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AuthorTopic: A sad day  (Read 2450 times)

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Offline F0LLETT

Re: A sad day
« Reply #45 on: May 30, 2017, 04:55:51 PM »
Quote from: Acill;826426
There's no room to make any money on these new systems.


Hence Tabor, I pushed for a low cost board.
Quote from: Hungry Horace
Resolute and Industrious Grand ruler of the yellow people and the Ultimate Amiga Empire
Ultimate Amiga Network (Home of SONY PSP Amiga Emulator and AMOS Factory)

Quote from:  He who shall not be named
"Chris is that you!!!"
My all time favorite quote.
 

Offline Iggy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #46 on: May 30, 2017, 07:58:36 PM »
Quote from: F0LLETT;826428
Hence Tabor, I pushed for a low cost board.


The approximately 400 pound board with less performance than a Raspberry Pi 3, and a crippled fpu?

I pushed for a low cost board too, but I'm NOT buying that piece of crap.

Not when emulation at similar performance levels cost less than $70.

That's kind of pointless.

I am still interested in a P5040 based X5000, BUT when it becomes available I may have to have it shipped from Great Britain.
That seriously sucks, and for that matter, it increases the chances I'll receive a damaged system (so, I'm more likely to buy the motherboard alone).
"Not making any hard and fast rules means that the moderators can use their good judgment in moderation, and we think the results speak for themselves." - Amiga.org, terms of service

"You, got to stem the evil tide, and keep it on the the inside" - Rogers Waters

"God was never on your side" - Lemmy

Amiga! "Our appeal has become more selective"
 

Offline kamelito

Re: A sad day
« Reply #47 on: May 30, 2017, 08:10:20 PM »
The real question is :
Do US customers cease to buy the X5000 computers from AOTL to buy them directly from AmigaKit?
If yes then it is a problem, if not why care?

Kamelito
 

Offline Iggy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #48 on: May 30, 2017, 09:01:53 PM »
Quote from: kamelito;826434
The real question is :
Do US customers cease to buy the X5000 computers from AOTL to buy them directly from AmigaKit?
If yes then it is a problem, if not why care?

Kamelito


It WAS a consideration.

Further, I would NOT recommend transatlantic shipment for a complete system (too expensive, and too likely to incur damage)
So, for us, the best bet is motherboard only purchases (and for those that don't want to build a system, another negative).

That being said, while I like Aaron (and will continue to buy what I can from him), I decided not to shoot myself in the foot.

Outside of the T2080 laptop project, this is probably my last PPC system.
You all can have Tabor, I already have G4 performance level hardware.

And I'm hoping by 2020 or so to be using an X64 based system.
"Not making any hard and fast rules means that the moderators can use their good judgment in moderation, and we think the results speak for themselves." - Amiga.org, terms of service

"You, got to stem the evil tide, and keep it on the the inside" - Rogers Waters

"God was never on your side" - Lemmy

Amiga! "Our appeal has become more selective"
 

Offline BCP

Re: A sad day
« Reply #49 on: May 30, 2017, 10:05:13 PM »
Quote from: Iggy;826433
The approximately 400 pound board with less performance than a Raspberry Pi 3, and a crippled fpu?

I pushed for a low cost board too, but I'm NOT buying that piece of crap.

Not when emulation at similar performance levels cost less than $70.

That's kind of pointless.

I am still interested in a P5040 based X5000, BUT when it becomes available I may have to have it shipped from Great Britain.
That seriously sucks, and for that matter, it increases the chances I'll receive a damaged system (so, I'm more likely to buy the motherboard alone).

_____________________

Iggy,  while I share your concern about ordering from overseas & would prefer to be able to order from AOTL, when I ordered my AmigaOne X1000 in Dec. of 2012, it arrived in less than 4 days from Cardiff & in good condititon, so no complaints about AmigaKit's service.
__________________________
AmigaOne X1000 & Amiga 4000
Amiga Response Crew
Indianapolis, IN USA
 

Offline Iggy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #50 on: May 30, 2017, 10:22:20 PM »
Quote from: BCP;826437
_____________________

Iggy,  while I share your concern about ordering from overseas & would prefer to be able to order from AOTL, when I ordered my AmigaOne X1000 in Dec. of 2012, it arrived in less than 4 days from Cardiff & in good condititon, so no complaints about AmigaKit's service.


I'm actually not that concerned about AmigaKit in this equation, its the handling by shippers.
I ship overseas regularly, and its brutal on packages.
"Not making any hard and fast rules means that the moderators can use their good judgment in moderation, and we think the results speak for themselves." - Amiga.org, terms of service

"You, got to stem the evil tide, and keep it on the the inside" - Rogers Waters

"God was never on your side" - Lemmy

Amiga! "Our appeal has become more selective"
 

Offline SACC-guy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #51 on: May 30, 2017, 10:51:58 PM »
So many distinctions and distractions..

Has This thread has been about profit (theirs or ours) or who do you love?
At first AOTL and it%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8217;s need to show it%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8217;s anger when that was threatened???
And as the threads continued to show that love in

%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8220;As the Amiga World Turned%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8221;.

First, for your consideration..

Is and has AmigaKit been a %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8220;retail%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8221; store selling various products? Yes.
Has AmigaKit been based in England? Yes.
Has it been a problem for Amigans in the U.S.? Yes.
Has it done a perfect job. No. Not bad but not perfect.
Over all, Matthew was considered a saving grace for most Amigans after ALL the amiga stores closed.
At that time we loved Matthew as the owner of AmigaKit.

But now, AmigaKit is perceived as a distributor (and other things), by selling to other retail stores.
By luck and intent, Matthew is an owner of a store, AmigaKit. He also became a distributor as well as a partner in a manufacturing company A-Eon. Why? He was one of the few willing to risk his money!

But, as these companies all are different legal entities.

With the advent of the Internet, we are offered items to buy from the manufactures, distributors and the retail stores, even individuals.
So%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8230;
AmigaKit gets to sell to us.
A-Eon gets to choose to have AmigaKit distribute.
If you don%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8217;t like this close arrangement, just buy out Matthew (or Trevor)

One of the reasons we love AOTL was that Aaron (good cust service) but his prices weren%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8217;t great.
I know I wanted to support him as a new dealer so I bought a video card and other stuff. Another reason, the extra cost of freight might be lower (Iggy/Jim likes the fact he could drive to the store and save freight and return broken things without the hassle of return freight etc.) That%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8217;s why he loves AOTL, at this time) Might not be the case if AOTL was in CA.

But Consider freight, which we don%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8217;t love, it cost money to get things (people too) somewhere..trucks, trains, planes, fuel, drivers etc. Still have to pay.. even if it says free shipping

Next thing to consider is this business AOTL stating %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8220;in any way, shape or form%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8221; WOW!
I remember the days when the discounters lobbied to change the keystone retail prices here in CA.
The retailers hated it undercutting their prices. Then the law changed, then it was the discounters hating other dealers undercutting their profit. And so forth%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!8230;

A-Eon (Trevor) paid what was needed to make brand new custom boards,
AmigaKit (Matthew) has to manage his costs to be able to sell those boards.
AOTL (Aaron) has to manage his business.

Trevor, just Thanks. I love my X5000!!!
 

Offline SACC-guy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #52 on: May 30, 2017, 10:55:45 PM »
So many distinctions and distractions..

Has This thread has been about profit (theirs or ours) or who do you love?
At first AOTL and its need to show it;s anger when that was threatened?
And as the threads continued to show that love in

;As the Amiga World Turned
First, for your consideration..

Is and has AmigaKit been a  store selling various products? Yes.
Has AmigaKit been based in Wales (okay)? Yes.
Has it been a problem for Amigans in the U.S.? Yes.
Has it done a perfect job. No. Not bad but not perfect.
Over all, Matthew was considered a saving grace for most Amigans after ALL the amiga stores closed.
At that time we loved Matthew as the owner of AmigaKit.

But now, AmigaKit is perceived as a distributor (and other things), by selling to other retail stores.
By luck and intent, Matthew is an owner of a store, AmigaKit. He also became a distributor as well as a partner in a manufacturing company A-Eon. Why? He was one of the few willing to risk his money!

But, as these companies all are different legal entities.

With the advent of the Internet, we are offered items to buy from the manufactures, distributors and the retail stores, even individuals.
So
AmigaKit gets to sell to us.
A-Eon gets to choose to have AmigaKit distribute.
If you dont like this close arrangement, just buy out Matthew (or Trevor)

One of the reasons we love AOTL was that Aaron (good cust service) but his prices werent great.
I know I wanted to support him as a new dealer so I bought a video card and other stuff. Another reason, the extra cost of freight might be lower (Iggy/Jim likes the fact he could drive to the store and save freight and return broken things without the hassle of return freight etc.) Thats why he loves AOTL, at this time) Might not be the case if AOTL was in CA.

But Consider freight, which we dont love, it cost money to get things (people too) somewhere..trucks, trains, planes, fuel, drivers etc. Still have to pay.. even if it says free shipping

Next thing to consider is this business AOTL stating ;in any way, shape or form; WOW!
I remember the days when the discounters lobbied to change the keystone retail prices here in CA.
The retailers hated it undercutting their prices. Then the law changed, then it was the discounters hating other dealers undercutting their profit. And so forth

A-Eon (Trevor) paid what was needed to make brand new custom boards,
AmigaKit (Matthew) has to manage his costs to be able to sell those boards.
AOTL (Aaron) has to manage his business.

Trevor, just Thanks. I love my X5000!!!
« Last Edit: May 31, 2017, 12:44:45 AM by SACC-guy »
 

Offline a1200

Re: A sad day
« Reply #53 on: May 30, 2017, 11:37:47 PM »
I would think this is simply a case of a weak pound causing an issue for US customers buying from their US dealer vs the option of buying from Amigakit even after delivery and import charges. Plus AOTL May have different overheads and margin expectations to Amigakit and we know a unified price point across the globe is what clicky hobbyist groups are sensitive to.
Amiga A1200, 3.1 ROMs, Blizzard 1230 MKIV 128MB & FPU, 4GB DoM SSD, Workbench 3.1
 

Offline Rob

Re: A sad day
« Reply #54 on: May 30, 2017, 11:44:33 PM »
Quote from: SACC-guy;826440

Has AmigaKit been based in England? Yes.


When was Amigakit based in England?
 

Offline Iggy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #55 on: May 31, 2017, 12:03:43 AM »
Quote from: SACC-guy;826440
So many distinctions and distractions..

Has This thread has been about profit (theirs or ours) or who do you love?
At first AOTL and its need to show it;s anger when that was threatened?
And as the threads continued to show that love in

;As the Amiga World Turned
First, for your consideration..

Is and has AmigaKit been a  store selling various products? Yes.
Has AmigaKit been based in England? Yes.
Has it been a problem for Amigans in the U.S.? Yes.
Has it done a perfect job. No. Not bad but not perfect.
Over all, Matthew was considered a saving grace for most Amigans after ALL the amiga stores closed.
At that time we loved Matthew as the owner of AmigaKit.

But now, AmigaKit is perceived as a distributor (and other things), by selling to other retail stores.
By luck and intent, Matthew is an owner of a store, AmigaKit. He also became a distributor as well as a partner in a manufacturing company A-Eon. Why? He was one of the few willing to risk his money!

But, as these companies all are different legal entities.

With the advent of the Internet, we are offered items to buy from the manufactures, distributors and the retail stores, even individuals.
So
AmigaKit gets to sell to us.
A-Eon gets to choose to have AmigaKit distribute.
If you dont like this close arrangement, just buy out Matthew (or Trevor)

One of the reasons we love AOTL was that Aaron (good cust service) but his prices werent great.
I know I wanted to support him as a new dealer so I bought a video card and other stuff. Another reason, the extra cost of freight might be lower (Iggy/Jim likes the fact he could drive to the store and save freight and return broken things without the hassle of return freight etc.) Thats why he loves AOTL, at this time) Might not be the case if AOTL was in CA.

But Consider freight, which we dont love, it cost money to get things (people too) somewhere..trucks, trains, planes, fuel, drivers etc. Still have to pay.. even if it says free shipping

Next thing to consider is this business AOTL stating ;in any way, shape or form; WOW!
I remember the days when the discounters lobbied to change the keystone retail prices here in CA.
The retailers hated it undercutting their prices. Then the law changed, then it was the discounters hating other dealers undercutting their profit. And so forth

A-Eon (Trevor) paid what was needed to make brand new custom boards,
AmigaKit (Matthew) has to manage his costs to be able to sell those boards.
AOTL (Aaron) has to manage his business.

Trevor, just Thanks. I love my X5000!!!


I can't counter any of that.
Basically, sucks to be Aaron.
And his business has been a boon to me.

BTW - His OWC pricing isn't bad, but you're not going to be able to do anything with AmigaKit prices if you're in direct competition with the distributor (you basically take whatever margin he offers you).

So, maybe that last point explains a possible reason for part of Aaron's dissatisfaction.
Just a possibility, but...

And not one any of us can counter as we don't know what the margins made by dealers amounts to.
BUT, if you're in a business, and that margin sucks, yeah you have a right to be unhappy.

Could Aaron have dropped AmigaKit hardware without complaint or explanation?
Yeah, but if this somewhat forensic analysis is correct, in his place I'm not sure I would either.

So, a limited supply of a product with a %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty margin?
Sounds like a good reason to complain.
"Not making any hard and fast rules means that the moderators can use their good judgment in moderation, and we think the results speak for themselves." - Amiga.org, terms of service

"You, got to stem the evil tide, and keep it on the the inside" - Rogers Waters

"God was never on your side" - Lemmy

Amiga! "Our appeal has become more selective"
 

Offline SACC-guy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #56 on: May 31, 2017, 12:14:43 AM »
Iggy said"
"Could Aaron have dropped AmigaKit hardware without complaint or explanation?
"Yeah, but if this somewhat forensic analysis is correct, in his place I'm not sure I would either.

So, a limited supply of a product with a %&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!%&$#?@!ty margin?
Sounds like a good reason to complain."

I said"
If there were lots of options...maybe!

But in business, a one and only one (you do know AEon is the only place to get x5000 and AmigaKit is the source) option is the wrong place to show your emotions.
Going with the cutting nose to spite face...
« Last Edit: May 31, 2017, 12:19:37 AM by SACC-guy »
 

Offline BozzerBigD

Re: A sad day
« Reply #57 on: May 31, 2017, 12:36:52 AM »
@SACC-guy (& Rob for spotting this)
 
Can we trust ANY of the other Yes/No "facts" you've given? ;-)

Quote
Has AmigaKit been based in England? Yes.
Amigakit.com

[/B] [/FONT]Registered Address:
Leaman Computing Ltd
Asquith House
Unit 1 Dyfrig Road
Cardiff. CF5 5AD. U.K.

= WALES, part of the United Kingdom but definitely NOT England!

Wiki:

  Wales is a country in southwest Great Britain known for its rugged coastline, mountainous national parks, distinctive Welsh language and Celtic culture. Cardiff, the capital, is a refined coastal city with a nightlife scene and a medieval castle with ornate Gothic Revival interiors. In the northwest, Snowdonia National Park has lakes, glacial landforms, hiking trails and a railway up to the peak of Snowdon.
  Capital: Cardiff
  Area: 20,761 kmĀ²
  Population: 3.063 million (2011)
  National anthem: Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau

Flag:

National Sport: Rugby

Famous Coastline seen in Dr Who: Southerndown nr Bridgend, South Wales
 
 
« Last Edit: May 31, 2017, 12:43:00 AM by BozzerBigD »
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."

John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios
 

Offline SACC-guy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #58 on: May 31, 2017, 12:43:40 AM »
I'm on the correct side of the pond...give me a break.
the whole UK thing and what the maps call England is your issue (lol)
 

Offline SACC-guy

Re: A sad day
« Reply #59 on: May 31, 2017, 12:45:45 AM »
Too right!

Tis better to have erred and lost...
« Last Edit: May 31, 2017, 12:46:43 AM by SACC-guy »