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AuthorTopic: Pirates and TOSEC sucks  (Read 5930 times)

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Offline iamaboringperson

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #15 on: July 24, 2003, 12:24:15 AM »
Quote
Uuuuuuuuuuuhm.
they should definently get rid of that one   :-x
 

Offline LP

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #16 on: July 24, 2003, 12:30:23 AM »
:-D :-D :-D

Going to bed already?

:-D :-D :-D
 

Offline LP

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #17 on: July 24, 2003, 01:21:57 AM »
Ehm... TOSEC is just a database isn't it?

As far as I can see they just provide names for the games/apps?

-Let me edit my self-

I'm too blind :)
 

Offline Tomas

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2003, 01:49:57 AM »
I guess listing names of software is considered piracy this days also... *sigh*
 

Offline Kent

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #19 on: July 24, 2003, 03:12:58 AM »
Just saw the thread, verified links to the KS files as well as other (still able to be purchased new) files.  I've informed some of the licensing parties of the potential copyright infringements as well their main host provider about the site.  I'm not sure how long it will stay alive.  I'm glad that I had a part in taking down Lazarus, and I'll be happy to help take this site down or reshape their file sharing ethics.  BTTR is on the other hand, a well respected emulation site that doesn't infringe on any copyrights or intellectual properties that I've seen.

:pint:
I love the modern age world of this middle age crises America... all these SUVs driving around like there\\\'s gas to spare and then some.

http://www.RequestFocus.com

W. Kent Seaton ~ RequestFocus.com
 

Offline iamaboringperson

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #20 on: July 24, 2003, 03:39:35 AM »
Kent

well done my man! if only i could buy you a  :pint:
 

Offline smerf

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #21 on: July 24, 2003, 03:52:52 AM »
Hi,

Lets really talk about pirates, I mean real software pirates who stole from us and really killed the Amiga computer.

The first one I want to talk about is the one that ripped me off, I am talking about Electronic Arts, yea you heard me, when the Amiga first came out I bought their games, like Arctic Fox, Star fighter (I hope I got this name right, it was about a jet that takes off and blasts tanks) anyhow I bought Electronic arts games, this was back in the Amiga Dos 1.0 days, well Amiga upgraded to 1.1 and gues what none of those games worked on 1.1 due to EA's copy protection, during this time I also purchased a Supra scsi card for the A1000, more memory an accelerator and a 20 meg hard drive. Now EA's games wouldn't load on the hard drive due to copy protection and guess what neither would their flag shi_ Deluxe paint, it to was copy protected back in those days. So my vote for Number 1 pirate was Electronic Arts, they under handedly broke the Amiga's back from the get go with copy protection.

Lets talk about all the other companies that used copy protection to guard their disks, like Pschnogsis (yea yea I spelled it wrong) they to made excellent games that if they were let put on a hard drive would have really excelled, but no copy protection was the thing, as if they were stopping software pirates, you know software developers, the greater the protection the harder the pirates try to break it because it is a challenge, they don't buy your software to play the damn game they break it for the challenge and the glory of being the first to break your copy protection.

So now you know why the Amiga really died, it is because software developers copy protected their software so that when Amiga upgraded their Operating Systems the software wouldn't work and  couldn't be installed on hard drives.

Think of games like Battle Hawks, The one game where some one goes back to cartoon land (this game was a real pain because when you lost you had to start from the start all over again).

Anyhow how about dungeon master, a great game if you could install it on hard drive, on disk drive just to slow.

These developers I truly blame for the demise of the Amiga, not the software pirates, they just took on the challenge of breaking software protection, and more than likely they were software programmers themselves trying to break their friends code.

Any how I can say that I bought every program that had no protection on it and could be installed on a hard drive. I can't say the same about copy protected disks, if someone broke them and offered them to me I took them just for the spite of my loss of my favorite game Arctic Fox. (Hey it was one of the few games I could beat, and winning sometimes is fun).  My code was if it was protected and couldn't be installed on a hard drive then yes I pirated it, if it was protected and could be installed on a hard drive but I had to go through the inconvenience of a code wheel, look up word etc. I bought it when it got old. No protection or on CD I paid. When game I bought and really hate is ZOOL, great game, why did I hate it? Did you ever look at Black lettering on Dark Brown Paper for a code at the age of 50.  This is Bullsheet, come on guys gives us older people a chance to, we may be old but a lot of us like playing your game.

smerf
I have no idea what your talking about, so here is a doggy with a small pancake on his head.

MorphOS is a MAC done a little better
 

Offline Kent

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #22 on: July 24, 2003, 04:16:35 AM »
This is going to sound quite odd, but I have to completely agree with Smerf.  Not just because he's got a cool nick, but he's nailed the whole reason of piracy down to the bone.  Back before WHDLoad was even available, 90% of the software I had purchased wouldn't work cause I installed a 68010 14MHz in my A500.  I later upgraded to a Derringer 030/33MHz and 40MB Trifecta LX but still the majority of the software wouldn't work, not to mention the lack of hard drive install ability.  I admit that I used to share software with other local users, but only to find out the software didn't work or wasn't worth it due to hard drive installs or really horrid doc checks.  I try to stay away from any game that has a doc check, and if the software has some wicked copy protection that won't allow hard drive installs I won't use it.  In a modern age of computers, it's time for a modern age of program design.  Too much protection will automatically warrant piracy however, too little protection will make the software easy to hack and share.  The easiest medium I know by far is to just use keyfiles with the end users information in the key itself.  I don't pirate or share anymore, I just make sure the software I purchase doesn't have foolhardy restrictions in it before I purchase.

:pint:
I love the modern age world of this middle age crises America... all these SUVs driving around like there\\\'s gas to spare and then some.

http://www.RequestFocus.com

W. Kent Seaton ~ RequestFocus.com
 

Offline iamaboringperson

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #23 on: July 24, 2003, 04:17:04 AM »
Quote
Lets really talk about pirates, I mean real software pirates who stole from us and really killed the Amiga computer.
i dont believe that anybody outside of Commodore actually killed the amiga(apart from perhaps microsoft, ibm and apple...)

im too tired now, but probably later ill expand this message to give you a rant that will explain that what you are talking about, what you refer to as 'copyprotection' - is like that for technical reasons, and not business/political/ecconomic reasons...

later...
 

Offline iamaboringperson

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #24 on: July 24, 2003, 04:27:13 AM »
@kent
there are technical reasons for what you are talking about

and ive decided that,(pleeese nobody else do this)ill start a whole new thread on the very reasons for what you are both talking about

tomorrow when i (i hope)start this thread, i will explain all!
what i will show you:

- you will learn how commodore were always right from the beginning (and how it was the programmers who were wrong)
- i will tell you why you couldnt install those games on hard drive
- i will explain in detail the secrets behind amiga compatability - and what games developers did so wrong
- you will learn that commodore were so passionate about this very issue
- you will also learn that not only was it possible to write HD installable software, but also it was also possible to actually BENEFIT from writing it in this particular way
- developers will discover the secrets to keeping your apps comppatable, and how to not frustrate users, and why by doing this, you will profit even more!
- and more! stay tuned...

 :-D
 

Offline CodeSmith

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #25 on: July 24, 2003, 04:41:37 AM »
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i dont believe that anybody outside of Commodore actually killed the amiga(apart from perhaps microsoft, ibm and apple...)

I believe that what killed commodore was one braindead business decision after another.  Like launching the A500+, then less than a year later canning it and replacing it with the A600.

The companies you mention: as at 1994, when CBM imploded, Apple was a competitor, but I doubt they had the power to kill the amiga.  Microsoft was taking over on the x86 part of the industry, but based on their relationship to Apple (ie it's their "proof" that they're not a monopoly), I don't think it would've done it.  I think it's even possible that they would've ported Office to the Amiga, just to keep the DOJ off their backs.  IBM's attitude toward the Amiga back then was what it is now towards Apple (if you ignore their CPU division) - they don't see themselves as being in the same market segment.
 

Offline iamaboringperson

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #26 on: July 24, 2003, 04:46:59 AM »
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I believe that what killed commodore was one braindead business decision after another. Like launching the A500+, then less than a year later canning it and replacing it with the A600.
sort of agree there... the A500+ was great! it was a step forward... the A600 on the other hand was a bad idea... ok, it was cheap, but nothing else
i knew a guy who wentout and bought(his first computer) an A600, there was a game(some flight sim) which required use of the enter key! because of this game alone, he packed it up, rushed the A600 to the store the next day, got his money back and bought a seccond hand A500!!

Quote
The companies you mention: as at 1994, when CBM imploded, Apple was a competitor, but I doubt they had the power to kill the amiga. Microsoft was taking over on the x86 part of the industry, but based on their relationship to Apple (ie it's their "proof" that they're not a monopoly), I don't think it would've done it. I think it's even possible that they would've ported Office to the Amiga, just to keep the DOJ off their backs. IBM's attitude toward the Amiga back then was what it is now towards Apple (if you ignore their CPU division) - they don't see themselves as being in the same market segment.
i know they were just competitors, and im all for competition.. but i like to think they were probably scheming(sp?), it was a conspiracy! :-P :crazy:
 

Offline Belial6

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #27 on: July 24, 2003, 04:53:43 AM »
What amazes me is how many people will cry about the evil pirates, when to date, I have never met a single person that has not commited hundreds of IP violations.  Whether it's using someone elses creation as an avatar, taking a photo of your best friend holding a Coke can, or copying a movie you rented back when we had VHS, you are a "pirate".

Then there is the large group of people who would "pirate back in the old days", but since have learned the error of their ways, and come down on those who do it now like a hammer.

"Piracy" is a gray issue.  We all know that our IP laws are broken. (US and Euro alike)  When over 90% of your population refuse to obey a law, maybe it is time to re-think the law.
 

Offline iamaboringperson

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #28 on: July 24, 2003, 05:01:12 AM »
Quote
taking a photo of your best friend holding a Coke can,
thats not piracy...
Quote
Then there is the large group of people who would "pirate back in the old days", but since have learned the error of their ways, and come down on those who do it now like a hammer.
this might come as a shock, but in my early to mid teens i was a bit of a pirate, i always had this guilty feeling, and eventually i realised i was completly wrong - i can respect others who have done wrong in their past... thats what forgivness is all agout :-) you have to give people a chance to change...

Quote
When over 90% of your population refuse to obey a law, maybe it is time to re-think the law.
are you suggesting you want the law to change? i believe that if 99% of people are doing somthing wrong, it doesnt make that right - its still evil IMAO
 

Offline Belial6

Re: Pirates and TOSEC sucks
« Reply #29 on: July 24, 2003, 05:56:23 AM »
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thats not piracy...

It is if your friend is holding a Coke can that has coca cola's trademarked wave displayed.  Taking a picture of this without express written permission is an illegal copy of thier trademark, and thus "piracy".

Quote
this might come as a shock, but in my early to mid teens i was a bit of a pirate, i always had this guilty feeling, and eventually i realised i was completly wrong - i can respect others who have done wrong in their past... thats what forgivness is all agout  you have to give people a chance to change...


What you call forgiveness, others would call hypocracy.  "I got mine, now we should stop everybody else."

Quote
are you suggesting you want the law to change? i believe that if 99% of people are doing somthing wrong, it doesnt make that right - its still evil IMAO


YES, I am suggesting I want the law to change.  The idea of copying someone as being wrong is a new concept that was created with the relatively new idea of copyright.  For thousands of year, humanity, AND business functioned perfectly fine without copyright.

"Evil"???  Illegal, yes.  But evil?  You must be kidding?!?!?!  Everything created is derivitive, right down to the words you used to write your response.  If copying someone is "evil" as opposed to illegal, all humanity is evil from the begining of speech onward.

Or, are you saying that it is illegal, and doing something that is illegal is "evil"?  If so, changing the law makes it not "evil" anymore.