Amiga.org
Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga News and Community Announcements => Amiga Hardware News => Topic started by: System on June 06, 2005, 12:51:46 PM
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Amigaworld has posted their 20 questions with Alan Redhouse on the subject of the future of the AmigaOne motherboard. Fairly straight-forward.
You can read it here (http://amigaworld.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=2339)
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First and foremost, thanks to the guys at Amigaworld and Alan himself for taking the time to assemble the questions and responses.
Personally speaking though, I don't see anything that's surprising. It can (for me) be summed up as follows;
1) The AmigaOne has no future as there's no one left to buy the product. There will be no more new AmigaOne designs.
2) Alan and crew wish they'd never taken the project in the first place. (as stated by the comment that they'd have been better off to pay the A1 owners $500 each than to create the mobo)
3) They are only building motherboards when they want because everything has devolved to "a hobby" and they have no ability to make money from it.
4) Alan apparently blames the dealers for a great deal of the current situation, per the numerous references to "not being paid by the dealers".
5) There are no plans to support the repair issues, as Alan doesn't really (apparently) accept that there ARE any hardware repair issues. The famous UDMA bug isn't a problem, it's your fault for not running "a $3 USB hub".
Curiously missing is any real confirmation of what we all already know (the apparent death of MAI). I know these questions were written months ago, but now, even more questions exist.
In the end, with a great amount of respect and thanks for "sticking it out", it just sounds like they jumped naked into cold deep water (well over their heads) and just couldn't get their business-related ducks in a row fast enough to stop the shrinking Amiga market from falling out from under their feet.
In short -- and strictly in my personal interpretation of this interview -- the days of Eyetech are coming to an end, and the only way that OS4 will survive is to be ported to a supported hardware platform (such as the Mac) the way that Yellow Dog Linux was. I'm all for it.
Wayne
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@wayne
How can you be so sure that MAI is dead?
And how can Hyperion/Amiga Inc. support OS4 on a platform (Mac) when they'd have to hack it to make it work?
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I'm not "sure" of anything. As you conveniently fail to realize, I did say "apparent death", because by all appearances, MAI is dead.
And how can Hyperion/Amiga Inc. support OS4 on a platform (Mac) when they'd have to hack it to make it work?
How does Yellow Dog Linux support their product on a Mac, when they had to hack it to make it work?
It wasn't until after YDL was working that it gained ANY measure of acceptance by Apple themselves. Likewise, if porting AmigaOS4 to the Mac were done and Apple saw that they could sell 2000 additional devices, they'd be ok with that. Hyperion simply couldn't expect Apple's blessing until after they can prove the concept.
Wayne
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I think Wayne has stated the obvious.
We are "Amiga Enthusiasts" nothing more, not now - not ever will we be a thriving market place and more importantly a healthy community.
If this is the negativity from one of the few men that could truly turn around the Amiga spirit then frankly we are doomed to Spectrum/C64 status. Actually I take that back - at least the C64 has new hardware out there at the mo!
I think some of Amiga.org's dedicated viewers will turn off with these answers. In fact with our market dwindling so much I am suprised Alan was even bothered to answer any of the question let alone demonstrate that he see's OS4 as an alternative OS for developing corporate entities.
Roll on AROS. Seems this is the way to go. How can anyone justify purchasing OS4 based on this information.
Good luck Alan. I truly hope your company goes from strength to strength - I mean that. It's just a shame that, maybe un-intentionally, you have driven another nail into the Amiga coffin.
Shame.
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Of course all of this about the Mac is subject to the pending expected announcement today that Apple is going with Intel.
Please note that no one has said that Apple is going x86. Intel might simply start building PPC chips as well, since there is a hell of a lot of competition in the x86 world.
Wayne
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@merl,
Thank you.
We are "Amiga Enthusiasts" nothing more, not now - not ever will we be a thriving market place and more importantly a healthy community.
That's fine, and dandy even. The problem is that there are those who want to demand to treat the AmigaOne (and the Pegasos) as "the potential savior of the universe". If it's a hobby, and if everyone will simply compromise and treat it as such, the idea of getting so upset over things would become much much less prevalent.
It's been confirmed folks, the Amiga is just a hobby. Now that the AmigaOne issue has been officially settled (with Alan's interview) can we please get back to just enjoying the Amigas we have (the classics as well as the AmigaOnes and Pegasos boxes) rather than pretending that everything new is so critically important to the success of the platform?
Just a reminder that the classic Amigas are still here folks. They've just been shoved into the corner by the zealots clamoring for something new. Let's take a step back, get our breath, then get back to what matters, and that is enjoying whatever we've got without all the political stupidity.
Wayne
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its true the main cnet story doesn't say x86...but it has come down since then that it is in fact x86-64, by that I mean, generally reliable sources on the mac sites....
of course, we'll know in a few hours, so no need to jump the gun.
it took me all weekend to grasp that this is probably x86-64, but then again....
upon further examination, this is good news for apple...apple runs on a BSD core, BSD already runs linux apps natively, and os x already supports x server...
in other words, apple is moving in to co-opt the linux market...its not a leap, you have the real linux...and then yuo have this unix variant that can also run linux, and has microsoft office and adobe photoshop and thousands of other programs...one linux having trouble getting to consumers, another company that already sells millions of units per year to consumers....
its not impossible to think that linux and mac os x keep their momentum going (and now combined)...to both's advantage.
where does that leave amiga? no where.
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It's been confirmed folks, the Amiga is just a hobby. Now that the AmigaOne issue has been officially settled (with Alan's interview) can we please get back to just enjoying the Amigas we have (the classics as well as the AmigaOnes and Pegasos boxes) rather than pretending that everything new is so critically important to the success of the platform?
You've basically put it all in perspective with the above part. Amiga is a nice little (and expensive) hobby nowadays, whether it be the AmigaOne, Pegasos, Emulation, or the classic side...and there's nothing wrong with that, of course. :-) It's still very fun. No reason to get worked up over it. Just enjoy it for what it is.
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Granted it is easier, much easier, to finally rest and say we are hobbyist'.
This is not so much of an issue for most - lets be honest most of us gave up waiting for that new piece of hardware a long long time ago.
But I can see why people are going to be upset. They want to invest their money into something other than Windoze. Lets be honest - this is mainly the reason why alot of us here tend to use AROS/Linux/BSD/MacOS. (Not that I have any figures to corrobarate this)
From the inception of the A1 to the Beta's of OS4 I have been waiting for nigh on a decade for something new and truly wish there was something. But alas no. I think the best we can hope for is the Amiga in a joystick where we can play Kick Off and 1000 other games 'till our hearts content.
I do feel sorry for all of those people who believed that there was a saviour for our platform and I really wished that Alan would be the man but following his comments my heart grows weary knowing full well that the man never had any intention of delivering on his promises. On further inspection - the man invested, financially, into OS4 so why would he now insist that it's a hobbyist OS. Has he given up? I think he has. But atleast we know that yet another man whose company promised us the world has let the community down - and no doubt profitted - yet again.
Wayne - we are hobbyists - Alan we are enthusiasts and until something better comes along we will stay that way it's just a shame you missed the boat. Lets hope something as positive as the original Amiga lies waiting sometime in the years to come and we embrace it never to let it die and go to computer heaven.
To Amiga. The first truly amazing desktop computer. Long may you live in emulation purgatory.
Long live Amiga.org
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4) Alan apparently blames the dealers for a great deal of the current situation, per the numerous references to "not being paid by the dealers".
What amazes me is that some users seems to think this is news.
the days of Eyetech are coming to an end, and the only way that OS4 will survive is to be ported to a supported hardware platform (such as the Mac) the way that Yellow Dog Linux was.
It seems Apple is abandonding PPC so...
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@all
I think we all knew deep down that the AmigaOne wasn't going to turn everything around. It is an Amiga yes, it runs OS4 yes, but it is also expensive and specs are outdated. Unfortunately to casual users this is all that matters. I think AmigaOne is basically dead as a dodo, but I hope that OS4 can survive on another platform instead.
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We have to find a "recipe or a special feature" that a future amiga can do and no one else can. The old Amiga was cheap and easy to use as the C=64 before it.
The A1 cost 4 times more than a stupid PC to do the same thing. Its up to the guys with contacts, trademarks and some money to invest to figure out something....
Keep on smiling :-D
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[edit by admin : reason - personal attack]
I will remember the proper days (1987 - 1992) :-)
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In this day and age what spec will catch the eye of the user.
State of the art video capture out of the box with something like fruity loops as standard to write soundtracks.
full 3D sprites and ituitive development environment.
That would take years to develop. I agree with you that this is what is needed. But there is never going to be a chance of this happening.
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Was not a personal attack against Alan Redhouse.
So what should i say then? Alan is the best thing for the Amiga and all his screw ups are greatly appreciated?. There is no clear way of saying Alan is a walking disaster and the Amiga would be better of without the likes of him.
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In this day and age what spec will catch the eye of the user.
To their credit, this is one thing that Amiga Inc understood but ignored. The correct answer is "none".
People who buy machines these days (game, servers, or desktop) don't care what hardware it's running. They simply care that it works and does the exact job that they want it to with a minimum of fuss. Good examples of this include the XBox, PS2, Tivo, and others.
If Amiga Inc could have built a box that I could buy, bring home, plug in and have it "just work", they might have stood a chance. Instead, they went with a closed-end, outdated, and expensive PPC solution that got us nowhere, even FIVE YEARS LATER. (I tried to explain this in 2001 and was kicked out of their little club, but hey, at least several good people's lives got ruined in the meantime)
The future is the same as it always was. The classic platform.
Wayne
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@Unisys:
Why such negativity? Do you really believe that anything better than the present state things are in could have been accomplished? Perhaps in theory if there was a single, united next-gen Amiga project available from the start (before the blue/red wars) things could have possibly, slightly, been better than they are right now, however realistically looking at things...what chance does Amiga have as a serious platform outside of the enthusiasts market? What chance did it ever have, after the fall of Commodore?
The way I see it, Alan simply provided a solution for the enthusiasm to keep on going, and nothing more. Hey, it would have been nice if the AmigaOne project were cheaper for the end-user, however with such a small market, it was simply not possible. Last but not least, there are tons of cheap and way more efficient hardware solutions out there that get the job done quite well. It's not the end of the world. :-)
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Was not a personal attack against Alan Redhouse.
I beg to differ, as would most people here.
I'm not AT ALL suggesting that Alan didn't play a pivotal role in the problems here, but coming out in a public forum saying that he should just "go away and die" (paraphrasing) is, in fact, a personal attack.
I'm NOT suggesting that we should kiss anyone's a*s or even to sweep things under the rug. There are (and have been) MAJOR problems with their chosen direction for the Amiga platform, but direct personal attacks on Alan himself (who did apparently try to succeed despite all odds) or anyone else is simply bad form.
If you wanted to say "Eyetech sucks" or "Hyperion blows" or even "Genesi sucks", that's fine as long as you share with it real reasons for your opinion, but saying "Alan sucks" is a personal attack.
I can't believe that I would need to explain the difference :-)
Wayne
Note: Edited by Ltstanfo on 060805. Reason... Language
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Oh well my 1200/060 machine is working fine for what i want it for and it is my amiga future with elbox`s help...
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We all wanted the AmigaOne to be the harbinger of a new generation of machines. Sure, we knew that Wintel was never going to be under threat, but we hoped for a day when you could buy a new Amiga which could at least hold it's own with more modern machinery.
I guess that Alan and many others all had the same dream, and I'm saddened that there will be one less alternative to the Wintel monopoly.
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I guess that Alan and many others all had the same dream, and I'm saddened that there will be one less alternative to the Wintel monopoly.
Monopoly or not, the prices and availability of hardware out there have never been better. :-)
Plus it gets the job done and then some.
I don't understand why anyone should hate windows these days as they did (rightfully so, during it's early, uprising stages)? It's remarkably stable. :-)
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@x56h34
Why such negativity?
Why not? Alan has lied and betrayed Amiga users for quite a while now. He blames everything on dealers,Amiga users and anyone else he thinks would make a good fall guy, also Alan tried to cover up known problems with the Amigaone hardware Then to top it off Alan then expects people to pay for a fix due his own stupidity and quickly pushes Amigaone sales to Stellar Dreams to save himself from warranty repairs.
This man should have cut his losses from the start instead of getting deeper in things which he cleary did not understand. The Amiga users should not accept this, as for the ass kissing that just disgusts me - the Amiga users should have pride instead of being happy with whatever crap gets thrown at you.
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That's the price you have to pay for not treating all of this as a hobby. :-)
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But alas no. I think the best we can hope for is the Amiga in a joystick where we can play Kick Off and 1000 other games 'till our hearts content.
I find it damn odd that Amiga INC never thought of that.. I am sure they would have sold like hell, especially if it had some kind of flash card/memory card reader, so that you can upgrade it with more games later on. But no, they decided to develope a product that no one wants. "amigaanywhere"
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Quote :
I don't understand why anyone should hate windows these days as they did (rightfully so, during it's early, uprising stages)? It's remarkably stable.
So is Fedora and quite frankly a pleasure to use. That is not the issue.
I do agree with Unisys in that Alan is personally responsible for company policy within Eyetech and he personally - lets say misinformed - the "Amiga Enthuiast" into believing the A1 was the way to go.
As a businessman would he have made that comment prior to the A1 being manufactured/distributed. NO.
No he did it once the sales had dwindled and there was very little left in it for himself.
I feel sorry for the likes of Hyperion. The years of development of OS4, the dedication of it's staff so that one person piss on the one burning fire left within the community.
This sounds like a very big Ebay scam, a little more organised but the intention was to provide a dated product to a hungry market with a bleak future.
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I don't understand why anyone should hate windows these days as they did (rightfully so, during it's early, uprising stages)? It's remarkably stable.
It is quite stable today yeah, but is also very bloated and slow even on modern computers. It is also full of useless features that cannot be turned off unless you hack the registery yourself.
But this is my opinion...
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XP is very stable. At least, if you use the right hardware. B-brands and other cheap things can cause trouble but if you go for proven configurations XP is great.
I think that what was stated earlier is correct. Where was amiga after commodore collapsed?
I remember a post on some usenet group (I looked it up for you) where an ex commodore employee replied someone;
>Please understand this: CBM USA might be dead, but the Amiga is _VERY_ well
>alive!!!!!!!!!! It will continue selling just like before, and we have
>nothing to worry about support because in the first place we never got any
>from C=.
>
>So, don't panic, Amiga has a long way to go, and the upcoming AAA Amigas
>will make a big splah when they come out (they'll give SGI a run for the
>money).
You've been into the weed again, haven't you? Or just spending too much
time with Jim Drew. Man, oh man. Who the hell do you think MAKES Amigas?
Geez.
I think that sums it up pretty well.
edited by admin because user posted long URL (http://groups.google.nl/group/comp.sys.acorn.advocacy/messages/7bdd96782a0a63f4?hl=nl&thread_id=6a773ecd371c5ae4&mode=thread&noheader=1&q=commodore+who+think+makes+amiga&_done=%2Fgroup%2Fcomp.sys.acorn.advocacy%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fthread%2F6a773ecd371c5ae4%2F7bdd96782a0a63f4%3Ftvc%3D1%26q%3Dcommodore+who+think+makes+amiga%26hl%3Dnl%26#doc_7bdd96782a0a63f4)
Just my 2 cents
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When I first started to use Linux and started to delve into it's features I once read a question from another newbie which went along the lines of -:
Question - I am trying to install many applications onto my Linux box as I can to make it comparable to my Windows 200 setup. One thing I am trying to locate is a program to defrag the hard drive can anyone help.
Answer - THIS is linux - not Windows. We don't need to defrag.
Testament to an OS & it's filesystem. Not that I am promoting Linux as there are many alternatives, I used Windoze since it's inception way way back and I don't believe you can justify an OS so bloated and unreliable. I know it's unreliable because why else would you need to repair the registry so often.
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@Magic-Merl:
I doubt that Alan made millions from his AmigaOne scam and is laughing at us right now. :-) He should at least get a pat on the back for trying, IMHO. That takes courage too.
You simply have to rationally think about all of this before venturing into a purchase such as AmigaOne or Pegasos. Ask yourself what are the odds of such hardware/OS delivering any serious software, and for that matter staying competitive with today's computer world? Think rationally and make your decision. Anyone with a half of brain could have realized that AmigaOne and Pegasos (I'm using Pegasos as an equally risky purchase example only) were not very promising as far as anything, yet could be only viable for enthusiastic purposes, so there are lots of people that bought one or both for those very reasons. True, there are fanatics out there that expected next gen Amiga hardware to become a dominant choice in the computer hardware market today, but as I said before, realistically, with no emotions involved please...what are the odds of that ever happening? I think that we should really be happy that someone delivered something, and take it for what it's worth.
All in my own opinion, of course.
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@ x56h34
Granted you are right. But there is OS4 still to come and potentially he has destroyed it's market.
Who will develop for hardware that Alan says he will no longer develop.
As for the past, I believe Alan knew what he was doing and still does. I didn't buy the A1 myself so I have no vested interest or emotional attachment to the hardware (if there is such a thing). He kept a dream alive, yes, I never claimed he made millions - but he must have recouped beyond his development costs otherwise he would not have made such damaging comments.
If OS4 see's the light of day the A1 may be developed further but for now that is not going to happen and I would be very suprised if many "Amiga Enthusiasts" would buy from Eyetech anyway.
The unfortunate thing is - OS4 is tied to the A1 hardware and like it or not Alan still may see profit from his callous comments.
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@Magic-Merl:
It'll be interesting to see how Hyperion will handle OS4.0 from this point in regards to the AmigaOne/Eyetech situation. Probably the best thing for them would be to expand on the OS4.0 supported hardware, however it seems that there are limitations on this due to licensing, as you've mentioned in your last post.
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@Unisys
Hi Mr. Paul Gadd. You could have simply used your original account rather than violating the terms of service and creating a new account.
Wayne
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Original account is still set on restricted mode.
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Not according to the management screen it's not. That doesn't give you the right to ignore the posted rules though. I've confirmed your account works, but if you don't change the e-mail address and your signature immediately, I will begin actively banning you again for trolling and violating the TOS.
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Someone must have guessed my password and set up the Unisys account and changed my email address and signature. I am innocent of all charges.
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Poster: Wayne Posted: 2005/6/6 9:12:13 Of course all of this about the Mac is subject to the pending expected announcement today that Apple is going with Intel. Please note that no one has said that Apple is going x86. Intel might simply start building PPC chips as well, since there is a hell of a lot of competition in the x86 world.
Well, From Jobs lips to our ears... Macs go X86!
That should make things interesting.
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Hell of a time to take a holiday. ANN is missing out on some good flamewars.
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Not much news in the 20 Q&As if you ask me. Nevertheless the honesty and sincerity is very refreshing (coming from Amiga related companies anyway).
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Poster: Paul_Gadd Posted: 2005/6/6 22:11:17
Someone must have guessed my password and set up the Unisys account and changed my email address and signature. I am innocent of all charges.
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Oh heck....look what the cat dragged in. Looks alot like something that usually lives under a bridge.
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at least the C64 has new hardware out there at the mo!
By the way, do you mean official hardware (The TV-joystick) or unofficial ("CommodoreOne", for example)?
In many cases I find unofficial hardware better & more important for the future...
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Does it matter?
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@Odin
You can call me a troll all you want, but every single thing i accused Redhouse of through the years has been totally spot on. Crooks and ignorant followers are the ones to blame and they are certainly the ones who are damaging the so-called future Amiga, not the scapegoats (ie people who live under bridges).
So the world may know
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@Paul_gadd/Unisys:
Of course it is all to blame on the crooks and the ignorant followers. Of course the scapegoats are not to blame after all. And of course were you totally spot on with every 'accusation' about Redhouse in the past.
Let me clue you in on a little detail. Your life is not defined by Amigas, nor do you need to derive your identity from them. Get a life (i.e., one without computers), and consider seeking out professional help. It is not healthy to get so worked up about something which is nothing more than a somewhat nerdy hobby. Let it go. Noone cares anymore.
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:lol:
I think you are refering to people in this (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=12850&forum=3&start=0&viewmode=flat&order=0) fantastic and totally hilarious thread. Those guys still to this day amaze me.
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I'm just glad Alan used the term 'Amiga Enthusiast' rather than 'Amigan'...
It's not a very good warm-up for the 20-year celebrations, is it? Still, I gave up wanting a new Amiga years ago, happy with my A1200/030 (with slightly dodgy clock).
Whatever happened to Jim Collas anyway, after he was unceremoniously chucked out of Gateway? Come to think of it, what happened to Gateway?
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"It's been confirmed folks, the Amiga is just a hobby."
Well put Wayne.
Amigas are for fun, other computers are for... well, mostly boring stuff. Like work and {bleep}. Paying bills online...
A real Amiga boots clean off with a Spaceballs demo disk, or else it's not an Amiga.
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@560SL
I hope you're wrong.
Amiga for me is the OS of choice, always was.
Probably why I own Wordsworth 7 Final Calc Pagestream, AMIRc etc.... etc
I hope the OS grows and we get good application development again. I also hope AMIGA and it's peers have ideas on getting out new hardware to run OS4 on.
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A real Amiga boots clean off with a Spaceballs demo disk, or else it's not an Amiga.
Cheers
:pint:
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'Those guys still to this day amaze me'
Well that thread was started by a private individual and responded to by individuals. It is your continued misunderstanding that opinions on a website are not engineered by some kind of shadow organisation ( practically every comment you have ever made regarding articles on aw.net implies you seem to think that ) that cracks me up.
Carry on with the dried frog pills. Why did you name your online character after Gary Glitter, the useless 70s glam rock paedophile?
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aw.net is clearly in the pockets of amiga inc/hyperion/eyetech - unless covering up for them all the time is normal. That is not paranoia.
As for the last part of your post. Pointless and pathetic, makes me wonder if your into that sort of stuff.
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@Paul_Gadd:
Get a life. Seriously, get a life. Get healthy hobbies. (Hobby != collecting links from AW.net and making online insults day after day.)
You know, I have a hobby. I bought an A1 knowing that it's not a masterpiece of engineering. I'm almost perfectly happy with it (It should only have a better video card and that would make my day). It's the best Amiga I have ever had.
You shouldn't be so concerned about things that don't belong to you. Mind your own hobbies. Thanks for listening.
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Alan certainly didn't sound very happy, did he? :-)
I find it confusing that they are trying to get their hardware used in commercial markets outside the "Amiga Enthusiast" community. How is that at all possible with the schedule they build their machines and how much they cost?
Excuse me, I think I'll go play some old games on WinUAE, now...
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Paul,
We all know what's going on. We all know the truth of the situation. There is simply no point whatsoever to standing on top of the corpse and beating your chest as though you've won some amazing prize for pointing out the obvious.
In short, let's just get back to enjoying our hobby and forget about all the strife caught by all this sillyness and feudalism. We're all "Amiga Enthusiasts" (A term I greatly prefer to "Amigan"). End of story, so go. Enthuse..
Wayne
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I guess this is just yet another opportunity to say [color=FF0000]WE (http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?amigaos) TOLD YOU SO![/color]
But Eyetech seem to take pride in their efforts to kill AmigaOS. Screw you and your "investments", Eyetech. You're irrelevant, you're no longer needed, the world is filled with "new Amigas" (hardware platforms that AmigaOS could be sold for) without your labels and your monopoly.
The Amiga is dead. It's been a decade, is it REALLY that damn hard to understand? AInc and Hyperion, adapt already! Quit pretending, stop making decisions that obviously "defy commercial logic"! (Jeezus! I remember when I said that...) Leave Eyetech and the whole "new Amiga" and "Amiga hardware market" idiocy behind. Stop making a software product into nothing more than a means of charity for an irrelevant hardware dealer, which less than a thousand people will donate to anyway. Sell AmigaOS for hardware that people actually want to buy or already own in numbers that could possibly begin to make it worthwile.
"It is such a tiny market and the costs of entry are so high that no commercial concern in its right mind would get involved."
No SH!T?? You don't say? I think I've heard that before, but then it wasn't from Eyetech, but from us who oppose the compulsory hardware licensing/bundling/dongling...
In other words, it's NOT a good idea to lock all sales of AmigaOS to this unnecessary and artificially separated "Amiga market".
"Without a 'monopoly' this tiny market would be even more fragmented, making for even smaller production volumes and much higher prices. "
Is this from the department of redundancy department? The department of samfacial logic? What we don't need and don't want is your monopoly, i.e. this tiny market.
"This exclusivity is in itself no big deal. Competition only has any significant effect on prices when the market is large and unrestricted and volumes reaches mass-production (500,000+ per year) proportions."
This is hilarious. Or sad. Or just weird. The exclusivity [Eyetech being the only ones allowed to sell hardware to you if you want AmigaOS] is not a big deal, because without it AmigaOS could have benefited from hardware competition, and when shopping for hardware potential AmigaOS customers could've been part of a larger unrestricted market...? So that's why we need a small, restricted pseudo market, instead of for example buying AmigaOS for a Mac that's sold in the millions by multiple competing vendors all over the world? Duh.
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@seehund.
It'd be nice if you read what I posted prior to your post. There is no point in "I told you so" at this junction.
Wayne
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Wayne,
Sorry.
I've never done an "I told you so" before, and I figured I'd at least have to try it once before this is all over and forgotten. :) Won't happen again.
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Thanks Alan for your comments. It certainly has been a rocky road for everyone involved.
Now back to my hobby ...
---
redfox
µA1-C "Amiga Enthusiast"
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aw.net is clearly in the pockets of amiga inc/hyperion/eyetech - unless covering up for them all the time is normal. That is not paranoia.
Let me know where I should be picking up my paycheck then. You aint paranoid, its just everyone hates ya ;-)
As for the last part of your post. Pointless and pathetic, makes me wonder if your into that sort of stuff.
Yeah cos that reaction was really LOGICAL right ;-) :roflmao:
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@Wayne
Yeah your right. I will just sit back and watch the fun.
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Amithlon Enthusiast
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@Wiffy
Dave,
With the upcoming user group meeting mentioned by Tony on AmigaOrg News, there will
be an opportunity for people to see with their -own- eyes. Let us hope then, that a
few people are willing to make up their mind based on their -own- personal conclusions,
and -not- based on the rumor and conclusion mill.
Best Wishes,
#6
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stop making decisions that obviously "defy commercial logic"!
You mean close down the Amiga OS 4.0 project and eat the losses, stop AmigaOne production and any other hardware development, and Amiga, Inc. fold up and go out of business.
I assume you also have a problem with the way Apple conducts its business. Tying Mac OS to only Apple approved hardware.
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Argo: I assume you also have a problem with the way Apple conducts its business. Tying Mac OS to only Apple approved hardware.
Apple is far, far more competent at that, and even Macs have a load of problems of their own. :-)
Any time you have to pay considerably more money for hardware several generations old, you are buying into a hobby market. It's just disappointing that the AmigaOne is pretty damn generic for a specialty, hobby platform. It really is just a PC with a non-x86 CPU, and no native support for the old Amiga we know so well.
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"Just a reminder that the classic Amigas are still here folks. They've just been shoved into the corner by the zealots clamoring for something new. Let's take a step back, get our breath, then get back to what matters, and that is enjoying whatever we've got without all the political stupidity.
Wayne"
I eat every word you say. I don't so much that the Amiga's future will be on Mac hardware, though I would not be surprised to see it appear on IBM.
None the less. There is an upside to this being the efforts of a hobbyist collective (that has a very smash the church, smash the state kind of ring to it) so far...
..but who's to say it won't pick up? I think the philosophy behind the OS itself is alive now, more than ever. It has been designed to be embedded from day one, and I truely feel that the future will be devices, as opposed to our large boxes. I think the next generation of game consoles should speak as a testament for the future of computing just by there abilities and price tag, which we all know is both HIGH and low.
They are tiny with microscopic CPU's, built by none other than IBM.
RAM devices are growing in popularity, and are unchallenged in the hard drive market when it comes to speed, only size atm, but things always change, and things come to and end, and new things come into being.
Resource friendly, as well as a use friendly OS, that has gone un-sung for MANY years, though it has been ripped off, a thoughsand times over in design.
It has the all to familiar Prefs (control panel), which winblows shares many striking similiarities with. Oh and recall how Microsoft introduced "multi tasking" back in 95, or even Apple for that matter? How about web browsers with pop-up blockers? A simple GUI that runs on a mere 256k RAM if needs be, but in this rapidly growing market, who needs to bother with a mere 256k when we've got Gigs? Gigs of overkill, as the OS does not even nead anything near that, nore do the applications, everything is tiny, needing little from the CPU and Memory, leaving plenty of room for large scale processes that the Amiga was designed for, such as video editing, and audio mixing. Of course there is always room for boring office apps and what not. Only now, unlike M$ Office, they have the option of booting in a millionth of a second, thankx to Amiga's minimalistic philosophy.
And if not, then it continues to be a Hobbyist Collective, and is saved from the corruption of commercialism, capitalism, facism, and all the other fun things that really rule out governments and coporations. I know most Amiga fanatics don't seem to be fond of being spied on, and having tracking devices in there computers and the like.
Anyhow, I'm done ranting, glad I didn't buy an Amiga One.
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stop making decisions that obviously "defy commercial logic"!
You mean close down the Amiga OS 4.0 project and eat the losses,
I mean make it possible to sell AmigaOS. It is a commercial product that isn't done for free, so it must sell or it's pointless. Might as well open it completely and release the sources then, instead of just sitting on it to let a computer shop sell a few hundred overpriced motherboards. It would be different if it were a hobbyist project made for free in people's spare time.
stop AmigaOne production and any other hardware development,
If AmigaOS weren't exclusively tethered to the "AmigaOnes", there wouldn't be much cause for concern if they were cancelled today. Get competitive, or good riddance.
Hardware development? There is no hardware development for AmigaOS, at least that much has been done right - anything else would defy commercial logic. (Unless you count fringe phenomena like PPC cards to be used with old Amigas, but that defies commercial logic...)
and Amiga, Inc. fold up and go out of business.
If that would mean AmigaOS transferred to competent hands, and harmful alliances with irrelevant hardware shops would be broken, yeah, go for it!
I assume you also have a problem with the way Apple conducts its business. Tying Mac OS to only Apple approved hardware.
Apple sells Macs - their own hardware, their own software. It's Apple's hardware. They have full control over their hardware. They can choose to make new hardware, how to make it, and set their price. They make money on it. I'd wager they make MOST of their money on it. They have the resources, control and competence to try to make their hardware stay competitive. They're in the hardware business.
It's nothing like the situation with AmigaOS4. It's more like the situation back when there were Amigas, and when Commodore had money.
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I'd wager they make MOST of their money on it.
Actually? No. Apple make far more money on their ancillary products such as the iPod and music service than they do on Macs themselves. I'm not suggesting Apple make NO profit on the mac, simply not "most of it".
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I'd wager they make MOST of their money on it.
Actually? No. Apple make far more money on their ancillary products such as the iPod and music service than they do on Macs themselves. I'm not suggesting Apple make NO profit on the mac, simply not "most of it".
If I'm reading this table (PDF) (http://images.apple.com/pr/pdf/q205data_sum.pdf) right, then my guess was wrong. Apple doesn't make most of its money on Macs, but Macs are still their single largest source of income; 46% of Apple's revenue.
The iPods and iTunes are growing faster than Macs, but they haven't overtaken the Macs just yet. Apple sells a much larger number of iPods than Macs, though.
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"single largest", yes, but 54% of their income comes from the ipod, music service and "other". The sale of OSX Tiger this last few months certainly helped to swing that number. My point, and I guess we both have a point, is that the iMac is no longer providing the majority of their income.
That being said, I expect the x86 mac to violently sway those figures the other direction on it's introduction next year for at least one or two quarters (depending on price).
The scary thing now is whether mac hardware sales will survive the next few quarters waiting on the x86 mac to arrive. No one wants to buy a product that Jobs declared both slow, underpowered, and dead-ended. (Maybe Eyetech and Genesi could have taken the hint there as well).
Wayne