If Genesi owned the rights to Amiga IP

see you use this 'support' as a weapon against freedom of choice for a motherboard... Microsoft handles support how do they do it? Linux(all the various distros) BeOS? QNX??? BSD??? Apple had clones how did it do it?... they all somehow magically can do it...how come you cant? and as BBRV has said they plan to bring MorphOS to macs and they said MorphOS will run the Teron's w/o A1 changes made....

[Rogue]

The more people using the OS the better your bank balance is

That would highly depend on the effort required to bring the OS to a different hardware, and the amount of copies sold. x Million Apple users wouldn't mean x million additional sales. The question would be, how many Apple users would buy it? I'd venture to say very little. So the question is, how much would it cost in terms of development resources, and customer support (the often-neglected part) to bring AmigaOS to Apple hardware? These two factors need to be balanced against each other, and only if there is a plus coming out does this make sense.

Right now, I don't believe this.

Bill Gates is a very rich man because of this.

Sigh. Bill Gates didn't do it by himself. Windows relies on external developer works (mainly drivers, mainboard BIOSes etc). Doing an OS on a specific hardware is much easier if the company making the hardware also supports the product by providing the required drivers. You won't see Apple produce drivers for AmigaOS. So you have to do this all by yourself.

Another things I always keep saying (which is always ignored it seems) is customer support. We are talking about a commercial product, so everyone calling support will want to have exactly that - support. You can't just say "sorry, I don't know this hardware". Even if you narrow down the hardware by saying "does only run on x and y", you can be certain that someone with z will come along and complain that it doesn't work. What then? Saying "it's not supported" isn't going to make you friends.

For the same reason, we don't put "Amithlon" or "AmigaOSXL" on the "supported" stickers even of those games we release for 68k. We cannot support them, since we don't have enough knowledge about it. A certain person using a three-letter acronym involved in Amithlon always tried to convince me that there is no difference between Amithlon and a real Amiga, but that is simply not true (not spelling his name, I don't want to summon him :-) )

[Rogue]

Microsoft handles support how do they do it?

With a multi-millon dollar budget. Come on, this is ridiculous.

Linux(all the various distros) BeOS?

Linux? Support? Try getting a Matrox card to work on an ALI chipset mainboard with AGP. Where do you turn to when things don't work out? Where is the Linux support department?

BeOS? That company went bust, if you didn't notice it. Partly because they entagled themselves in an endless driver writing mess. Support? Yeah, sure.

Apple had clones how did it do it?

Again, with a multi-million dollar budget. And it's not like Apple is doing the hardware support all by themselves.

hey all somehow magically can do it...how come you cant?

Yeah, sure they magically work by money, or not at all.

as BBRV has said they plan to bring MorphOS to macs and they said MorphOS will run the Teron's w/o A1 changes made....

"Planing" is nice. I don't think it's done yet, though, or is it?

You completely twist the meaning of "support". I don't mean to actually get something to run on a hardware. I mean "customer support", like in "Parametric User calls support hotline" kind of support.

S: "This is Support, how may I help you"?

U: "Hi, I do have this apple computer, and my AmigaOS crashes".

S: "What kind of Apple computer do you have?"

U: "A Macintosh"

S: "I mean, what kind of Macintosh?"

U: "One of those strawberry colored things"

(competion left as an exercise to the reader)

[dammy]

by JoannaK on 2003/5/2 16:29:56

Lately I have been having Windowse PC for work and Linux PC for network server.. and I still wanted something different for use as a personal system. I really can't expect my latest purchase (Pegasos) to replace either of them right now (perhaps ever?) but at least it'll gives me chance to have something with personality.

I agree that a fun system, MOS/OS4/AROS can be justified in spending money, if there is already a XP or *nix box already in the house.  AROS even more so since it can run on existing hardware.  

Dammy

[Madgun68]

Seehund, I think I asked you before how you would handle customer support. Did you ever answer to that?

I'm not Seehud (nor do I play him on tv) but wouldn't it be the same as other companies handle it?

When I worked in the Windows 98 support group, for example, you let the caller know what you do and don't support before troubleshooting begins. They'll then know what to expect out of support. You troubleshoot it as best you can so long as hardware is not the suspected culprit. If it is, send them to the hardware vendor regardless if the vendor supports that operating system or not.

I had people calling in using older laptops that the vendor only supported under Windows 95. Guess what? If they wanted support they HAD to reinstall Windows 95 first. If the hardware was deemed okay and they call back for software support, then you do what you can with them knowing fully well that the software may not run on that machine and that's just the way it is.

[Desmon]

Re: If Genesi owned the rights to  Amiga IP

Then we might actually see a product released.   :roll:

Linux? Support?

red hat support network

suse customer care

many 'small' companies giving support for their distros via phone/web/etc ...supporting PPC/X86 and all boards that fall in there... thats more then MICROSOFT and their budgets are very small...

Try getting a Matrox card to work on an ALI chipset mainboard with AGP. Where do you turn to when things don't work out? Where is the Linux support department?

they kindly say 'that isnt supported' wich is why they release hardware support sheets so consumers dont make those mistakes... but since you mention it... why wont WindowsXP run on my 386? what is microsofts answer to that??? minimum system requirements.. and why wont XP support my Wildcat 2110 card? what is microsofts answer to that? 'not our problem"...

you arent expected to support 'ALL" or even 'MOST" you the company pick a set of hardware and use it and then tell users what to buy... its that simple..expanding from a set spec to support more and more...

You completely twist the meaning of "support". I don't mean to actually get something to run on a hardware. I mean "customer support", like in "Parametric User calls support hotline" kind of support.

no I dont think so... I think you've pretty much twisted the meaning of support... microsoft dosent even have a number to call for support .. their the biggest software vendor going... most people cant call red hat... you dont even need a number... it's about supporting more hardware and giving the users a free choice...

you could  have hardware compatability lists... you have dealers following them creating systems useing the compatability lists ...and you let dealers handle the support to their clients... it wouldnt all fall back to little ol hyperion the way you're making it out... you could even still bundle it on a dealer to dealer basis so you can avoid support entirely...

  dont sit and tell me a 500$ waffleone is better because of 'support' then a  cheap generic PC... because tons of little companies and groups are getting their products out there supported only on X,Y,Z configurations and doing a good job... NewTek dosent support every PC they manage to get their apps out there, Pinnacle manages it, A|W manages to get maya out there  , they all manage it... ALL of them... from the tiny little AROS  wich offers a free product and supports plenty of systems to the free FreeBSD... they all do it ...money or not...saying 'support' is this massive mountain blocking our way to generic hardware just dosent hold water when everyone else is able to support their products free or proprietary.


that little example of what Apple customer care would have to put up with is bogus to... SuSE/Debian and tons of Linux distros are running on Mac's aswell as BeOS... and Apple hasnt even complained nor has anyone gone under because of the Mac... BeOS went under for differant reasons....

[Hooligan_DCS]

@Kurt

Why do you feel the need to make Attacks against Amiga Inc. Eyetech,Hyperion.

Who have attacked Hypersion or Eyetech from MorphOS users? I know no-one, and that includes myself. What you said yourself, only proofs that Amiga Inc. have made even the involved companies look bad.

[z5]

@hooligan:

Who have attacked Hypersion or Eyetech from MorphOS users? I know no-one, and that includes myself. What you said yourself, only proofs that Amiga Inc. have made even the involved companies look bad.

This is a big statement you are making there. Just dig up some of the discussions here and on ANN. The mud throwing between the two parties has been so big that i somehow feel that you forgot reality there for a moment. And yes, i mean between morphos and hyperion/eyetech.

[EntilZha]

> Pathetic attempt at what?

AInc bashing.

You assume that Genesi would do it differently. But that's not the case, because MOS is also only available for the Pegasos and the old machines. That's why your comment, IMHO, was just AInc bashing.

Ok, here's *my* personal view, and that's got nothing to do with Amiga or Hyperion or Eyetech: I don't really like the dongle either. I see, however, the necessity to protect against piracy.

[bbrv]

If Genesi owned the classis AmigaOS IP?

One possibility might be to turn everything over to the AROS folks (they have stayed motivated and working independently for years!) or another, just release everything to OpenSource.  :-o

For the moment that would seem the best course as far as we are concerned, but that is PURE SPECULATION at this point as we do not own the IP.  ;-)

Sincerely,
Raquel and Bill   :-)

[EntilZha]

> Why can't I run AOS4 on any hardware I want then? Because of AInc.

No, not really. Rather because every hardware platform adds another amount of cost to the project. With a tight budget, this is nothing to be trifled with.

And what would we gain ? The only viable alternative for OS4 would IMHO be the Pegasos. Apple users are far too concerned about Apple to care for AmigaOS. Of all Pegasos users, I would estimate that a lot of them are not even interested in AmigaOS.

Ok, what other PPC hardware ? The few $ 5000 IBM pop boards ? Yeah, sure, that would be a market of, say, 10 to 20 people worldwide. Anything else ?

Sure, I don't have a clue about marketing. But at least I think I still have some common sense (even though Seehund will probably say I haven't an I'm doing "true Amiga Thinking").

[EntilZha]

> RELEASE OS4 Screenshots.

Yeah, did that, and have been accused of faking them.

[EntilZha]

> Microsoft handles support how do they do it

ROTFL.

Microsoft spends 250 million dollars for X-Box advertisement alone.

[Hooligan_DCS]

@Z5
This is a big statement you are making there. Just dig up some of the discussions here and on ANN. The mud throwing between the two parties has been so big that i somehow feel that you forgot reality there for a moment. And yes, i mean between morphos and hyperion/eyetech.
---------------------
Are you sure they are all MorphOS "fans" (if somebody wants to call them so ?
I stand behind what I said: No-one I know comes to my mind now who has been spreading mud about Eyetech and Hyperion.
Critisized maybe, not mudded. And there is nothing wrong in critisizing.

Don't mix those anonymous cowards at ann.lu as MOS users.
 

[z5]

@EntilZha

Yeah, did that, and have been accused of faking them.

Whatever you do, you will always be accused of something by someone... That is the amiga community. This is nothing you should care about.

However, while i appreciate that Hyperion is a small company with limited resources, isn't there anything possible to keep us positive while waiting? I've believed in the project all along but IT is difficult sometimes to stay positive when no info is released and the small info that is released, seems to be for those who have paid for it (for which i don't blame Hyperion).

I'll ask in a different way. Do you, as a company, find it important what people think about your product. Isn't there some small things you could do to create a bit of prerelease 'hype' (big word here ;-) ). Some claim that OS4 is far away, some say it is very close. So it is kind of hard to know exactly what is going on. Wouldn't somebody expect some activity starting to appear concerning marketing IF it is close away?