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Author Topic: MorphOS x86  (Read 14624 times)

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Offline B00tDisk

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2010, 09:29:47 PM »
Quote from: Karlos;562430
And yet in doing so, you'd have to sacrifice one of the much vaunted features of MorphOS, it's compatibility with 68K, WarpOS, PUP, MOS PPC et al.

Unless you go for some sort of rosetta-like PPC JIT for x86, anyway.


That's certainly doable; there's at least two PPC emulation architectures you could draw from to do it (bits of sheepshaver and pearPC), as well as various m68k emulation tools...
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Offline Piru

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2010, 09:40:47 PM »
Quote from: B00tDisk;562431
That's certainly doable; there's at least two PPC emulation architectures you could draw from to do it (bits of sheepshaver and pearPC)

We don't like stealing GPL code.
 

Offline Karlos

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2010, 09:49:39 PM »
Quote from: Piru;562434
We don't like stealing GPL code.


Writing a PPC emulation from scratch would be a fairly large undertaking. Without using any of the GPL code, you could presumably examine how existing GPL examples have been implemented.
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Offline utri007Topic starter

Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #17 on: June 04, 2010, 08:42:43 AM »
Well this thread was actually a test :D

Conclusions are:

1. OS4  and moust of classic users aren't interested to commenting MorphOS
     *But why MorphOS/classic users jump every Amiga OS4 thread to commenting
2. Morph OS users have better knowledge or they don't want to talk nonsense

* MorphOS doesn't arouse feelings like Amiga OS4 for agains or for
* OS4 and classic users aren't simply to interested to comment or knowing about MorphOS
« Last Edit: June 04, 2010, 08:52:44 AM by utri007 »
ACube Sam 440ep Flex 800mhz, 1gb ram and 240gb hd and OS4.1FE
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Offline itix

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2010, 09:45:26 AM »
Quote from: utri007;562807
* OS4 and classic users aren't simply to interested to comment or knowing about MorphOS

You just did ;-)

Edit: And now another classic user commented to MorphOS thread ;-)
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Offline warpdesign

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #19 on: June 04, 2010, 12:11:09 PM »
Quote

We don't like stealing GPL code.

You mean you don't like sharing code ?

There's no stealing involved unless you don't share what's linked with your gpl code...
 

Offline Piru

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #20 on: June 04, 2010, 12:23:36 PM »
@warpdesign

If you have a proprietary product you can't use GPL code for such integral part as CPU emulation. Unless of course you want to make everything GPL. For some that might be an option but for us it is not. If it was LGPL then it could be possible to use it in theory, but with GPL it is not.

And obviously no-one wants another CherryOS...
« Last Edit: June 04, 2010, 12:28:57 PM by Piru »
 

Offline warpdesign

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #21 on: June 04, 2010, 12:33:12 PM »
I understand. And no, we don't want another CherryOS...
 

Offline Fats

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #22 on: June 04, 2010, 07:23:04 PM »
Quote from: Piru;562827
@warpdesign

If you have a proprietary product you can't use GPL code for such integral part as CPU emulation. Unless of course you want to make everything GPL. For some that might be an option but for us it is not. If it was LGPL then it could be possible to use it in theory, but with GPL it is not.

And obviously no-one wants another CherryOS...


It's good to be careful concerning licensing but I think the GPL CPU emulation could be quite isolated from the rest. UAE is also GPL but the ROM and a lot of software running on it are closed source.

greets,
Staf.
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Offline Piru

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2010, 08:48:15 PM »
Quote from: Fats;562884
UAE is also GPL but the ROM and a lot of software running on it are closed source.

That is a completely different situation. Try to take UAE itself and include it as a integral part of a proprietary system, and then tell me it can be done.
 

Offline kolla

Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2010, 08:56:52 PM »
Port MorphOS to Wii and run it under Dolphin.
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Offline Fats

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2010, 11:11:56 AM »
Quote from: Piru;562903
That is a completely different situation. Try to take UAE itself and include it as a integral part of a proprietary system, and then tell me it can be done.


It should be able to be done but depends on how you make UAE an integral part of the whole system. Linux distros are also consisting of a lot of non-GPL code and some even of proprietary code with the GPL kernel an integral part of the system.
Of course if you don't want to open source any of the extensions added to the emulation core itself you won't be able to use GPL code.

greets,
Staf.
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Offline Piru

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2010, 01:07:32 PM »
Quote from: Fats;563011
It should be able to be done but depends on how you make UAE an integral part of the whole system. Linux distros are also consisting of a lot of non-GPL code and some even of proprietary code with the GPL kernel an integral part of the system.

Again that is a completely different situation.
 

Offline Fats

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2010, 03:52:44 PM »
Quote from: Piru;563018
Again that is a completely different situation.


IMO it is similar enough. The linux kernel runs programs and libraries. The CPU emulation layer runs programs and libraries where code is in an alien binary format. As Linux can have an OS running on it that is fully or partly closed source the emulation layer should also be able to do that with clever engineering.
Please explain where the analogy breaks down.
In your opinion, what part of the integrated emulation would force most or whole of MorphOS to be GPLed ?

greets,
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Offline deadwood

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #28 on: June 06, 2010, 04:56:45 PM »
Quote from: Fats;563144
IMO it is similar enough. The linux kernel runs programs and libraries. The CPU emulation layer runs programs and libraries where code is in an alien binary format. As Linux can have an OS running on it that is fully or partly closed source the emulation layer should also be able to do that with clever engineering.
Please explain where the analogy breaks down.
In your opinion, what part of the integrated emulation would force most or whole of MorphOS to be GPLed ?

greets,
Staf.


AFAIK Linux kernel license has a special clause that allows non-GPL code to use it.

"  NOTE! This copyright does *not* cover user programs that use kernel
 services by normal system calls - this is merely considered normal use
 of the kernel, and does *not* fall under the heading of "derived work".
 Also note that the GPL below is copyrighted by the Free Software
 Foundation, but the instance of code that it refers to (the Linux
 kernel) is copyrighted by me and others who actually wrote it."

As for the closed source user applications which link with GPL modules (libraries for example) they are simply doing this agaist the license terms (in my view). If those libs are LGPL than all is ok. (source http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html)
 

Offline Fats

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Re: MorphOS x86
« Reply #29 from previous page: June 07, 2010, 08:09:09 PM »
Quote from: deadwood;563149

"  NOTE! This copyright does *not* cover user programs that use kernel
 services by normal system calls - this is merely considered normal use
 of the kernel, and does *not* fall under the heading of "derived work".
 Also note that the GPL below is copyrighted by the Free Software
 Foundation, but the instance of code that it refers to (the Linux
 kernel) is copyrighted by me and others who actually wrote it."


As UAE does not have this exception is it illegal then?
IMO this note is just a clarification that the user programs that are run on the kernel are not derivative works of the kernel.

Question we want to answer is if you can implement a GPLed emulation layer that from user point of view is integrated in the OS without infecting the whole OS with GPL.
Or to put it in GPLv2
  • terms: can you make a Program that does the emulation of an alien CPU without making the OS a derivative of this emulator? Can you implement it in such a way so that this emulation layer is automatically started when a program wants to run such an alien program and still not make the OS a derivative work from the emulator?


I'm still convinced it is possible and am curious to see what roadblocks other people see.

greets,
Staf.

  • I am not very familiar with the wording of GPLv3.
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