A2000 can't boot hard disk

[Michele31415]

I tried booting my 2000 yesterday after a long hiatus but was unable to boot from FS3:, the disk mounted on the A2091.  Doing a L+R mouse boot, the only devices listed there are the floppy drive and QDH0:, which is a second hard disk daisy-chained on the 2091.  It contains a copy of the boot disk, but if I select it and boot, I just end up in AmigaDOS and can't give any commands.  I can successfully boot a WB 2.1 from floppy though.

I also have a CD drive with AmigaDOS 3.9 in it but I can't boot from that either.  The CD drive isn't on the boot device list.  I could use some help on how to proceed from here before I make things worse by randomly poking around.  Is my boot disk toast or is this a controller issue?  Is there any diagnostic I can run?  Is there a way to boot from QDH0: into WB?  Any help would be most appreciated.

[mechy]

Just a guess but it sounds like QDH0: is not bootable. You could load up hdtoolbox off floppy and run it,set the bootable check box and save it. If you do this do NOT alter anything else on the drive or it will likely destroy the contents.
does the main drive spin up at all or make any noise sitting there?

[Michele31415]

The boot drive feels like it's spinning and it gets warm but the activity LED only blinks twice and then nothing more.  I tried reseating the controller board and the SCSI connectors but that didn't help.  I think it's dead, Jim.

But I also misspoke.  The second drive is in fact not a copy of the boot drive, it's just full of extra stuff (games, compilers, etc.)  So although it shows up in the boot device menu, it looks like it is indeed not bootable.

But all is not lost.  Turns out I did make a complete copy of the boot drive - but it's on a USB stick on my Deneb board.  So my plan looks like this now.  I'm going to replace the failed drive with an SD card.  I'm looking at SCSI2SD - does that seem like a good choice?  That will greatly lower the power consumption and heat output and give me more storage.

But what do I do next?  I can boot a floppy and use that to format the new drive.  But to restore the backup from the USB stick I need to start the Deneb, using the utility ... which is on the failed drive.  I'm guessing put the rescue jumper in on the Deneb and treat it as a new installation?  I'm also a bit shaky on restoring a backup.  Can I just say "copy usb:*.* fs3:" (or whatever the AmigaDOS syntax for that is)?  It's been so long since I played with this I can't remember any of it.

[Malakie]

I tried booting my 2000 yesterday after a long hiatus but was unable to boot from FS3:, the disk mounted on the A2091.  Doing a L+R mouse boot, the only devices listed there are the floppy drive and QDH0:, which is a second hard disk daisy-chained on the 2091.  It contains a copy of the boot disk, but if I select it and boot, I just end up in AmigaDOS and can't give any commands.  I can successfully boot a WB 2.1 from floppy though.

I also have a CD drive with AmigaDOS 3.9 in it but I can't boot from that either.  The CD drive isn't on the boot device list.  I could use some help on how to proceed from here before I make things worse by randomly poking around.  Is my boot disk toast or is this a controller issue?  Is there any diagnostic I can run?  Is there a way to boot from QDH0: into WB?  Any help would be most appreciated.

See if you have your cards install boot disk on floppy.. (if not you can find a download of the latest a2091 install disk on a few websites out there but you DO NEED a working floppy disk OR Gotek Drive ADF image of that disk to accomplish an attempt to repair)

 Boot the system from that disk.  Load HD Toolbox.  Once it loads, does that HD appear in the list?   If so, that means the drive is still available but something probably corrupted the boot sector and/or directory table.   If the drive itself no longer appears in the list at all, the drive most likely failed.

If it does appear however, you can try to repair the boot sector of that drive a few tools like diskdoctor or QBTools.  They can both repair a damaged boot sector so it may be worth to try to fix the boot sector IF that HD does appear in the HD Toolbox list as available. 

If that does not work, your next option is to go back into the HD Toolbox and try to fix JUST the boot partition by removing just that partition and recreating it.   If that is not able to be done, back up any other partitions that may still be available on that HD before doing anything else.

Once you do that and as long as that HD does appear in HD Toolbox, perform a FULL LOW LEVEL format.  Not a high level or OS level format, not yet.. There is a button in HD Toolbox to perform a full low level format.   It will take a while depending on drive size.

Once the low level format is complete, reboot again using the a2091 install boot disk.

Go back into HD Toolbox and if that HD does appear, click it and then the DEFAULT setup button.  DO NOT select boot option yet.

Let it set the defaults, save the changes to the drive and exit HD Toolbox.  Reboot again.

Once reboot is complete, now do a regular FULL format.  DO NOT use quick format.  Do a FULL format to insure all bad sectors get mapped that the low level format found.

Once that is complete, go back into HD Toolbox, click on that HD again and then set to BOOT, save changes to the HD, exit and reinstall the OS to that boot drive.

If the drive is still functional, you should get through all of that without any errors and be back up and running from it..  If you start getting consistent errors as you work through all this, the HD may be going bad and quickly (the a2091 failing too is a possibility but the last case possibility)

[Michele31415]

Thanks for the great ideas.  I hadn't considered the possibility of a boot block corruption.

"See if you have your cards install boot disk on floppy."

I have a disk called "Amiga 2090A Hard Disk Software" but it doesn't seem to be bootable and I don't see an HD Toolbox on it.  It has a program called Install and a drawer called HardDisk.  So I guess I'm off to try and find an A20091 install disk, though I don't know how to get that image onto a floppy the Amiga will read.  I guess the keyword clue is "Gotek" :-)

UPDATE:
I see a bunch of Goteks on Ebay but they all specify 500, 600, or 1200.  Will they also work on a 2000 or is this just a case mounting format difference?

I also found the A2091 Install disk and HDInstTools on www.amigaforever.nl/drivers.php.

[Malakie]

Hi, There is a program you can use on both a PC and Amiga to either make an ADF out of a floppy or make a floppy from an ADF file... Can't remember it's exact name, maybe someone here knows or has a direct link they can post.....

If you have a gotek, that is the easiest though.. just place the ADF file on a memory stick and it will boot off it as if it were a floppy..

You can find the A2091 ADF file on a few different archive sites.. or again maybe someone has a link they can post here for you...  Look for version 1.3 at minimum..  Then use the HD Toolbox on that disk (I think it is in tools or utilities on that version if I am remembering right)  The ADF/Floppy for that IS bootable either gotek or floppy if you make one.

[Malakie]

bah need a delete message option

[Michele31415]

"Hi, There is a program you can use on both a PC and Amiga to either make an ADF out of a floppy or make a floppy from an ADF file... Can't remember it's exact name, maybe someone here knows or has a direct link they can post..... "

 That would be great.  But is it not the case that you can't load a PC floppy onto an Amiga and vice-versa?

"You can find the A2091 ADF file on a few different archive sites.. or again maybe someone has a link they can post here for you...  Look for version 1.3 at minimum.."

Thanks - the version I got from amiga4ever is 1.30.  Are all the Goteks the same except for the case or do I need one specifically for the A2000?  The Ebay listings all refer to 500/600/1200, but not 2000.

[Malakie]

I have one for my A2000 and as far as I know, connection wise they are all the same.. You want one that does say A2000 just to insure it fits in the floppy slot because the outer case is slightly different for different machines.   They also make TWO versions.. One has a small screen that only shows 3 numeral digits and nothing more, another version has a fill OLED display though, that tells you what disk you are loading, shows the tracks as they are loading off a disk and more.  This is the one I chose.


What's nice is you can set the gotek to emulate a single drive or to just copy a buttload of ADF files to a memory stick and scroll through them to find the one you want.. it then loads that one automatically as if you put a floppy in a drive.. So far the use has been flawless and is also faster than a floppy drive itself of course.  You can also set the gotek as a boot device, i.e. DF0: which I did.  My actual floppy drive, I changed to DF1: then.   The gotek plugs right into the same power and cable as the floppy you have now using the same cable for both.


The Gotek is available both brand new and on Ebay from what I am finding.   So make sure to compare prices.


Also a couple other points..   There are no decent instructions on using the thing..   I am learning how to use it by trial and error.. Why someone has not actually written up a comprehensive manual is beyond me.. Especially since it has multiple modes and I have yet to figure out how to use some of those other modes it has.

Finally, your memory stick you use, it has to be formatted to fat32 to support Amiga and the Gotek.. If you format it any other way, it won't be recognized.  I just bought a $5 pack of a dozen cheap 64gb sticks and they work great.  And of course with 64 gb.. well you can pretty much store the entire Amiga library on one...  Although I am organizing mine now for games, applications, utilities and so forth.

[Michele31415]

Great - that's all good to know.  I didn't get the point of the OLED display but it seems like a good idea so I just ordered one (https://www.ebay.com/itm/324528012392).  Unfortunately, these all seem to come from Europe (this one's from Germany) so it's going to be a while before it arrives.

But meanwhile, good news!  I found my A2091 Install disk.  It was in a dusty floppy box on a dusty shelf under something else.  (Why is it always in the last place you look?)  And it even booted.  Then following your advice:

" Boot the system from that disk.  Load HD Toolbox.  Once it loads, does that HD appear in the list?   If so, that means the drive is still available but something probably corrupted the boot sector and/or directory table.   If the drive itself no longer appears in the list at all, the drive most likely failed."

Sadly, SCSI unit 0 (FS3:) is not on the list.  Only QDH0: (the bay-mounted disk) and the CD drive. 

So now I'm waiting for my SCSI2SD.  At least it was a good idea.

[Michele31415]

Well my SCS2SD arrived quickly enough, and even included a bonus 16 GB Class 10 Sandisk SD card.  Now I just need to figure out what to do with it.,  I got a v. 5.2.  Can I just pop it in or do I need to do anything about termination?  I have two other devices on the SCSI bus.  There doesn't seem to be any good documentation on this (that I could find).

UPDATE:

Sigh - nothing's easy.  First, the holes on the SCS2SD don't line up with the holes on the A2091 so I'm going to have to 3D print an adaptor bracket for it *.  Second, the Molex power plug on the 2091 is the large style while the board uses the small style.  I have one free small connector daisy-chained off the floppy drive but it's not long enough to reach the board.  Grrr.

* Ahh, thingiverse to the rescue: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3653369  At least I don't have to design the adapter.

[QuikSanz]

Reminds me that, the SCSI2SD really could use a backplate for us that have a full front panel, put over an ISA slot. If boot drive and you have more, make it 1 and term down the line.

Chris

[Michele31415]

OK, so then it looks like I can just drop the SCSI2HD in place of the existing failed drive without messing with terminators.

The 3D printed adapter came out very nice but with a small problem.  Although the holes all line up perfectly, when the SCS2SD is mounted, its SCSI connector is offset from the 2091's connector by about half an inch.  I haven't tried yet to see if the ribbon cable will jog over enough to accomodate this.  I may need to do my own design after all.

UPDATE:
Nope. I was too lazy to get up and go look before but it turns out the SCSI2GD is last in the chain, not first, so there's no ribbon cable issue.  While I'm waiting for my power adapter  I  got a 128 GB SD card.  Might as well go all the way :-)

[Michele31415]

Some news, and it's not good.  I finally got my power adapter pigtail, pulled the existing hard disk out of the A2091 and replaced it with the SCS2HD.  Now the machine wouldn't boot at all.  Not even the L+R eartly diagnostics.  So I pulled the second hard drive out of the SCSI daisy chain - still wouldn't boot.  I removed the CD drive - still wouldn't boot.  I finally pulled the cable entirely from the A2091 - still wouldn't boot.  Removed the A2091, machine booted fine.

Then I took an old A2090A I had lying around.  Using this I was able to successfully format an Aimga drive using the SCSI2HD and the same cable as before.  Of course it's only 256 MB so I'd really rather have more than that.  Aty least it proves that the cable is OK, the MB slot is OK, and the SCS2HD is OK.  It may be that I condemned the old boot drive prematurely.  It's looking now like it's the A2091 itself that has gone south.

So any recommendations for a newer, better hard disk controller for the A2000?

UPDATE:

Having heard nothing back, I just ordered an Alfa Data 24050-00A Oktagon 2008 SCSI Hard Disk Controller.

While waiting for that, I set the Rescue jumper on the Deneb to make it load its tools onto my SCSI2HD.  But the install did not go well (on reboot the Poseidon USB stack was MIA).  I think it's because I'm running WB 1.2.  I guess I'll try the upgrade to WB 3.1 and try the Deneb install again.  Or maybe I should just wait for the new controller which will hopefully let me make a disk bigger than 256 MB.

[Michele31415]

For those following the ongoing saga, I got my Oktagon 2008.  Turns out it's a rev. 7 with 6.12 ROM so that's nice.  Setup was super easy.  The install floppy is available online and my new Gotek came in handy to get it going.  Actually, the machine reported the card as defective when I first plgged it in, but I cleaned the edge connector with my Mars Staedtler acid-free plastic eraser, wiped them off with Deoxit Gold and reseated the ROM.  Then it worked fine.  It's not the fastest controller out there but it has one big advantage over my A2091 - it works.

The only problem I have now is that I can't get a SCSI2SD device larger than 1 GB.  I've set a 4 GB size for the first device in scsi2hd-util on the PC and the Oktagon installer reports its size as 4 GB but when I open the new disk in Workbench, it says it's only 1 GB.  This is WB 1.3 though so maybe that's it.  I'll try upgrading to 3.1, which I need to do anyway to get my Deneb running.

So then I'm thinking - it would be nice if I could figure out what's wrong with my 2091.  I powered it up on my bench and found that diode D1 was open, so I replaced that.  Then I found that U7, a 7407 hex inverter was turning up squirrely numbers so I'm going to replace that too.  I have a lot of IC's in my stash, but not that one.  So I'm waiting for that now.  There's a video on Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swU3w6_ipLs) that describes my problem almost exactly.