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The "Not Quite Amiga but still computer related category" => Alternative Operating Systems => Topic started by: runequester on January 26, 2011, 07:22:21 PM

Title: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: runequester on January 26, 2011, 07:22:21 PM
So if I wanted to mess with shapeshifter on an 030/56, what version of mac os would be the optimal ?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: commodorejohn on January 26, 2011, 07:28:14 PM
System 7 of some description. I prefer 7.5 for beefier Macs (25MHz+, 8MB+ RAM) and 7.1 for everything else. Not sure how much of a performance/memory penalty Shapeshifter inflicts, but you'd probably handle 7.5 all right.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: beakster2 on January 26, 2011, 07:29:08 PM
7.1 is probably best.  I found 7.5 a bit unstable.  7.6 was better, but I don't think there is much there you need.

When I last installed shapeshifter you could download 7.0.1 from Apple for free.  Maybe you can get newer versions from them now?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: zipper on January 26, 2011, 07:41:00 PM
I think at least 7.5.5, probably 7.6.1 is easy to find.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Cammy on January 26, 2011, 08:30:32 PM
If anyone would like to try Shapeshifter on their Amiga, I have gone to the effort of mounting and installing all the disk images for OS 7.6 as well as the 7.6.1 updates and all the other updates available, including the later Appearance Manager extension which makes OS7 look like OS8. These are all official Apple updates and are freely available on their site, along with the disk images for the OS, but I have installed it all and packaged the harddrive file for anyone else to try.

http://home.exetel.com.au/~amiga/MacOS7.6.1.zip

All you need to run it on a sufficiently expanded 020-060 Amiga are:

ShapeShifter 3.11 - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/ShapeShifter
MuEVD - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/MuEVD
MuFastZero - http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/MuFastZero
VirtualLink - http://aminet.net/package/comm/tcp/vlink

Here are the recommended ROM and OS for each CPU type:

Best ROM Images

68000: Mac Se
68020: Mac LC
68030: Mac LC III
68040: Quadra 650
68060: Quadra 650

Best OS Versions

68000: 6.0.8
68020: 7.1.1
68030: 7.6.1
68040: 8.1
68060: 8.1

This forum has further help with Mac ROMs - http://nbbemulation.free.fr/forum_ma...opic.php?id=69

Remember: You can play games like Warcraft II, Links Pro Golf, Settlers II, Prince of Persia II and other cool games and sequels that weren't released on the Amiga, all in 640x480 in 256 colours! With the AMAZING MuEVD video driver, these games are totally playable on a 030 AGA machine.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: koshman on January 26, 2011, 08:55:34 PM
Cammy, thank you so much!
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Crumb on January 26, 2011, 09:04:50 PM
Quote from: Cammy;609490
ShapeShifter 3.11 - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/ShapeShifter
MuEVD - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/MuEVD
MuFastZero - http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/MuFastZero
VirtualLink - http://aminet.net/package/comm/tcp/vlink

Here are the recommended ROM and OS for each CPU type:

Best ROM Images

68000: Mac Se
68020: Mac LC
68030: Mac LC III
68040: Quadra 650
68060: Quadra 650

Best OS Versions

68000: 6.0.8
68020: 7.1.1
68030: 7.6.1
68040: 8.1
68060: 8.1

This forum has further help with Mac ROMs - http://nbbemulation.free.fr/forum_ma...opic.php?id=69

Remember: You can play games like Warcraft II, Links Pro Golf, Settlers II, Prince of Persia II and other cool games and sequels that weren't released on the Amiga, all in 640x480 in 256 colours! With the AMAZING MuEVD video driver, these games are totally playable on a 030 AGA machine.


I used to play Duke Nukem 3D, Dark forces, Comanche, WarcraftII and others in my A1200 with Falcon040/25. I have to say that OS7.x has always felt way faster than 8.x even installed in a scsi partition. I wouldn't use 8.x in my miggies again. OS8.x is quite useless and for a few apps and games OS7.x is more than enough.

I tried different 1MB rom images (650 and 900 IIRC) and it didn't make any difference.

With a graphic card Fusion3.x usually feels smoother even if you use Shapeshifter TurboEVD/MMU drivers. Fusion3.x allows using MMU for virtual memory on OS8.x IIRC. You should use Fusion 3.2 version iif you own a gfx card or Shapeshifter3.11 if you use ECS/AGA.

If you don't have an MMU there are some drivers called "AgaBoost", these had small gfx glitches but on a friend's a1200+fastram were fine to load Prince of Persia.

PS: Savage driver was the best for 030 AGA IIRC
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Matt_H on January 26, 2011, 09:10:05 PM
@ Cammy

Cammy, do you have VirtualLink set up and working? I've been trying to get it going for years, but to no avail. Can you post a bit about your network configuration? Thanks!
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: nicholas on January 26, 2011, 10:16:21 PM
Quote from: Crumb;609495
I used to play Duke Nukem 3D, Dark forces, Comanche, WarcraftII and others in my A1200 with Falcon040/25. I have to say that OS7.x has always felt way faster than 8.x even installed in a scsi partition. I wouldn't use 8.x in my miggies again. OS8.x is quite useless and for a few apps and games OS7.x is more than enough.

I tried different 1MB rom images (650 and 900 IIRC) and it didn't make any difference.

With a graphic card Fusion3.x usually feels smoother even if you use Shapeshifter TurboEVD/MMU drivers. Fusion3.x allows using MMU for virtual memory on OS8.x IIRC. You should use Fusion 3.2 version iif you own a gfx card or Shapeshifter3.11 if you use ECS/AGA.

If you don't have an MMU there are some drivers called "AgaBoost", these had small gfx glitches but on a friend's a1200+fastram were fine to load Prince of Persia.

PS: Savage driver was the best for 030 AGA IIRC


Thanks for pre-answering MOST of the questions I had! :D

Just one more, how good is Basiillisk II on 68k Amigas?  Any pro and cons for or against it over Fusion or Shapeshifter?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Digiman on January 27, 2011, 12:26:43 AM
Quote from: Cammy;609490
If anyone would like to try Shapeshifter on their Amiga, I have gone to the effort of mounting and installing all the disk images for OS 7.6 as well as the 7.6.1 updates and all the other updates available, including the later Appearance Manager extension which makes OS7 look like OS8. These are all official Apple updates and are freely available on their site, along with the disk images for the OS, but I have installed it all and packaged the harddrive file for anyone else to try.

http://home.exetel.com.au/~amiga/MacOS7.6.1.zip

All you need to run it on a sufficiently expanded 020-060 Amiga are:

ShapeShifter 3.11 - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/ShapeShifter
MuEVD - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/MuEVD
MuFastZero - http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/MuFastZero
VirtualLink - http://aminet.net/package/comm/tcp/vlink

Here are the recommended ROM and OS for each CPU type:

Best ROM Images

68000: Mac Se
68020: Mac LC
68030: Mac LC III
68040: Quadra 650
68060: Quadra 650

Best OS Versions

68000: 6.0.8
68020: 7.1.1
68030: 7.6.1
68040: 8.1
68060: 8.1

This forum has further help with Mac ROMs - http://nbbemulation.free.fr/forum_ma...opic.php?id=69

Remember: You can play games like Warcraft II, Links Pro Golf, Settlers II, Prince of Persia II and other cool games and sequels that weren't released on the Amiga, all in 640x480 in 256 colours! With the AMAZING MuEVD video driver, these games are totally playable on a 030 AGA machine.


Post of the year award goes to Cammy :)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on January 27, 2011, 04:57:51 AM
Cammy you beautiful beast you! Thanks for putting this pack together and for all the links!!!!!

On a side note, how does Fusion compare with Shapeshifter? I heard it was faster?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: runequester on January 27, 2011, 05:46:40 AM
wow, cammy goes and shows everybody up : )
 very very helpfull, thank you
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: MaximvsPayne on January 27, 2011, 09:32:48 AM
damn cool, very very helpful!

thx
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: nicholas on January 27, 2011, 11:11:30 PM
Quote from: nicholas;609504
Thanks for pre-answering MOST of the questions I had! :D

Just one more, how good is Basiillisk II on 68k Amigas?  Any pro and cons for or against it over Fusion or Shapeshifter?


Anyone?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: X-ray on January 29, 2011, 05:45:42 PM
Thanks Camster, I owe you one! :hat:
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on January 30, 2011, 08:53:25 PM
This site might be of interest to those of you who get this working...

...I've still not gotten around to messing with it yet, so I dunno if these files are ShapeShifter friendly yet or not.

http://www.macintoshgarden.org/
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: matthey on January 30, 2011, 09:45:52 PM
Quote from: nicholas;609963
Anyone?


I couldn't get Basilisk to work and I'm an advanced Amiga user. I think Shapeshifter is the best 68k emulation. Fusion works well and has some advantages (file transfer is easier) but it also has more bugs and quirks. Fusion might be a little faster for low end Amigas but the speed is pretty similar on high end Amigas.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on January 31, 2011, 12:10:03 AM
Thankx for that Matthey!
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on February 28, 2011, 12:01:14 AM
Ok, so I finally got the happy mac face to come up, but loading the 7.6.1 OS file posted takes minutes upon minutes of hard drive spinning action.  Is there something I can do to improve performance?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: nicholas on February 28, 2011, 01:01:38 AM
Quote from: thebilgerat;618321
ok, so i finally got the happy mac face to come up, but loading the 7.6.1 os file posted takes minutes upon minutes of hard drive spinning action.  Is there something i can do to improve performance?

Code: [Select]
makedir ram:shapeshifter
copy work:shapeshifter/#? Ram:shapeshifter/

;)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: nicholas on February 28, 2011, 01:02:11 AM
Quote from: matthey;610975
I couldn't get Basilisk to work and I'm an advanced Amiga user. I think Shapeshifter is the best 68k emulation. Fusion works well and has some advantages (file transfer is easier) but it also has more bugs and quirks. Fusion might be a little faster for low end Amigas but the speed is pretty similar on high end Amigas.

Thanks! :)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on February 28, 2011, 01:40:21 AM
Quote from: nicholas;618335
Code: [Select]
makedir ram:shapeshifter
copy work:shapeshifter/#? Ram:shapeshifter/
;)

Well, I cannot put a 120 meg file in ram with 16 meg max :D

Have to wait for a good accelerator with some onboard ram or a zoram

otherwise it does seem to load ok... perhaps a bit zippier...

maybe I need to install it to its own partition...
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: mongo on February 28, 2011, 01:42:05 AM
Quote from: TheBilgeRat;618321
Ok, so I finally got the happy mac face to come up, but loading the 7.6.1 OS file posted takes minutes upon minutes of hard drive spinning action.  Is there something I can do to improve performance?


Addbuffers drivewhereyourhardfileis: 100
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Tenacious on March 01, 2011, 12:25:45 AM
Quote from: TheBilgeRat;618342
Well, I cannot put a 120 meg file in ram with 16 meg max :D

Have to wait for a good accelerator with some onboard ram or a zoram

otherwise it does seem to load ok... perhaps a bit zippier...

maybe I need to install it to its own partition...


IIRC, Shapeshifter recommends the user giving the Mac side its own small hard drive to improve loading time.  This is how I did it years ago with A3000 and PIV (no 060 at the time).  I remember the emulation being faster than a real Mac with equiv CPU.  It didn't like the 060 when it arrived (I didn't try too hard) so I gave it up.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on March 01, 2011, 09:19:42 PM
shapeshifter's prepareemul locks up my system when I double click it! :/

Without that I can't use Shapeshifter at all can I?

Amiga 1200 with 50Mhz Blizzard 060, 32Mb FAST RAM.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Cammy on March 02, 2011, 01:11:50 AM
Please try replacing PrepareEmul with these:

MuEVD - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/MuEVD
MuFastZero - http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/MuFastZero

Your Startup-Sequence after C:SetPatch QUIET should have these lines added:

C:MuMove4k PrepareEmul A1200
C:MuFastZero On

Making sure you have installed all the files to C: and Libs:
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on March 02, 2011, 11:46:57 PM
MuFastZero On - came back with an error, but I forgot to write it down and bring it with me. Doe! :/

Oh and Shape Shifter says that the ShapeShifter rom is not present or is corrupt. Yippy! :)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: smerf on March 03, 2011, 02:10:47 AM
Hi,

@Cammy,

Thanks for the info, always wanted to try getting shapeshifter running, will try this weekend.

If you ever need anything let me know, maybe I can help.

smerf

(Somethings wrong, I must be sick, I was actually nice)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on March 03, 2011, 04:36:03 AM
Quote from: smerf;619133
Hi,

@Cammy,

Thanks for the info, always wanted to try getting shapeshifter running, will try this weekend.

If you ever need anything let me know, maybe I can help.

smerf

(Somethings wrong, I must be sick, I was actually nice)


Tell me about it, I've been offering to come over and arrange her under garment  drawers for months now. Is it just the pretty Amiga girl effect, or am I sincerely a nice guy deep down inside? We may never know. ;)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on March 04, 2011, 04:29:10 AM
OK I resolved my issue with MRFastZero, but now when ever the Mac first shows the little Mac Computer Icon to let me know it is booting...

...my Amiga crashes. :(
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: slayer on March 04, 2011, 06:27:35 AM
Well I got fusionPPC set up many years ago on my a4000 604e just to run warlords II... sadly I was quite disappointed on what they'd done to such great potential...

Thing is I think you'll find most of these games will work on dosbox... not that I've tried them...
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on March 04, 2011, 05:48:02 PM
Fusion PPC actually released?

Anyhow, DOSBox is not to friendly with PPC machines. The most one can play on my eMac are low end 386 titles.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: zipper on March 04, 2011, 05:54:53 PM
Quote from: XDelusion;619683
Fusion PPC actually released?


It was called iFusion, works just with CSPPC/CGX.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Cammy on March 04, 2011, 08:05:09 PM
XDelusion, have you tried booting up MacOS without extensions? If you hold down the shift key when you see the little smiling Mac icon, next it should open a picture saying Mac OS - Extensions Disabled. Hopefully this might help you boot into the OS without crashes, and you can remove the extension that's causing it to crash. Extensions are sort of like your WBStartup drawer, you just remove items from it that you don't want starting at boot time.

Other than that I'm not sure what could be causing the crashes. Do you have the hardfiles on a SFS, PFS or FAT partition? If you have it on a FFS partition it could be very slow, although I doubt it would cause crashes. You could also try the command "Addbuffers" to speed up the drive the hardfile is on, like this for example if the hard file was on a CF or SD card in the PCMCIA slot - "Addbuffers CF0: 1000" and you;ll have plenty of buffers and faster disk access. To be honest I'm not sure what the perfect amount of buffers is, but this works for me.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: zipper on March 04, 2011, 08:37:03 PM
I think I had 1000 buffers for my UWSCSI Hd, too.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Cammy on March 12, 2011, 06:39:43 PM
Here's a photo of my A1200 running Photoshop. It's perfectly usable too.
http://www.amiga.org/gallery/index.php?n=3456
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: mfilos on March 12, 2011, 06:46:37 PM
Awesome pic Cammy! It looks really cool :)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Cammy on March 12, 2011, 07:45:50 PM
Thanks :)

Here's Photoshop running on my A600: http://www.amiga.org/gallery/index.php?n=3457
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: BooBoo1200 on March 12, 2011, 11:47:13 PM
Cammy can you recommend how to get a speed increase in colour? I have an A1200 030@40 but no MMU
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: magnetic on March 13, 2011, 12:29:23 AM
Yes Ifusion PPC finally came out after years of Jim drew and co stalling...and then it only kind of worked it emulated an imac.. it was cool but almost alpha or early beta status and sold commercially.

@cammy

nice thread one more project for my a1200.. u see my spec so it should run fairly fast right?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Cammy on March 13, 2011, 01:04:32 AM
BooBoo, you should definitely try the AGA Boost 030 driver: http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/agaboost030ec

I hope it's speedy enough to get things done, I haven't tried it myself yet, I hoped there would be a 020 version to use with my 10MB A1200.

Magnetic, as long as your Apollo is a model with a 030 and not a EC030 it should be very nice to run Shapeshifter, even faster than my own A1200, unless you have no MMU and you'll have to use the video driver I recommended to BooBoo.

I found another driver for 030/MMU/ECS machines which I will have to try on my A600 and compare it to the MuEVD driver I'm currently using, which seems very quick considering this is on slow ECS.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: magnetic on March 13, 2011, 01:28:36 AM
hi cammy

Yeah its the full version 030 w/ mmu :) So exciting..,
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: BooBoo1200 on March 13, 2011, 05:38:58 AM
Thank you Cammy ill check it out :)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on March 13, 2011, 07:57:20 PM
Cammy, if I hold Shift, my system locks, no reboot. I have to power down to get back to the OS.

Does Shapeshifter need an FPU or something? Or I am wondering...

since RAD will not use my Apollo 060's Fast RAM, maybe some other programs like Shape Shifter are having issue with it too?


Also can I just use the Addbuffers command in my user-startup?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Cammy on March 13, 2011, 10:58:48 PM
I'm really sorry but I'm stumped as to why Shapeshifter is crashing while it starts up on your 060. :( I know other people have definitely run it on them though, so don't give up. Perhaps there's an option somewhere that needs to be selected, or perhaps you need to try a different boot image or ROM file.

Shapeshifter doesn't need a FPU. My A1200 and A600 don't have them.

You can definitely add the AddBuffers command to the User-Startup, but I think you can also effectively do the same thing by increasing the buffers for each partition in HDToolBox as well, which might be more efficient than adding extra commands to the boot sequence.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: stefcep2 on March 13, 2011, 11:52:11 PM
try this in s/user-startup

c:setfpuexceptions off
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: XDelusion on March 14, 2011, 12:57:40 AM
It's all your fault Cammy! You are the Pied Piper of false hopes!!! Shame on you! ;)

I'll keep tinkering. I'm also going to play with this on my 600 tonight as well. Will report....

Quote from: Cammy;621607
I'm really sorry but I'm stumped as to why Shapeshifter is crashing while it starts up on your 060. :( I know other people have definitely run it on them though, so don't give up. Perhaps there's an option somewhere that needs to be selected, or perhaps you need to try a different boot image or ROM file.

Shapeshifter doesn't need a FPU. My A1200 and A600 don't have them.

You can definitely add the AddBuffers command to the User-Startup, but I think you can also effectively do the same thing by increasing the buffers for each partition in HDToolBox as well, which might be more efficient than adding extra commands to the boot sequence.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 25, 2011, 10:21:31 PM
Is it possible to give the Mac OS an actual HFS partition to work on?  In a fit of pique I've gone and decided to go back to 3.9 on an 80GB hard drive, but I'd like to make a partition that is Mac native for the shapeshifter (the idea is to make a partition as well for AROS 68K to live in.)

My initial thought was to slam it on into my linux box, cfdisk it and make a bunch of partitions, but I wasn't too sure which ones should be primary and which should be logical, or if I couldn't just do this with HDToolBox either.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: mongo on May 25, 2011, 10:38:31 PM
Quote from: TheBilgeRat;640247
Is it possible to give the Mac OS an actual HFS partition to work on?


Yes.

I think the partition has to be in the first 2GB of the drive though.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Crumb on May 26, 2011, 12:30:09 AM
Quote from: XDelusion;621577
Cammy, if I hold Shift, my system locks, no reboot. I have to power down to get back to the OS.

Does Shapeshifter need an FPU or something? Or I am wondering...

since RAD will not use my Apollo 060's Fast RAM, maybe some other programs like Shape Shifter are having issue with it too?


Also can I just use the Addbuffers command in my user-startup?


Try to disable specific 060 caches (Superscalar IIRC).
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 29, 2011, 03:42:11 AM
Anybody know a good place to get OS 7.6.1 for install?  Cammy's hardfile doesn't work if you are installing to a dedicated partition.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 29, 2011, 04:59:11 AM
Well, found out that 7.6.1 was never released "into the wild," so am sourcing a solution elsewhere.

Also, for the myved etc etc, I think the easiest solution is to download the whole shebang here:

http://aminet.net/package/util/libs/MMULib#contents

This has all of it, plus a handy dandy install script and the full set of documentation, which is a good read.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: zipper on May 29, 2011, 07:13:58 AM
http://nbbemulation.free.fr/forum_macintosh/viewtopic.php?id=43 at least US 7.6 is there.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: bbond007 on May 29, 2011, 08:19:47 AM
Quote from: TheBilgeRat;640988
Anybody know a good place to get OS 7.6.1 for install?  Cammy's hardfile doesn't work if you are installing to a dedicated partition.


You can't just boot Cammy's hardfile, format the partition and drag the system folder over from Cammy's hardfile?

I thought for sure that is how I did it.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: rvo_nl on May 29, 2011, 11:38:50 AM
if not, you can use this method on the infamous 'jeans' hardfile that you can find online or on some cucd. or try to find macos8.1 classic.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 29, 2011, 04:30:02 PM
Quote from: rvo_nl;641081
if not, you can use this method on the infamous 'jeans' hardfile that you can find online or on some cucd. or try to find macos8.1 classic.

You know what was terrible?  I had kept the copy of OS 8 that came with my power mac clone so many years ago.  I found it in my CD holder, only to realize it had a split! :furious:

Ah, well, it's (hopefully) sorted soon.  Oh, and I can't get Cammys HDfile to boot - I'm not sure if my download is corrupted or not, so I'm just going about it the manual way for now.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Xanxi on May 29, 2011, 04:40:30 PM
The Muv-thing driver that Cammy is talking about is pretty good.
I use it on my 1200 shapeshifter setup (AGA and B1260) and i get 0.750 of the video speed of a real Quadra 605 Mac according to Speedometer 4.02 in 640*480 8 bits.
Not sure faster result could be achieved with AGA.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 29, 2011, 08:20:22 PM
The issue I'm having now is that I boot up into 7.6.1, and as per shapeshifter instructions, I set the hard drive partiton I want to use in the prefs.  OS comes up, says it needs to be initialized.  I say OK, give it a name, it churns for 30 minutes, then says Disk Initialization failed.  I'm not sure what is messing up.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Flashlab on May 29, 2011, 08:37:38 PM
My experience is that hard files with SFS are faster than dedicated Mac partitions and more flexible too.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: rvo_nl on May 29, 2011, 08:44:13 PM
Quote from: TheBilgeRat;641194
The issue I'm having now is that I boot up into 7.6.1, and as per shapeshifter instructions, I set the hard drive partiton I want to use in the prefs. OS comes up, says it needs to be initialized. I say OK, give it a name, it churns for 30 minutes, then says Disk Initialization failed. I'm not sure what is messing up.

annoying, but sounds familiar. I had loads of issues configuring a partition for mac emulation. in the end I had to split it in 2. That worked, somehow. Also make sure its below the first 4GB of your drive! You need to boot from the Jeans hardfile. After macos has loaded, it will ask you to initialise the new partition. this should now work. then copy the files over from the hardfile to your partition. hardfiles are in general the better option. but a dedicated partition is ofcourse way cooler.. :) good luck.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 29, 2011, 08:45:18 PM
I actually figured it out - you aren't supposed to use the mac side initializer I believe.  I just rebooted the mac and the HD showed up.

System 7 is happily installing away.  I set aside a partition for it so I may as well go for a dedicated partition.  I'm rather impressed so far as to how fast it is and this is just off the CDROM.  Now I have a huge stack of mac disks to go through and see if they are any good.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: rvo_nl on May 29, 2011, 10:07:04 PM
let me know your greatest finds, please. compatibility and availability were dissapointing for me. a lot of games you find online need a ppc processor. I only found 3 playable demos and a few old simulators so far. they do run great though, the emulation is pretty good. I do use Fusion instead of Shapeshifter, but there are hardly any speed differences. have fun.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: LaserBack on May 29, 2011, 11:19:17 PM
Quote from: Cammy;621438
Here's a photo of my A1200 running Photoshop. It's perfectly usable too.
http://www.amiga.org/gallery/index.php?n=3456


which version of photoshop is ?
where I Can download it?
thanks
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 29, 2011, 11:34:22 PM
Well, so far its fine.  It crashes my system unless I use Extensions disabled, so I need to spend some time tracking down that culprit.  So far it has done what I wanted - I can install my complete NAt Geo that I bought ages ago and only works on Win95 era machines.  As for games, I haven't attempted that yet.  The era of "good mac gaming" was the starcraft, warcraft, Myth, Civ era, which I believe was the PowerPC era.  I'd need a lot more ram for that too.  Looks like Zorram and a Picasso 4 are the next ones to get.  It really sucks having to use an interlaced setting for shapeshifter.  I feel like I'm having a seizure.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 30, 2011, 09:24:20 PM
Well, some of the crashing was due I'm sure to the fact that I had memory set very low :lol:

It's been very fun to run System 7.6.1.  It actually reminds me of a fond time between the end of my amiga days and the final caving into Wintendo when mac games just weren't being released.  Makes me wish I still had my PowerComputing Powerbase.  The thing definitely needs more memory, tho...  So it's either a zoram or I get lucky and snag an accelerator with memory on it.

I fired up the old NatGeo complete today and got a treat - an advert for Kodak from the late 90's (pushing their "photo CD" technology).
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: rvo_nl on May 30, 2011, 10:00:06 PM
fun :) natgeo has some great cd's, dvd's and blu-ray's these days..

what system are you running shapeshifter on? a graphics card makes an amazing difference. I refuse to use my Amiga without one. go buy one NOW. seriously.

http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=15931

you wont regret.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 30, 2011, 10:21:17 PM
Quote from: rvo_nl;641444
fun :) natgeo has some great cd's, dvd's and blu-ray's these days..

what system are you running shapeshifter on? a graphics card makes an amazing difference. I refuse to use my Amiga without one. go buy one NOW. seriously.

http://www.amibay.com/showthread.php?t=15931

you wont regret.

It's already sold and 300 euros is way out of my league.  I paid about that much for my 4000 alone.

I would love to have a picasso 4 or an indivision 4000, but with one rather pricey and one non-existent its going to be a while.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: amigadave on May 31, 2011, 01:44:43 AM
Quote from: Xanxi;641152
The Muv-thing driver that Cammy is talking about is pretty good.
I use it on my 1200 shapeshifter setup (AGA and B1260) and i get 0.750 of the video speed of a real Quadra 605 Mac according to Speedometer 4.02 in 640*480 8 bits.
Not sure faster result could be achieved with AGA.

Where is this driver available for download?  I have an A1200 with IndivisionAGA & B1260 w/256mb Fast RAM that I would like to set Shapeshifter up on this week.  Does this "Muv-thing driver" work with the IndivisionAGA?  Can you access a wireless NIC in the PCMCIA slot from the Mac emulation?  If yes, what would be the best browser to use from the Mac emulation while running MacOS7.6?  And finally, on such a setup as mine, would it be better to try to get MacOS8, 8.5, or 9 running on Shapeshifter?  I have heard about other people running MacOS8 and maybe MacOS9 on Shapeshifter, but can't remember where I read it.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on May 31, 2011, 06:01:25 AM
Quote from: amigadave;641473
Where is this driver available for download?  I have an A1200 with IndivisionAGA & B1260 w/256mb Fast RAM that I would like to set Shapeshifter up on this week.  Does this "Muv-thing driver" work with the IndivisionAGA?  Can you access a wireless NIC in the PCMCIA slot from the Mac emulation?  If yes, what would be the best browser to use from the Mac emulation while running MacOS7.6?  And finally, on such a setup as mine, would it be better to try to get MacOS8, 8.5, or 9 running on Shapeshifter?  I have heard about other people running MacOS8 and maybe MacOS9 on Shapeshifter, but can't remember where I read it.

I have been reading a lot at lowendmac.com.  OS 7.6.1 evidently is the "sweet spot" in the mac world for speed/performance.  I couldn't answer the if's with any certainty, not having any of that gear, but the link for the "mu thingy" I posed farther up in the thread.  It's the whole MMUlib, but it comes with an install script that lets you customize your install to just what you want, or you can install them all separately.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: magnetic on May 31, 2011, 08:09:05 AM
amigagdave

you dont need the MU tool as its for people who DONT have an MMU (and you must with the 060) iirc
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Damion on May 31, 2011, 08:36:44 AM
Erm, '060's came MMU-less, but the MuEVD driver (and the rest of the software) requires an MMU.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Xanxi on May 31, 2011, 10:19:23 AM
060 cpu do have a mmu on amiga or they can't work with amiga os.

MmuEvd uses the mmu of course.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: zipper on May 31, 2011, 10:26:09 AM
68EC060 doesn't have FPU either MMU.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Xanxi on May 31, 2011, 11:58:25 AM
Quote from: zipper;641512
68EC060 doesn't have FPU either MMU.


These one do exist in the wild but not in the amiga world.
I believe Atari users can use those EC060.

68LC060 (without FPU) can however be used on amiga but need special libs. The original Apollo060@75 use a LC060.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: HotRod on May 31, 2011, 12:09:07 PM
Quote from: Xanxi;641511
060 cpu do have a mmu on amiga or they can't work with amiga os.

MmuEvd uses the mmu of course.


Huh? the 000/010/020 doesn't have a MMU and not all 030s either AFAIK. MacOS requires a MMU but not AmigaOS.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Xanxi on May 31, 2011, 12:47:46 PM
Quote from: HotRod;641519
Huh? the 000/010/020 doesn't have a MMU and not all 030s either AFAIK. MacOS requires a MMU but not AmigaOS.



I'm speaking about 68040 and 68060. Those CPU need a MMU on the amiga or won't work for long past the kickstart screen.

Otherwise, i have here a nice new 68EC060 80 MHz. Feel free to buy it from me for 100 EUR :D
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: amigadave on May 31, 2011, 11:29:20 PM
Before this thread gets any further off topic discussing if 060's in Amiga's must have an MMU or not, can someone please point me to a location to find this "MmuEvd" software that is supposed to be so great for helping an A1200/060 run Shapeshifter on AGA?

I tried to Google it and only found this thread and nothing else that was related to the Amiga, or Mac emulation.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Damion on June 01, 2011, 12:25:53 AM
Quote
Before this thread gets any further off topic discussing if 060's in Amiga's must have an MMU or not, can someone please point me to a location to find this "MmuEvd" software that is supposed to be so great for helping an A1200/060 run Shapeshifter on AGA?


Try an aminet search for MuEVD and MuLib.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: TheBilgeRat on June 01, 2011, 01:45:14 AM
AmigaDave, did you read this post?  All of the Mu(insert ending here) are in this one package.  Do you have me on your ignore list or something?

Quote from: TheBilgeRat;641004
Well, found out that 7.6.1 was never released "into the wild," so am sourcing a solution elsewhere.

Also, for the myved etc etc, I think the easiest solution is to download the whole shebang here:

http://aminet.net/package/util/libs/MMULib#contents

This has all of it, plus a handy dandy install script and the full set of documentation, which is a good read.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: neoCDTV on July 02, 2011, 02:26:46 PM
The Graffiti card will increase the video output significally, but therefore you need to switch off MuFastZero. It works even faster with Fusion than with Shapeshifter. Im using it with ACA1230@56Mhz and I am really impressed.

Quote from: Cammy;609490
If anyone would like to try Shapeshifter on their Amiga, I have gone to the effort of mounting and installing all the disk images for OS 7.6 as well as the 7.6.1 updates and all the other updates available, including the later Appearance Manager extension which makes OS7 look like OS8. These are all official Apple updates and are freely available on their site, along with the disk images for the OS, but I have installed it all and packaged the harddrive file for anyone else to try.

http://home.exetel.com.au/~amiga/MacOS7.6.1.zip

All you need to run it on a sufficiently expanded 020-060 Amiga are:

ShapeShifter 3.11 - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/ShapeShifter
MuEVD - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/MuEVD
MuFastZero - http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/MuFastZero
VirtualLink - http://aminet.net/package/comm/tcp/vlink

Here are the recommended ROM and OS for each CPU type:

Best ROM Images

68000: Mac Se
68020: Mac LC
68030: Mac LC III
68040: Quadra 650
68060: Quadra 650

Best OS Versions

68000: 6.0.8
68020: 7.1.1
68030: 7.6.1
68040: 8.1
68060: 8.1

This forum has further help with Mac ROMs - http://nbbemulation.free.fr/forum_ma...opic.php?id=69

Remember: You can play games like Warcraft II, Links Pro Golf, Settlers II, Prince of Persia II and other cool games and sequels that weren't released on the Amiga, all in 640x480 in 256 colours! With the AMAZING MuEVD video driver, these games are totally playable on a 030 AGA machine.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: bbond007 on September 22, 2011, 12:26:39 AM
Quote from: LaserBack;641229
which version of photoshop is ?
where I Can download it?
thanks


http://www.amberdean.com/68kp/software.html
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: bbond007 on September 22, 2011, 03:01:04 AM
Quote from: Cammy;618868
Please try replacing PrepareEmul with these:

MuEVD - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/MuEVD
MuFastZero - http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/MuFastZero

Your Startup-Sequence after C:SetPatch QUIET should have these lines added:

C:MuMove4k PrepareEmul A1200
C:MuFastZero On

Making sure you have installed all the files to C: and Libs:

Cammy,

C:MuMove4k PrepareEmul A1200

causes my computer not to boot.

C:MuMove4k A1200

works though... what do you think that means?

Photoshop 4.0 runs surprisingly well for a 40mhz 030.

Thanks for figuring this all out!

I found this to be a good resource for getting applications for the mac...

http://www.amberdean.com/68kp/software.html

I was having a hard time figuring out how to get them on my mac partition.

I just downloaded all the files from that page and burned them to a CD.

Now I have vlink.device set up so I can FTP with transmit.

-nate
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: amigadave on September 22, 2011, 05:51:28 AM
Quote from: TheBilgeRat;641633
AmigaDave, did you read this post?  All of the Mu(insert ending here) are in this one package.  Do you have me on your ignore list or something?

No, not ignoring you, but with several people spelling the package differently (some use Mmu, Mu, Mv, mym, etc.) it's a bit confusing, and being away for most of the last 10 weeks (4 weeks working in Hawaii and another 4 weeks on a 3,700+ mile road trip), I have missed a lot of posts on many forum sites.

Thanks for the info, I will get it downloaded and installed soon.  (I have lots of projects going right now and must prepare for the AmiWest 2011 Show)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Crumb on September 22, 2011, 08:49:21 AM
Quote from: Xanxi;641522
I'm speaking about 68040 and 68060. Those CPU need a MMU on the amiga or won't work for long past the kickstart screen.

Otherwise, i have here a nice new 68EC060 80 MHz. Feel free to buy it from me for 100 EUR :D


AFAIK that would depend on 68040.library used, as it was explained in other thread the cache control registers can be configured to avoid using cache in some memory areas so MMU wouldn't be mandatory.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: zipper on September 22, 2011, 09:36:51 AM
Quote from: bbond007;660513
Cammy,
C:MuMove4k PrepareEmul A1200
causes my computer not to boot.

C:MuMove4k A1200
works though... what do you think that means?


Have you removed the original prepareemul program from C:

either: MuMove4K PREPAREEMUL
or if it doesn't work : MuMove4K PREPAREEMUL A1200

should do the job.

> " Be warned! The "PREPAREEMUL" option is really a hack. This doesn't
mean its worse than the original "PREPAREEMUL" - this is a hack as well. "
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 03, 2012, 08:10:22 PM
Been playing with MacOS 7.6.1. This Mac stuff is fun and runs like a sucker on my 060 :).  There are many games to be explored and I've started already Warcraft II and Prince of Persia. Must try different apps and more games :banana:

Thanks again Cammy :)

PS. stick wth 7.6.1 and leave 8.0/8.1 for the random testing.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Karlos on December 03, 2012, 09:42:12 PM
Did anybody else ever try the SavagePPC video driver? That was pretty neat on AGA. I only had the evaluation version (which limited the res) but it was pretty damned quick. As you might expect, using your PPC for the job rather than the 68K.

It all became redundant once I installed a graphics card, however. I actually used Office (don't taze me bro) and chemdraw on shapeshifter running 7.5.3 (?) to complete my final year writeup.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 04, 2012, 02:24:22 PM
Yes tried it (full version on EAB server) and it didn't work for me. But it's useless anyway since there's CardTrickEVD and PippinEVD (http://www.iki.fi/sintonen/sw.html) with RTG to use.
PS. I think it SavagePPC works only with older Shapeshifter versions
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Crumb on December 04, 2012, 02:48:28 PM
Quote from: Cammy;621503
BooBoo, you should definitely try the AGA Boost 030 driver: http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/agaboost030ec

I hope it's speedy enough to get things done, I haven't tried it myself yet, I hoped there would be a 020 version to use with my 10MB A1200.


AgaBoost driver worked with 020, I don't know if it was Aminet version the one I ran but I promise it worked with 020+8MB fast.

BTW, WarcraftII stopped working on my miggy since certain Shapeshifter version (3.6? 3.7?) was released, I haven't tried again with 3.11
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 04, 2012, 02:56:02 PM
Warcraft II working with ShapeShifter 3.11 here.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Karlos on December 04, 2012, 04:02:22 PM
Quote from: Bamiga2002;717452
Yes tried it (full version on EAB server) and it didn't work for me. But it's useless anyway since there's CardTrickEVD and PippinEVD (http://www.iki.fi/sintonen/sw.html) with RTG to use.
PS. I think it SavagePPC works only with older Shapeshifter versions


Are either of those needed once you have a gfx card? I seem to recall it working just fine under CGX without any additional drivers. Although Pippin was an overlay one IIRC. I never used it as I used to run it fullscreen 1280x1024.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: Bamiga2002 on December 04, 2012, 04:20:28 PM
On my A1200 with Med+voodoo3 I use CardTrickEVD. It's faster than the drivers that come by default. So it's not necessarily needed but I definitely recommend it. Okayish < FAST :)
And use "direct" mode :)
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: danwood on April 21, 2014, 09:27:33 PM
Decided it was time to finally get round to trying Shapeshifter on my A1200 030/25mhz (64 mb RAM).

Followed all the steps in Cammy's tutorial but on Mac OC booting it stops and says "Sorry A System Error Occurred, error type 10" and I have to Restart.

Holding down shift and disabling extensions makes no difference either, any ideas?
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: LiveForIt on April 22, 2014, 12:39:46 AM
Quote from: XDelusion;621577
Cammy, if I hold Shift, my system locks, no reboot. I have to power down to get back to the OS.

Does Shapeshifter need an FPU or something? Or I am wondering...

since RAD will not use my Apollo 060's Fast RAM, maybe some other programs like Shape Shifter are having issue with it too?


Also can I just use the Addbuffers command in my user-startup?

You need to disable superscalar I belive. Before starting shapeshifter / Fusion.
I don't have a 68060 my self, so I can't help you anymore, but you should find some info about it using google or maybe some else can show you how to.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: nyteschayde on April 22, 2014, 01:47:55 AM
OMG Cammy you're the best!

Quote from: Cammy;609490
If anyone would like to try Shapeshifter on their Amiga, I have gone to the effort of mounting and installing all the disk images for OS 7.6 as well as the 7.6.1 updates and all the other updates available, including the later Appearance Manager extension which makes OS7 look like OS8. These are all official Apple updates and are freely available on their site, along with the disk images for the OS, but I have installed it all and packaged the harddrive file for anyone else to try.

http://home.exetel.com.au/~amiga/MacOS7.6.1.zip

All you need to run it on a sufficiently expanded 020-060 Amiga are:

ShapeShifter 3.11 - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/ShapeShifter
MuEVD - http://aminet.net/package/misc/emu/MuEVD
MuFastZero - http://aminet.net/package/util/boot/MuFastZero
VirtualLink - http://aminet.net/package/comm/tcp/vlink

Here are the recommended ROM and OS for each CPU type:

Best ROM Images

68000: Mac Se
68020: Mac LC
68030: Mac LC III
68040: Quadra 650
68060: Quadra 650

Best OS Versions

68000: 6.0.8
68020: 7.1.1
68030: 7.6.1
68040: 8.1
68060: 8.1

This forum has further help with Mac ROMs - http://nbbemulation.free.fr/forum_ma...opic.php?id=69

Remember: You can play games like Warcraft II, Links Pro Golf, Settlers II, Prince of Persia II and other cool games and sequels that weren't released on the Amiga, all in 640x480 in 256 colours! With the AMAZING MuEVD video driver, these games are totally playable on a 030 AGA machine.
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: jkadaver on January 22, 2022, 02:00:05 PM
Does anyone have a live link this seems dead -thanks
Title: Re: Shapeshifter. Best mac os for 030?
Post by: zipper on January 22, 2022, 04:18:52 PM
Link for what?