1084s Monitor as a preview video monitor on PC. Possible?

[Ral-Clan]

I see. Thanks for the link. As you mentioned, basically I am trying to connect my IBM ThinkPad, with various emulators (SEGA, SNES, MAME, NEO.GEO, etc.) running on Win XP, and connect it to my 1084S-D1 monitor.

I don't understand why you are not just using the S-VIDEO output on your Thinkpad to go to the 1084.  Why buy an expensive VGA to [whatever analogue NTSC mode] converter when the Thinkpad already converts its video to S-VIDEO NTSC analogue?

All you need is a $5 S-VIDEO to dual RCA (Chroma/Luma) cable and connect that to the appropriate connectors on the back of the 1084.

http://media.photobucket.com/image/1084%20monitor%20connectors/elboaconstricto/1084s-p.jpg

Note:

Do NOT merge the two RCA outputs together.  You lose the advantage of S-VIDEO this way (unless you really want a more smeared retro composite video look).

[Zac67]

Yes, going with a simple cable mini-DIN ("S-video") to dual RCA is the easiest, cheapest and probably best quality route. You only need to configure the S-video port to output a signal (if it doesn't all the time already).
If that isn't possible for whatever reason (driver or software problem) then you can also go the expensive route with an external VGA-to-video converter. But you'll also need to activate that VGA port of yours...

[CodeHunter]

Thanks, I have already connected my IBM ThinkPad to 1084S-D1 that way (S-Video to Luma/Chroma), but I was under the impression that if I connect it via VGA to RGB, I will get a better/flicker free image (superior to S-Video).

I will post the images shortly...

[Zac67]

The flicker you see is inherent to the standard: NTSC has only 480 lines delivered in two interlaced fields alternating with just 30 Hz - very visible for high contrast edges. While this is true for a high fidelity (=no processing) conversion, some converters apply filtering (possibly even adaptive) to the image and reduce the flicker substantially. (With adaptive filtering only blurring the image where it's necessary.)

The output of my first S-video capable graphics card (Kyro II aka PowerVR 3) was flickering very badly (comparable to Amiga video), but the output of its replacement (GF4 Ti4200) was much more tolerable yet a bit blurred due to non-adaptive filtering.

[CodeHunter]

I wish there was a way to make a similar cable (VGA to RGB):

http://www.bordersdown.net/showthread.php/36436-Connecting-a-Megadrive-to-a-Commodore-1084s-monitor/page6

[desiv]

I was under the impression that if I connect it via VGA to RGB, I will get a better/flicker free image (superior to S-Video).

Nope.
The 1084S flickers with interlace resolutions.  Just it's design..  (Zac67 beat me to the answer..)
And you'd have to downscale your Thinkpads resolution and frequency to something the 1084s understands on RGB.

I haven't seen a device that does that...

s-video is going to be your best bet, but s-video is generally pretty darn good to be honest.  ;-)

desiv

[CodeHunter]

No even if I use software 15khz or similar software?

[CodeHunter]

Here are the screen-shots of my S-Video connection to Luma/Chroma:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/48901682@N02/7153600027/in/photostream/lightbox/

The first two of from my ThinkPad's LCD, showing you the settings that I am using, third image an up are the actual screenshots of the gameply on 1084S-D1.

I think they look pretty good.

[desiv]

Not even if I use software 15khz or similar software?

It's not the 15khz, it's the vertical resolution.
If you are only showing a low-res screen, like 320x200 or 640x200, there's no flicker.
But when you up the resolution, you get into "Interlace" ranges, (320x400 or 640x400) and those flicker on the 1084, no matter what..

Yeah, those pics look pretty good.  I don't think you'll get much better than that.. ;-)

desiv

[CodeHunter]

Thanks! OK one last thing:

If I order this cable:

http://site.ambery.com/webgraph/CGA-VGACable.jpg
http://site.ambery.com/webgraph/CGA-VGACable-Connector.gif

Can I connect my ThinkPad via its VGA and connect the other end (9 pin) In combination, can I use a 15Khz software that lets me lower the resolution/frequency of ThinkPad to match 1084S-D1?

I connected my real Amiga 2500 (via 9 pin to 15pin) and its image is superior to that S-Video that I am getting from my ThinkPad.

there is got to be a way to convert VGA to RGB with superior video quality over S-Video. Right?

[Zac67]

MAME games are as limited in resolution as Amiga titles. The image quality doesn't actually change much when scaled up (to VGA/SVGA/XVGA/...), so when it's scaled back down (to NTSC) it's pretty much as before.

[desiv]

Tcan I use a 15Khz software that lets me lower the resolution/frequency of ThinkPad to match 1084S-D1?

You can try something like Advanced MAME, which lets you tweak your video settings to output 15khz, if your video chip supports it.
Never tried this, but it might work in Windows:
http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Custom_display_modes_%28Windows%29_-_Soft-15khz
I think you can do similar things with PowerStrip.

desiv
Warning, sending wrong signals to the monitor could damage it...

[Ral-Clan]

No even if I use software 15khz or similar software?

You do realize that the signal output by your ThinkPad's S-VIDEO port is already 15KHz, right??

This 15KHz software you speak of probably only affects the timing of the VGA port.

[CodeHunter]

This 15KHz software you speak of probably only affects the timing of the VGA port.

I assume so as well..., since it will "fool" the monitor that it is connected to an older device (i.e. Amiga, Atari, etc.)

As you know, if you connect a real Amiga to 1084S-D1 via S-Video it looks inferior compared to when you connect it using a DB 15-pin to DB 9-pin cable.

If I determine what is Amiga's native resolution/frequency when connected to 1084S-D1 via a 15pin to 9pin cable, then I might be able to buy a VGA to DB 9-pin, and in Windows environment somehow change reslution/frequency, so my MAME and other emulators, look as sharp as when a real Amiga is connected to my 1084S-D1 (again using a DB 15-pin to DB 9-pin).

Surely, 1084S-D1's RGB port, somehow must be able to receive a comparable signal from ThinkPad (or a modern computer for that matter), and convert this into something comparable to a real Amiga video signal. My issue with S-Video (from ThinkPad) to Y/C on 1084S-D1 is that it is NOT as sharp as when you connect a real Amiga to 1084S-D1 using a a DB 15-pin to DB 9-pin cable.

http://www.ambery.com/db9todbadca.html


Well, what is through software in Windows (PowerStrip, 15Khz, etc.) I might be able to adjust this?

Someone is making a progress here:
http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?topic=4096.0

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l2736&_nkw=DB+9pin+vga


There has to be a way...

[CodeHunter]

Looks like it is possible and have been already done here!

http://www.dragonslairfans.com/smfor/index.php?topic=127.0

"No need extra converter, VGA to SCART in RGB will work fine BUT you'll have to use AdvanceMame under DOS, or, more easy for setup : buy an Ultimarc's ArcadeVGA and you'll be able to use windows. I strongly suggest you that option if you never worked under dos and AdvanceMame config"

[desiv]

"No need extra converter, VGA to SCART in RGB will work fine BUT you'll have to use AdvanceMame under DOS, or, more easy for setup : buy an Ultimarc's ArcadeVGA and you'll be able to use windows. I strongly suggest you that option if you never worked under dos and AdvanceMame config"

I mentioned AdvanceMAME above.. ;-)
I didn't mention ArcadeVGA as you have a laptop.  It's a card for PCs..

And if your chipset is supported by soft-15khz or powerstrip, you can use those.

desiv