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AuthorTopic: Problems running several programs  (Read 799 times)

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Offline cabissi

Problems running several programs
« on: January 18, 2021, 12:48:12 AM »
In the remote past I was very active with the Amiga, but have not been
active until quite recently so my memory/understanding is very rusty. I
am having quite a bit of problems getting some key software to work
despite searching an trying the many solutions I found on the internet.
So I am reaching out to see if some member of the Amiga community can
point in the right direction. Here is some background information.

I recently acquired an Amiga 4000 that required some resuscitation. My
friend who did the repairs provided me with an image for my 32 GB CF
card with a Workbench partition (Size: 4.618Mb)  and a Data partition
(Size: 26.691 Mb ). Originally the machine had a 113.3 Mb HDD (Seagate
Model: ST3144A ), an LG DVD-ROM (Model Santack GSA-422N ), and a HD FDD
(Chinon Model FZ-357A ) which appears to have been dead so I replaced it
with 880 Kb FDD. To bring the machine up to modern standards I purchased
and had installed a ZZ9000 card which is running Picasso 96 for RTG, aa
2GB USB memory stick that I use for "Sneaker net" transfer of data, and
an Ethernet port.
I also installed an AmigaKit
http://amigakit.amiga.store/product_info.php?products_id=599  IDE
adapter. Currently, the CF-card is connected to IDE port 0 in the first
IDE connector on a 2-connector IDE cable. The card's' jumper is set to
"Master" position. The second 2-connector IDE cable is on port 1 of the
IDE board and has only the DVD_ROM drive connected on the (First) cable
connector. The DVD is set to be "Master" When I first turn on the
machine I have to do a (CTRL-A-A) reset to get it to boot. If the
network is not plugged in the machine takes quite a long time to
complete the boot (1-2 minutes), but if the network is plugged into the
router is boots much quicker. It has been suggested that this results
from the Network Startup Sequence, but I have not looked into this yet.
I will post some specs and Startup Sequence files below. I have been
working on the following problems for about 3 1/2 weeks now.

Problem 1: Originally I wanted to employ the HDD on the port 1 cable
with the DVD ROM using IDEfix software, but every time I start this
piece of software the machine crashes to black screen and will only
reboot beyond a Guru Meditation error if I power down, wait 15 seconds,
and then power it on again. I have tried several versions of the IDEfix
such as IDEfix97 and IDEfixMaster and several patches that have solved
the problem for others all to no avail. I tried running SnoopDOS, but
the crash either stops or wipes out any log file for the execution of
IDEfix so I cannot see what might be th cause. After trying all
combinations on the jumper settings (Slave, Master, and only drive on
the cable) I found no change in its behavior so I removed the HDD and it
recognizes the CF drives (2 partitions) and the DVD-ROM without running
IDEfix. Does anyone have an idea of how to get IDEfix to not crash the
machine?

Problem 2: I purchased iBrowse 2.53 and have been trying to get this to
run. Despite updating the SetPatch, the MUI patches and reinstalling
several times, starting this program always leads to a crash similar to
the first situation although after the most recent installation running
it only  locks the machine up, but still requires a power cycle reboot
to operate properly. SnoopDOS has the same problem as I described above
unless there is a way to force it to write the log file prior to
crashing. Any idea of why this is happening will be greatly appreciated.

Problem 3: I tried the demo version of Yam for messages and again this
leads to a crash as in problem 1. I have not fully examined this as the
first 2 problems have more than fully occupied my efforts.

I have been working on these for several weeks and tried every searched internet thread that I could find. I
would be very appreciative of any help anyone could offer that helps me solve these problems.


Specs:
Amiga 4000 25MHz 68040 FPU 68040 25 MHz
AGA OS 3.1     KS 40.68     WB 45.194
Picasso 96     1200x768     32 Bit AGA
Chip RAAM 2044    Fast RAM 16 MB
Gary Rev 0
Various Startup Files in attachment:
 

Offline TribbleSmasher

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2021, 10:42:40 AM »
Problems 2 and 3 are most likely caused by a faulty MUI setup. Does the MUI Prefs program work?
When you re-install MUI v3.8, make sure you also delete the settings in Envarc:mui first.
Add only external classes that the programs really need, to avoid cluttering.
E.g. NList, Betterstring, Texteditor.mcc.

When installing, choose Expert mode and create Protocol file.
That way you get more decisions to make instead of libraries and such get overwritten without warning.
 
As your system is already setup for you, there is the possibility of mismatch regarding your CPU or FPU, e.g. Libraries, MMU settings and what not.
 

Offline AndyFC

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2021, 12:45:16 PM »
Your IDEFix problems sound similar to my experience last year. My A1200 would hang installing IDEFix so I did it manually but then it would hang when executing IDEFix instead during startup. I found that it's common for CF Cards to be incompatible and you might find changing to a different card works.

https://forum.amiga.org/index.php?topic=74596.msg848512#msg848512
A1200 in DIY Tower. 3.0 ROMS (but 3.1 in RAM), 3.5" HD, CD Rom and IDE to SD adapter running off the internal IDE port (using the A4000 4-port IDE adapter from Amigakit), Blizzard 1230-IV, with 32MB 60ns RAM and 50MHz 68882 FPU. 3COM PCMCIA Network card running with Miami DX. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PrGdL6XjmE
 

Offline Pat the Cat

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2021, 06:40:22 PM »
What's the make and model of the hard drive?

It sounds very hostile to the idea of running as an ATAPI slave drive for some reason. I've come across IDE HD drives that insisted on being master device (despite having config jumpers).
"To recurse is human. To iterate, divine."

A1200, Vanilla, Surf Squirrel, SD Card, KS 3.0/3.z, PCMCIA dev
A500, Vanilla, A570, Rev 5, KS 1.2/1.3 Testbench system
Rasp Pi, UAE4ARM, 3D laser scanner, experimental, hoping for AmigaOS4Arm, based on Watterott Fabscan Pi
 

Offline cabissi

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2021, 10:49:55 PM »
The HDD is no longer in the machine, but originally the machine had a 113.3 Mb HDD (Seagate
Model: ST3144A ).
 

Offline cabissi

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2021, 10:55:05 PM »
Thanks Tribble smasher. The only thing I have time to verify is that the mui prefs program does indeed work. I want to start with another blank CDRom and keep track of all the changes using installer logs.
 

Offline TribbleSmasher

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2021, 11:19:54 PM »
Some logfiles are called the same name ("Installation-Protocol") and appear on the Workbench partition. Make sure you give each a useful name before starting the next install.
 

Offline Pat the Cat

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2021, 12:02:13 AM »
Looks like the drive is ultra fussy, only connects on same bus with other HDs of the same close family, not any kind of ATAPI drive.

https://www.seagate.com/staticfiles/support/disc/iguides/ata/9144ig.pdf

It's from 1992.

It looks like MUI is expecting to be in Workbench:system drawer. Which is maybe where it is on your hard drive, not your cF card?

For some reason, your startup sequence is also loading up Aweb. Which isn't going to help getting iBrowse working. Probably it makes no difference.

But to me, looks like all of your problems boil down to your hard drive not being available, so everything is in a different place to what the system is expecting to startup from.

It does not help that CF adaptors are also fussy about sharing an AT channel.

A quickish but flawed workaround would be to make a new drawer on the CF card, copy all the current Workench partition to it (from the card, to the card).

Then turn off, disconnect the DVD-ROM, plug the CF card  and HD into one channel each, boot from the CF, and copy all your HD boot partition straight to the boot partition on your CF card.

Turn off again, unplug the HD, and reconnect the DVD-ROM in the same place. Turn on, and your CF card should boot same as your hard drive used to.

BUT... if every time IDEFIX locks up whene the HD is connected (it can't speak ATAPI) then you really might have to use a separate controller to get the data from the HD to the CF card. Or perhaps upload it to the internet from your machine booted from just the HD, then downloaded onto your CF card.

The reason for the reboot is because you are using 3.1 ROMs, by the way. The system is upgrading components (like large drive file system), needs a reboot for them to take effect. Later ROMs (3.x and now 3.1.4) don't have that issue.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2021, 01:19:44 AM by Pat the Cat »
"To recurse is human. To iterate, divine."

A1200, Vanilla, Surf Squirrel, SD Card, KS 3.0/3.z, PCMCIA dev
A500, Vanilla, A570, Rev 5, KS 1.2/1.3 Testbench system
Rasp Pi, UAE4ARM, 3D laser scanner, experimental, hoping for AmigaOS4Arm, based on Watterott Fabscan Pi
 

Offline cabissi

Re: Problems running several programs
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2021, 03:41:15 PM »
Thanks for the tips. I will pursue them and get back to you when I know more. Pat, greeat tip on the boot delay. I have 3.1.4.1 roms on order. Looking forward to at least fixing one problem.

Chris