Several PPC cards on Amibench

[Jose]

I think in the general text attachment that was sent to us it says there were various people from the group replying to mails...

So, should we start thinking about what are we going to do?
European union consumer protection (if it it even exists, maybe german..) or police or what? Just the ones I remember right now...

[cgutjahr]

I'm from Germany and I could try to help you, I could try to phone somebody (if you have an address and a full name) or ask in the German forums of amiga-news.de if somebody knows any of the persons involved.

[x56h34]

@cgutjahr:

That would be great.

I guess we should see first if cgutjahr can locate Bernd Binder, and if he can, then we should forward cgutjahr our information as to what exactly each of us ordered from Bernd, etc., so he could straighten things out, if possible. :-)

[punkpie]

@cgutjahr

At last!  Some good news!  I think we need some of that.

Is it possible if you could find out if anyone knows Tibor Tóth and/or Roland Geiger too?  Maybe we could trace it back to them.

Thanks.

[JaXanim]

Good, some local help will be much appreciated. Here's a few facts on the case.

The address to which I sent my cheque, payable to Bernd Binder, is the same address he had in 2001, when he sent a sales brochure to Lemmink. At that time, he used the ID 'Kralle'. The phone number on the letterhead is not recognised today. That could have changed, I guess.

In 2001 his email was 'kralle2@gmx.de' which I posted to, but is no longer recognised.

His current Ebay ID appears to be 'Kralle900' which someone here determined via a Google or something (?). This ID appears convincing 'cos 'Kralle900' is auctioning lots of stuff right now, including Amiga kit and he's located in Albstsdt. That's the place I sent my check, as did most others here I believe.

I have repeatedly sent messages to 'Kralle900' via the Ebay members' messager system, but had no reply. That in itself is suspicious 'cos 'Kralle900' is sending and receiving Ebay feedback right now. I asked him to post something on AmiBench or Amiga.org to show us he isn't a fraud.

There was a 'Kralle1' or 'Kralle2' on Ebay a while back and that had only negative feedback, but there were only one or two auctions under that ID.

Maybe someone would be prepared to bid/win something trivial on a 'Kralle900' auction and use it to make contact? A lot of his stuff goes for a couple of Euros.

I have been unable to find a Bernd Binder at the Albstadt address I sent my check to. I have spoken with the only two Albstsdt/Bernd Binders in the German phone book. Neither is our man. Maybe he is now ex-directory?

I made contact with the only Amiga Computer Club I can find in Albstadt and they haven't heard of Bernd Binder.

There isn't a Roland Geiger in the Albstadt phone book, though there is one 'R. Geiger'. I don't think I will call that number 'cos the connection's too weak. Maybe someone in Germany would call it? ...eh?...Pretty Please!

I will be seeing my Bank Manager next week and I will try to get him to contact Binder's bank. We have his account number. In fact this makes the whole scam idea seem unlikely. Who would give away his account details if he were obtaining money by fraud?

It's all very queer ain't it?

@cgutjahr

If you need anything else, like Binder's full postal address, etc, please PM me or one of the others on here. Many thanks for your offer of assistance.

JaX

[odin]

I've had a look at kralle900's ebay feedback and there was one user who left a negative. I've contacted this user via Ebay's system asking if he/she would be willing to provide a phone number/address.

I expect no response though :-).

And I've made a bid on a Cloanto CD kralle900 is selling (for the whopping price of 1EUR %-) ).

[CU_AMiGA]

According to his email he said to me that Bernd Binder was his secretary and Roland Geiger seems to be his name - as he used it in his Amibench advert. Anyway, i think we need to act now, this has become a mess and it is nearly the end of the month anyway. Best bet being that someone local should contact him.

[Morley]

Guys, listen...

The names Bernd Binder, Roland Geiger, Kralle, Tibor Toth and whatever else you have heard, they could all have been used by someone completely else. (BTW, I did a quick look and there are something like 10 different Kralles on ebay...)
Go check with your bank, if you sent money via money-transfer, to get the name of the recipient. Or pester Paypal to give you the account-number of the recipient and check that out. Bear in mind though that non-us Paypal accounts don't have verified addresses. At least mine isn't. Then maybe you'll find that the account is closed and whatever he is named has left with the money, or maybe not. Most low-lifes don't care if they leave their real name though, as they most likely have spent the cash before they get caught.
Just make sure you are chasing the right guy before calling in the cavalry.

Best of luck to you all, I hope the PPC cards turn up or you get your money back.

[preacher]

Hi all.

My bank phoned me earlier today and said that my moneyorder could not be cancelled because our 'mystery man' told his bank not to refund the money. So, whoever he may be, he's still alive and kicking...

I will try to make contact with his bank directly, to see if that can lead to anything.

@JaX
If I do get a phonenumber, I'll PM you.

[Flowman]

I still got the list with everyone that bought anything from him.. i will post it when im back at my home computer.. And ppl using irc lets join some good chan where we can talk about this..

It if this guy have f**ked us.. we need to send over the killing squad  :pissed:

[NightShade737]

Send them where exactly?

[JaXanim]

If this does turn out to be a scam, then the proper way to deal with it is through the Police. Talk of duffing him up is silly and will land you in an even worse mess. And we don't really know who's who, do we....?

Hopefully, I will soon have a contact at the Albstadt local Police Station, which I will appraise of the situation as and when everyone thinks it's right.

My rough guess is that around a dozen people have sent Binder money amounting to around two thousand Euros. When the list being compiled is ready, we'll know the firm numbers.

Meantime, let's hope our German collegues here on Aorg can get some more local details. And bidding for some cheap Ebay stuff from Kralle900 gets us in more direct contact with our presumed Mr Binder. It would be really useful if several people following this story, but not directly involved, would try to win something from him. That would give us a broader contact base to use.

And before we get too far ahead in all this, maybe Mr Binder is in hospital, or sick or dead even? And doesn't it look like there maybe other people associated with this deal? Maybe they are the real scammers? All I am saying is keep an open mind and avoid doing anything you might regret..

Cheers,

JaX

[AccyD]

JaXanim wrote:
And before we get too far ahead in all this, maybe Mr Binder is in hospital, or sick or dead even?

But still managing to post items on Ebay??

[x56h34]

Update:

I've just tried to send money to both TTAmiga@gmx.de and Kralle1@web.de through PayPal. I used 1EUR just to see what sort of PayPal feedback Bernd has, and to check out if the PayPal account is still active, and I received this message:

"This recipient is currently unable to receive money."

Well, he either did this himself or PayPal has frozen his account due to complaints.

Either way, I think this about confirms it that he is a fraud in my mind...not sure what you guys think.

There's been too many things going on now in order for me to believe that this is all going to work out fine. Frankly, I don't believe it will and I am putting my foot down and calling this a scam.

[JaXanim]

@AccyD

Kralle900 appears, through circumstantial evidence, to be Bernd Binder. I haven't seen any proof yet.

If someone here will win one of his auctions, then we'll have the proof. Till then, it's circumstantial.

Cheers,

JaX

[cgutjahr]

Okay, I read the whole thread now (phew...) and Lemmink gave me a few additional hints (thanks).

I don't think you've been scammed - some of you seem to be overly optimistic (and I'm saying it mildly ;-)) regarding shipping delays - at least not by Bernd Binder himself (the info Lemmink supplied would suggest that the guy is a reliable seller). If this is a scam, somebody probably abused Binder's reputation, but my personal theory is that the seller is simply ignoring you because he sent the stuff and doesn't want to deal with {bleep}loads of very nervous people :-P.

Lemmink supplied me with phone numbers for Bernd Binder that were printed in a newsletter released in December 2003. I'll start by calling these numbers later this evening - I hope their still valid.

In the meantime, you could supple me with all the info you have about all the persons involved (Bernd Binder, Roland Geiger, Tibor Toth - did I miss somebody?). I need the following details for each person (if available):

Full name
e-mail
postal address
phone number

Please only supply info that was given to you by the guys in question, not stuff you investigated yourself.

Additionally, I need to know who recieved the money (Roland, Bernd or Tibor) and who promised to send the stuff (Bernd, it seems?).

If I reach Bernd, I'll ask him for the status of your cards. I tried to collect the information from this thread, but that's useless, as nobody seems to include his real name in his profile. Therefore, please let me know:

- your real name
- the product you ordered
- the amount you paid (preferably in EUR)

You can post the information here, send me a PM or email me (I prefer email over PM)