Amiga.org
Operating System Specific Discussions => MorphOS => MorphOS -- Application questions and support => Topic started by: amigasociety on July 21, 2010, 01:03:30 AM
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So, curious how MorphOS license works in that today, if I have MorphOS on one system, decide to upgrade to a better system, can I move the license to the new system and kill it from the old?
tj
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So, curious how MorphOS license works in that today, if I have MorphOS on one system, decide to upgrade to a better system, can I move the license to the new system and kill it from the old?
tj
No. There is no way to warrant that the license really got destroyed. One maschine - one license.
If your reg'ed maschine breaks and you can provide evidence for that you get a new keyfile issued for free.
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Only if you axe the old system and send the remaining pieces to the morphos team as evidence.
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Hmmm. Sounds like an odd policy. People update computers all the time. My plan was to try it out on Mac Mini 1.25GHz until I can score an 1.5GHz model but sounds like that will not work. Even had thoughts of finding a Pegasos II. Bummer! Sounds like a $111 gamble to me that I will have to think about now. Wonder what proof they need that a computer died and you now have a replacement?
tj
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It's free to download and try, 30 minutes at a time before it slows down to encourage you to purchase.
It also boots quickly.
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Hmmm. Sounds like an odd policy. People update computers all the time.
Not in amiga land, and it shows.
My plan was to try it out on Mac Mini 1.25GHz until I can score an 1.5GHz model but sounds like that will not work. Even had thoughts of finding a Pegasos II. Bummer! Sounds like a $111 gamble to me that I will have to think about now.
You can still try it out for 30 minutes at a time, which usually plenty since you'll need to reboot long before that anyways if you try out old Amiga software on it.
Wonder what proof they need that a computer died and you now have a replacement?
I can think of a few things, but mentioning them would probably have the moderators here go bananas... and I dont mean :banana: :laughing:
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I wouldn't use that axe, have mercy on Mac/Peg and sell it to the next user with the license fee added and you get next license covered!
Hmmm. Sounds like an odd policy. People update computers all the time.
There's similar things elsewhere too. You can't use OEM Windows on other computers and transferring is limited too. I wouldn't like some kind of network identification they use.. what would happen when there isn't services available anymore etc. It is better to tie hardware itself, so you can reinstall the system as many times you want etc. For this small market it is understable that keyfiles are controlled to prevent illegal copying... of course it makes things bit harder for multiple computer users, but free copying would hurt the sales too much.
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Maybe they should offer a multi-computer license option so you can get #2 and #3 cheaper being a loyal customer. tj
I wouldn't use that axe, have mercy on Mac/Peg and sell it to the next user with the license fee added and you get next license covered!
There's similar things elsewhere too. You can't use OEM Windows on other computers and transferring is limited too. I wouldn't like some kind of network identification they use.. what would happen when there isn't services available anymore etc. It is better to tie hardware itself, so you can reinstall the system as many times you want etc. For this small market it is understable that keyfiles are controlled to prevent illegal copying... of course it makes things bit harder for multiple computer users, but free copying would hurt the sales too much.
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well, in the end they can offer whatever license terms they want, and those will either be acceptable or unacceptable to the end user.
Given that nothing is around forever, I'll pass on a scheme like this, but if you are used to windows, its basically no worse (and a lot cheaper)
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To be honest I just bought the licence after using MorphOS for two days for two reasons.
1) The 30 min thing was getting mighty annopying
2) £98 is not a lot to show support for so much hard work
I am finding it a learnign curve, because got so used to Windows and linux.
Must say OSX has some nice touches. Like it when you open up a cd and the window has a background. Like the warcradt III cds :)
And I like the disk image installing way of just drag and drop.
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well, in the end they can offer whatever license terms they want, and those will either be acceptable or unacceptable to the end user.
Given that nothing is around forever, I'll pass on a scheme like this, but if you are used to windows, its basically no worse (and a lot cheaper)
And one of the major reasons why I haven't bought MorphOS. Point rifle at foot, aim, FIRE!
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This has been asked a endless amount of time now.
still the same response, if your hardware dies you can transfer your license.
people keep complaining about the way the license works. But keep forgetting how much work the MorphOS devs have invested in the OS. I think they are more then worth the price of the OS. They are worth all support they can get.
Most other ways of licensing would destroy MorphOS, many people are cheepskates and would not pay if a cracked version was obtainable.
So im fine with the way it works now, the 30min limit is enough to get a good feel of the OS and learn to use it a bit.
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I wouldn't use that axe, have mercy on Mac/Peg and sell it to the next user with the license fee added and you get next license covered!
Yeah, that's the best way to go, to resell it and bake the license fee into the price...
But to only "try it out", you will actually come a very far way by the $0.00 unrestricted 30-minute demo mode. You can do *a lot* of things during 30 minutes, and then you reboot it very fast for another 30 minutes, and then another, and another...
There's similar things elsewhere too. You can't use OEM Windows on other computers and transferring is limited too. I wouldn't like some kind of network identification they use.. what would happen when there isn't services available anymore etc. It is better to tie hardware itself, so you can reinstall the system as many times you want etc. For this small market it is understable that keyfiles are controlled to prevent illegal copying... of course it makes things bit harder for multiple computer users, but free copying would hurt the sales too much.
Indeed the licensing scheme has been the subject of heavy debates in the past, and I haven't been the greatest supporter myself. But it has grown on me since then, and I recently bought my second license (this time for my Mac Mini).
Basically, we have seen two philosophies used by the OS4 and MorphOS teams when trying to protect their OS from piracy:
The first one is to release the OS in a version that at least seemingly is untied to individual machines, like the OS4 team did. But then there is always great worry about piracy. I mean, what if someone uploads the contents to piratebay? The way to reduce this risk (not eliminate) has this far been:
1) To avoid using the Internet as a distribution channel, and use physical CD's sent by snail mail instead.
2) To charge money for the physical CD upfront (in advance), and *not* a registration/keyfile fee after the user tried it out
3) To release *not* a unified version, but separate CD's locked down for separate HW platforms.
4) To mainly focus on HW "specially built" for the OS.
5) To tie OS/HW distribution together, i.e. to "force" a bundle of the above mentioned "specially built" HW, so that you can't buy the HW without buying an OS4 license at the same time.
6) To release any digitally distributed updates behind password protected walls, only accessible by approved/registered users.
The effect of "the OS4 way":
1) You'll have to wait for traditional mail order and shipment (often international and perhaps even overseas, depending on where you live) until you can even boot up the OS for the first time
2) You'll have no idea of what you really are buying into, since you had no chance of trying it out before you did. If you find it too unstable, too unfinished, too limited, or not to your taste for whatever reason, then it's too late to change your mind, since you have already paid the money.
3) You *can't* take the Sam 440 CD and install it on your newly purchased Pegasos 2 (regarding the topic of this thread; 'paying once, and later moving the OS to a newer system' illusion), but you'll have to buy a second CD for the Pegasos 2.
4) Extremely low production series of the HW and extreme system costs of €1000-€3000 for hardware that's greatly sub-standard by any 2010 measurements. Quite a lot of money, especially for new users wanting to try it out, and especially if they don't like what they see.
5) If you have bought 2 or more Sam 440 systems, you will *still* have ended up paying for 2 or more OS4 licenses, no difference to MorphOS there...
6) Relatively more hazzle when updating, and when reselling the system, since you would have to change registration data (I assume that this *is* possible?).
7) You are *still* not safe from piracy! (*Evidently*)
The second one is to take a more open approach, aim as wide as possible, and release the full version of the OS completely for free, completely in the open, but to tie registration/keyfile to individual machines, like the MorphOS team did:
1) To *take advantage* of the Internet as a distribution channel (http://morphos-team.net/downloads.html), instead of looking at it as a piracy threat
2) To release the full, unlimited, but time restricted OS to the public, and only charge money for the registration/keyfile, *after* the user tried it out, but tie the keyfile to the individual machine from which the OS gets registered.
3) To release a unified OS version (or at least make it all freely available in the same fashion (I'm thinking of the separate Efika version due to special requirements))
4) To mainly focus on HW that's as powerful, cheap and widely available as possible
5) To keep OS distribution/purchase separated from HW distribution/purchase
6) To release any updates and additional files in the same open, unprotected manner as the OS itself
The effect of "the MorphOS way":
1) The OS gets as widely distributed as possible, without any hazzle, and is instantly available to anyone wanting to try it out the same moment they think of it
2) While the keyfile gets tied to one particular machine, you'll know *exactly* what you are buying, no secrecy or surprises, since you had all the opportunity in the world to fully try it out before hand. If you decide you want it, you buy it. If you don't, you'll have ended up paying exactly $0.00 for the OS.
3) Less hazzle, just put the same CD into whatever supported HW you want to install it on, and off you go.
4) True mass market hardware now in the second hand market warrants for really low total system costs (even considering OS registration). While the hardware is sub-standard by any 2010 desktop measurements, it's at least cheap, safe, and the most powerful HW available to MorphOS in its current PPC version. And *lot's* of people can easily try MorphOS if they are the slightest curious!
5) Get the supported HW (or access to it if you merely want to try it out) in the most convenient way you want/can (it's up to you). Download the OS separately, and off you go.
6) Less hazzle, just download any updates and off you go!
7) Pirate bay? Why bother, when it's freely available from the MorphOS Team's web page anyway? Just another shopping window (http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4909704/MorphOS_v2.2_%28scuba-doo%29) for more potential users, I guess (note that he's not seeding any more, but indeed just points to the official DL site)...
When looking at the big picture this way, "the MorphOS way" has really grown on me. I think this is the long term winning philosophy, because of the above mentioned "effects". Only time will tell I guess...
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And one of the major reasons why I haven't bought MorphOS. Point rifle at foot, aim, FIRE!
If you weight in *all* aspects like above, you'll indeed see that there are bottom line pro's and con's with both license- and distribution philosophies.
In the end it comes down to personal preferences, nothing more. The above con's of the OS4 way sums up why I would never even consider OS4 as it currently stands...
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I'd have more than a mild interest in MorphOS if there was the possibility to buy multiple licenses at a discount rate.
Old machines die all the time, and many people have more than one of 'em.
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6) Relatively more hazzle when updating, and when reselling the system, since you would have to change registration data (I assume that this *is* possible?).
This is actually pretty easy for OS4. You can "unregister" your copy through Hyperion's site and the new owner can then re-register it with the same code as if it were a new copy.
With a second-hand MorphOS machine, you'll have full functionality and upgradability out of the box, but you'll need some manual intervention from the Dev Team to put the keyfile in your name.
Six of one, half-dozen of the other. Not sure what's better in this respect.
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The question for me is this:
When Genesi cease trading or lose interest, and your machine dies, what do you do then? Seems to me you have a pretty doorstop.
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When Genesi cease trading or lose interest, and your machine dies, what do you do then? Seems to me you have a pretty doorstop.
Genesi has absolutely nothing to do with MorphOS licensing.
If the MorphOS Team would for some reason totally quit some day (I don't see that happening anytime soon) I'd imagine we'd release the MorphOS free for all then.
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If the MorphOS Team would for some reason totally quit some day ...
Don't even say that :(
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You can still try it out for 30 minutes at a time, which usually plenty since you'll need to reboot long before that anyways if you try out old Amiga software on it.
I think I know what you wnat to say, but let me tell you that I had only a single freeze since the 2.5 release yet. But I am not testing old Amiga apps anymore, my system is balanced since a couple of years...
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What's the issue with the old Amigs software running on it? Is it unstable?
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What's the issue with the old Amigs software running on it? Is it unstable?
No issue really, except when you try some old apps. Often it's hard to tell beforehand if some app will play ball or not. If it doesn't you might need to reboot.
While most apps don't hit the amiga hw directly, some do.
It's fun sport btw... trying to find the oldest apps that run ok. I've ran some from 86 or so. :)
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What's the issue with the old Amigs software running on it? Is it unstable?
It isn't generally unstable, but software hitting the Amiga custom chips direclty may cause a crash. It ain't a big deal and I run several older softwares on my MorphOS systems and, as said already, had only a single freeze since the 2.5 release on my Mac mini.
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Cool. Currently keeping my eyes open for a 1.5GHz Mini to try Morph on.
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Genesi has absolutely nothing to do with MorphOS licensing.
Some times I wonder how some people managed to live under a rock during the last *6+ years*, but over time I've learned to never get surprised by stuff like this... ;)
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It's fun sport btw... trying to find the oldest apps that run ok. I've ran some from 86 or so. :)
What, some pre-compiled ANSI C example of "Hello World"?
;)
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If the MorphOS Team would for some reason totally quit some day (I don't see that happening anytime soon) I'd imagine we'd release the MorphOS free for all then.
My guess is two years.
Really, what is left to do with it? In terms of technology, it stagnated years ago and is way behind just about anything, the only really new thing is making it available on new... old... hardware. Like with OS4 there's a handfull of native software, and if you want to explore Amiga software then UAE is just so much better, and typically faster too - and you can upgrade whenever you like.
Back when MorphOS started, I had big hopes for it, but as time has gone and very little has happened in terms of becoming an alternative to for example Linux, I've more or less given it up, for me it's just a glorified emulator that runs on exotic hardware. Many of the "improvements" and things done to "modernize" it are even the opposite of what I want.
But indeed, the number one reason to not register is this OEM wannabe scheme - those who compare it with OEM Windows don't get it - Microsoft does not only offer OEM releases that are locked to one computer, Microsoft offer several licensing scemes and I can pick one that fits me. With MorphOS it is "take it or leave it", and as devs suggest that it will eventually be free anyways, I'll just leave it for now - in a few years it will most likely be free anyways, and I've been following it for almost a decade already, I can always wait a couple of more years. But perhaps Laire decides to never release it for free, ever - noone knows.
If there was a license I could buy that would allow me to run it limitless on whatever hardware I see fit, I would buy it, even if it costed twice as much - I buy to own, not to "borrow".
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My guess is two years.
Really, what is left to do with it? In terms of technology, it stagnated years ago and is way behind just about anything, the only really new thing is making it available on new... old... hardware.
AFAIK, You will not find *one single* MorphOS developer who wouldn't sign to the following statements:
1) "If we would have known back then, what we know today about the PPC platform, then we would have chosen differently altogether when it comes to supported architecture."
2) "Since MorphOS *is* built on the PPC platform as of now, the best short term solution is to make *the most use* of all the available, mass produced Mac PPC HW there is!"
3) "There is no *Long Term Future* for MorphOS in the PPC platform, since the PPC platform in a MorphOS context is kind of dead".
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AFAIK, You will not find *one single* MorphOS developer who wouldn't sign to the following statements:
3) "There is no *Long Term Future* for MorphOS in the PPC platform, since the PPC platform in a MorphOS context is kind of dead".
Well then I wonder if it would simply cease to progress or be written to run on other hardware?
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Kolla: here we go again, comparing hobbyist OS to a quite huge product from huge company as Microsoft is...