Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: minator on January 24, 2011, 10:13:03 PM
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I am seriously considering selling the Walker.
In case you don't know it is this machine:
http://www.blachford.info/computer/walker/walker.html
The Walker is the very last of the classic machines, it is a prototype made 15 years ago during the Amiga Technologies years.
This is pretty much the ultimate collectable Amiga, the only Amiga with the "Toni" custom chip (FPGA actually) and Kickstart/Workbench 3.2.
I bought it because I wanted to ensure it'd be looked after. It's got a very flimsy case and it'll easily break. I also got it for it's rarity value - there are only 2 Walkers in existence.
The case is still in the condition I got it in but as far as I'm aware it *probably* does not work any more. That said when it did work it didn't work very well - it was damn near impossible to get it to boot and it's slow and temperamental when it did. It can't access the floppy or CD so getting data in or out requires dismantling it! It is however a prototype so this is only to be expected.
Even if it would boot the boot drive is currently unbootable after Windows wrote over the RDB. I do have instruction on how to fix this but never got around to doing it. I do have a copy of the data from the HD though.
It's nice to have but I don't do anything with it, I'm not really a collector so it's not that important for me to own. OTOH I know it's worth quite a bit and I happen to be currently eyeing up an Alesis Andromeda synth.
So, I'm thinking of selling it. I'll most likely put it on eBay but I thought I'd let you lot know first.
IF I sell it it will be *collect only*, Posting it anywhere is likely to destroy the case unless it's packed very, very carefully. I bought it to protect it remember!
...that said I live very close to a train station which goes directly to the London Euro star terminal.
So, anyone interested? or have an Andromeda they'd like to swap...
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keep it!!! it'll get destroyed if u sell it mate.
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get the andromeda as well though!! nice bit of kit!!
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Someone like Trevor Dickinson might be interested, you'll know it will be preserved and not sold on.
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Why do I get the feeling I'm going be in a bidding war with tever :)
I would like to own that bit of Amiga history. Its a shame that it was never produce, even if it looked weird I liked it.
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Placed one Sam Board and you will have one New Walker!
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I would be interested :D
Dunno what a Walker is worth (like you say they dont exactly come up much) but it would go great next to my CDTV prototype and CDTV CR :)
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I would be interested :D
Dunno what a Walker is worth (like you say they dont exactly come up much) but it would go great next to my CDTV prototype and CDTV CR :)
The Walker is simply priceless. With the present audience included, who knows where it will end up.
With only two around and the stuff of legends, I could easily see 5 or more figures.
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I havent seen a "rare" amiga get more than £500, including the Amiga Nyx that Haynie tried (and failed) to sell on ebay so I think five figures is a bit high but it would be interesting to see! ( I paid four figures for my current A4KT setup with all the upgrades, £2K plus yet the CDTV CR was super cheap!)
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I havent seen a "rare" amiga get more than £500, including the Amiga Nyx that Haynie tried (and failed) to sell on ebay so I think five figures is a bit high but it would be interesting to see! ( I paid four figures for my current A4KT setup with all the upgrades, £2K plus yet the CDTV CR was super cheap!)
That A1000 the kid in Washington bought of CL went for more than 1200 dollars on ebay.
EDIT: Of course, that is probably around GBP500 :(
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Why don't you sell it to the community. Name your price, have the Amiga community buy it and elect people in electronics to develop it.
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minator
Hmm cool kit. I'd be interested in buying it as well... if it was working then you could get big money but in the current condition not as much.. but still ok :) Let us know your desired price.
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Why don't you sell it to the community. Name your price, have the Amiga community buy it and elect people in electronics to develop it.
Well, the synth Minator is interested in seems to be in the $3000-$4000 range on eBay and he's proposed a swap for the synth on the offchance someone here has one, so that might be a starting point...
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Well, the synth Minator is interested in seems to be in the $3000-$4000 range on eBay and he's proposed a swap for the synth on the offchance someone here has one, so that might be a starting point...
Even if he allowed the circuit board to be photographed then it would do the Amiga community a good service.
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This is pretty much the ultimate collectable Amiga, the only Amiga with the "Toni" custom chip (FPGA actually) and Kickstart/Workbench 3.2.
Out of curiosity was was Toni, what did it do?
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Ebay it, it'll give you a nice chunk of change. Possibly could break £10K if the right bidders are around. It's a one of a kind collectable.
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It belongs in a museum!
Actually, come to think of it, maybe that's not such a bad idea: http://www.computerhistory.org
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It'd make a nice addition to any retro-hoover collection... :-)
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Maybe someone is interested in making public:
-a copy of the kicktart roms
-a copy of the workbench 3.2 install
-a WinUAE kind of hardware profile
-documenting it entirely
-fixing what remains to be fixed
-sending it to a computer museum that can adequately exhibit and take care of the machine, so that the entire Amiga community may be able to see it, someday.
I can easily put a $20 donation towards a community goal for something along those lines.
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Hi,
Lets get down to brass tacks, What is the darn price?
I am interested in buying it for the case, I think a new MSI board with an AMD 6 core processor should bring it right up to date, and don't worry, I will even put win UAE into it, so it can be used as an ultra fast Amiga.
smerf
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Hi,
I am interested in buying it for the case, I think a new MSI board with an AMD 6 core processor should bring it right up to date, and don't worry, I will even put win UAE into it, so it can be used as an ultra fast Amiga.
smerf
Don't Commodore USA make one like that? If not they may soon ;)
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Hi,
Lets get down to brass tacks, What is the darn price?
I am interested in buying it for the case, I think a new MSI board with an AMD 6 core processor should bring it right up to date, and don't worry, I will even put win UAE into it, so it can be used as an ultra fast Amiga.
smerf
i guess the starting price is in the $3000-$4000 range..... good luck bidding.
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Hi,
Lets get down to brass tacks, What is the darn price?
I am interested in buying it for the case, I think a new MSI board with an AMD 6 core processor should bring it right up to date, and don't worry, I will even put win UAE into it, so it can be used as an ultra fast Amiga.
smerf
For gods sake man, you would destroy a part of Amiga history for a case?
Un-be-freckin-lievable!
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I think it'd make an awesome Jello mold. Giant red gelatin Walker with little boing balls suspended in it!
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Please god dont let be sold to someone who would try and do a mod out of it, this is a nearly one of kind prototype it needs a good home where it will be looked after, someone who would be willing to bring it down to an Amiga show once in a while and someone who would really apperichate it...that someone is me...NOW GIVE IT ME...I WANT :rant: I WANT :rant:. :)
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Hi,
Lets get down to brass tacks, What is the darn price?
I am interested in buying it for the case, I think a new MSI board with an AMD 6 core processor should bring it right up to date, and don't worry, I will even put win UAE into it, so it can be used as an ultra fast Amiga.
smerf
Ugh....please no!
But hey, I like that frame the Mona Lisa is in...I could see my snapshots of my pet in that...
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Going to buy some tickets for the next lottery. I would really like this machine. What did you pay for it yourself?
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Maybe someone is interested in making public:
-a copy of the kicktart roms
-a copy of the workbench 3.2 install
-a WinUAE kind of hardware profile
-documenting it entirely
-fixing what remains to be fixed
-sending it to a computer museum that can adequately exhibit and take care of the machine, so that the entire Amiga community may be able to see it, someday.
I can easily put a $20 donation towards a community goal for something along those lines.
I agree with Gulliver. Documenting this is really essential since the physical machine could easily be lost, stolen or destroyed (fire, flood, etc..).
A copy of the Kickstart ROM and Workbench disks would also be very nice for reference. I -personally- would be interested in looking at the Kickstart code to see what subtle changes they made.
As Gulliver pointed out, I'm sure Toni would be interested as well since implementing this in WineUAE is very possible.
Finally, given the fanatical nature of the Amiga community I'm shocked that nobody has this working. I read posts where community members are ashamed to be seen in public because their Buster chip is not at the latest revision and yet this relic sits un-bootable.
I hope that whomever purchases this will actually do something with it towards furthering the Amiga Archives and History. No offense to the OP but there is so much more that could be done than letting sit on a shelf.
Perhaps the Amiga.org community or a group of folks here should pool their money and purchase it?
It would ensure that its properly documented, archives of Kickstart and Workbench could be made, and then an attempt to fix whatever system/boot issues it has could be addressed.
-P
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It would ensure that its properly documented, archives of Kickstart and Workbench could be made, and then an attempt to fix whatever system/boot issues it has could be addressed.
I think its value is solely as a prototype/curiosity. What is there to gain in making it work 100%/reproducing it? It's a 33mhz A1200 compatible system, and an incomplete one at that, probably with some unresolved hurdles.
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I'd love to see a copy of the ROM and SYS:... someone should take a cast of the chassi and make available too for purchase. I'd love to mod an A1200 MoBo + 030 into that chassi... considering there's only 2 out there it'll be the closest most of us whould ever come to owning a Walker.
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Some guy over on EAB (or actually it may have been two separate guys) put together their own Walker case replicas, one of them was looking pretty good.
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The Walker design was ugly then, and it's ugly now. The system inside is interesting, but certainly not revolutionary. It wasn't even evolutionary.
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The Walker design was ugly then, and it's ugly now. The system inside is interesting, but certainly not revolutionary. It wasn't even evolutionary.
Luckily only two were ever made. But then again, two is all it takes to breed!
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walker was just another frantic attempt to do something original carried out by people given not a slightest bit of imagination. it quite resembles the x1k initiative of today.
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walker was just another frantic attempt to do something original carried out by people given not a slightest bit of imagination. it quite resembles the x1k initiative of today.
I can't believe you guys are complaining about the walker! Remember, this was in 1996. At least SOMEONE was seriously attempting to revive the Amiga with new hardware while there was still a chance, given that it had only been three years since Commodore had gone under.
You expected a small design team to come up with something revolutionary? At least they were trying to get something slightly updated (new WB, PCI slots) back to the market in order to make money and THEN do R&D on new systems.
In 1996 a 68030 was still a reasonable, middle of the road system for home use. A good market to go after when you are starting up. Not bad when you consider the competition was the Intel 486.
Frankly, I would have much rather have seen the Walker come to market rather than the way things played out.
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Even if he allowed the circuit board to be photographed then it would do the Amiga community a good service.
Ahem - How many years ago did I post this?
http://www.blachford.info/computer/walker/walker_inside.html
Well, the synth Minator is interested in seems to be in the $3000-$4000 range on eBay and he's proposed a swap for the synth on the offchance someone here has one, so that might be a starting point...
What I'd like and what I get are often two different things!
Anyway, the price is ...whatever it goes for! I haven't set one.
BTW I'd also swap it for a CS80 ;-)
Out of curiosity was was Toni, what did it do?
I think it's a memory controller.
It belongs in a museum!
I'm inclined to agree. Whoever gets it could always loan it to a museum.
I am interested in buying it for the case, I think a new MSI board with an AMD 6 core processor should bring it right up to date, and don't worry, I will even put win UAE into it, so it can be used as an ultra fast Amiga.
The idea of someone buying it and putting another board in it absolutely horrifies me.
You just don't do that to old very rare machines!
That said, it's a prototype. There are no mounting points for anything and you'd have to cut holes in the back to put cables through .
What did you pay for it yourself?
I'll say after :) It was something of a bargain. I got it at the Thendic-France bankruptcy auction.
I think its value is solely as a prototype/curiosity. What is there to gain in making it work 100%/reproducing it? It's a 33mhz A1200 compatible system, and an incomplete one at that, probably with some unresolved hurdles.
Correct. It's a prototype. Given the number of patch wires on the board I suspect it would of needed quite a bit more work before putting it into production.
Some guy over on EAB (or actually it may have been two separate guys) put together their own Walker case replicas, one of them was looking pretty good.
Yes. That looked amazing! It's probably better made than the real thing.
If you wanted a Walker case that's the way to do it.
Walker was just another frantic attempt to do something original carried out by people given not a slightest bit of imagination
I don't agree at all. AT were pushing towards moving to PPC and the Walker was an intermediate step to update the range before the PowerPC machines were ready.
Certainly *nobody* was doing cases like that in 1995. It was all beige boxes back then - even from Apple!
Unfortunately the case if anything was too imaginative, if AT had continued it would have been sold in a different case.
BTW Apparently I haven't read my own pages in a long time - it did read from the floppy when it worked.
I tried to fire it up last night but it wasn't playing ball. It may be the capacitors have gone or something like that but it needs someone qualified to look at it.
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That case build project was started by me, but I decided it was going to be just too difficult to do, but another user salax52 got pritty far with project.
Original thread here: http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=48069
At the same time I got into google sketchup and made a 3d version of the case http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=bbdd531f7e373cbb8e729875f416f9e1
And I also have my own little web page on the Walker
http://www.vincentperkins.com/AmigaNG/walker.php (remember early beta of my site so spelling, grammar and further information is yet be added)
Just to prove that I have had more than a passing interest in this machine.
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Quick update:
Looks like there are some interested collectors here so I'll probably list it on ebay in the next few days.
There will be a reserve price, probably around £250 (I never said I wanted thousands!)
As mentioned on the first post of this thread it will be *collect only*. It is very fragile so I am not posting it anywhere. That said I'm a 10 minute walk from a well connected train station - I can get to London in just over an hour and Paris in 4-5 hours.
The full package will include:
The Walker.
A painted Amiga keyboard (German I think).
A non functional black Amiga branded mouse (it never worked).
An Amiga branded M1438S CRT monitor.
Regarding it's functional status:
I've been trying to get it to boot and it's being temperamental as ever. It does power up but it's not going into the boot sequence, but is getting confused sometimes and goes into a reset cycle. This is actually not unusual, it always used to do this. It *might* actually still be working and I just haven't been patient enough.
If you fix the RDB on the HD and sit pressing reset and/or random keys for an hour you might get lucky!
I have consequently changed the status in the first post to "probably not working".
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I've taken a few pictures and I took a few more to get some measurements.
I will be keeping the Walker web site going so maybe I'll post them some year.
BTW According to my web stats lots of people have visited the walker site in the last couple of days. Disappointingly >80% are running Windows and if there are Amigas they're not even showing up in the stats!
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Still trying to get her to try and boot (it should display a guru like message) but no luck yet.
I did discover the keyboard probably wasn't connecting so I made sure it did and indeed the caps lock light did light up - you need to be an engineer to get this thing to do anything!
I might get the PSU checked out, it's a standard PC supply but maybe it's gone. Who knows.
I took it to an ANT meeting a couple of years back and it did go into the boot sequence and display the guruesq message once so I'm hoping I can get it to do that again.
Even if I can talk in into working, this isn't a machine you'd ever want to use as a desktop - it's far too unstable.
The fact you need to dismantle it just to power it up doesn't help!
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Hi,
So now you see, by me replacing that old shoddy intermittent board with a new MSI board and a new AMD 6 core processor, I would be doing it a favor for now it would boot up everytime.
and
What is a few new holes in the case to have a working Walker emulated by winUAE.
smerf
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I have seen and handled this Walker.
It is a very interesting bit of tech and as a 90's design statement it is priceless.
As Nicholas says, the case is very fragile.
I captured a short video at the ANT meeting last year,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gI2gSEZSPfg
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OK, an update:
I'm still thinking of selling it but it might be a while yet:
I'm going to try a bit more to get her working. I'll see if I can get the HD RDB fixed as well - I have instructions for this but don't know if they'll work on a PC.
I've been asked a few times to save Kickstart / Workbench 3.2. I have a copy of the data on the disc but I'll see about getting the ROMs dumped as well.
I am also now considering opening up the sale to international folks.
I think I have figured out a way to get it transported without destroying the case. It involves dismantling it and putting the bits into a wooden box full of bubble wrap or polystyrene bits. It'll be expensive to ship but should be transportable to pretty much anywhere then.
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@minator
What's international to you?
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Are you thinking of buying it Persia?? Would be great to see the Walker on our shores!!!
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Agreed, make detailed documentation on the thing before you sell it - measurements of the case, pics, etc.
I made a Walker-ish clone case a year or two back for my SAM, but never having seen the thing IRL and no measurements to go off, my version is likely way off dimensionally.
Thing needs to go to a good home, or a museum!
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Would like to see a picture of your effort Duce.
PS: Did you ever visit his web site?
http://www.blachford.info/computer/walker/walker.html
its got the sizes already
- Width 26 cm
- Depth 37 cm
- Height 28.5 cm (total)
- Height Bottom section (not including feet) 6.5 cm
- Height Top section (to highest point) 20 cm
- Height Top section (Front face only 17 cm
- Height Feet (bottom of foot to bottom of case) 2 cm
- Width Feet (at bottom) 3.5 cm
- Depth Feet (where they meet bottom of case) ~2.3 cm
- Height lower Feet (bottom of foot to bottom of case) 2 cm
PPS: dont open it up to international buyers, it will make it hard for me to get it :laughing:
You knows what been even harder to judge the sizes off the AmigaMCC I currently working on, anyone know what ever happened to that prototype case?
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Walker has Workbench 3.2 and 3.2 rom.
What is difference between 3.1 and 3.2 Workbench???
Would I get any benefits to using workbench 3.2??
Has anyone looked inside of walker rom??
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In 1996 a 68030 was still a reasonable, middle of the road system for home use. A good market to go after when you are starting up. Not bad when you consider the competition was the Intel 486.
Dude, in 1996 I was already upgrading my PC from a Pentium 90 to a Cyrix 6x86 P166+. Both the 68030 and Intel 80486 were already far obsolete.
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@MelbourneBen
It's tempting, I must admit. Depends how much over £250 he wants. Wonder how much it weighs?
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Weight? Not sure but it's not very heavy. But to ship it that far will will require a crate and that will up the weight a lot.
OTOH I'll not include the monitor - it's a CRT so is heavy.
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There are measurements on the web site but I didn't describe them very well. However, I took some pictures the other night with a ruler included to get better measurements :-)
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@minator: Looking forward to the extra pictures you got!
If you remember, i'm the one who started building the "replica" over at eab. :)
I trully hope this goes to loving hands; if only the darn crisis wouldn't have hit us.... :( i'd surely try buying it from you!
Just a small favor, try telling the potential buyer to not disappear, and release any more details possible for the rest of us.
Thanks!
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@Persia
I reacon it'll go for more than 250 pounds, my guess would be around 400. Then you'd have to consider postage which I'm guessing would cost between 50 and 100 pounds.
I'd love to get hold of it myself but I just can't justify the cost for a machine that doesn't actually function.
I'd also be very interested too see the contents of the 3.2 rom.
It will be interesting to see what happens ;-)
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@Persia
I reacon it'll go for more than 250 pounds, my guess would be around 400.
This will sell for a lot more than £400.
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This will sell for a lot more than £400.
I certainly hope so :-D
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So what ended up happening with this being put up for sale?
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So what ended up happening with this being put up for sale?
I decided to hold off for a while. I wanted to try and get it working again and salvage the ROM.
I've been busy so haven't been able to get it going again. However the ROM has been salvaged and it'll hopefully be available to everyone in the future.
I'll be busy for a while yet so it may be another month or so before I do anything with it.
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Thanks for taking the time to get the ROM image. It will be interesting to hear from people who have a poke around with it.
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OK, an update:
I'm still thinking of selling it but it might be a while yet:
I'm going to try a bit more to get her working. I'll see if I can get the HD RDB fixed as well - I have instructions for this but don't know if they'll work on a PC.
I've been asked a few times to save Kickstart / Workbench 3.2. I have a copy of the data on the disc but I'll see about getting the ROMs dumped as well.
I am also now considering opening up the sale to international folks.
I think I have figured out a way to get it transported without destroying the case. It involves dismantling it and putting the bits into a wooden box full of bubble wrap or polystyrene bits. It'll be expensive to ship but should be transportable to pretty much anywhere then.
I cant promise money, but I can promise the best possible service.
On A1k.org are a lot of professionals with electronic background.
If you like the idea we can also talk about loan and we can try to reactivate it.
Just an idea ...
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Can I imagine someone updating UAE to emulate the Walker?
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Can I imagine someone updating UAE to emulate the Walker?
You can imagine anything you want! :lol: Seriously, that would be pretty neat; I'm just feeling punchy today.
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I am just wondering... I am no way interested in old junk. But we do have a computer museum here in Jyväskylä in Finland. There is no centralized place but static exhibitions are in local universities anyone can visit. If anything I could probably try to arrange a place for this machine there.
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Can I imagine someone updating UAE to emulate the Walker?
You can imagine anything you want! :lol: Seriously, that would be pretty neat; I'm just feeling punchy today.
Be careful what you wish for ;-)
IIRC 3.2 is just a modified 3.1. While there may be technical issues getting it to work (memory map changes) it should be functionally the same as a 3.1 68030 based A1200.
To get an accurate emulation would be more difficult, because it wasn't finished it actually ran quite slowly and the timing was all screwed up. Then there's the fact it took about five minutes of pressing reset and randomly hitting keys before it booted in the first place...
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I am just wondering... I am no way interested in old junk. But we do have a computer museum here in Jyväskylä in Finland. There is no centralized place but static exhibitions are in local universities anyone can visit. If anything I could probably try to arrange a place for this machine there.
Thanks for the offer but Finland is a bit far!
That said, I'm no longer planning on using it to raise money any more so actually museum is a quite good option and the British computing museum is not that far away...
Video about the place here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Sw15F2QzMQ&fmt=18
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Thanks for the offer but Finland is a bit far!
That said, I'm no longer planning on using it to raise money any more so actually museum is a quite good option and the British computing museum is not that far away...
Video about the place here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Sw15F2QzMQ&fmt=18
Nope, it is just the UK which is far far away from everything :-P
Anyway the museum is the best place for Walker. If it booted it still wouldnt function properly and there is nothing to see anyway.