Amiga 1300[What ifs]

[WolfToTheMoon]

Reading a bit through the wonderful Amiga History webpage and found this...

Commodore UK were planning to develop the current Amiga technology for the next year (1995, although a next generation Amiga would likely have slipped to 1996). An unconfirmed rumour suggested that the new line that is referred to would be based upon an upgraded A1200. The Amiga 1300, as it was dubbed, would feature an 25 or 33MHz EC030, 2Mb Chip, 2MB Fast RAM, as well as an internal CD-ROM and an optional hard drive (the hard drive would be added by local dealers to take advantage of the latest prices). This rumour had been circulating for a number of months before Commodore went into liquidation, the A1300 would have been a prototypical design created by Commodore UK

Ok, A1300 never been confirmed to existed so it's just a hypothetical, but is it just me or this sounds awfully underpowered for the time? Or maybe it was their intention to sell it as a (very)cheap PC alternative? How did the A1200 compare to a cheap 286/386 system pricewise?

[Matt_H]

The first 1300 reports I saw were shortly after the Escom acquisition. I'm pretty sure it was a placeholder name for what became the Walker (itself another placeholder title).

[Xanxi]

Reading a bit through the wonderful Amiga History webpage and found this...


Ok, A1300 never been confirmed to existed so it's just a hypothetical, but is it just me or this sounds awfully underpowered for the time? Or maybe it was their intention to sell it as a (very)cheap PC alternative? How did the A1200 compare to a cheap 286/386 system pricewise?

286/386 would have been ridiculous for 1996, full of Pentium and Pentium MMX along with Windows 95!
An A1300 with those specs would have been cool in an amigan point of view but no way to compete with a PC.

[save2600]

I can check later when I get home or maybe someone here already knows... but there were some oddball numbers like this from a Canadien Amiga mail order house. After Commodore folded, they basically took A1200 motherboards and towerized them. Some models had accelerators, extra RAM, HD's, etc.

IMO, Commodore themselves would never have marketed an A1300. You ever notice how all their model numbers were divisible? A1000<>A500. A2000<>A1000. A3000<>A1500. A4000<>A2000. A1200<>A600, etc., etc. Guess that wouldn't apply to the A2500 though... DOH! lol

[amigakit]

Dave Pleasance (MD of Commodore UK) was proposing the A1300 around 1993 in response to users request for integral CD, a full 32-bit CPU and fast memory.  These were the failings of the A1200.

The black A1300 with CD was shown as an artist's impression in the Amiga Format Annual 1993.

It would have been viable as around this time the Atari Falcon, 3DO and other consoles were built around similar specifications in terms of memory and CPU.

In 1994 when Commodore filed for Chapter 11, Dave Pleasance had plans for Commodore UK (which was profitable until the end) to buy the assets and continue development.

[Digiman]

Some called it the A1400 some the A1800 but Lew's 'no comment' in Xmas 93/Jan 84 was an admission. Keep googling

Timescale was ready before Xmas 94

Status was motherboard prototype completed, case specifications complete, case design incomplete.

Tech specs = A1200/CD32 features/expansion ie AGA/CD32 chipset plus.....
68EC020 @ 28mhz (same speed in reality to 25mhz 030)
2mb chip + either 2mb 32bit fast RAM on motherboard
AKIKO on motherboard
HD Floppy disk drive
No Zorro slots
Processor trap door compatible expansion
PCMCIA unconfirmed
Dual IDE for accommodating HDD and CD-ROM inside case.

Form factor = 3 box design using case of A3000 dimensions + A4000 keyboard.

Price point=£499 with 3.5" HDD £599 with HDD & CD

Reason = A4000/030 & 040 too expensive for people not using Zorro, A1200/CD32 too slow stock speed &2.5" HDD too expensive, no mid range competitive with 386/486 machines.

Reported by Amiga Shopper/Format and CU Amiga. C= UK spouted 'no comment'

Remember PCs were around £999 for good soundcard + CD in early 93 and 33mhz 486 same in early 94 and both still ISA based so AGA is superior on some levels. Amiga fans were crying out for such a machine as were software houses. Could have given them the £££s to finish AA/AGA+ too. Shame, sounds like C= UK finally 'got it'. Management buyout would have pushed ahead with this too.

edit:didn't see Amigkit post.

[Khephren]

93' or 94' this could perhaps have worked. Later than that -your up against PS1 and Saturn at the low end, and Pentium at the high end. But with the A500+ quickly replaced by the A600, people had already had their fingers burnt. Imagine then getting the A1200 and having it phased out a year later!

A lot of these specs are what the A1200 should have had. I think Commodore had missed the boat once they'd buggered up AGA.

[WolfToTheMoon]

93' or 94' this could perhaps have worked. Later than that -your up against PS1 and Saturn at the low end, and Pentium at the high end. But with the A500+ quickly replaced by the A600, people had already had their fingers burnt. Imagine then getting the A1200 and having it phased out a year later!

A lot of these specs are what the A1200 should have had. I think Commodore had missed the boat once they'd buggered up AGA.

Yeah...
Maybe it would be enticing enough for (then)current Amiga owners to upgrade, especially if it also had an OS upgrade, but it wouldn't work in the outside world, especially in 95'.

[Digiman]

93' or 94' this could perhaps have worked. Later than that -your up against PS1 and Saturn at the low end, and Pentium at the high end. But with the A500+ quickly replaced by the A600, people had already had their fingers burnt. Imagine then getting the A1200 and having it phased out a year later!

A lot of these specs are what the A1200 should have had. I think Commodore had missed the boat once they'd buggered up AGA.

First 4mb Pentium 60 multimedia machines mid 93 onwards cost anywhere from $2500-4000 depending on brand. Same value with £ sign for UK. Even in mid 1994 Pentium 75mhz were about £1500 in the UK.

People forget the costs, 4mb alone was about £125 even in 94. £500 Amiga 1400 would have undercut branded 386DX40 multimedia machines and played better games.

PS1 and Saturn are red herrings, if you needed a computer you still needed a computer so they make no difference. You opposition was Falcon, Archimedes, Falcon, Mac LC 3/4 and ISA 386DX/486SX PC. And remember in Europe PCs and Macs were very expensive. USA RRP in $ = same in £ too.

And Windows 95 still a year away, Win 95+USB 2 years.

Would have sold very nicely for Sept-Xmas 94 IMO

[Khephren]

True, there was always a place for nice low priced home computer, that could run good apps and play multiplayer games (I remember PC gaming in that era as a lonely hobby, before netplay became common much later).

I'm not familiar with PC prices of the era, there's a few price guides in ACE magazine. I'm interested in this, but can't find many figures. I expect even an amstrad 386DX with vga would still be more expensive than the 1300/1400 . But come with a monitor and HDD, which would make it more competitive.

I don't see consoles as a red hearing. Rather the low end Amiga's were a Trojan Horse. It sucked gamers in, and spat hobby computer users out. I know many in the UK and Europe bought the Amiga as a games machine (I did), but then discovered it's other joys You can't discount how important that was.

Many of my friends either dumped their home computers for consoles, or got a PC, or both. This pretty much happened in '94 '95. Low end Amiga's (which were the majority of sales) were, like it or not, stuck between the PC and the consoles. It could have been an advantage, but the lack luster A1200, and the overpriced A600 turned out to be otherwise. If Mehdi Ali (cursed be his name) and given the money and resources needed, it could  have been so different. Just my opinion of course

Also, would the A1200 have been discontinued? If not, you end up in a Falcon/STE situation, developers writing for the lowest common denominator.

[runequester]

For amiga software, this would have been a nice system. Probably better in 92, but even 93 or 94, people were still buying 1200's, so they would have bought this.

Strike a deal with whoever to make expansion cards cheaper and its a winner.

[Digiman]

David Pleasance of C= UK knew this would work. Had management buyout happened quickly this would have been a priority.

A real alternative to budget PCs of the time, and in 1994 Windows 3.1 was pathetic looking to all shoppers. Home users never used more than graphics/sound/cdrom ISA cards anyway so 4000/030 Zorro slots were overkill.

One of my pet projects is to one day build one inc special case...I have an A3000ish looking design sorted already

[runequester]

I guess maybe this was just a local thing but I dont know many, if any people who sat and compared specs and bought their computer based purely on that.
 
People bought an amiga because they wanted an amiga and the software eco system that went with that. Same for people who bought a PC or a Mac.
 
Buying a 2000 dollar PC is no dice if you want to run an amiga application, and no amount of 68060 will help you run a PC or Mac application (well, actually.. it might for mac )

[spaceman88]

I can check later when I get home or maybe someone here already knows... but there were some oddball numbers like this from a Canadien Amiga mail order house. After Commodore folded, they basically took A1200 motherboards and towerized them. Some models had accelerators, extra RAM, HD's, etc.

IMO, Commodore themselves would never have marketed an A1300. You ever notice how all their model numbers were divisible? A1000<>A500. A2000<>A1000. A3000<>A1500. A4000<>A2000. A1200<>A600, etc., etc. Guess that wouldn't apply to the A2500 though... DOH! lol

I think the Canadian mail order house advertised an A2200, with an expanded CD32 motherboard.

[Digiman]

I guess maybe this was just a local thing but I dont know many, if any people who sat and compared specs and bought their computer based purely on that.
 
People bought an amiga because they wanted an amiga and the software eco system that went with that. Same for people who bought a PC or a Mac.
 
Buying a 2000 dollar PC is no dice if you want to run an amiga application, and no amount of 68060 will help you run a PC or Mac application (well, actually.. it might for mac )

Hmmm in the UK at the time of 4000/040 and 1200 launches home user PC sales were more hype than substance.

The new buyers looked at demos running and picked a format in their budget ie 386/Mac LC III, Falcon, Acorn or Amiga. 4000=too much,1200=old style toy computer look and 'slow' 14mhz with expensive HDD/no HD FLOPPY/Little RAM

A1200 and Atari Falcon looked cheaper than 3 box design of Mac/PC but options cost 200-300% more. CPU/RAM upgrades not sold in regular High St stores here either.

Nobody cared about crappy DOS/WIN at that time in the UK, and PC home users were viewed as fools though. Funny thing is things were back to the early 80s of UK home computing where only the creative/educational/gaming potential mattered for new comers NOT the brand of the CPU or OS. Amiga had everything it needed AND CHEAPER than SEGA/Nintendo cartridges or Mac/PC creative/small business software.

Of course owners would become viciously loyal fans of their Alt. format choice.....hey it worked for Mac sales in mid 90s :roflmao:

http://support.apple.com/kb/SP209

That is what Commodore needed to copy, the ethos of the Mac LC3 030/25 in pizza box case with no excessive expansions, the 4000/030 couldnt compete with 040 based LC475 by 94! madness was rife @ Medhi Ali central...is he dead yet?