try to create it manually and put somethin like this to it?
use_diskfont:1
font_sans:Topaz
font_serif:Topaz
font_mono:Topaz
font_cursive:Topaz
font_fantasy:Topaz
I can try this.
Currently the content of "Choices" is:
"theme:PROGDIR:Resources/Themes/Default
pubscreen_name:Workbench"
Shall I leave that in or should I overwrite it with what you suggested?
-
That's unlikely to help, because the font used on the splash is hard-coded. I think it uses helvetica/15 (if not, it's ruby/12). Maybe try that in DPaint or something.
There's some unnecessary string copying too, which I'll get rid of, but I'd be surprised if that is causing the crash.
The options above only apply to browser rendering.
Hmmmm - so what else could be the reason for the crashes?
I mean - from the SnoopDos-logfile we know that the last action of the starting process that was executed (with result "O.K.") was:
"31 [7] work:internet/ Load FONTS:helvetica/15 OK".
What would be the next action in the starting process?
Obviously this next action somehow causes the system freezes.
Or could it somehow be due the "failed" actions in lines 13 - 18 of my SnoopDos-log in posting #83?
-
Currently the content of "Choices" is:
"theme:PROGDIR:Resources/Themes/Default
pubscreen_name:Workbench"
Shall I leave that in or should I overwrite it with what you suggested?
Leaven them, if you try this.
-
Or could it somehow be due the "failed" actions in lines 13 - 18 of my SnoopDos-log in posting #83?
Those seems to be GuiGfx settings, they shouldn't matter. GuiGfx uses defaults, if not said other way. In guigfx lha archive has a folder wich should be copied to ENV: under it has three settings files, content is on 0 or 1, ie. on or off.
guigfx environment variables
----------------------------
guigfx/USESCALEPIXELARRAY
internal default: 0
use ScalePixelArray() / cybergraphics v41
if you have cybergraphics v41 (or later) installed to
your system, this flag tells guigfx.library to use
ScalePixelArray() for scaling truecolor data to truecolor
displays.
ScalePixelArray() scales inside the graphics card's memory
and can thereof be very fast. it is NOT used by default,
due to accuracy problems. ScalePixelArray()
- uses an incorrect bresenham algorithm
- overwrites areas outside the specified rectangle
- overwrites areas outside the specified rastport
- flickers
set this flag to 1 if you prefer higher performance
instead of higher accuracy.
guigfx/USEWPA8
internal default: 0
use WritePixelArray() on native Amiga screenmodes
the OS functions WriteChunkyPixels(), WritePixelArray8() and
WritePixelLine8() are awfully slow and almost unusable on
native Amiga displays. therefore, guigfx.library uses an
internal chunky-2-planar conversion for planar displays.
there are very fast third-party patches available to
improve the performance of WritePixelArray(). if you
are using such a patch for WritePixelArray(), set this
flag to 1.
note: this flag is meaningless for graphics card displays.
guigfx/AUTODITHERTHRESHOLD
internal default: 250
set global default autodither threshold
this setting allows you to set a global default for
guigfx.library's autodither feature. the lower, the earlier
dithering is activated.
note: applications may override this global default value.
-
...
if you have cybergraphics v41 (or later) installed to
your system,
...
And what if I use Picasso 96?
Cybergraphix did not work with the Voodoo4 PCI in my Mediator when I installed the Voodoo...
-
No problem with Picasso96, I use it too.
There is no Cybergraphix driver for my Graphics card.
-
...
When you start Netsurf first time, it creates choises file, path is something like program folder / users / user - > choises.
Maybe you could try to create it manually and put somethin like this to it?
use_diskfont:1
font_sans:Topaz
font_serif:Topaz
font_mono:Topaz
font_cursive:Topaz
font_fantasy:Topaz
Tried this - same result as before.
-
I don't know how to help you.
I have doubt that you system has unkown failure, because a RAD problems. RAD should work, memory error? or what?
...
RAD: problem fixed.
The RAD: I had in DEVS:dosdrivers was v40.1 of August 12th, 2005.
I just had a look on my OS 3.9 CD and the RAD: in the Emergency Boot directory there was of June 22nd, 1999.
So I replaced tthe 2005 RAD: with the 1999 one.
And now Ram_0: ( RAD: ) works...
-
Sounds that you have installed some unofficial stuff, could there be more of them?
-
Sounds that you have installed some unofficial stuff, could there be more of them?
I remember that some time ago I tried a software (Grunch?) to update libraries and other stuff. No idea what it all did.
Can you provide a list of things needed to start NetSurf where I should check the versions?
-
I don't know would it work.
How about if you copy from your OS3.9 CD content of, libs, c and classes to equlent directories of your system partition?
After that install (or copy files) BB1&2?
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Can you provide a list of things needed to start NetSurf where I should check the versions?
http://git.netsurf-browser.org/netsurf.git/tree/frontends/amiga/libs.c#n207
Pretty much anything in red on that page ^^^
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http://git.netsurf-browser.org/netsurf.git/tree/frontends/amiga/libs.c#n207
Pretty much anything in red on that page ^^^
O.K.
Just one question:
Are the numbers behind the red marked items the required version numbers?
Example (the underlined, bold number "37"):
AMINS_LIB_OPEN("asl.library", 37, Asl, "main", 1, true)
If not, can you please provide the info which versions are required?
Then I can check the versions tonight when I'm, back home in front of my Miggy...
Thanks in advance!
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O.K.
Just one question:
Are the numbers behind the red marked items the required version numbers?
Example (the underlined, bold number "37"):
AMINS_LIB_OPEN("asl.library", 37, Asl, "main", 1, true)
If not, can you please provide the info which versions are required?
Then I can check the versions tonight when I'm, back home in front of my Miggy...
Thanks in advance!
If there is a risk that you have replaced more libraries with thrid party unofficial updates you just make it easy way if you revert back to OS3.9 and BB1/BB2 versions.
If you want to update system libraries, you should do it one by one and only if needed.
I don't know if there is any unofficial reaction classes / gadgets replacents? System:clasess/gatdgets
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O.K.
Just one question:
Are the numbers behind the red marked items the required version numbers?
Yes. But as utri007 says, you're probably better off just re-installing.
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Yes. But as utri007 says, you're probably better off just re-installing.
O.K.
Last night I re-installed OS 3.9, BB I and tried to install BB II.
The BB II Installation stuck at roughly two third while copying "vnc.library".
The only way to exit the failed installation was < CTRL > +< A > + < A > ...
After that the system rebooted. I still have to copy all my old settings to the fresh Installation, as well as to re-try to install BB II (and the Euro Update).
Then I will re-try to start NetSurf...
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...
I still have to copy all my old settings to the fresh Installation,
Did that. All fine so far.
Strange thing is that the system asks for the "Emergency (Floppy-)Disk" each time it boots.
For the fresh OS 3.9 install I had booted from the "Emergency (Floppy-)Disk" and the OS 3.9 CD.
Normally after a reset my Miggy starts to boot, makes another reset and then, after some seconds, the control light of my monitor changes from orange (Stand-by) to blue (active) and then the DOS Screen appears, telling me that ASIMCDFS gets started, followed by the Workbench.
Now the monitor (flatscreen, connected to the Voodoo4) stays in Stand-by mode and apparently nothing else happens. But as soon as I connect an Amiga monitor to the 23-pin sub-D Amiga video out, it shows a white DOS screen and an requester, telling me to insert the "Emergency (Floppy-)Disk".
As soon as I insert the floppy disk, the system loads one or two files from it and then switches the video signal over to the Voodoo, the flatscreen monitor goes active (while the Amiga monitor becomes inactive) and shows the rest of the booting process.
How can I find out why it asks for the "Emergency (Floppy-)Disk" and how can I fix this? Do I need to insert "movesys dh0:" somewhere?
SnoopDos and Rad: are only available AFTER the system booted...
:confused:
I still have ... to re-try to install BB II (and the Euro Update).
Then I will re-try to start NetSurf...
I will do that after the issue with the "Emergency (Floppy-)Disk" is fixed.
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It must be something is system:s/startup-sequence or user-startup
Have you checked them?
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It must be something is system:s/startup-sequence or user-startup
Have you checked them?
It must be in the startup-sequence - just befor the "loadwb".
But I can`t see anything suspicious there.
(The Startup-Sequence is the same I already posted here earlier in this thread in my posting #81)
But the good news is that starting Netsurf by clicking the icon now brings up the version number in the splash screen. Subsequently I was asked to select the Screenmode.
After that the Netsurf GUI came up, but with empty browser area - and then the system freezes again.
Will have to retry it from shell...
EDIT:
Starting from shell with option -v now leads to a system crash with error number #80000003...
It does not even get to the point where the splash screen comes up.
NetSurf_log was created in RAD:, but is empty.
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Double check it again? Somewhere must be path to emergency boot disk.
What happens it you boot to without startup sequence and type setpatch and after reboot loadwb to shell?
You could also try echo ON command in startup sequence? That should display everything, or maybe someone remember better?
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Just a though, is it so that you don't have monitor file system:devs/monitors?
That would explain Netsurf behavior and need of boot disk.
Try this :
Boot without startup sequence, open shell an type ->
set echo on
then - >
execute s:startup-sequence
Note if setpatch reboots you amiga you need to do it again.
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...
Try this :
...
Will try that next week. Today after work I will go home (to my 'other' home). Commuter's fate, you know...
:(
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Just a though, is it so that you don't have monitor file system:devs/monitors?
That would explain Netsurf behavior and need of boot disk.
In system:devs/monitors I have a file called "Voodoo" with its .info-file.
Try this :
Boot without startup sequence, open shell an type ->
set echo on
then - >
execute s:startup-sequence
Note if setpatch reboots you amiga you need to do it again.
Will try this now.
EDIT:
Tried it and in the shell was displayed what happened. After "c:LoadMonDrvs" the requester pops up asking for the "Emergency Disk"...
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Tried it and in the shell was displayed what happened. After "c:LoadMonDrvs" the requester pops up asking for the "Emergency Disk"...
OK now you know where the problem is. There is something wrong in you picasso96 install. If everything is ok with startup-sequence?? maybe you could try to copy files over eisting ones on you HD??
Maybe you could start snoopdos also before you execute startup-sequence?
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OK now you know where the problem is. There is something wrong in you picasso96 install.
Nah - I don`t think so.
I checked the timestamps of the installed Picasso files - they`re all from 2005.
It`s the Picasso install that worked flawlessly all the years since I changed my system from CybervisionPPC/Cybergraphix to Mediator/Voodoo4/Picasso96 back in 2005.
If everything is ok with startup-sequence??
I have no idea what could be wrong with it:
"PsdLoadModule DEVS:input.device QUIET ;Added by Poseidon-Installer
; $VER: Startup-Sequence_HardDrive 45.1 (25.11.00)
; Startup-Sequence for hard drive systems
If Exists C:IDEFix
C:IDEFix
EndIf
C:SetPatch QUIET
C:Version >NIL:
C:AddBuffers >NIL: DF0: 15
FailAt 21
C:MakeDir RAM:T RAM:Clipboards RAM:ENV RAM:ENV/Sys
C:Copy >NIL: ENVARC: RAM:ENV ALL NOREQ
Resident >NIL: C:Assign PURE
Resident >NIL: C:Execute PURE
Assign >NIL: ENV: RAM:ENV
Assign >NIL: T: RAM:T
Assign >NIL: CLIPS: RAM:Clipboards
Assign >NIL: REXX: S:
Assign >NIL: PRINTERS: DEVS:Printers
Assign >NIL: KEYMAPS: DEVS:Keymaps
Assign >NIL: LOCALE: SYS:Locale
Assign >NIL: LIBS: SYS:Classes ADD
Assign >NIL: HELP: LOCALE:Help DEFER
BindDrivers
C:Mount >NIL: DEVS:dOSDrivers/~(#?.info)
C:LoadMonDrvs
; IF EXISTS DEVS:Monitors
; IF EXISTS DEVS:Monitors/Voodoo5
; DEVS:Monitors/Voodoo5
; EndIF
; C:List >NIL: DEVS:Monitors/~(#?.info|Voodoo5) TO T:M LFORMAT
; "DEVS:Monitors/%s"
; Execute T:M
; C:delete >NIL: T:M
; EndIF
SetEnv Language "english"
SetEnv Workbench $Workbench
SetEnv Kickstart $Kickstart
UnSet Workbench
UnSet Kickstart
C:AddDataTypes REFRESH QUIET
C:IPrefs
C:ConClip
Path >NIL: RAM: C: SYS:Utilities SYS:Rexxc SYS:System S: SYS:Prefs SYS:WBStartup SYS:Tools SYS:Tools/Commodities
SYS:System/REXXMast >NIL:
IF EXISTS S:User-Startup
Execute S:User-Startup
EndIF
Resident Execute REMOVE
Resident Assign REMOVE
C:LoadWB
EndCLI >NIL:
"
maybe you could try to copy files over eisting ones on you HD??
Which files do you have in mind?
Maybe you could start snoopdos also before you execute startup-sequence?
Will try that.
B.T.W.: Meanwhile I successfully installed BoingBag II and the Euro-update.
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Nah - I don`t think so.
I checked the timestamps of the installed Picasso files - they`re all from 2005.
It`s the Picasso install that worked flawlessly all the years since I changed my system from CybervisionPPC/Cybergraphix to Mediator/Voodoo4/Picasso96 back in 2005.
Problem solved.
The above and
maybe you could try to copy files over eisting ones on you HD??
brought up the idea to check the timestamp of the "Voodoo"-file in Devs:Monitors/ as well.
It turned out it had the same timestamp as the "Voodoo"-file on the Emergency Disk.
So there was a great likelyness that the "Voodoo"-file in Devs:Monitors/ on the HD and on the Emergency Disk were the same and that this caused the problem.
As I had backupped my System3.9:devs/ before I started to re-install OS 3.9, I could delete the "Voodoo"-file in System3.9:devs/Monitors/ and replace it with the one from the backup.
Then I rebooted - et voila - no Emergancy Disk required anymore!
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Problem solved.
The above and
brought up the idea to check the timestamp of the "Voodoo"-file in Devs:Monitors/ as well.
It turned out it had the same timestamp as the "Voodoo"-file on the Emergency Disk.
So there was a great likelyness that the "Voodoo"-file in Devs:Monitors/ on the HD and on the Emergency Disk were the same and that this caused the problem.
As I had backupped my System3.9:devs/ before I started to re-install OS 3.9, I could delete the "Voodoo"-file in System3.9:devs/Monitors/ and replace it with the one from the backup.
Then I rebooted - et voila - no Emergancy Disk required anymore!
Could it be that some reason, it wants DEVS: from floppy?
There is a list of assigns if you add this end of it?
Assign >NIL: DEVS: System: DEVS
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Could it be that some reason, it wants DEVS: from floppy?
...
No - I don`t think so.
I assume that it copied the Voodoo-monitorfile from the Emergeny Disk to System3.9:devs/monitors when I re-intslled OS 3.9, as I had booted the system from the OS 3.9-CD using the Emergency Disk.
OS 3.9 CD does not know of my Mediator and my Voodoo - so the Voodoo monitor file must have come from somewhere else.
Only remaining possibility was that it was copied from the Emergency Disk during the install, as after the reboot my Voodo worked - after I inserted the Emergency Disk...
And as it does not ask for the Emergency Disk anymore during the booting process, there seems to be no further reference to it.
Furthermore, typimg "assign" in a shell revealed that all assigned directories are assigned to harddrives, not floppy disks.
I think my system is now based on the original system files of OS 3.9 & BoingBags I & II and boots without any hickups now, so let`s focus again on getting NetSurf up and running.
What about e.g. MUI?
My copy of IBrowse (which I`m just using for this posting) has a menue item "About Mui", where it says:
Library version 19.35,
Mui Release Version: 3.8,
Compilation Date: 12.,02.[19]97 .
Furthermore it says:
Custom Class Version Date Copyright
Busy.mcc 17.37 23.7.97 1994- 1997 kmel, Klaus Melchior
IBTextEditField.ibcc 24.1 22.12.2006 2001-2006 Stefan Burstroem
Listtree.mcc 17.36 30.1.97 1995- 1997 kmel, Klaus Melchior
Newstring.mcc 16.18 27.12.2005 1995- 1996 Rüdiger Sopp fixes by MM
NList.mcc 20.138 [OS3/m68k] (05.04.2014) Copyright (C) 2001-2014 NList Open Source Team
NListview.mcc 19.93 [OS3/m68k] (05.04.2014) Copyright (C) 2001-2014 NList Open Source Team
Aboutmui.mui 19.8 12.02.97 1992- 1997 Stefan Stunz
Floattext.mui 19.8 12.02.97 1992- 1997 Stefan Stunz
Gauge.mui 19.8 12.02.97 1992- 1997 Stefan Stunz
Popasl.mui 19.8 12.02.97 1992- 1997 Stefan Stunz
Scrollgroup.mui 19.8 12.02.97 1992- 1997 Stefan Stunz
Virtgroup.mui 19.10 12.02.97 1992- 1997 Stefan Stunz
As I can remember having updated some mui classes at some point(s) in time, the reason for NetSurf Mui not starting could also be one of the non-original MUI-files.
But which files are original, and which not?
Could a fresh install of the original MUI v3.8 possibly solve the problem?
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Netsurf doesn't use MUI, it uses Reaction for a GUI.
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Netsurf doesn't use MUI, it uses Reaction for a GUI.
O.K.
Sorry - I somehow mixed it up...
Is there something special about Reaction?
Does it possibly conflict with Mui, if both is installed on a system?
Is there anything special about the Reaction prefs - special settings required?
As I just installed Reaction from the Contribution drawer in BB II...
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O.K.
Sorry - I somehow mixed it up...
Does it possibly conflict with Mui, if both is installed on a system?
No. And I very much doubt you could do anything in Reaction prefs to break anything.
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O.K.
Sorry - I somehow mixed it up...
Is there something special about Reaction?
Does it possibly conflict with Mui, if both is installed on a system?
Is there anything special about the Reaction prefs - special settings required?
As I just installed Reaction from the Contribution drawer in BB II...
Back to basics.
Do you have these exact versions installed?
http://aminet.net/package/dev/misc/guigfxlib
http://aminet.net/package/dev/misc/renderlib31
What happens if you rename render library something like render.lbrary_test? So that it can't be found?
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It's a shame that NetSurf on workbench 3x is just some experimental thing, or atleast that's what I gathered from the recent interview with Chris Young.
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Sources are open, compiling has made as easy it can be. Chris, DNADNL and Tygre will be happy if someone else can contribute to Project.
Currently it is very good proof of consept. I highly doubt thet i woun't get much faster. This page is rendered less than 20 seconds with my 68060 66mhz. There are some serious problems, like slow down effect, caused by memory fragmention or some unknown reason.
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So there was a great likelyness that the "Voodoo"-file in Devs:Monitors/ on the HD and on the Emergency Disk were the same and that this caused the problem.
As I had backupped my System3.9:devs/ before I started to re-install OS 3.9, I could delete the "Voodoo"-file in System3.9:devs/Monitors/ and replace it with the one from the backup.
Then I rebooted - et voila - no Emergancy Disk required anymore!
I don't think the Voodoo file was the real problem here, but rather the Tooltypes of it's icon.
The thing is that the standard "SETTINGSFILE=SYS:Devs/Picasso96Settings" Tooltypes line will not work when booting from the Emergency Disk, since this will cause P96 to look for the Picasso96Settings file on the AmigaOS3.9 CD, where it obviously cannot find it.
I guess that you have changed this line in the past, so that P96 loads it settings directly from the E.Disk instead.
A more correct line in this situation would be "SETTINGSFILE=Devs:Picasso96Settings". This will cause P96 to first look on the CD for the file, and then check out the floppy.