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Author Topic: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?  (Read 5784 times)

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Offline gizmomelb

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2006, 01:11:43 PM »
Quote

boing wrote:

...
  Frankly I've often wondered by various interests haven't just hired a lwayer backtrack the various post-CBM "IP" transfers and find out where it all stands.  If Deloitte and Touche liquidators screwed up it may well be that at least the OS is floating around out there, actually unowned in a grey netherworld (legally).
...



My ears pricked up at that - if someone cares enough to fill me in on what the current known status is, as well as some of the background (I was out of the Amiga when the crash came) then I can ask my contacts at Deloittes and maybe I can do some digging around.  I work for a company that writes legal tracking and forensics software, and have good contact with Deloittes.  Not guaranteeing I can find anything (confidentiality and all that).. but at least I should be able to find out who the current listed owners of different names/IPs actually are, and possibly what isn't owned by anyone.

Gizmomelb
 

Offline amiga1084

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #15 on: January 13, 2006, 01:16:00 PM »
Then Why Spend Money On It? Printing posters, stickers,
conventions,Amiga expo's etc
 

Offline uncharted

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2006, 01:44:57 PM »
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bloodline wrote:

Because 68k asm source code for a 15 years old operating system is very close to useless. TECHNOLOGY HAS MOVED ON! :-D


So what about an OS that tries to be a carbon copy of 15 year old operating system?
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2006, 01:48:20 PM »
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uncharted wrote:
Quote

bloodline wrote:

Because 68k asm source code for a 15 years old operating system is very close to useless. TECHNOLOGY HAS MOVED ON! :-D


So what about an OS that tries to be a carbon copy of 15 year old operating system?


Fine, if you don't plan to sell it ;-)

Offline uncharted

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #18 on: January 13, 2006, 01:51:38 PM »
@Boing

Yes I'm aware of that ruling, it was brought up (along with the C= 1.0 source in a book episode) by many a blue when MorphOS' legal status is being questioned.

However, while Escom were a bunch of monkeys, I'd imagine that Gateway would have done thier homework.  I think there is little chance that the corporate sharks, er, I mean, lawyers would have over-looked something as obvious as that.
 

Offline uncharted

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #19 on: January 13, 2006, 01:56:25 PM »
@Senex

Don't forget that Amiga Development LLC filed several patents on systems/technologies they created themselves. (AmigaObjects Etc.)  
 

Offline xeron

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #20 on: January 13, 2006, 01:59:02 PM »
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Even Hyperion have stated that little of the origianl source code was used, do you really think it would have taken 4 years JUST to port an OS from one machine to the next with the full source code?


Actually, a lot of OS4 is based on the AmigaOS source code. Obviously it has a lot of changes, since OS4 is a massive upgrade to pretty much every area of AmigaOS. Exec was written entirely from scratch, and DOS has been heavily rewritten, but the changelogs for nearly all components go back to 3.x.
Playstation Network ID: xeron6
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #21 on: January 13, 2006, 02:07:48 PM »
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xeron wrote:
Quote

Even Hyperion have stated that little of the origianl source code was used, do you really think it would have taken 4 years JUST to port an OS from one machine to the next with the full source code?


Actually, a lot of OS4 is based on the AmigaOS source code. Obviously it has a lot of changes, since OS4 is a massive upgrade to pretty much every area of AmigaOS. Exec was written entirely from scratch, and DOS has been heavily rewritten, but the changelogs for nearly all components go back to 3.x.


When pressed Ben Hermans said that the only thing he could remember being used from original AmigaOS source code was some binary tree algorithms...

Anyway as a coder yourself you know that very little of AmigaOS 3.x code is in AOS4.0.

Offline uncharted

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #22 on: January 13, 2006, 02:13:28 PM »
 :-?
 

Offline Senex

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #23 on: January 13, 2006, 02:20:32 PM »
@Gizmomelb

There is a german source by Rainer Benda (former employee of Commodore Germany and Amiga Technologies).

A quick summary:

On the CD-ROM "Kickstart Archive", published by Thomas Unger, there is a chapter "Patente", which does list what has been purchased by Escom under the patent number "US 5,594,473" from Commodore back then.

From that listing one can't conclude that the Amiga operating system would have been part of that buyout.

On July 16, 1997, there has been a judgement (13 U 97/97) by the Higher Regional Court in Celle, Lower Saxony, Germany, which does contain the following paragraph:

"In den zwischen der Commodore-Amiga-Gruppe und der X. geschlossenen Veträgen ist nur von -sämtlichen aufgrund der Patente bestehenden Rechte, Titel und Rechtsansprüche- die Rede; das Betriebssystem OS3.1 ist dort nicht als solches bezeichnet. Den vorgelegten Unterlagen über eine Vereinbarung zwischen diesen Parteien vom 13.03.1995 lässt sich deshalb nicht hinreichend überprüfbar entnehmen, daß die X. die ausschliesslichen Lizenzrechte an dem Betriebssystem erworben hat."

In short it says that in the contracts with the Commodore-Amiga group only those rights are mentioned which are based on the patents - but that the operating system itself wouldn't be mentioned as such. Based on the documents from March 13, 1995, there is no sufficient proof of exclusive rights to the operating system.

Furthermore the court did rebuke the lack of lucidity of the situation.
 

Offline snowman040Topic starter

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #24 on: January 14, 2006, 12:07:32 AM »
Ok, so I guess attempt of buying all Amiga IP, patents, brand etc. would be real pain in the arse job ? With lawsuits, licences, etc, etc...?

No one answered second part of the question ? How much money Gateway paid for Amiga ? I remember Escom paid 5mil$ for Commodore ?

regards
 

Offline bhoggett

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #25 on: January 14, 2006, 02:31:27 AM »
IIRC Gateway retained most of the patents related to "Classic" Amiga technology, certainly in terms of hardware. Aminos (later Amiga Inc) did buy the trademark, software (possibly including software patents or exclusive licenses regarding the original software, which Gateway had no use for themselves).

However, haven't quite a few of the original patents expired by now?
Bill Hoggett
 

Offline yester64

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #26 on: January 14, 2006, 06:55:06 AM »
Aehem... as i mentioned in the 3th post.
There is a company who is currently owning the Commodore name and paid, i believe, about 32Mil.$.
I have to look up the facts, but Commodore is working again.
From Amiga Inc. i don't expect anything. There is nothing taking off.
 

Offline amiga1084

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #27 on: January 14, 2006, 09:37:35 AM »
Hello All,

Could Gateway take the licences from so called Amiga
Corp at any time? As Gateway still owns the patents?
 

Offline Oliver

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #28 on: January 14, 2006, 09:58:59 AM »
@yester64

I believe this incarnation of C= is completely disassociated with Amiga and its related patents.  Isn't this the case?
Good good study, day day up!
 

Offline Senex

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Re: Amiga technology and patents ownership ?
« Reply #29 from previous page: January 14, 2006, 12:38:42 PM »
@Oliver

Right