"A couple of clarifications" from Bill McEwen

[Atheist]

Dear Mr. B. McEwen,

I as a fanatical follower, and ever a defender of Amiga don't understand why it took soooooooooo long to do this? I mean come forward and answer many/some or any questions at all.

Why is that?

Now, that you're working on OS5, can AOS4.0 SW run on it unmodified? Is it 64 bit? Is it SMP capable?

If it can't use AOS4.0 SW, we'll be in the same boat as we are now, broswerless, and no office application SW either. We need a version of Basic, too.

What, in your opinion, is the lifespan of AOS4.0, and why is AOS4.0 not able to be built upon, that version 5.x is needed already?

I'm not against progress, but it seems too soon to look forward, when what is currently on offer is now sorely lacking.



If you have funds to code the next iteration, why don't you put some into getting the Amiga Phantasy case up and running?

This case is BETTER than putting ads on televison IMO!!!!!!

[amigarules2k]

To whom it may concern!

First I appologise to the moderators for my last post (not to that guy at A Inc.)

But still, guys, why do you believe a word he is saying? I can remember having him talk about the next gen Amiga running a G3 or even G4 (must take a look for that magazine) So where are those machines? OS4 (by A inc, not Hyperion) was supposed to be releases around 2k3 or maybe for. Nothing happened.

Good Lord, he is doing great PR, but dont you see he is just pulling your legs?

I mean, if Billy Boy just gives us one proove of existence of an OS5, than everything would be okay, but he never will, so he is just trying to keep his utterly small company somehow alive.

There is nothing he can or will ever do, point

[Panthro]

hey thanks for clearing that up. :-)


it's interesting to see the nay sayers claiming its just a load of BS although both A.Inc and Hyperion are agreeing on the state of things.

I wonder if they make up conspiracy theorys on other things ..... maybe wearing tin foil on thier head to ward of spy satilite "mind" rays while looking for UFO's in thier gum tree out back :lol:

no serious lets stop with the fatalism.  I know the reality is bad enough

[Legerdemain]

Good Lord, he is doing great PR, but dont you see he is just pulling your legs?

There is NO WAY to see if he is pulling one's leg or not. I'm glad for your sake, though, that you have found a way to see what is impossible to be seen (for all the people besides the ones working closest to McEven).

I mean, if Billy Boy just gives us one proove of existence of an OS5, than everything would be okay, but he never will, so he is just trying to keep his utterly small company somehow alive.

See. either this one or that one or someone else makes silly claims that he 'has to' do 'this' or 'that' to put any 'doubts' (I'd rather say speculations and conspiracy theories made up by people with too much time on their hands).

Thing is. Let's say that McEven shows us some pictures of OS5. What will happen? Some will go 'WOW!'. Most will go 'MOCKUP! MOCKUP! MOCKUP! GIVE US MORE PROOF!'.

Then McEven posts a short movie demoing OS5. Some will go 'WOW!'. Most will go 'MOCKUP! MOCKUP! MOCKUP! MOCKUP! GIVE US MORE PROOF!'.

Then McEven releases a shourt compiled routine which shows off one of the features in the OS on the targeted hardware. Some will go 'WOW!'. Most will go 'MOCKUP! MOCKUP! MOCKUP! MOCKUP! MOCKUP! GIVE US MORE PROOF!'.

Then McEven releases OS5 to the community. Some will go 'WOW!'. Many will go 'what the hell is this CRAP! No way I am supporting this! No way I am supporting ANYTHING but OS4!'. And so forth. And so forth.

My point?

I find your claim that 'if Billy Boy just gives us one proove of existence of an OS5, than everything would be okay' naive. There is NOTHING McEven can do to please the entire community. Because even if OS4 will get an official release thanks to official hardware being produced, some people will keep on thrashing Amiga Inc., claiming that it is just a matter of time before they '{bleep} everything up again'.

I find this entire situation ridicilous. Sorry to say. But if there is one thing that have become apparent, that must be the fact that people do LOVE to read things that haven't actually been written and keep on speculating, though claiming it to be the undeniable truth, concerning matters they, in reality, don't have the slightest chance of 'knowing' anything about at all.

Oh, and please note that I have nowhere in this post claimed to be in favour of Amiga Inc. or adore their decisions, or consider McEven being the greatest of all time, or...

Well... I think you get the point.

{edited by moderator : removed one instance of profanity}

[falemagn]

Well, alot of people came away thinking there was some sort of lawsuit and counterlawsuit going on between Hyperion and Amiga Inc. This dispells these utterly nasty speculations.

Actually, I really don't see how those "nasty speculations" are dispelled. I can't see anything in what McEwen wrote that would contraddict them, nor I see anything that contraddicts or even just clarifies what McEwen stated in the q&a session.

For one, he didn't clarify whether or not the buyout clause has been triggered, which is all that the speculations were about.

[Panthro]

well I dont think that either party will let thier relationship sour!!

thats good to know! and either way Hyperion prob. set the price so they wont get screwed! A.Inc wont want to become the bad guy anyway ..... it's bad for buissness!! :lol:

roll on OS4 I got money waiting for you and a G4!!

[redrumloa]

Hmm, if you are reading this Bill McEwen, maybe you care to comment on Dr. Ryan C. PHD and his mother's "Amiga Corp".

[dammy]

I notice that item #2 in that mail takes the wind out of alot of cynical, pessimistic interpretation I have seen being waved around, and banged over people's heads, as if it were incontrovertible fact...

Smells more like damage control since Friedens (SP?) own ExecSG and Hyperion doesn't.  So if Amiga Inc has triggered the buy back clause, they don't get ExecSG which means they have please the Friedens so  they will ink a contract.  Friedens probably do not like the public out cry that was in result of McBill's statement about lawyers between Amiga Inc and Hyperion since that poisons the waters that Friedens want as a market.  Atleast that's my read on it.

Dammy

[TheMagicM]

According to the Freidens Q&A at BB4, they were contacted about two months ago by Amiga, Inc. about writing the kernel for OS5. So, I would assume they don't even have anything near an alpha. Probably at most just some OS components.

well that contradicts what Bill said.  AI is working on OS5 in house, meaning not Hyperion/Friedens.  

here's his quote just in case you missed it.

I should mention that while we have only talked about it once, OS 5 has been in development in Amiga by Amiga engineers and staff for over two years.

After two years worth of work, I'm sure there would be something to show for it.

[dammy]

well that contradicts what Bill said. AI is working on OS5 in house, meaning not Hyperion/Friedens.

Do you really think they have broken status quoa and hired AOS developers as full time employees?  I don't see it.  I can see them subcontracting things out, like Friedens to do the kernel.

Dammy

[TheMagicM]

@dammy:

I dunno.. I'm just going by what was said.

[mr_a500]

Lets ignore the fact that Mac, Linux and Windows were developed over many years with hundreds or even thousands of developers working full time while Amiga Inc. have had a couple developers (full time? part time?) working for the past two years. Forget about that. Imagine (if you can) that OS 5.0 is coming out today - right this second, completely finished, totally awesome looking and running flawlessly.

What software does it run? Does it run existing Linux, Mac or Windows software? (I assume not) Does it run existing classic Amiga software? (probably not) Does it even run existing AmigaOS 4.0 software?

Lets (generously) imagine it runs existing OS 4.0 software perfectly with no conflicts or crashes. So what does it run - a few freeware games, a text editor, a few miscellaneous home-coded utilities. Is there any "professional software"? (or even anything as good as the out of date software on classic Amiga?) Is there any good software company planning on writing software for OS 5.0? If so, and considering how long it takes to write "professional software" hadn't they better start now? Are there APIs and tools for these software companies to actually develop software for it?

So consider:

Even IF OS 5.0 was out TODAY and ran flawlessly on modern hardware with modern graphics cards and modern CPUs, and even IF Bill McEwen had somehow convinced major software companies (tempted with "huge" potential Amiga market;-)) to sign up and develop for OS 5.0 and there are existing tools RIGHT NOW for these major software companies to start developing real and useful software - how long would it take? 2 or 3 years? So lets say that for 2 years, you have an operating system with only small utilities and freeware games. Who in the hell would be interested in buying this thing? How would a market be built up? What major software companies would be stupid enough to spend years of development time on an unproven operating system with no market?

"Oh, I'm sooo excited about OS 5.0."

[System]

> "Oh, I'm sooo excited about OS 5.0."

Sarcasm aside, you have a valid point and it's a battlecry I've shouted for years.  The only exception is that ALL operating systems started somewhere.  

Even the almighty Windows started as nothing but a task switcher.  It's not "thousands of programmers" that got them there, it was a few men making great decisions and making great deals that got their foot in the door.

I can't speak for Amiga Inc's greatness, but I'm more than willing to let them try.  After the first 10 years since the fall of Commodore, I'm not in so much of a hurry any more.  

If they come out with something I'm interested, I'm cool with that, but the time of people being really interested in learning about computers (ala the vic-20 and Coleco Adam) has long-since passed.

Hell, my 6 year old niece probably knows more about computers than I did at age 20, but it's all Windows and/or Mac-based.  The idea of there being  a "real" market for a tinker's machine is something that will need to be proven.  

Personally, I think they need to fall back to Commodore's original concept of "here's a game machine, and oh, by the way, you can add a keyboard and -- wow, it's now a computer!"

Wayne

[mr_a500]

ALL operating systems started somewhere. Even Windows started as nothing but a task switcher. It's not "thousands of programmers" that got them there, it was a few men making great decisions and making great deals that got their foot in the door.

Yes, but now they have a 20 year head start. In other areas of technology you can jump in with innovations and compete, but not with operating systems because of the thousands of dependent pieces of software. OSX was something new but even that was built on existing software - a UNIX kernel and NeXT. And OSX would have failed miserably if not for the emulation layer allowing the thousands of professional OS9 and earlier programs to run (their $billions in assets helped too;-)).

Think about the operating systems that failed: NeXT, BeOS and OS2 - and consider how much money was behind them. Then think about Amiga Inc. and it becomes a bit of a joke. I've worked for a big software company that went bankrupt and even when it was totally falling apart, it was still more impressive than Amiga Inc. (and I learned to spot the "pre-death unrealistic BS")

I would LOVE to be proved wrong, but I'm not foolish enough to believe in unrealistic tripe.

[System]

I'm not foolish enough to believe in unrealistic tripe.

Ok, I'm not sure that we're not talking about two different things here, but my point was not challenged.  All operating systems, including Windows, AppleOS, AmigaOS, and even BeOS started with the bare minimum.  

I'm not suggesting that Amiga could become the next Windows. The facts are, it can't, but given the right circumstances, push, and decisions, it could very well become the next BeOS or at least as big a market as some of the smaller Linux distros which have a rabid following.  

Rabid community, we gots.  Software we ain't gots.

Just out of curiousity, just to prove that I have no problems with contrary opinions, your original post remains unfettered, but I wonder... If you see "all of this" as "unrealistic tripe", then why are you here anyway?  

Wayne

[mr_a500]

When I say "I'm not foolish enough to believe in unrealistic tripe", I am referring to Bill McEwen's answers. Maybe "unrealistic tripe" is a bit harsh. I probably should have chosen some other term for it, but I can't think of one right now. What is the term for someone deliberately making extremely unrealistic promises?

Why am I here? Do you mean this thread? I am giving an opinion that hasn't been given yet. Isn't that the point of a discussion? Should I not be here?

If you mean why am I on Amiga.org, then that should be obvious. I am an Amiga user.