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Offline Amiga_Nut

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #104 from previous page: September 16, 2010, 09:25:14 PM »
So what would people say is the bare minimum to not poke a stick at someone trying to sell a Pissy as a new generation Amiga because they spent 10 minutes installing AROS on it or something?
 

Offline dammy

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #105 on: September 16, 2010, 09:29:58 PM »
Quote from: Golem!dk;579731
And this would be based on? pure speculation?


Who else would have that type of money to invest in Chinese hardware?
Dammy

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Offline Amiga_Nut

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #106 on: September 16, 2010, 09:35:50 PM »
Quote from: Golem!dk;579731
And this would be based on? pure speculation?


The fact he sells some crappy imported Chinese furniture to finance this joke of a scam called Commode USA?
 

Offline haywirepc

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #107 on: September 16, 2010, 09:38:18 PM »
This may be off topic, well not really... I know the cybernet pc is one they are selling, but that AMIGO... I know the other one like it is asus...
 
Does anyone know the source of the amigo? I seem to recall someone posted it here awhile ago, and it was called a websurf computer or something like that but I can't remember who makes it, nore can I find it on google.
 
I'd like to buy one but I'm certainly not buying one from them.
 
Steven
 

Offline tone007

Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #108 on: September 16, 2010, 10:20:07 PM »
3 Commodore file cabinets, 2 Commodore USB turntables, 1 AmigaWorld beer mug
Alienware M14x i7 laptop running AmigaForever
 

Offline djrikki

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #109 on: September 16, 2010, 11:11:03 PM »
Quote from: WolfToTheMoon;579721

Hyperion DOES NOT own AmigaOS or Amiga OS trademark rights...


You said the same thing on AW after I gave you the link proving the opposite.

Perhaps yet again... selective reading.

http://www.hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=134:hyperion-entertainment-cvba-and-amiga-inc-reach-settlement&catid=38:corporate&Itemid=18

"As part of the settlement agreement, the Amiga Parties acknowledge that Hyperion is the sole owner of AmigaOS 4 without prejudice to any third party rights."

Offline takemehomegrandma

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #110 on: September 16, 2010, 11:47:50 PM »
Quote from: redrumloa;579719

 
Projected budget: $30 million.


Impressive! :)

Maybe 2011 *will* be The Year of Amiga? :)

Hmm, why don't they sell *these* AIO products under the Commodore Amiga name? That would be cool! Aros is being ported for it as well... ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4L914kAIWOM
MorphOS is Amiga done right! :)
 

Offline ChrisUnionNJ

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #111 on: September 20, 2010, 07:42:03 AM »
Quote from: gdanko;579238
I became fascinated with the, for a lack of better words, drama around this new Commodore USA and its CEO Barry Altman. Then I remember seeing the Commodore name being used for on high end Windows "gaming" systems awhile back and how that appalled me. So I emailed Barry at Commodore USA to offer complaints about offering Windows machine and some suggestions. The text of my email is here:

---
Barry,
While I am a firm believer in the rights to be protected against libelous speech, I am also very leery of Commodore USA and what they're producing. If it's the same Commodore USA from about two years ago, all I saw were some fancy PC clones with Commodore logos on them. Remember, Windows is the epitome of what Commodore was NOT and to put the Commodore name and/or logo on a Windows PC is an abomination.

If you REALLY want to honor the Commodore name and legacy, you would consider one or more of the following:

1) Invest money/resources in the AROS project to help them make it truly usable. As we stand, it's not all that viable for daily use.
2) Invest in the MorphOS project/aid in an x86 port of the entire MorphOS system. MorphOS is far more advanced and polished than AROS at this point. To have an x86 port of MorphOS on a solid piece of hardware with a well-thought design would be awesome. It's doable but the resources are stretched thin as is.

Selling Windows-based run of the mill PCs with the Commodore logo is a travesty and a slap in the face to Commodore loyalists. I know business is business but to me it's sickening.

And yeah I know Linux is an option. But Windows is ever-present and I would be ashamed to buy a Commodore machine today.
Gary
---

Barry was more than willing to put his money where his mouth is and offered me his phone number at Commodore USA so we could talk over the phone. We had a 30 minute conversation and these are the major takeaways I took from the conversation.

* Barry is not simply some schmuck trying make a dime off the Commodore name.
* Barry has been in electronics and manufacturing for 25+ years
* Barry's family has a long successful history of entrepreneurship, going back to the B. Altman and company (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B._Altman_and_Company) department store which was started by his great (or great great) grandfather.
* Barry still owns furniture factories which produce furniture for high-end brands like Thomasville, which I am a fan of an own.

* Regarding the usage of the image(s), he said he wanted an image and found that one concept image, looked in vain for the owner, but could not find him. The image was put up on the site in hopes that the owner would come out of the woodwork and ask to have it removed or for royalties, neither of which happened. The email address was cropped out because it was a bogus address but later re-added so people would stop whining. At this point he would still like to contact the artist for permission to use the image.
* Acknowledges the poor quality of the web site and is actively looking for web developers. If you are a talented web developer and can show proof of your work, please contact him as they are actively looking to improve the web site.
* Has nothing to do with the company who created those beefy Windows boxes with the Commodore logo on them or the company who made Commodore-branded MP3 players.
* Reveled to me that the Commodore name is owned by a company in the Netherlands and that he has full exclusive right to use the Commodore name and logo. This has been arranged through said company. Fully willing to show me proof of this licensing.
* Has license to use the Amiga name and logos (boing ball, checkmark, etc) for all products. Does NOT have license to use Amiga OS, AmigaOS or derivatives. Also willing to show proof of licensing.
* Has true desire to make real machine for a hobbyist market. Has a design group that has actually designed these cases and boards. In fact, while we were speaking he had put the phone down to take a call from their motherboard manufacturer. I was able to hear his end of the several minute conversation and unless it was a ruse, it's all legitimate.

* Was fully open to my suggestion of supporting development of an x86 MorphOS port. I told him how I felt it was eons beyond AROS and he said he'd love to contribute to a port. How technically feasible this is, I don't know. But after having spoken to some experienced OS developers I was told that it IS possible, it just depends on how willing you are to work on it.
* Was fully open to committing resources, financial or otherwise, to bringing AROS to the state MorphOS is at in order to create a true modern Amiga not tied to Hyperion. In fact he said that when he tried to get driver development kickstarted he received criticism as if he was some sort of infidel.

Unlike Bill McEwen, Barry Altman is more than willing to converse with  people and answer their questions. I told him I would keep our conversation completely confidential and he told me, "I wish you wouldn't. Please share anything I tell you because I want people to know the truth.". So here I am. Barry seemed to be frustrated by the herd mentality of the forum communities and quite frankly, I am too. Yeah many of us have had ill dealing with the likes of Doomy but Barry has slighted no one. He's trying to make interesting computers with the Commodore name.

Before you light your torches and beat down a path to his door, I'd say communicate with the guy. Offer suggestions, he is extremely open to dialogue with the community if that dialogue is intelligent and insightful.

Lastly, I want to say that I thoroughly enjoyed our conversation and I found Barry Altman to be an intelligent and interesting man to talk to. He was courteous, friendly, and no question was off limits. He was fully willing to answer anything I had for him. Since our conversation was a few days ago I may have an inaccuracy or two so I will be forwarding this post to him so he can correct any of my mistakes. Give the guy a chance, I honestly think he's on the level.

Did you research anything you posted??
I did they just rebrand computers here's the real maker..
http://www.cybernetman.com/cart/viewProduct.cfm?productId=2

Invictus
This was was made about 2 years ago by a company in china never sold outside of china..
http://www.gadgetell.com/tech/comment/great-wall-unveils-the-cross-pc-u510-an-all-in-one-keyboard-pc/

Boing ball thats one is still up in the air everything I have looked at points to Hyperion they have the right to OS and the Boing ball...

I found this in about 1 hour of research....

Chris  :laughing:
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Offline WolfToTheMoon

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #112 on: September 20, 2010, 10:50:31 AM »
Quote from: djrikki;579807
You said the same thing on AW after I gave you the link proving the opposite.

Perhaps yet again... selective reading.

http://www.hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=134:hyperion-entertainment-cvba-and-amiga-inc-reach-settlement&catid=38:corporate&Itemid=18

"As part of the settlement agreement, the Amiga Parties acknowledge that Hyperion is the sole owner of AmigaOS 4 without prejudice to any third party rights."


And your link and quote only goes to show that they own only OS4 code. Trademarks they do not own, period.
 

Offline persia

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #113 on: September 20, 2010, 03:25:49 PM »
Hyperion have an exclusive license to the name AmigaOS, Amiga Inc own the name, but essentially have given up the right to actually use it.  The Amiga name belongs to Amiga Inc and they have given an exclusive license to use it to CommodoreUSA, so essentially Amiga Inc cannot produce an operating system or a computer.  But since they never actually produced either of these in the past, it shouldn't be a problem....
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Offline djrikki

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #114 on: September 20, 2010, 04:00:50 PM »
Quote from: persia;580375
Hyperion have an exclusive license to the name AmigaOS, Amiga Inc own the name, but essentially have given up the right to actually use it.  The Amiga name belongs to Amiga Inc and they have given an exclusive license to use it to CommodoreUSA, so essentially Amiga Inc cannot produce an operating system or a computer.  But since they never actually produced either of these in the past, it shouldn't be a problem....


"Hyperion have an exclusive RIGHT..."

Once again why do people feel the need to edit the original wording.  A 'license' is different to a 'right'.

Essentially Hyperion won the right to use AmigaOS (etc...), Amiga Inc didn't 'give it up' - it was taken from them in a court of law.  The rest of your paragraph is correct. :rtfm:

Offline KThunder

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #115 on: September 20, 2010, 04:02:42 PM »
Quote from: Golem!dk;579731
And this would be based on? pure speculation?


well since Dammy said "He could be getting Chinese financing."  emphesis on "he could be" yeay it would be based on speculation.

Given Barry's existing company I think it more likely he is financing this himself.

      We have hoped for years that a company would put time and money into anything amiga or commodore related and then we rip anyone apart who actually does so.

Honestly it is easier with barry compared to tulip or others who had their affairs more in order. but still geeze. If I had any aspirations to build hardware I would not build it for the commodore or at least Amiga crowd.

we are freaking rabid...
Oh yeah?!?
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Offline WolfToTheMoon

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #116 on: September 20, 2010, 04:51:28 PM »
Quote from: djrikki;580387
"Hyperion have an exclusive RIGHT..."

Once again why do people feel the need to edit the original wording.  A 'license' is different to a 'right'.

Essentially Hyperion won the right to use AmigaOS (etc...), Amiga Inc didn't 'give it up' - it was taken from them in a court of law.  The rest of your paragraph is correct. :rtfm:

AmigaOS is still Amiga Inc.'s trademark, they just cannot use it while Hyperion is using it.  Amiga did gave it up, they settled.
 

Offline Argo

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #117 on: September 20, 2010, 05:41:44 PM »
Quote from: WolfToTheMoon;580345
And your link and quote only goes to show that they own only OS4 code. Trademarks they do not own, period.


Right, They don't. Amiga, Inc. ended the court battle with a settlement worked out and agreed to by Hyperion. Amiga, Inc. recognizes Hyperion as the sole owners of AmigaOS 4 and gave they the sole exclusive right to use AOS 3.1. Plus gave Hyperion sole use of the trademark "AmigaOS" and other associated trademarks, like the boing ball.  Problem is, basically those Amiga OS associated trademarks are also Amiga associated trademarks. As are Amiga OS and Amiga, the words.

Licensing the trademark "Amiga" to a third party could be legally seen as diluting the settlement agreement with Hyperion. Not to mention damage to Hyperion's market by causing confusion in the marketplace due to the extreme similarity in the trademarks.

Who should be sued? Why, Amiga, Inc.  

Quote
As part of the settlement agreement, the Amiga Parties acknowledge that Hyperion is the sole owner of AmigaOS 4 without prejudice to any third party rights.

Within the framework of the settlement agreement Hyperion is granted an exclusive, perpetual, worldwide right to AmigaOS 3.1 in order to use, develop, modify, commercialize, distribute and market AmigaOS 4.x (and subsequent versions of AmigaOS including without limitation AmigaOS 5) in any form, on any medium and for any current or future hardware platform under the exclusive trademark “AmigaOS” (Amiga operating system) and using other associated trademarks (such as the “BoingBall” logo).

Hyperion will continue development and distribution of AmigaOS 4.x (and beyond) as it has done since November of 2001.
 

Offline the_leander

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #118 on: September 20, 2010, 06:00:31 PM »
Quote from: Argo;580402
Right, They don't. Amiga, Inc. ended the court battle with a settlement worked out and agreed to by Hyperion. Amiga, Inc. recognizes Hyperion as the sole owners of AmigaOS 4


Oh it's even more messy than that. Hyperion have the right to the binaries of OS4, but the code itself remains the property of the developers who wrote it (this is what happens when you don't pay your developers). This was tested and found to be true when the Frieden brothers successfully sued
Hyperion over the ExecSG code.

 
Quote from: Argo;580402

Licensing the trademark "Amiga" to a third party could be legally seen as diluting the settlement agreement with Hyperion. Not to mention damage to Hyperion's market by causing confusion in the marketplace due to the extreme similarity in the trademarks.


Hyperion could try, but tbh given the boneheaded moves they've pulled over the past 10 years, it'd be hard to prove damage to the market that wasn't down to Hyperion themselves.

Consider how well they've not done - in less than a month a guy selling re-branded Chinese zpc's has managed to garner more media attention than Hyperion has in the whole time they've been "developing" OS4.

Quote from: Argo;580402

Who should be sued? Why, Amiga, Inc.


Easy target given that they are at the present pretty much bankrupt.
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Offline ChrisUnionNJ

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Re: Commodore USA
« Reply #119 on: September 20, 2010, 09:21:30 PM »
Quote from: KThunder;580389
We have hoped for years that a company would put time and money into anything amiga or commodore related and then we rip anyone apart who actually does so.


we are freaking rabid...

This is the whole point CommodoreUSA is not helping the Commodore or the Amiga community's just playing on the name they create nothing just rebrand
computers.. :furious:
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