68k library DVD for Natami MX

[fishy_fiz]

I must admit Im still a bit sceptical about Natami. I think there's a reasonable chance of it arriving at some pont, but apart from the ability to perhaps be an alternative to classic amigas and minimig I just cant see it doing much. Where's the new software coming from for one thing ? Apart from maybe a release title or 2 I cant see people being in a big rush to create new software for it. There's already significantly more powerful amiga like options out there than natami, and has been for many years, but even they dont have any new software (apart from open source ports). Not to mention that Natami wont even run some 68k software as well as exisiting 68k machines. (will quake 1 or 2 run well on them for example ('060 + voodoo3 runs Q2 acceptably, something Im very dubious of natami). I personally have emailed the Natami team a few times, being interested in developing for it but have received absoultely no responses. The whole thing reeks of an excercise in engineering with a bunch of hanger-ons wanting to big note themselves by calling themselves part of the "team" (and there's actually a few people involved I *know* are exactly like that, but I wont name names).

[fishy_fiz]

SDL software wont be an option for 68k software. Even an '060 struggles with all but the most simple (ie. space invaders/pacman style) SDL software. As for the new screenmodes, the modes it provides (and higher) have been available to the amiga for many years.

[fishy_fiz]

SDL is an open source, multiplatform api that can deal with gfx, audio, io, cdrom, etc.  Basically (for conversations sake) it wraps itself around a host oses apis. The advantage being it's typically easy to port software using it to a platform that supports it, the disadvantage being it's not very efficient, especially in it's amiga incarnations.

[fishy_fiz]

I'd say probably 1/3rd or more of current 68k amiga users have an rtg board of some description. Once upon a time it would have been more, but I think a lot of the "power users" moved on to MOS/OS4/aros. In addition to this I guess the vast majority of UAE users (the biggest part of the amiga user base these days) all have access to rtg modes). As for SDL software, I wasnt advocating it, in fact I was saying it wasnt a good idea on the back of someone else saying that some Natami people had been working on SDL ports. I think you also over estimate just how much stuff is written in 68k asm, its more or less a dead language, even to those that are still developing for the amiga.
The thing is though, why make a machine with enhanced hardware when all its going to do is drive up price and run exisiting software? Something like minimig + fpgarcade seems much more attractive if the idea was simply to offer alternate hardware to actual classics. They offer the same sort of benefits, with a much lower price and without being surrounded by so many clowns.
Another thing to consider is that the compatibility isnt even known yet. It's potentially an awful lot of money to take a gamble on.

[fishy_fiz]

It was only a few years ago when I was the only one without an rtg based amiga system amongst my group (of about 20 of us). I really think you underestimate how many people have things like a grex, a prometheus, a mediator, are using zorro slots, using isa slots, using a p5 gfx card and so on. I also think you vastly overestimate C vs. asm. A quick glance at aminet at any time in the last 5 years shows that asm is a minority language. Performance between code generated from a good c compiler isnt massively different to that written in asm, although the quality of the code is down to the coder as much as anything.

And Im absolutely not missing the point youre trying to make, but what you seem to be missing is that just because its new, doesnt mean it'll be reliable. As for compatibility, is 100% the actual target? Once upon a time likely compatibility was being touted at about 30%.

[fishy_fiz]

Don't tell Novacoder that.  Just let him continue on with his ScummVM ports.

:-)

desiv

Novacoder didnt use SDL for his ScummVM version. It was based on the exisitng AGA version + his own work.

[fishy_fiz]

Anyway, I'll leave the Natami threads alone from now on I guess. It's no secret by now that I think its just as farcical as anything else relating to new Amiga hardware (capital "A"), there's no need for me to keep harping on it. There is a couple of talented people involved and all credit to them for thier efforts, but Im dubious at best and find it mostly a clown show besides a couple of people involved.

[fishy_fiz]

How much RTG software is out there now?

Shedloads.
Doom/Heretic/Hexen/Quake/Quake2/Descent/Descent Freespace/Napalm/Earth 2140/Payback/Trapped/Trapped2/Genetic Species (via official update)/Nightlong/Feeble Files/Duke3d/AB3d-2:TKG (via patch)/Nemac IV/Onescapee/Ultimate Gloom/Zombie Massacre to name but a few games. Anything system friendly really. The list really is too long

[fishy_fiz]

The point of threat not only to keep an eye on Natami now more then ever,
but that ALL OF US NEED one centralized "68k best off", in OS area, games area, RTG games and apps etc.

Sure, and I appologize for going off topic to the thread. I got a bit caught up in slightly off topic conversations within the thread, but I've said what I wanted to say now

[fishy_fiz]

I dont know that the actual website of a project is the best indication of the level of entusiasm
Even the sites by A.Inc and C-Usa would suggest enthusiasm by the community