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The "Not Quite Amiga but still computer related category" => Alternative Operating Systems => Topic started by: the_leander on February 13, 2009, 01:40:56 AM
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Yes, Elive has done it again.
The ultra lean, slick and fast Enlightenment desktop, combined with Compiz 3D goodness.
OMGWTFBBQ! (http://www.elivecd.org/Download/e17-compiz)
Tried it out on the EeePC 2G surf I have here.
Ran incredibly smoothly and was completely stable.
Oh, and it might even be pretty enough to tempt our resident macwhore (hello Bloodline!) to go over to the dark side, at least for a few hours :lol:
Note to laptop users: Using 3D compositing reduces battery life. On my Eeepc, which has about an hour and a half of useful life in it (the surf model has perhaps the most crappy battery ever fitted to a laptop that didn't come from sony), was reduced by about 20 minutes.
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I've seen some strange vids in my time but...
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Don't care much for Linux, but it did look cool. . . :-o
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I've been studying Compiz recently actual, I think that OS looks really nice :-)
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This is a copy of my email to the developer list:
The following are my initial findings on the Elive+Compiz development edition.
System tested: EeePC 2G Surf,
512Mb Ram
2Gb onboard SSD
No camera.
Booting in live mode from a USB keyfob.
Things noted as broken: Splash screen missing, some stability issues found when running elive on defaults, these disapeared completely when I selected no bluetooth - this model doesn't have it, so I suspect that might have been the cause.
One thing I did note was that whilst the volume function keys and mute were not active, sound did work (albeit at full blast with no means to silence it) no function keys whatsoever worked when the "EeePC" specific boot option was selected All other function keys were supported in no bluetooth mode otherwise.
Battery life... Well, I have to estimate that it took around 15 minutes off of the battery life over the default Xandros install, which on the Surf model I have reduces it to UPS class times of a little over an hour or so. The battery status indication was fine, however the estimated time to shutdown was all over the place, ranging from 14hours (lol) to 0mins whilst at around the half way point of discharge.
Wireless picked up several access points, though none I could connect to due to not having the keys to them (obviously). The wireless did however support being shut down from function keys (a first - no other distribution, including eeebuntu supports that without much emacs voodoo). Suspend reboot and shutdown all worked without issue. The panel looked great, but possibly a little large for the size of the eee's screen.
Speed was superior to anything I have yet thrown at this little machine with the possible exception of slax running in memory only mode, the flip side is that slax doesn't support the EeePC's atheos chipset whatsoever in it's latest encarnation without having to compile your own. Stability wise, once I selected the no bluetooth option this thing was production ready stable. No crashes or oddness within the 6 hours I tested it.
Theme selection worked like a charm. As did every application I tested.
Temperatures were within acceptable norms with the fan kicking in a little sooner then normal, though I suspect this is down to the GPU (and I use this term loosely when speaking of the POS intel onboard) being pushed harder then usual.
One thing I might ask though is this: Is there any possiblity of getting a stripped down version of Elive/compiz so that it would fit on the 2G, as is, it takes 2.5Gb. Perhaps have an option to select what applications get installed at install time. Maybe have the option (within the non dev branch) of not including the compiler toolchain?
All in all. With the exception of the missing volume control, Elive as is, could be used day to day in terms of stability. 7/10
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I like how they had that girl fondle her breast half way through just to wake us up ;)
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Sorry, I hated every bit of it. This graphic stuff only a burden to the processing power, the benefits can be easily achieved with conventional 2d graphics by a creative mind.
It's just the same 'shock and awe' song again. While there's still so much to do considering performance, flexibility and user friendlyness (and also flexibility in user friendlyness - for future applications)
:roll:
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I long for an advanced functional desktop *not* aimed at "most users". :-(
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Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
Sorry, I hated every bit of it. This graphic stuff only a burden to the processing power, the benefits can be easily achieved with conventional 2d graphics by a creative mind.
It's just the same 'shock and awe' song again. While there's still so much to do considering performance, flexibility and user friendlyness (and also flexibility in user friendlyness - for future applications)
:roll:
Don't worry Speel, this eyecandy is handled by the GPU... no CPU cycles are wasted, so it's good to put the GPU to some use other than sitting idle...
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They should put a disclaimer, "no cpu cycles were harmed in this demo..."
IT's pretty neat actually, but they don't tell what CPU and RAM are required.
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Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
Sorry, I hated every bit of it. This graphic stuff only a burden to the processing power, the benefits can be easily achieved with conventional 2d graphics by a creative mind.
The standard Enlightenment 17 offers this in buckets. So far as I can tell, this is just to show it can be done. Perhaps you should try one of the non 3d composited versions of Elive...
Fact is, is that Enlightenment uses a fraction of the resources a gnome or kde based linux does and is as fast as xfce on the same hardware. That it runs so smoothly even on something as pathetic (spec wise) as my eeepc is a testiment to the amount of optimisation that it has for "low end" systems.
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
It's just the same 'shock and awe' song again. While there's still so much to do considering performance, flexibility and user friendlyness (and also flexibility in user friendlyness - for future applications)
:roll:
You might also want to double check Elive's minimum system requirements - Pentium 1 processor with 64Mb of ram, same as with a cut down linux running xfce.
Only prettier. And more flexable. And more conducive to keeping a high level of workflow.
I used Elive 1.0 on my PC after trialing SUSE, Ubuntu and a half dozen others, all of which I found clunky after using BeOS/Zeta. It was the first distro that I didn't have to prat about with codecs or drivers for, it was the first one that ran out of the box with all of my hardware first time everytime.
I loved it and it still bugs the hell out of me that that machine was stolen. I got so much done using it that it wasn't funny. It had a great interface, had a rediculously small memory and system overhead and it seemed never to slow down even when you were thrashing the hell out of it.
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persia wrote:
They should put a disclaimer, "no cpu cycles were harmed in this demo..."
IT's pretty neat actually, but they don't tell what CPU and RAM are required.
Elives system requirements for non composited E17 is a pentium 1 with 64mb of ram.
My EeePC, with a crumby onboard intel gpu ran the composited version without issue in terms of performance. Yes, the non compiz version is marginally snappier. But the difference is minute tbh.
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kolla wrote:
I long for an advanced functional desktop *not* aimed at "most users". :-(
Try a linux that uses busybox or similar for its desktop ;-)
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If you're trying to be funny, you're not succeeding, and I believe you mean matchbox, not busybox.
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persia wrote:
I like how they had that girl fondle her breast half way through just to wake us up ;)
Exactly what I was thinking, 45 seconds in.
To be honest nice looking desktops are fine, but I just can't be fu*ked with all the 3d stuff, I don't see how it could possibly increase my productivity.
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bloodline wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
Sorry, I hated every bit of it. This graphic stuff only a burden to the processing power, the benefits can be easily achieved with conventional 2d graphics by a creative mind.
It's just the same 'shock and awe' song again. While there's still so much to do considering performance, flexibility and user friendlyness (and also flexibility in user friendlyness - for future applications)
:roll:
Don't worry Speel, this eyecandy is handled by the GPU... no CPU cycles are wasted, so it's good to put the GPU to some use other than sitting idle...
Bwhahaha, the year is 2005, Karlos has had a curry that has played havok with his internal organs, and so is suffering from a case of "the fear". We discuss modern hardware and he comes up with the following:
In my day it was expected that hardware would have bugs just as any gentlemen had vices in his otherwise perfect character. Non DMA is just hte hardware equivalent of riveting your secretary.
After all, gents prefer PIO (parts in often)
You can't trust these DMA devices, too much autonomy. In my day, CPU's used to tell parts what to do in exacting terms and they were thrashed with frequent busrequests when they were insolent. All this DMA is the same rot society is experiencing with all this liberalist nonsense. The CPU is the gentry class, subordinate processors must be kept in their place, what?
Northbridge and Southbridge are your working classes. They mustn't be allowed to think for themselves, they must be told what to do. You'll have a bloody socialist revolution otherwise, everybody thinking they have the right to access the memory. You see, old bean, memory is like land, only the gentry should own it. Cant have these commoners setting up camp. Bad for society!
Bring back the hardware oligarchy, I say! People today are in too much of a damn rush. In my day, we'd sit back and have port and cigars whilst waiting for a long IO transfer, comfortable in the knowledge it was done correctly and with class, the CPU guiding the way.
Nowadays, you can't trust anything since all this so called progress. Your bolshevik DMA transfer seems hard working and keen to impress but by damn, you cant trust it you know. Without the CPU transferring those bytes to memory how can you be sure it isn't spreading it's socialist sedition by tampering with them? Or worse still it might pocket a few on the way. The working classes can't be trusted with that type of authority old bean, it just isn't in their breeding.
Its almost as bad as these garish GPU things, what?
In my day you simply let the CPU work on the framebuffer, there was none of this 'hardware accelerated' malarchy.
All this high and truecolour displays and fancy so called eye candy! Damn homosexuality is what it is! It wouldn't have been tolerated in my day, by damn. We had green on black, a manly colour scheme for real men.
Lord Karlos of Quarterpast Two strikes again!
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kolla wrote:
If you're trying to be funny, you're not succeeding,
I see you're still the same humourless.. bah nevermind.
kolla wrote:and I believe you mean matchbox, not busybox.
BusyBox (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BusyBox).
Not for everyone, in fact, not for many people. But some folk like it. A mans desktop, for manly men!
Though thinking about it, perhaps this might be more to your liking Window Maker (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Window_Maker)..
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lorddef wrote:
persia wrote:
I like how they had that girl fondle her breast half way through just to wake us up ;)
Exactly what I was thinking, 45 seconds in.
To be honest nice looking desktops are fine, but I just can't be fu*ked with all the 3d stuff, I don't see how it could possibly increase my productivity.
Speaking as someone who has used both non 3d accelerated Elive and this, it doesn't improve productivity. But the key thing is this: It doesn't reduce it either. Which I think is key.
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the_leander wrote:
kolla wrote:and I believe you mean matchbox, not busybox.
BusyBox (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BusyBox).
Not for everyone, in fact, not for many people. But some folk like it.
I do like busybox, I've hacked around in it quite a bit over the years. However I fail to see what's so amusing mentioning it in the context of desktop environments.
Edit: Also, I'd bet busybox has more users around than almost any other linux program around, so it's definetly for most people.
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kolla wrote:
However I fail to see what's so amusing mentioning it in the context of desktop environments.
Clearly. Problem is, even if I explain it to you, the moment has passed.
kolla wrote:
Edit: Also, I'd bet busybox has more users around than almost any other linux program around, so it's definetly for most people.
Most computer users I know consider cli to be a thing of myth and legend. Comparing it to the darkest black magic. Of a time when only the truly hardcore geek used a computer.
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the_leander wrote:
kolla wrote:
However I fail to see what's so amusing mentioning it in the context of desktop environments.
Clearly. Problem is, even if I explain it to you, the moment has passed.
Actually, thats not fair. So I'll elaborate for you.
I first came across busybox on a floppy disk, it had written on it "Busybox rescue disk, for when all else fails".
I found the concept of you using an uber powerful modern computer, with only a cli running off of a floppy in place of a desktop somewhat amusing.
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Single floppy? We stopped ordering floppies when Dull started asking for a few bucks for them, didn't seem to make sense to pay for something you don't use. And I only got into Macs this century so I've never seen a Mac with one. The other day someone brought in a floppy to read and the only drive we could find was in the old computer we put aside for students to use to file their timesheets....
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Well he did specify something built not for everyone.
I figured that it was about as niche as one could get outside of an amiga...
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Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
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moto
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motorollin wrote:
Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
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moto
Pass?
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the_leander wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
Sorry, I hated every bit of it. This graphic stuff only a burden to the processing power, the benefits can be easily achieved with conventional 2d graphics by a creative mind.
The standard Enlightenment 17 offers this in buckets. So far as I can tell, this is just to show it can be done. Perhaps you should try one of the non 3d composited versions of Elive...
Fact is, is that Enlightenment uses a fraction of the resources a gnome or kde based linux does and is as fast as xfce on the same hardware. That it runs so smoothly even on something as pathetic (spec wise) as my eeepc is a testiment to the amount of optimisation that it has for "low end" systems.
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
It's just the same 'shock and awe' song again. While there's still so much to do considering performance, flexibility and user friendlyness (and also flexibility in user friendlyness - for future applications)
:roll:
You might also want to double check Elive's minimum system requirements - Pentium 1 processor with 64Mb of ram, same as with a cut down linux running xfce.
Only prettier. And more flexable. And more conducive to keeping a high level of workflow.
I used Elive 1.0 on my PC after trialing SUSE, Ubuntu and a half dozen others, all of which I found clunky after using BeOS/Zeta. It was the first distro that I didn't have to prat about with codecs or drivers for, it was the first one that ran out of the box with all of my hardware first time everytime.
I loved it and it still bugs the hell out of me that that machine was stolen. I got so much done using it that it wasn't funny. It had a great interface, had a rediculously small memory and system overhead and it seemed never to slow down even when you were thrashing the hell out of it.
O.K. :-)
I'll try it when I reinstall my pc.
I just hated how slow kde and gnome were.
Still, I'd love to see a linux distro as fast as BeOS. (or faster :-D)
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motorollin wrote:
Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
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moto
Because it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
Or something like that.....
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Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
QFT :lol: :-P
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moto
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motorollin wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
QFT :lol: :-P
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moto
:-D
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Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
motorollin wrote:
Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
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moto
Because it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
+1
:idea:
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bloodline wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
motorollin wrote:
Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
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moto
Because it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
+1
:idea:
Eh? Je ne comprendre pas...
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Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
bloodline wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
motorollin wrote:
Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
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moto
Because it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
+1
:idea:
Eh? Je ne comprendre pas...
Wie bitte? Ich verstehe nicht ;-)
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bloodline wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
bloodline wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
motorollin wrote:
Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
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moto
Because it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
+1
:idea:
Eh? Je ne comprendre pas...
Wie bitte? Ich verstehe nicht ;-)
Ik zei dat ik je niet begreep...
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Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
bloodline wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
bloodline wrote:
Speelgoedmannetje wrote:
motorollin wrote:
Annoying video... Why do they have to cut away from footage of the software every 0.5 seconds to show a shot of some girl sitting on the ground with an EeePC on her lap?
--
moto
Because it's a GIHIRL! WHOOHOO A GIHIRL! YAY FOR BOOBIES!
+1
:idea:
Eh? Je ne comprendre pas...
Wie bitte? Ich verstehe nicht ;-)
Ik zei dat ik je niet begreep...
Scusi, bobba da boopie?
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bloodline wrote:
Scusi, bobba da boopie?
En nu in 't Nederlands? :-P
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Wat moet ik daar nu over zeggen?...
Back to the discussion: I tried it out on my old Thinkpad T23. It works fine, very much better than KDE 4.something via PC-BSD on the same machine. I think I'm going to replace the system on my laptop. It is looking good and it is fast. And Enlightenment would have been the new Amiga-desktop if Jim Collas had succeeded in 1999. We would have now systems looking like except not the MacOS X toolbar, but everything more in the AmigaOS 4 design, with an integrated emulation of classic hardware.
Not a bad idea...