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Offline gaula92

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #44 on: March 27, 2014, 11:19:08 AM »
Use LUBUNTU: it has the same software base that "mainline" UBUNTU, but it's waaay lighter and has a small memory/cpu footprint.

Try LUBUNTU, you won't regret.
 

Offline Thorham

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #45 on: March 27, 2014, 11:37:13 AM »
Quote from: polyp2000;761352
@commodorejohn have you forgotten what happened last time you started bashing Linux in a thread like this.
Perhaps those complaints have some merit: http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.current.html. Don't know if it's all true, but it doesn't seem like a bad idea for people to do some research into Linux problems if they want to switch.
 

Offline CritAnime

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #46 on: March 27, 2014, 11:37:52 AM »
Having used many distributions of Linux over the years, including completely build your own varieties such as Gentoo, I would personally say for a complete newbie either Ubuntu or Mint (which uses Ubuntu as a base on one of its versions) are the best choices. Others will disagree on this while others will agree. The thing with Linux is there is so much variety within it that there is something for everyone pretty much.

One thing you may struggle with is WI-FI as some chipsets are supported within Linux natively. While lots of chipsets aren't and will either need stuff compiling, not good for newbies, or require odd workarounds using Windows drivers.

So for your questions

1. What type of Linux would be the most widely compatible and still good on a system from about 8 years ago (specs above)?

Lubuntu is going to the most compatible out of the Ubuntu flavours. If your feel adventurous then maybe look into something like Puppy Linux. I had this running on a crappy netbook with very little effort.

2. For my purposes (gradual immersion), should I create a partition on the 160GB hard drive for Linux, or buy a 32GB or 64GB USB stick and install on that?

Live distributions, that is a version that runs off CDs, DVDs or USB sticks, is a good way to go. Most distributions come with Live variations and are a great demo of how things work within the system. Just expect limitations and slow performance as it reads off things like CDs and DVDs. If you like it then generally it is a easy case of clicking on a icon and following some install instructions for the newbie friendly installers.

3. Any tips or good guides on creating a dual boot system?

Make sure something like GRUB installs, generally it does automatically. So long as you don't mess too much with the installer, going for custom installs, it should pickup windows fine and setup a dual boot environment.

5. Any tips on creating a Linux partition on a hard drive WITHOUT having to destroy and re-install the XP partition that already exists there (i.e. Swissknife?)?

Most installers come with a partitioning tool. However if it doesn't then you can use any partition tool, even within windows, to slice up the drive and get it ready for Linux. Before you start I would recommend watching videos and reading guides because if you do it wrong you will kill the Windows partition and lose all your data.

6. Any complications or pitfalls I need to watch out for on a dual boot system?

When it comes to getting rid of Linux, if you feel you don't want it any more, then it is a pain to do. So before you decide you want Linux then try, try, try and try it more using live media and even using virtual machines.

7. Are all Linux strains compatible? I don't want to be stuck with a Linux branch that can't run common binaries.

Anything for Linux will run on any Linux flavour. The package installers vary depending on distribution, commands and such. But generally the package managers have pretty comprehensive repositories of software. Updates filter through flavours pretty quickly. If you want something that is not in them you can do a manual compile. This is a bit tricky but doable.

Windows stuff however won't work without something like Wine. But this has it's own pitfalls and not all Windows software will work. But if your mainly using XP stuff then it shouldn't have too many issues with basic stuff.

8. In future, will I always need a Windows XP partition to run my legacy Windows XP applications, or is Wine under Linux good enough now?

Wine is not perfect. Don't let people tell you otherwise. It's getting better but some stuff simply either wont work or will be buggy. If you rely on Windows software then keep the Partition.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2014, 11:42:45 AM by CritAnime »
 

Offline gaula92

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #47 on: March 27, 2014, 12:10:49 PM »
Quote from: Thorham;761361
Perhaps those complaints have some merit: http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.current.html. Don't know if it's all true, but it doesn't seem like a bad idea for people to do some research into Linux problems if they want to switch.


If half that was true, my parents (+60 years old), my girlfriend (who is a chemistry student without deep computing knowledge) and most of my friends wouldn't be using GNU/Linux on a daily basis. And they do, with no problems whatsoever.
They produce technical documents, watch videos on youtube, watch downloaded films and series in a perfect smooth way, surf the internet, etc... and they don't need my technical assistance at all once the system is installed.

What's more: they daily have a nice, responsive desktop computing experience, whereas their computers struggled to do anything back in 2009 when they where using Windows Vista instead, before I moved back to my small town and started installing Lubuntu/Debian everywhere.
You can't start to imagine how much quality their computing has earned through using a proper OS like a good GNU/Linux distro.
 

Offline Madshib

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #48 on: March 27, 2014, 12:25:38 PM »
Quote from: CritAnime;761362

7. Are all Linux strains compatible? I don't want to be stuck with a Linux branch that can't run common binaries.

Anything for Linux will run on any Linux flavour. The package installers vary depending on distribution, commands and such. But generally the package managers have pretty comprehensive repositories of software. Updates filter through flavours pretty quickly. If you want something that is not in them you can do a manual compile. This is a bit tricky but doable.


In fairness to the question you answered, I think it should be stated that pre-compiled binaries on on different architectures will not work when crossing over other Linux distributions. Debian vs Ubuntu vs. Arch vs. Puppy etc. I think that this should be spelled out for some as I didn't know this when I switched over. I am not trolling here at all, I think he should know that initially. The last bit you mention is part of the reason I wanted to learn C as compiling in Linux can be important at times if you want something arch specific. To your point though, most software is compiled for different architectures already in the repositories.

@TCMSCP - TY for Bitwig! I never heard of it and it looks well polished as a Linux DAW.
 

Offline CritAnime

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #49 on: March 27, 2014, 12:42:14 PM »
Quote from: Madshib;761369
In fairness to the question you answered, I think it should be stated that pre-compiled binaries on on different architectures will not work when crossing over other Linux distributions. Debian vs Ubuntu vs. Arch vs. Puppy etc. I think that this should be spelled out for some as I didn't know this when I switched over. I am not trolling here at all, I think he should know that initially. The last bit you mention is part of the reason I wanted to learn C as compiling in Linux can be important at times if you want something arch specific. To your point though, most software is compiled for different architectures already in the repositories.
 
@TCMSCP - TY for Bitwig! I never heard of it and it looks well polished as a Linux DAW.

 
Yup i would agree and accept that correction. Jumping between different base systems, debian to gentoo for example, you will find differences in how packages are handled and subtle changes, which do have effects on software, in how things are compiled. But as a general rule all software written for Linux will work no matter the system with some tweaking.
 
But to ballance it out. If the op picks a distro and sticks with it then there should be no issue. Or if they go from debian to Ubuntu to mint.

Offline danwood

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #50 on: March 27, 2014, 01:49:10 PM »
From my personal experience of the main Linux distros, when they work fine and everything goes smoothly they are great, when you run into problems though Linux can be a bastard to fix.  Most of the problem solving advice still tends to be dropping into the Terminal and editing obscure config files.

Providing everything works out of the box though, you're in luck.  I almost put my fist through the wall spending almost an entire weekend trying to get an unsupported Wireless card to work with NDISWrapper and a problem with enhanced graphic drivers a while back.

For the basic day-to-day tasks most users do (web, email, facebook, youtube) Linux is great, in fact I put in on my brother's laptop as he had a habit of ending up with malware every few days (80 trojans on his Win 7 machine on last count was enough for me to replace it with Linux Mint).  

It does lack applications which I need for work though which is why I keep Windows and OS X around for apps like the Adobe Suite, Pro Tools/Logic, and decent video editing software, but for general use Linux can be fine.
 

Offline danwood

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #51 on: March 27, 2014, 01:51:19 PM »
Quote from: stefcep2;761334

The thing is thats its often simple stuff that should not be an issue by now but it is.  A dodgy CD driver can boot you into a shell and you end up not having a clue why.  Off to the  forums and watch as your spare time crosses the Linux event horizon as you try and track the error down.


This is totally my experience, when everything is sailing along fine and working it's great, as soon as something breaks though, there you are in the depths of Bash and text editors editing all these obscure files and typing unintuitive Unix commands.
 

Offline cgutjahr

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #52 on: March 27, 2014, 02:34:37 PM »
Quote from: stefcep2;761338
Anectodally?  Its still poor if 1 in 5 are not happy.

It's 1 in 6. And while these numbers are completely made up of course, 1 in 6 would still be a major improvement over Windows.

Quote

No-one runs operating systems, they run applications. Its a core app that runs on the Linux platform. It matters.

"Windows is a pile of crap because of all the malware"
"Windows sucks because it has Origin, Uplay and all that DRM crap"

Blaming Linux for any alleged problems in LibreOffice is stupid for several reasons. For once, nobody's forcing you to run LibreOffice: there are various commercial alternatives, like Kingsoft Office and Softmaker Office. You can even run MS Office under Wine, if you really have to.

And if you "have to use Powerpoint collaboratively" - maybe, just maybe that's not the most fair test case for LibreOffice? I know it's a common complaint, but if you're expecting LibreOffice to be a 100% compatible drop-in replacement to MS Office, you (a) don't have a clue about Microsoft's history apparently and (b) look like you are just making up excuses for bashing LibreOffice. If your employer wants you to use Powerpoint collaboratively, that's what you use, obviously. I'm not blaming British car manufacturers for mounting the wheel on the wrong side of the car - I simply don't buy British cars for use on German streets (Yay, a car analogy!)

Quote

I was very open to Linux in 2007.

I tried Windows in 1987, and I was very open to it. I can tell you from personal experience that Windows is a total pile of crap.

Btw., what's the Windows version that was current in 2007? Vista? Enough said.

In 2007, Ubuntu was less than a year old - give it a try now. I'm not using it myself, but I usually install it for people who are sick of Windows or want to try Linux for some reason. I didn't get any complaints so far.

Quote

small update caused some conflict somewhere.

There are problems like that, with any OS. I never encountered one of them myself, and from what I see in the forums, not many other people do. You do have to keep an eye on what hardware you use, of course. Drivers usually take a short while to arrive/mature after a new product is released.

I actually think the rock solid and idiot proof software update mechanisms on Linux - that keep all of your software up-to-date automatically - are one of the best things about Linux.
 
Quote

How do I fix it?  Oh lucky i dual booted with XP to get online to work it out
[...]
Thats right if you go Linux, keep a Windows machine handy-you'll need it.

Erm... these days you simply boot from a Linux Live DVD or a USB stick. The same Linux Live DVD a Windows user would have to use in a similar scenario, btw. (due to lack of Windows Live DVDs).

Quote

The OP needs to hear the good and the bad- and no its not the user's fault either.

"The bad" being "it totally destroyed my machine in 2003"? That's not going to help much, since he has no clue if he's going to encounter hardware issues with his setup - booting a live DVD should give him a clue, and he might want to list his hardware here so people can point out potential troublemakers (there aren't many left in 2014).

For anything else, the sane approach would be to install Linux in a virtual machine - provided his hardware is up to the task.

I'm not saying Linux doesn't have its problems. But having Windows users (of all people) complain about "terrible UI issues" or "random dependency problems" is pure comedy.
 

Offline Paulie85

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #53 on: March 27, 2014, 03:01:23 PM »
I was thinking of trying the Aros/Linux hybrid Aeros. Does anyone have any experience with that? It seems a bit fiddly to install though.
 

Offline TheMagicM

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #54 on: March 27, 2014, 03:43:55 PM »
Quote from: Paulie85;761374
I was thinking of trying the Aros/Linux hybrid Aeros. Does anyone have any experience with that? It seems a bit fiddly to install though.

dunno..but there is a thread out there somewhere that you can reply to.  I think I replied to it myself*...being that this is a Linux only thread.

EDIT: nvm..I replied to Icaros thread..but you can spin off a new thread.
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Offline commodorejohn

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #55 on: March 27, 2014, 04:03:31 PM »
Quote from: polyp2000;761352
@commodorejohn have you forgotten what happened last time you started bashing Linux in a thread like this. I think you are entitled to your own opinions but your ugly head seems to rear itself at the very mention of Linux.
I'll rear my "ugly head" any damn place it's relevant, thankyou. And given that ral-clan is a Windows user curious about the Linux experience, and has specifically stated that he wants to hear opinions from all sides, it's certainly relevant here.

Quote
Quite frankly I don't know how you managed to have such bad experiences! Your comments may have had some merit 10 years ago. We have heard them all before. Please can you try and tone it down or bite your lips?
Ten years my ass, these issues were as bad as ever as recently as November 2011, when I finally threw up my hands after some seven years of periodic migration attempts and gave up on Linux altogether. As for "toning it down," this is the toned-down version. What you really want is for me to not say anything bad about Linux at all.

And once again, a Linux advocate thinks that "well I haven't noticed any problems, so I don't see how anybody else could take issue!" is a meaningful argument...

Quote
The original post has made a decision to try a new OS and was asking for tips. Not to hear the bitter ramblings from the king of Linux hate "commodorejohn"
I'm trying to save a fellow forum member the time and headache I experienced in basically the same situation. I don't really give two shíts what you think about it.
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Offline commodorejohn

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #56 on: March 27, 2014, 04:04:27 PM »
Quote from: TheMagicM;761355
Strange because my dad, myself and people I know  who use Linux have *never* had anything like that happen.  My dad has  had completely different machines every 3 years or so because I just  like buying better systems.  No issues.  Dunno why you had yours.  

I agree.  But I disagree when people start bring back issues from 1990  or because of their own shortcomings or issues they created themselves  which caused the problems in the first place.
And once again, the "I don't notice any problems, therefore the  problems that you experience can't possibly exist or must somehow be your fault!" argument...

Quote from: TheMagicM;761357
I'm just adding the correct spin on it when it  seems as though anything new other than Amiga and Windows gets bashed by  users who havent left their pigeon hole.
This is absolute horseshít and you know it. Tons of people here embrace  possibilities other than Amiga and Windows; there's a bunch of OSX  users, there's RiscOS devotees, and I myself have already mentioned that  I like where Haiku's going. What you mean by "anything new gets bashed"  is "people say bad things about Linux, and I don't like that." That's  enough of a non-argument as it is, but you could at least own up to it.

Quote from: TheMagicM;761358
Ok.  Then Linux isnt for *you* specifically.   Thats fine.  Just dont ruin other peoples enjoyment of trying something  different because of your personal shortcomings.
If people have their enjoyment ruined simply because someone on the Internet is saying mean things about something they like, they need to grow a thicker skin. And in this case, that's just you and polyp2000; ral-clan himself has specifically said that he wants to hear all views on the issue.

Quote from: TCMSLP;761359
If you have any doubt about the quality of such  software then check out some of the Blender videos:-
Check out the Blender interface - it's designed for space aliens, by space aliens. The technical underpinnings may be excellent, but they're accessible only via a poorly-designed UI, which is a lot of Linux software in a nutshell.
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Offline TheMagicM

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #57 on: March 27, 2014, 06:17:27 PM »
Quote from: commodorejohn
I'm trying to save a fellow forum member the time and headache I experienced in basically the same situation. I don't really give two shíts what you think about it.

So you dont even want him to try it.  Just want him to give up.  Momma raised a quitter, huh?

Quote from: commodorejohn
If people have their enjoyment ruined simply because someone on the Internet is saying mean things about something they like, they need to grow a thicker skin.

After those two posts, I can surmise you're just a troll doing trolly things.  Not trying to actually post any LOGIC and REAL reason as to the pros and cons of linux..just trolling thru AO because of your lack of abilities at learning new things.  No problem.  I was wrong and thought you had something constructive to say, but after wasting a few minutes of my time and reading your drivel, all you do is resort to cursing and crying when someone says Linux is great.  

Quote from: commodorejohn
And once again, the "I don't notice any problems, therefore the problems that you experience can't possibly exist or must somehow be your fault!" argument...

And once again, the "I have problems, therefore the problems that I experience must somehow be Linux fault!" argument...
^^^^ See what I did there?

Quote from: commodorejohn
Check out the Blender interface - it's designed for space aliens, by space aliens. The technical underpinnings may be excellent, but they're accessible only via a poorly-designed UI, which is a lot of Linux software in a nutshell.

VIP/Donor needs to be edited to Troll.
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Offline Oldsmobile_Mike

Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #58 on: March 27, 2014, 06:19:06 PM »
Quote from: commodorejohn;761380
Ten years my ass, these issues were as bad as ever as recently as November 2011, when I finally threw up my hands after some seven years of periodic migration attempts and gave up on Linux altogether.

I'm sorry.  It just sounds to me like you don't know what you're doing.  I've had zero problems installing the latest version of Ubuntu even on 10-year-old Pentium 4 Dell Dimensions that people were throwing away.  Good luck to the OP, I trust they won't have nearly so many issues as you claim to have had.  I know things can be frustrating, but if they approach it in a less negative manner they'll be more likely to receive any help and support they need.  Have a good day!
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Offline ElPolloDiabl

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Re: Tips on moving to Linux?
« Reply #59 from previous page: March 27, 2014, 06:55:20 PM »
My reason to avoid Windows: $150 to have 15GB of my hard drive taken up by who knows what.
Linux: an OS that is not intrusive.

Half the Linux software you download is buggy unfinished etc. but there is plenty that works great.
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