Amiga.org

Amiga computer related discussion => General chat about Amiga topics => Topic started by: redrumloa on August 22, 2003, 06:51:29 PM

Title: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redrumloa on August 22, 2003, 06:51:29 PM
This has all gotten out of hand. This is a little community and infighting helps no one. As far as I’m concerned from this point forward there shall be immunity granted for all users for past comments. This shall be a fresh start. No more fighting, no more hurt feelings. Everyone basically is looking for the same thing, something to replace their old dying Amigas. No matter what road they are traveling they have a home here at Amiga.org. Anyone who has in the past burned bridges will find new bridges waiting for them.

I personally have been privately speaking to MikeB in email. While we certainly do not see eye to eye, both of us agree the fighting has to stop and both of us agree it has gotten out of hand. If MikeB and I can be civil and come to an agreement anyone can.

Let us all please start over. Let us REALLY welcome back MikeB, Mikey_C, Luca and anyone else who has felt slighted. Right or wrong who cares. Fighting has solved nothing but drive people away from the scene altogether. Whatever happened in the past is behind us. I cannot make people agree with me, but I can ask you give this a chance. No more attacks on Wayne, AO, AW, BB, Bill McEwen, AI, whoever.

BTW: This is a comment from me as a user and not a announcement of Amiga.org.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: voxel on August 22, 2003, 06:58:54 PM
Well said Red :-)

Welcome back everyone :-D

Amigalement,

Jean-François. Amiga ONLY since 1985.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Kronos on August 22, 2003, 07:00:35 PM
Nice try  :-D
No chance it will hlod longer than till the next polit-crap  :-(
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: downix on August 22, 2003, 07:03:07 PM
No problems here.

But please, no trying to bash non-Amiga, Inc news as being non-Amiga news, k?
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: bhoggett on August 22, 2003, 07:09:37 PM
@red

I'll reserve judgement pending their future behaviour, if you don't mind.  If their return heralds the return of the pointless flame-fests, or if the anti-amiga.org attacks continue on other forums, then the amnesty will be rather one-sided, don't you think?

Traditionally, this site belongs to the "Amiga community", not to the "Amiga Inc loyalists". If that stops being the case it will be a dark day indeed.

Remember what they say about leopards changing their spots, that's all I have to say.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Linchpin on August 22, 2003, 07:13:27 PM
Well said red. I agree - being quite a new member to a.org i dont really know much about the feud's that are dividing the amiga community, but one thing i do know is that the main thing that this poor dying platform needs to recover is the support of the people not some petty arguments. My opinion is this. If your not here for one reason and one reason only ( i say here, i mean on the amiga community), and that reason is to support our faithfull friend mr amiga and to bring it back to being the #1 platform, then i dont want to hear about it (im sure i have the backing of a lot of community members here). As i said before, i havent been on a.org for long, dosent mean that i wasnt an amiga user for years and would like nothing more in the computer world than to see the amiga rise hopefully with the release of OS4 and the combination of the new hardware and software, also now with the compatibility it needs to bring it to the outside world, which im sure will attract both old users and the new back to the amiga. If you want to "battle it out" (and never come to a conclusion), please dont do it here. I totally agree with redrumloa up there. To sum it up, its time to recreate the community. Lets make a fresh start. Sorry, but i needed to say this, fed up of the pettyness and stupid arguments. Well done to red, lets keep this up,

Thanks

Kevin :-)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redrumloa on August 22, 2003, 07:14:26 PM
@bhoggett

This anmesty goes for everyone. The hope is everyone will feel at home. Hopefully there will be no need for anti-AO attacks or anti-AW for that matter.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: MarkTime on August 22, 2003, 07:21:49 PM
The healthy discussion and debate that exists in this community, has always existed, and those who remember otherwise, are just fondly remembering a past that never really existed...its called nostalgia.

I for one, have never wished for anyone to leave, regardless of how misguided their opinions may be.

The difficult thing, is always, the idea that certain people only see an end to 'fighting' when you agree with everything they say.

I have no intention of subordinating my opinions to others....nor agreeing when it isn't merited.  I form my own opinions.  

If anyone is willing to give of their opinion, they should also be willing to hear the counter argument.

I welcome all these people, but nothing has changed...they were always welcome with me, and they were always going to get a lively discussion from me, and they still will.


Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: KennyR on August 22, 2003, 07:25:47 PM
Red, does the amnesty also include Ray A. "HMetal" Akey? I'm well aware of what he did to get his ban, but downgrading his ban from a permanent one to a temporary one might be fairer.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: downix on August 22, 2003, 07:28:39 PM
@Kevin

The problem is, not everyone in the community is in anticipation of AOS4.

A good chunk is in the "blue camp" or "green camp" of MorphOS and AROS.  Then there's the Amithlon folk, the UAE fans, and even some DE folk.

Can't go "with the release of..." for any of these products, because none of them represent the whole of the community.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Linchpin on August 22, 2003, 07:29:41 PM
Surely there is a difference between :-

Fighting

and

Admitting where there is no common ground and letting the matter lie like adults?
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redrumloa on August 22, 2003, 07:33:13 PM
@KennyR

That will ultimately be up to Kees, but I don't see why not.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: downix on August 22, 2003, 07:35:42 PM
@kevin

But your statement made it sound as if everyone on this site *must* abandon all of their efforts and back OS4.  Hard to "bury the hatchet" when you're hearing the same rhetoric that caused the flamefest in the first place.  (that goes for both sides, mind you)  I would not expect you to bury the hatchet either if I said "abandon AInc like they abandoned you, buy a Pegasos and to hell with "The Name Inc." like some folk have done in the past.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: cecilia on August 22, 2003, 07:36:35 PM
i can't understand why people feel the need to fight over this stuff?????

it's a freaking message board. get over it.

anybody hear of a REAL LIFE?????

have an opinon, state it. move on.
it's really simple.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Kees on August 22, 2003, 07:38:56 PM
Quote
does the amnesty also include Ray A. "HMetal" Akey?


I'm trying to settle things with Ray at this moment ... In private ...
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: amigamad on August 22, 2003, 07:44:29 PM
Very well said i hope we can all get on and help each other ratther than fight amongst ourselves. :-)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Linchpin on August 22, 2003, 07:45:35 PM
Not really what i was trying to get at. Reguardless of what you are waiting for, there is no need to bicker about it. Accepted, there will always be devides in this world, we are human we all want different things. Does that mean that the community spirit needs to suffer becouse of it?
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: downix on August 22, 2003, 07:47:11 PM
@kevin

I will agree, we need to get over these things.  But that also requires not waving a red flag in front of the bulls either.  Stopping the fight is not just a "you stop then I'll stop" kind of thing, you need to watch yourself, and I need to watch myself, to see if ones remarks can be taken the wrong way.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Linchpin on August 22, 2003, 07:52:18 PM
@downix - agreed.

Point taken.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: DaveC on August 22, 2003, 07:56:43 PM
@red

That is a good sentiment, but people are people.  Please keep in mind that those on both sides may still feel like they have been through a virtul divorce.  

I would also contend that users here cannot easily get over things if the same people here are unfair on other sites.  If certain people continuously post things elsewhere containing a certain rhetoric, a number of AO users will still feel a need to lash out against them.  I am not giving examples, as that would be the same as laying blame.  In the end, I'm for it; however, don't expect users who feel slighted elsewhere to just turn the other cheek here.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Linchpin on August 22, 2003, 08:01:48 PM
So what is the number 1 thing that everyone wants?
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: voxel on August 22, 2003, 08:06:04 PM
>So what is the number 1 thing that everyone wants?

AmigaOS4 :-D
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Coder on August 22, 2003, 08:06:21 PM
Hi,

I had no idea they all were gone or banned or whatever. Also about Ray. He is a OK dude. No idea what happend. Poor chap, he get's a full load of over him all the time.

Coder
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redrumloa on August 22, 2003, 08:09:16 PM
@DaveC

Nothing ventured, nothing gained. We can only control what is immediatly in front of us. We extend the olive branch and see if it is accepted.

Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Skyraker on August 22, 2003, 08:26:52 PM
@Red

It's a nice sentiment mate... hell i'll even apologise to bbrv (and lets face it, I was very out of order) and whomever else i've managed to insult.....

So bbrv , if youre out there.. I sincerely apologise for my previous comments......

Life's to short...

Regards

sKy
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: legion on August 22, 2003, 10:01:57 PM
Kum-bye-yah, A.org, Kum-bye-yah....


Kum-bye-yah, A.org, Kum-bye-yah...    :-D
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Cymric on August 22, 2003, 10:15:51 PM
Quote
cecilia wrote:
i can't understand why people feel the need to fight over this stuff?????

it's a freaking message board. get over it.

anybody hear of a REAL LIFE?????

have an opinon, state it. move on.
it's really simple.


And that is about the only thing that makes sense in this entire on-going trolling flamefest.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: iamaboringperson on August 22, 2003, 10:34:22 PM
The very reason that amiga.org appeals to me, over many other amiga related websites(nothing wrong with them however) is that amiga.org is a much more generalised resource.

amiga.org is where all people who use Amiga's, Pegasos's, AROS based machines, or some kind of emulation, can come together and discuss [this whole thing] - what ever you want to call it as a whole - together.
It's all related, and to me that is what amiga.org seems to be about.
If you don't like it, it's pretty obvious that there are the more specific sites out there. :-)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Dan on August 22, 2003, 11:37:02 PM
Hatfields and McCoys is that some obscure american reference? :-)
Amigausers are more like the Ogg-family in Terry Pratchetts Discworld books :lol:
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: CodeSmith on August 22, 2003, 11:48:37 PM
@Redrum:

Well done, everyone agrees we need to stop the fighting but someone needs to be a big-enough person to actually be the first to call a truce.  I'm particularly glad that you've been in contact with MikeB, and both agree on the need for some order - he's about as far away from the Genesi viewpoint as you can get - if you two can be civil to each other, I don't see why the rest of us can't just chill :-)

People need to remember that it's OK to say "I don't (want/care about/see the point in) an (AmigaOne/Pegasos)", just respect that there are people who see things differently.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: cecilia on August 23, 2003, 12:39:38 AM
Quote

Dan wrote:
Hatfields and McCoys is that some obscure american reference? :-)

yes. two families in the South who just insisted on NOT getting along. sort of like the Middle East today. unfortunately.

some people don't want peace. they want anger, revenge and general stupidity.

let's see if we can all rise above the nonsense and get on with making sure amiga has a good future. in all it's various ways.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Atheist on August 23, 2003, 01:03:21 AM
Just in case it's not known, I support the AOS4.0 future. (A frothing at the mouth supporter. Yuck! ;-))

If Amiga Inc. is to go belly up, wait for it to happen, don't announce continually that it's happening next Wednesday.

Try to speculate on up-coming events that are positive in a positive light, and let the negative ones happen when they happen, and don't draw conclusions about them that go further and further into the negative zone.

I'd like to point out that, even when I speak of MOS, I try to make it encouraging commentary.

I support and agree with AROS, AmigaForever, and Amithlon.

But a real Amiga for me is still HW and SW, and PegasOS is close enough, but not the one I will go out and purchase.

Good Luck to ALL the alternatives!  :pint:


AmigaOne! AOS4.0! MorphOS! AROS! Amithlon! AmigaForever! . . . . . Look out your windows, Amiga is here to , STAY!!!!  :-D[/size]
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: downix on August 23, 2003, 01:06:27 AM
@kevin

The $180k to finish Eddas.  8)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: GadgetMaster on August 23, 2003, 01:22:51 AM
Quote

_LinchpiN_ wrote:
So what is the number 1 thing that everyone wants?


A community that can get along fine despite its differences.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: meerschaum on August 23, 2003, 01:53:44 AM
@Red

while I agree with your sentiment in part, I dont think anyone should forget whats happend here and what Wayne has said happend with him concerning some of these people.

I respect AmigaWorld.net it was a NEEDED and WANTED solution, a site with leanings toward Amiga.inc for those who follow their solutions. I dont think this site should be compared with it as this is a 'general' community site for all those interested in our 'genre' ... you go to anandtech.com it's a hardware review site right? does it just show Intel chip benchmarks?, do they just praise one motherboard? etc etc etc... its the 'PC genre' ... and in that genre all things have a home... Amiga.org is to the Amiga genre, what Anandtech.com is to the PC hardware genre.

I hope Amiga.org stays that way and over time we will see if it reverts.

enough said   ;-)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Targhan on August 23, 2003, 02:54:24 AM

Hey Meers, Amiga.org isn't, and shouldn't, ever go backwards.  I think the current Amiga.org staff are going to be blazing new trails into a very different, and hopefully more prosperous, future.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: iamaboringperson on August 23, 2003, 04:10:09 AM
Atheist

Quote
Just in case it's not known, I support the AOS4.0 future.
Yeah! I think we know that by now! ;-)


:lol:

Pegasos! erm... I'm read to buy one! (?)
:-D
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: DethKnight on August 23, 2003, 05:41:16 AM
 I dunno, I had two recent posts deleted without notification/explanation, granted they may not have been constructive posts,
but without notification or explanation, this is censorship imho  

 
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redrumloa on August 23, 2003, 06:27:42 AM
Quote

Dan wrote:
Hatfields and McCoys is that some obscure american reference? :-)


American, yes obscure no. This is the best known fued in american history. This is where the term "The real McCoy" comes from.

(http://www.matewan.com/Images/hatfieldclan.gif)

Short history (http://userwww.service.emory.edu/~dmcco01/McCoy/diversion.html)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Wolfe on August 23, 2003, 07:12:29 AM
It's a good idea, But !  Only time will tell.  ;-)

But, you have my vote !  :-D
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redrumloa on August 23, 2003, 01:30:15 PM
Well it is now official. MikeB and I have burried the hatchet and no I don't mean in MikeB's head :lol: I have already seen positive steps both here and on Amigaworld.net.

So let's please take this at face value and move forward.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: MikeB on August 23, 2003, 01:32:33 PM
@ Redrumloa

I am happy to see that our private communications yielded positive results!  :-)

More power to Amiga.org, AmigaWorld.net and the Amiga community as a whole! 8-)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Bobsonsirjonny on August 23, 2003, 01:49:34 PM
Pheww.. About Bloody time :-) :pint:
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: meerschaum on August 23, 2003, 02:12:03 PM
I'll take you at your word redrumloa and hold you responsible... whatever MikeB or any of those people do is your faul and yours alone... if they indeed do anything...

I'm not about to forget what happend with Wayne and what he said...he was a good leader for this site
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redrumloa on August 23, 2003, 02:17:54 PM
@meerschaum

Please let's be constructive and not destructive. Start new here.

Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: meerschaum on August 23, 2003, 02:20:29 PM
I am bieng constructive... I'm just saying if they do ANYTHING its your fault. I am willing to trust YOU about them...I think others can understand this sentiment... we're willing to give it a fresh start...
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Billsey on August 23, 2003, 02:31:03 PM
The interesting observation here, is the similarity between us all. No matter the background, people remember the past. As has been said in the past, many believe that to continue doing the same things while expecting different results is insanity. They remember that and forget that people do change. More importantly, so many people are so reluctant to publicly look in the mirror and honestly point out their own faults instead of trying to put the blame somewhere else.

This is not even to mention those individuals who do “drive-by's” only to sit back and watch the carnage. Their repentance would be paramount in the successful healing of wounds—and I do mean public repentance. I speak of both the artful and the clumsy; the “wish-they-were's” and the CEO's. This community will never heal until the behavior I speak of stops.

It is indeed difficult to know someone else's heart, but their own actions give solid evidence as to the content of their character. No matter how hard you try to cover your path, the truth eventually comes out.

It would be easier for all parties if the leopards would change. Spots can be changed with paint, but that doesn't change the heart, and the source of behavior is the heart—i. e. the content of your character—but we must trust that change is indeed happening (since we cannot see the heart), until behavior tells us otherwise; then we must be intelligent in our response. Our response must be the path that will bring the most effective healing—not the path most satisfying to the emotions.

“Drive-by's” are bound to happen, but, please, think before you type.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: tony23 on August 23, 2003, 02:32:21 PM
This all makes me so happy because I love em all. :-)
 :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-)  :-


[color=0000FF]Viva Amiga[/color][/b]
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: cecilia on August 23, 2003, 03:03:11 PM
i've never understood why some in the "OS4" camp would object to MorphOS - or any other variants of amiga use. (or visa versa)

to my mind it's all healthy competition. (heavy on "healthy"). that is, it gets people moving. it should make them want to PROVE they have someting better. and thats always good for the user - me!

and, as everyone knows, the universe revolves around me. :lol:

ok. really, if everyone keeps their eye on the real point of what AMIGA means, we should be fine. AMIGA is all about choice. Not having to use Windows (ever or all the time, depending). Being able to have the computer JUST the way YOU like it. flexibility is what I want in a computer. And FUN. fun, fun, fun!
Bring back the damn fun!  :-D

I remember the first time i went to an AmiExpo in NY (late '80's) and saw things like that LIVE! setup. My mind was blown like I can't even describe!!!

Let's do that again.

please! :-D
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redfox on August 23, 2003, 04:03:56 PM

Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: dammy on August 23, 2003, 04:16:30 PM
Sadly, peace only comes after victory.  Peace is only an illusion without victory.

Dammy
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Warface on August 23, 2003, 07:29:18 PM
I have to admit I can easily loose my temper and say things I regret later. Most probably I offended pretty much ppl here.

I like the intention for a reunion however. And to hope we will be nicer to each other, despite that we all have a somewhat different view of all the things that surround us.

Welcome Back Everyone :-)

There are 2 places for me where ppl from every aspect of "Amiga" can come together.

The first is ann, the second is amiga.org.

Ann.lu as a battlefield for everyone :-)
Amiga.org on the other hand is like a sanctuary.


It'd be a pity to lose it. :-)
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: redfox on August 23, 2003, 08:25:37 PM
Welcome Back Everyone   :-)

@ redrumloa and MikeB

 ... good for you guys   :-D

----------------
redfox
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Ilwrath on August 23, 2003, 09:30:38 PM
Hey!  It all sounds good... I never understood all the fuss, anyhow.  

We should all be able to play nice and avoid pointing faults..

And, personally, I'm waiting for a few million bucks so I can retire, buy an island, raise a nice small family, and tinker with all the electronics I want without having bosses nag at me.

Of course, I'm probably going to be waiting even longer than the folks waiting for OS4...  at least for the millions and small island part!  ;-)

Peace, love, and Amigas!  Whatever form.
Title: Re: Hatfield and McCoy (AO & AW) feud is over.
Post by: Argo on August 24, 2003, 08:13:17 AM
Greetings All,

 I got this link from a friend. I think it pretty much sums up all the infighting in the community.

Red vs Blue (http://www.redvsblue.com/bloodgulch.shtml)

Enjoy!!! :-D