New A-EON Music Card for Classic Amigas

[spirantho]

so the almost only advantage of this card is that you will be to play your audio collection stored in some compressed format using a dedicated player? at least something like mpga.library should be thought of. or are we facing c64 future wehre everything hast to be statically linked?

*shudder*
I hate static linking. What do you think I am, a Linux coder?

Here's what you currently need to do to play an OGG Vorbis file:

PrismaBase = OpenLibrary( "prisma.library", 0L);
Prisma_Init();
Prisma_PlayFile( "GreatMusic.ogg" );
CloseLibrary( PrismaBase);

There are a few extra parameters to PlayFile if you want to use them (volume, balance, buffersize, task priority), but that's pretty much it.
There's also PlayMemory() which I'm going to implement soon, and it's this that'll hook into AHI and any apps such as SCUMM.

[spirantho]

That looks simple enough, consider my request for datatypes withdrawn.

That's the idea - keep it simple. The beauty of the Amiga is the way we can use libraries and devices to interface things, so I like to provide as high a level API as possible. No point in having an easy-to-use library system when the library itself makes it a nightmare to use.

[spirantho]

then i dont see an advantage in this kind of device. it is like warpup, only making difference on very few dedicated tasks and everything tat wants to use it must be specifically recompiled against it. why not just buy a standalone $5 mp3 player instead? you can even place it somewhere weithin your amiga if you really must.. otherwise it gets seriously integrated into the system or let it be.

It depends on how much you listen to compressed audio. But remember that not all compressed audio is music which you put on like a jukebox.
The obvious reason is for listening to music. In that case you can use a standalone $5 MP3 player if you want, but you'll need to connect it to an amp. And it won't have access to your Amiga's hard disk. Or the internet.
There are other reasons, though - many later SDL games/apps use compressed audio for background music. You can't play game background music using a $5 MP3 player. For instance SCUMMVM - it uses CD audio compressed as MP3 or OGG. With this, a major load can be removed off the CPU and it sounds better too, if you were using Paula before.

Of course any app to use it will be specifically recompiled with support for it, but that's always the way when you do anything like this. The fact that nothing supports hardware which hasn't been made yet is no reason not to make the hardware.

[spirantho]

An MHI driver might be a good option.

http://aminet.net/package/driver/audio/mhi_MASPro

Now that looks like it might be a good system to use too. I'll see what I can do.

Thanks for the idea!

[spirantho]

I'll need to check exactly how the S/PDIF interfaces with the rest (I don't have this module yet), but if it reads raw data then it means a purely digital pathway from the sound generation through to the receiver. That means no interference or noise - and that's a pretty good thing if you like listening to your music loud!
Even if the pathway from the decoder to the S/PDIF is analogue, it should still pick up a lot less noise than analogue wiring coming out the back of your Miggy.

[spirantho]

I think FLAC may be optimistic for a 68000 - it requires a lot of data bandwidth and we're already pushing it just with a high-bitrate OGG/MP3. I can try though.
It's only CD-quality, though - no 20- or 24-bit or 96KHz I'm afraid.

[spirantho]

@spirantho
I doubt it is a full digital path for SPDIF, as the chip seems to provide only analog outputs. Unless you are doing something wicked with that built-in XilinX.

I suspected as much. Nonetheless, the audio path between the decoder and the S/PDIF is still much shorter and should held reduce the noise over an analogue output.

On the hardware side, you could offer something interesting with the 12 GPIO pins the DSP chip has. Maybe an expansion module that could provide a sort of Geekport or a simple series of relais for controlling fun stuff, or even a LCD module that could display some playback parameters.

There are possibilities. There are certainly things that could be done with the GPIO ports, but the first goal is to make the board and make it work. Extra things like that could be added on to future versions and I'm sure Amigakit are always open to considering such suggestions.

@matt3k
FLAC works fine - it just might struggle on a vanilla 68000... as most people have 68030s at least, and anyone with enough storage space to hold FLACs will almost definitely have at least a 68030 it shouldn't be a problem.

I don't think Z3 will be in the first versions, anyway - but it's not that necessary I don't think. Maybe for highly compressed FLACs, it'd help. We'll be concentrating on Z-II and clockport first, anyway.

[spirantho]

You're probably right about that, yes.
What I would say, though, is that my A1500 produces a lot less noise than my PC with it's X-Fi soundcard. I can ramp the volume up much more before I get too much background noise.
That's with an analogue output at the moment.

[spirantho]

Just for reference if anyone's interested in FLAC - My A1500 (7.14MHz, OS3.1) just managed to play a FLAC of I Feel Fine by the Beatles (2:20) without problem, but it did need a hefty buffer size of 1MB (my Zip drive isn't a speed demon ).

Next comes the "Yes" test (7 minutes), then comes the Iron Butterfly test (In-a-gadda-da-vida - all 17 minutes of it - though that won't fit on a Zip disk as a FLAC!)

[spirantho]

This is an internal media player for amiga. Not a full sound card

This is true.

However, as it is a sound card that supports WAV (i.e. uncompressed audio), we're planning to make a simple AHI driver too. It won't be a full RTA solution like a Prelude - it's not meant to be - but we're aiming to use the WAV functionality to give Classic Amigas a CD-Quality AHI channel.
It's primary focus is indeed for decoding of compressed audio, though, yes.

[spirantho]

damn that's what I was hoping for....a new sound card, fully supported so i wouldn't have to replace my audio caps (just remove them to avoid acid damage to my 1d4)

For one thing it'd have to be a pretty special sound card to emulate Paula in games.

Secondly, I'd very strongly recommend getting your A1200 recapped if it ever plays up at all. The sound caps do go easily... but so do some of the power ones...

[spirantho]

Hiya,

How's the AHI driver progressing?   Can you tell us anything about it yet the max sample rate or if it will support 16bit?

I just wondering if passing 16bit stereo sound to this card will take up less of the CPU cycles than using AHI with Paula.   In theory a real 16bit card would skip the conversion (down to 8/14 bit) which may give it a slight edge.

Some of my ports like ScummVM produce 16bit stereo sound and so I use AHI to deal with the conversion.

The AHI driver will always be limited compared to a dedicated sound card like the Prelude. The Prisma is, after all, primarily a music card - it just so happens that it's a music card that supports uncompressed audio It does mean that it only supports two channels - left and right. There may yet be problems with the AHI driver as we're kind of fitting a square peg into a round hole so we're concentrating on the music functionality first.

AHI does, I believe, support software mixing itself, so only having two channels shouldn't be a problem, but using Paula may well still be useful for spot effects. Also, you won't be able to play AHI samples at the same time as decoding another compressed stream (as there's only one decoder!). For something like ScummVM I'd recommend using the Prisma for the background music, and Paula for the sound effects.

If your background music is WAV, of course, you could use AHI for that and the sound effects at the same time.

Quality is always up to 16-bit 44KHz ("CD qaulity").

[spirantho]

Sorry for noticing the card so late. Hopefully it is not too late to contribute:

Questions:

Will this card have drivers for both OS3.9 and OS4.1 Classic? I ask this because I have Solo-1 in Mediator for them and Terratec 512i for better sound for OS3.9 only. So I would be happy to buy this to replace them both.

OS 4.1 for the Classic will be supported, yes. I got a CS-PPC specially for my A4000 at work so now it has to be done

Is that connector on top left this: HD Audio connector (F - Audio) which helps those who build their Amiga to modern PC cases could use the audipanels included. I just built a adapter cable to connect A4000 and Solo-1 sound card with 3.5mm plugs to LIAN LI PC-D 600 F- AUDIO cable.

No, that's the JTAG connector, sorry! If you have a front panel connector which comes out as separate plugs rather than a block, though, you can still connect it that way.

How much address space will this card consume? I have A4000 + Mediator and Radeon 256MB+ZorRAM 256MB+X-Surf 100+Solo-1+Terratec 512i consumes so much address space that I can't use Picasso IV and Elbox FastATA4000 VI with them at all.

I think from memory it's 64KB. It's not a lot.

Comments:

Changing that white connector to 90 degree one would help those who have many Zorro cards and this goes under some other card.

I use a ribbon cable, which just about fits, but yes. Maybe Matthew can comment (I'm only the software guy )

Would be a good idea to have silkscreen saying "AMIGA FRONT SIDE or AMIGA REAR SIDE" and pointing to their directions to avoid plugging the card to Zorro in a wrong way. This would also help with MEDIATOR 4000D MK-II where "THIS SIDE UP or THIS SIDE DOWN" might give wrong impression if Mediator is installed to customized case with card brackets pointing down like it is for me.

I think the board is already screened, but maybe in the next version? Need to ask Matthew.

For those who speculate on the price, I'm pretty sure that it will be more expensive than ZorRAM 256MB made by same authors, which did not require any driver coding. Depending on the price, I will buy 1-3 for my own use.

The ZorRAM retails at about £150 from memory - the Prisma should be much less than that.

For the one who said his is only for A2000/A3000/A4000, you forgot that many A1200 users have tower cases and bus expansions to be able to use Zorro cards and even PCI cards. I think there is a great market it compated to many other Amiga hadware.

I think this board will usually be used in a desktop or tower too (not a "wedge" Amiga), but it'll be interesting to see.

After this I would like to see some new graphics card for Amiga Zorro and some A3000/A4000 CPU card that would make Cyberstorm PPCs less must for OS4.1 Classic users. There are already enough new accelerator cards for A500/A600/A1200.

An Amiga Zorro graphics card is possible but drivers will be difficult so it won't be cheap. I wouldn't hold your breath on that one.
I'm afraid you should forget about a PPC card for the A3000/A4000 (or A1200 for that matter) - it's not going to happen, as they're just SO complicated. The market is too small for that kind of financial outlay.

[spirantho]

What you're asking really, I think, is does it support AHI. Currently it does not, but that's because I've not finished the driver yet. We're hoping to be able to support a basic AHI driver.  Obviously it doesn't replace Paula or anything like that (that's impossible without a huge amount of work, as non-AHI programs tend to just hit the hardware).
It does support MHI if the game supports that, but I don't know of any that do.

Edit:
@MrMoonlight
It goes without saying that I shall be using parts of my rather comprehensive Beatles music collection to test with I have Dr. Ebbett's FLACs for testing with, and all my needle-drops of my Beatles records are in 200Kbps OGG Vorbis format.

[spirantho]

I doubt you'd see any difference, to be honest - the Zorro II bus is about the same speed as Chip RAM (i.e. not fast).
Please remember that the Prisma is a different beast entirely to Paula. Paula plays sound samples but has no concept of streaming. Prisma plays streams but has no concept of sound samples (per se - but you can stream a sample).

The AHI driver will at best be something that might come in handy in certain circumstances, it is not (and is not designed to be) a replacement for Paula or any other sound card that requires use of a lot of samples.

[spirantho]

A sample is really just a very short stream.

The real difference is in buffering - a sample would be loaded entirely into memory and the the sound chip (e.g. Paula) is instructed to playback memory starting from its address and then stopping at the end.
Streaming would be where - in the case of a sound chip like Paula - you would keep looping the data and changing the data in the buffer. With the Prisma, it just keeps on decoding and playing whatever we send to it. We can play samples on the Prisma in the same way as with Paula - by telling it to decode the contents of the buffer - but only two channels are available. We can't tell Prisma to play more than two sounds at once, in other words, and one would be in the left speaker, the other in the right.
With software mixing this isn't a problem, of course - but then speed becomes a factor as software mixing can be slow.

What it comes down to is this:
Sound samples - should be very quick to play with low latency (point Paula to the memory and let it do its thing). Prisma can not do this easily.
Music streams (or mixed audio) - Paula can't do this easily - it requires juggling a buffer to keep the data going. Prisma can do this easily - just keep feeding it data.