New iMac

[TheDaddy]

I don't understand how people can't grasp the idea that you can get better results with a PC by paying less money, a lot less. It happens at work as well, it drives me nuts.

The iMac doesn't give you anything special, it's the hardware. The hardware found in an iMac is nothing more than PC hardware and usually the graphics card in a iMac is a cut down version of the PC equivalent.

The iMac has no magic or special sorcery chip inside. I can assemble a much more powerful machine by just buying parts and a decent monitor for a lot less.

For example, when Apple talk of retina display for its phones and computers everyone starts drooling over them when in actual fact my Chinese phone has had a higher pixel density than "Retina" for almost two years. Iphone 6 Plus (2014) = 401 PPI vs my 2012 Chinese phone = 480 PPI.

It seems that brand names still have the desired effect!

Oh and you can't upgrade the bloody things...

The reason why people are attracted to Apple products is the "sex appeal", the aluminium, the "thinness", the all-in-one factor, the "exclusivity" but a properly specced PC smashes an iMac any time.

[TheDaddy]

>>Apple stays in business not for their superior hardware, which quite frankly on the PC end of things is just commodity hardware

No. They are both commodity hardware. It's just that being Apple's products less common they mantain an aura of exclusivity. It's all the marketing and hype built over the years...it's still working although I don't know how much long for. Also Apple have managed to cut themselves a niche market (DTP, Graphic Design) but wanting to do DTP+Graphic Design on any PC+Windows there would be no problem at all at achieving the same results.

>>Owning a Mac is a real smooth ride

Nope. I have 3 at home and they are not a smooth ride at all. I work with about 200 iMacs every day and they are a pain in the neck in a network environment. They freeze often, the multicoloured ball comes up and you can't do much. They are not well supported...I could go on.


>>The hardware and software combined make for a real nice out of the box experience for people not into Windows, and said people are willing to pay the premium for the experience.

True but isn't that much different than with Windows 7.

>>The people I know who buy Mac's buy them because they prefer OSX.  

Good on them...

>>Millions of people a year keep buying Mac's.

Many more millions buy PCs with Windows 7 etc...installed so?


>>This being said, the new 5k display on the iMac is really, really impressive when you use it.

Again...it's made for them by Samsung?!

>>Same goes for iPhone's and iPad's.  The hardware is nothing special, specs wise.  

Correct.

>>The Android apps ecosystem still pales in comparison to the iOS one

True. 88% of Smartphones run Android so you're never going to have a tidy, controlled ecosystem, it's based on Linux after all...

>>I've always found the Apple hate ironic within the Amiga community, really.

Nope. No hate. Just facts.

>>People gripe constantly about overpriced Mac's, but have no qualms about shelling out $3000+ for an X1

A completely different thing. Different economies, different users, different market, apples and oranges indeed.

Freedom of choice...absolutely, it swings both ways though.

[TheDaddy]

But that is because of what I said above...rarity = price increase.
There are only two "competing" Operating Systems for desktop use really: OSX and Windows so why are we comparing Amigas to Apple?

The reason why classic Amigas sell for more it's because of the nostalgia factor. When Commodore was big it had millions of Amiga 4000, 1200, 500 etc... users. People who buy them nowadays are people who know what they are and actively search for them.

Who is going to look for an A1XE or even a SAM? Only the die-hard user who knows what it is.
Also the older the hardware the more appealing it becomes.

Surely you didn't buy a SAM+OS4 as a short term investment did you?

People only know about PC (Windows) and Apple, that is it. The general consumer that is.
And of the two (thanks to its clever marketing/hype/advertising/design and I'll chuck in the OS as well) the iMacs retain more value but that is not to say it's down to the incredible hardware...you can get 5K displays for PCs, I even saw AmigaOS 4 running on a 4K monitor, it looked beautiful...

[TheDaddy]

No links to give you but if you're into building PCs yourself you can do it for the same, less or slightly more but with added advantages like a more powerful graphics card, this all depends on where you shop obviously.

First don't forget that Apple put huge orders in. For example millions of 27" 5k from Samsung (I think it's Samsung that makes the screens for Apple) so they can afford to "give it away" for less when you compare it to a PC builder who has to buy parts from a shop.

But let's say you wanted the Dell 5K 27" Ultrasharp screen which on its own gives the advantage of being a separate screen (not inside the machine) this is, for me, a big plus. This is about £1500. £600 for a motherboard, 8GB DDR3, i5 3.5GHz and an ATI 290x 4GB DDR5 NOT the cut down M version Apple offer on their site with 2GB, 1TB hybrid drive. £2100. This gives you the advantage of upgrading whenever you want, on the iMac you can JUST upgrade the memory yourself anything else and it's a trip to Apple.

[TheDaddy]

>>Which immediately makes this apples v oranges.

No, Apple vs Amiga = apples vs oranges.

I never said a thing about PC manufacturers, I was talking about people who build PCs themselves and if you have that kind of cash you can spec a better PC yourself.
All I am saying is that if I were a PC manufacturer I wouldn't offer those specs as they know that PC gamers would expect to run games at 5k but those specs will not even do 4k at a decent frame rate. That is probably why no PC manufacturer is offering it. Yes if you want to look at pretty pictures, want to have a massive desktop, do DTP, surf the web, fine. But Windows users play games.

Also I like to know that if I want to put a dual (SLI) Titan or future (next 3-6 months) gen card, change the hard drive myself, install 64GB...I can...

The Dell 5K 27" Ultrasharp screen is going to be, other manufacturers will follow so not a huge problem. I can wait and feel no need to jump in to get an iMac...

[TheDaddy]

As I said, I could build you a better specced PC for £2100.

Read my post above, I am talking about PC builders not manufacturers. You can buy the iMac I won't as it can't run games at 5k resolution properly.

[TheDaddy]

@Duce

The iMac has an M290x inside. Can you upgrade it?
I can build you a similar specced machine with the full 290x 4GB for £2100. That is GBP not US dollars by the way...

[TheDaddy]

Post #20 of this thread.

I give up...enjoy the new iMac...

[TheDaddy]

@Duce

It exists, you know it, I know it, Asus are working on 5K monitors. The PC market drives technology forward, it's been like that for years.

The one you're going to build is lovely...let's just say that if you're into building PCs, it's a lot more fun than buying an iMac and no I have no intention of buying a 2k, 4k or 5k...too expensive for me...

[TheDaddy]

>>Re: pc builders, how is the constant upgrade cycle treating you all there?

The constant upgrade is voluntary and not imposed. If I wanted I could also keep running the same medium range PC for as long as I like or decide to put another 32GB of Ram inside my PC to go up to 64GB and add another graphics card in SLI/CROSSFIRE mode.

How do you that on an iMac?

Also software and gaming evolve, 3D software requires more power etc...but it's up to you to decide whether do upgrade or not.

Depending on what you want to do with your machine you upgrade it or not. Some people are running Amigas with stock configurations, some have PowerPC boards and a graphics card...

If I think that Call of Duty Advanced Warfare is worth upgrading my PC, I get a new CPU, more memory and a better graphics card.

http://www.callofduty.com/advancedwarfare/media/discover-your-power

Nobody is telling me to do it...it's up to me.

[TheDaddy]

If it exists please post the link where I can buy it.

Post 47 and 51

You can always make do with one of these in the meantime:

Samsung U28D590 28"

Tear down or not you can't upgrade the graphics card and I would NOT want to open it (removing the glue, taking it apart, upgrade, re-glue it...no way) when it costs £2000.
The minute the 5K monitors hit the shelves price will come down, PC gamers will want to run their new game at 5120×2880 and not just look at static screens.

This is way cooler:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZCla-omFyA

[TheDaddy]

>>Yes, it is quite nice but not exactly 5K.

It would do for a bit...

>>It's an AIO - why would you want to open it? AIO is why you buy it - no clutter on desk.

I answered Duce' tear down. I like opening and upgrading whenever I want that is one of the reasons I would not buy one.

>>I used to build all my PCs from parts in the past but now I just can't be bothered. Upgrades? It usually meant only chassis, kb and mouse survived the process.

Not from my experience. I usually go two to three CPUs up on the same motherboard, double the memory and two to three graphics card upgrades.

If you start at the top end you'll find it difficult to upgrade, it can still be done though.

You can't buy a 5K right now. Apple probably jumped in and ordered Samsung to make a few so they could be first, good call on their part. I'm still going to avoid it...

Got a 24" Intel based iMac (Windows 7 and OSX in dual boot, hardly use OSX), a PPC G5 iMac...in the garage somewhere, I work with them every day and in a network environment they are a pain, they are not for me.

Amiga on the other hand I like...