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AuthorTopic: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot (solved) sort of  (Read 2954 times)

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Offline David Wright

Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot (solved) sort of
« on: November 20, 2021, 01:37:22 AM »
It does this no matter if 3.1 roms or 3.2 are installed, or if scsi and ide boot disabled.
Tried different Gotek. Same.
Everything was working before I installed 3.2 so even when going back to 3.1 same results.

.

So, tried two button mouse hold down for early boot. No luck, but would probably come up if I waited real long.
Tried without CF card just to wait for prompt same amount of time.

Floppy cable seem to connect and DF0 Gotek works.
Warp 040 seated well.
No Zorro cards are attached.
Memory shows all is well.
Ran some diagnostics from Gotek and couldn't find any issues.

So what gives?
« Last Edit: December 23, 2021, 02:38:48 AM by David Wright »
 

Offline Pat the Cat

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #1 on: November 20, 2021, 04:24:26 AM »
I think got to be Warp card related, you are not alone;-

https://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=108853

Oh wait, that is you.

One thing I'd try is booting, then updating the file system on the hard drive with HDToolbox.

This will likely nuke the contents of the hard drive, but at least you might get to a shell prompt quicker than 8 minutes.

3,2 is totally different version of everything, including the file system copy on the RDB of the hard drive.

3,2 can need a mandatory clean install from 3.1. 3.1.4 it might be doable, but not 3.1.

« Last Edit: November 20, 2021, 04:31:43 AM by Pat the Cat »
"To recurse is human. To iterate, divine."

A1200, Vanilla, Surf Squirrel, SD Card, KS 3.0/3.z, PCMCIA dev
A500, Vanilla, A570, Rev 5, KS 1.2/1.3 Testbench system
Rasp Pi, UAE4ARM, 3D laser scanner, experimental, hoping for AmigaOS4Arm, based on Watterott Fabscan Pi
 

Offline David Wright

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #2 on: November 20, 2021, 04:36:44 AM »
I’m thinking warp card related also but why would it start now? Keep in mind this does all of this with 3.1 roms also and even without a hd boot. Disconnect all and try to boot with only gotek and does the same. Even the two button hold down takes that long.
 

Offline Pat the Cat

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #3 on: November 20, 2021, 07:24:09 AM »
You have to remember that 3,2 will boot with a 3.1 ROM. :)

It will check the ROM version and try to remap the 3.2 system.

That doesn't explain why it takes so long to start up.

When you say SCSI is disabled, do you mean disconnected or entirely shut down on the Warp?

The Warp ROM startup will always be done before the startup-sequence, so if it is doing a scan of every SCSI address and LUN combination, that will take quite a while to check no SCSI devices are available.

Perhaps a terminator on the SCSI connector would definitely remove the issue.
"To recurse is human. To iterate, divine."

A1200, Vanilla, Surf Squirrel, SD Card, KS 3.0/3.z, PCMCIA dev
A500, Vanilla, A570, Rev 5, KS 1.2/1.3 Testbench system
Rasp Pi, UAE4ARM, 3D laser scanner, experimental, hoping for AmigaOS4Arm, based on Watterott Fabscan Pi
 

Offline Pat the Cat

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2021, 07:40:20 AM »
When I say shutdown on the Warp;-

"autoboot ROM (warpdrive.device) - can be disabled by a jumper"

From;-

http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/warpengine

Manual can be downloaded to check jumper connection (or lack of it).

The manual also uses the word "shunt" for jumper in one case. :)
« Last Edit: November 20, 2021, 07:42:11 AM by Pat the Cat »
"To recurse is human. To iterate, divine."

A1200, Vanilla, Surf Squirrel, SD Card, KS 3.0/3.z, PCMCIA dev
A500, Vanilla, A570, Rev 5, KS 1.2/1.3 Testbench system
Rasp Pi, UAE4ARM, 3D laser scanner, experimental, hoping for AmigaOS4Arm, based on Watterott Fabscan Pi
 

Offline David Wright

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #5 on: November 20, 2021, 03:54:15 PM »
Played with jumpers on warp card. Tried diasbled and with other settings. Nothing changed.
 

Offline kolla

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #6 on: November 20, 2021, 07:07:53 PM »
mmu.library and mmulib/3.2 version of 68040.library installed?

Edit: never mind… I see now.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2021, 07:09:26 PM by kolla »
B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC
---
A3000/060CSPPC+CVPPC/128MB + 256MB BigRAM/Deneb USB
A4000/CS060/Mediator4000Di/Voodoo5/128MB
A1200/Blz1260/IndyAGA/192MB
A1200/Blz1260/64MB
A1200/Blz1230III/32MB
A1200/ACA1221
A600/V600v2/Subway USB
A600/Apollo630/32MB
A600/A6095
CD32/SX32/32MB/Plipbox
CD32/TF328
A500/V500v2
A500/MTec520
CDTV
MiSTer, MiST, FleaFPGAs and original Minimig
Peg1, SAM440 and Mac minis with MorphOS
 

Offline Castellen

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2021, 01:39:54 AM »
While the computer is in the state where nothing is happening for 8 minutes, repeatedly press the caps lock key at least 10 times or more.  If the LED eventually sticks on or off, then it could be something holding the computer in reset state.  I've seen real time clock corrosion damage cause a similar issue before as well, so if there's been previous corrosion damage, remove both U177 and U178 to see if that resolves the delayed booting problem; the computer will boot normally without those ICs, though you'll have no RTC.  Remove U891 if there's signs of corrosion around that; the computer will boot without it, though you'll have no fast memory.

If the caps lock LED reliably turns on and off each time, then the CPU is at least active and suggests that the system is probably waiting for something in software (e.g. scsi.device) as others have alluded to.

Failing that, I can repair your A4000 main board if needed.

http://amiga.serveftp.net
 

Offline David Wright

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2021, 02:33:47 AM »
The caps lock test passed. No issues there.
No need to remove u177 etc. I hope
 

Offline Castellen

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2021, 03:32:57 AM »
No, unlikely to be U177, U891, etc, in that case.  Sounds as though the system is waiting an unusually long time for something if there's valid CPU activity.

If you reduce the system to bare basic, e.g. A3630/A3640 CPU board (with J100/J104 set correctly) and nothing connected except the power supply and monitor; do you get the 'insert disk' screen after about 30 seconds, or does it take 8 minutes?

If the 'insert disk' screen appears after the typical 30 seconds or so, then probably there's an issue with drives as others have already mentioned; you should be able to narrow things down from there.

If the 'insert disk' screen takes 8 minutes to appear with no floppy or hard drives connected, then there's likely some other problem with the main board at a hardware level.  It gets fairly difficult to diagnose yourself from that point.  I use special run-time monitoring equipment for quickly diagnosing that sort of problem to see what's happening with the ROM software, so you can contact me separately if it's looking to be a main board hardware issue that you need repaired.
 

Offline David Wright

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2021, 03:46:06 AM »
If everything is disconnected except gotek, still same time. Even without gotek same.
Eight minutes to get insert disk or with CF card boot. Holding two buttons on mouse same.

This was recapped and one through hole repair last year. (After my poor attempt to do myself)

 

Offline Pat the Cat

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2021, 08:07:47 AM »
Well... if it was checking each LUN of each SCSI address... allowing 4 seconds on each attempt to give the drive a chance to spin up...

... That would be 7 X 16 X 4 seconds, which is spookily close to 8 minutes.

It's not like the Warp SCSI lights up the hard drive activity light while it does that.
"To recurse is human. To iterate, divine."

A1200, Vanilla, Surf Squirrel, SD Card, KS 3.0/3.z, PCMCIA dev
A500, Vanilla, A570, Rev 5, KS 1.2/1.3 Testbench system
Rasp Pi, UAE4ARM, 3D laser scanner, experimental, hoping for AmigaOS4Arm, based on Watterott Fabscan Pi
 

Offline David Wright

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2021, 02:57:03 PM »
Good thinking Pat but my manual says if HJ &K are jumpered no LUN scan will proceed.
Still I played with all of them and nothing. The three terminator pins are in the card.

So frustrating since this configuration has always worked unless something broke or disconnected somehow.
 

Offline TribbleSmasher

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2021, 07:34:06 PM »
Regardless of any other help except 'its probably SCSI' i can at least state that a boot time of eight minutes is certainly some kind of a record... :o
 

Offline David Wright

Re: Amiga 4000 takes eight minutes to boot
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2021, 03:26:38 AM »
Another issue that I just noticed. When finally in workbench mouse movement is jerky and erratic. Two optical mice and one std. tank mouse. Optical work well on other Amigas.
Joystick seems ok but I swear there were issues of function before just thought it was a glitch.

Related? I sure as heck don’t know.