Amigakit and their customer service...

[Lorraine]

/

[dannyp1]

Darrin says:

"I'll tell you why, because the onus was on you to ask questions"

It kinda reminds me of Doomy selling a1200's on EBay and not mentioning that they were Pal and not NTSC.  When complaints started coming in his response was "If you wanted to know if they were NTSC or PAL you should have asked".  If the item is different than what one might assume it to be I'm not so sure that the seller shouldn't state that in the description.
As far as Painkiller, I think he got a little carried away and there is no excuse for vulgar language in emails. None.

As for Amigakit, I don't think that it was too much for them to change the description a little so no one else would ever be confused again.  I don't think they can say the description is perfect as at least one paying customer was confused by it.  A truly customer oriented business has to push personnel feelings aside.  That being said, I have ordered many items from Amigakit and had no problems at all.  I have always been happy with our dealings.

Dan

[ffastback]

Lorraine wrote:

If A600/1200 drives work in that Tower then why shouldn't a drive he orders to replace A600/1200 ones work with it also.

Painkiller has since admitted not all original A600/1200 drives work in that custom tower.  The tower design did not take into account the many different drives that came with A600s and A1200s over time.  Because he is mad at himself for not figuring that out ahead of time he is trying to find something else to {bleep} about so that its someone else's fault.  Thats the bottom line.

AmigaKit don't have to modify anything on their ads but why not? They know now the drives don't work in that Tower so they could either leave a note saying that or actually state what the drives are - modified PC drives rather than original Amiga ones.

They don't say that they are original Amiga drives and they list what their application is for, that being an original A600 or A1200 case.  Thats all they are saying the drives work with.  Once you start listing things it dosen't work in then you become responsible to figure out and list EVERYTHING it will not work in, and maybe you don't have that info.  If everything sold had to be like that then every product listing would be 50 pages long listing all the things it dosen't work with.  Thats silly.  If you have a custom case ask before you order.  

(And as a P.S., its been mentioned by Amigakit, that several original Amiga drives were modified PC drives, but again he never claimed what he was selling were NOS or OEM)

[maffoo]

Painkiller wrote:

I'm amazed how easily stores could sell products that are in some ways modified etc. and not told in the discription and some of you guys would be fine with it...  How would some of you guys feel if I created a MAC from custom parts installed OSX in it, fit it in MAC case and then sell it as a MAC. Hey it does job exactly like a MAC so it must be a MAC and screw you if you didn't bother to ask if it is a real MAC from Apple factory parts.

I suspect that "Macintosh" is a trademark so Apple would sue you into oblivion :-)

A better analogy would be if you bought an off-the-shelf graphics card for a Windows machine and flashed the firmware to make it work in a Mac* then sold it as a Mac graphics card - it would be up to the buyer to check it was compatible with their specific Mac (eg. making sure they had the right slot in their machine) before buying it.


*Not sure if this is necessary nowadays, but I'm sure it was in the PPC days.

[Darrin]

@ DannyP1:

Should AmigaKit also list that they won't fit up his ass either, just in case he wanted to install the drive in his rectum?  ;-)  :-D

[ffastback]

Darrin wrote:
@ DannyP1:

Should AmigaKit also list that they won't fit up his ass either, just in case he wanted to install the drive in his rectum?    

No because he does not have his rectum measurements Darrin (or at least I seriously hope not!)

[J-Golden]

I think someone will flame me for this, but whatever!

This dude has my luck, getting what was listed but not what was wanted.  I LOVE IT WHEN THAT HAPPENS!!!  My biggest joy in life is trying to make things work that shouldn't or weren't thought of before hand.

If I were this dude/dudet, yes I would be anoyed at first, but then I'd be looking at the drive, the case, and my dremmel with an evil grin on my face thinking all kinds of cool ways to mount that drive...

[ffastback]

J-Golden wrote:

If I were this dude/dudet, yes I would be anoyed at first, but then I'd be looking at the drive, the case, and my dremmel with an evil grin on my face thinking all kinds of cool ways to mount that drive...

Would you be annoyed at yourself, or at the company?

[Darrin]

Painkiller wrote:
I modified the other drive to fit and the second I will sell inside A1200 that I will put together.

The problem really here isn't wheter it would fit or not, but I should have know upfornt that these are same drives I can manufacture my self pretty easily without asking the seller. How hard is it to write these are modified PC drives... For some this product is worth the price but to me it wasn't and I'm not happy because the product discription isn't totally honest.

I expected an original Amiga part which wouldn't include cutsom modifications, but actually factory made parts. This was not mentioned in the product discription in any way. If they would have been these and wouldn't have directly fit my Infinitiv Case I would have been fine with it.

I'm amazed how easily stores could sell products that are in some ways modified etc. and not told in the discription and some of you guys would be fine with it...  How would some of you guys feel if I created a MAC from custom parts installed OSX in it, fit it in MAC case and then sell it as a MAC. Hey it does job exactly like a MAC so it must be a MAC and screw you if you didn't bother to ask if it is a real MAC from Apple factory parts.

Phew!  Well I'm glad that you managed to make them work.

I still think that it is unrealistic to expect companies to sell "new" replacement drives that are exactly like the mk1 drives that came with the original Amiga model when it was released when they have not been maufactured for over a decade.

Even in the days of the A2000 there were various companies supplying their own "non-Commodore" internal drives as cheaper options and they were sold as "Amiga drives".  Selling non-Commodore drives for Amiga computers has been going on for 20 years.

[Darrin]

J-Golden wrote:

I'd be looking at the drive, the case, and my dremmel with an evil grin on my face thinking all kinds of cool ways to mount that drive...

PERVERT!   :-o

 :lol:

[motorollin]

Painkiller wrote:
I'm amazed how easily stores could sell products that are in some ways modified etc. and not told in the discription and some of you guys would be fine with it...  How would some of you guys feel if I created a MAC from custom parts installed OSX in it, fit it in MAC case and then sell it as a MAC. Hey it does job exactly like a MAC so it must be a MAC and screw you if you didn't bother to ask if it is a real MAC from Apple factory parts.

But that's not what happened. If you want want to use a different computer as an analogy, a more accurate one would be this:

User buys a Mac Mini.
User decides to put the Mac Mini's guts in to a different case.
User buys a part designed and advertised for a Mac Mini
User whinges when it doesn't fit in the non-standard case.
User complains that the non-standard case is allegedly compatible with the part they have ordered. Apple inform him that the parts they sell are compatible with the original case, but cannot guarantee that they will fit in anything else due to variation in their own parts, and the fact that they do not manufacture non-Apple equipment.

Whose fault is this? Is it Apple's, for not listing every single piece of equipment that the part will or will not fit, or is it the user's for assuming it will work in something for which it is not advertised?

--
moto

[Lorraine]

/

[Darrin]

ffastback wrote:
No because he does not have his rectum measurements Darrin (or at least I seriously hope not!)

LOL.  He could have got a set of outside calipers for Xmas...

[amigakit]

Both Commodore and Escom used 'PC' modified drives (either through jumpering or hard wiring).  We have 11 different models and variations of drives from these companies that were supplied in Amigas over the years.

We have sold hundreds of our drives since 2004 and had no negative feedback from our customers.

We list them with the words "Brand new and guaranteed. Drive mechanism may vary." and that is accurate.

[ffastback]

Lorraine wrote:

This still doesn't mean Matt couldn't put a little note in bold/8point/times at the very bottom of the ad simply saying "this is a modified PC drive", unless he's worried it'll somehow put people off buying it, but then that's dishonesty in itself.

Products are often an amalgamation of parts from various vendors and often go through various manufacturing and/or re-manufacturing processes to become the final end-user product.  Did the owners of the Amiga brand on the A1200s and A600s that came from the factory with modified PC drives call them that or point that out on those particular units?  No.  Why?  Because they fit in the case, they read and write the proper disks in the proper format, and their eject button works.  Same thing here.  To the uneducated saying such could cause un-necessary confusion, and until someone says different that fact means nothing to what the product does.

[Painkiller]

@Amigakit
Did any of the modified "original" Amiga drives have custom shell modifications.

No.

If it was mentioned that these are modified PC drives would I have directly know that they wont directly fit for my purpose.

Yes.

Could it have been an original drive that wouldn't fit my purpose.

Yes. That would have been my bad.

Do I think it is misleading to sell these as just Amiga parts, yes because they aren't the same as the original drives be it that some of the original drives were made from PC drives, but all with factory parts.