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AuthorTopic: Song recognition algorithm  (Read 1590 times)

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Offline MarkTime

Song recognition algorithm
« on: September 14, 2003, 05:08:33 PM »
Here's my idea.

Before the internet, people were always copying off the radio and making their compilation tapes with their favorite songs.

Then along came the internet, and people began using MP3's, and file sharing like kazaa, to, in part, replace what they had always been doing with the radio.

Of course, the quality was even higher.

But I see an opportunity if file sharing is removed, and we go back to radio as the distribution method.
...the internet never promoted copying of songs...we forget that people were doing that since day one, decades before the internet.

common sense is wrong, what the internet is promoting is accountability, not piracy.
What was always 'de-facto' legal, because there was no way to catch someone...i.e. copying a song from the radio...is now illegal, because the laws can be enforced with technology and the internet to track a file swapper..

But I'm going into the background too much.

My idea, is post-kazaa world, we will need technology to catch radio up to the point TV is now.

A radio version of TiVO.

But different too, because my idea, is through the use of song recognition algorithms, to allow people to record music off the radio in the background.  No need whatsoever to have technology on the distribution end, only on the consumers end....Collecting 200 or so songs a day just with regular capture cards tuned to the radio..., and then when they want a song...they don't grab it from kazaa, they get it from their own collection of recorded music, and then they play it back.

The key to this working is technology, but technology whose time has come, in my opinion.

And another secret about busines, you can develop the product to sell to the public, or just develop it to sell to someone who will pay to keep it off the market.

Why do I share this?  well total lack of respect for anyone's talents, but also, just because I like this idea and if someone else develops it... great.
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2003, 05:15:54 PM »
So you mean a radio station that broadcasts a constant audio stream of songs, and you have some software that identifies the songs you want and saves them...

That sucks... ok how about a hijacking a special frequency (from the CB range?) and then transmitting the same stream as a digial signal (an mpeg stream), which could have the name of the song in the header, that way the user will HAVE to save it before they can listen to it (and the software can identify the name of the song from the header).

I don't know what the data rate would be... lets assume 1mbit... then you could get hundereds of songs transmitted every hour...

That would beat the RIAA... but that would suck since I wouldn't get paid.

I think its a stupid idea ;-)

Offline GreggBz

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2003, 05:39:11 PM »
Regardless of any ideas to prohibit file shareing and copy protection, the brute force of technology will negate any technique. Sorry, now I’m going to get all political! Thats inevitable for any thread with file sharing in it.

You do know it's still possible to make a copy of a music CD. In fact, that's really easy. What artist do you hear complaining about people burning copies of there latest album and giving to their neiborghs and schoolmates?  But file sharing is in vogue, and people like to break the law a little bit and then brag about it. Not so much because it’s convenient. If universities started cracking down on illegal file sharing, well that would alleviate about 50 percent of this non-sense. If an artists does not wish their music to be boinged around the internet then they have EVERY RIGHT. But I’ll embrace any artist that embraces the technology. So God Speed to the music industry. I hope they reprimand every person who’s stealed and lied, not just a little bit either, but because it was cool and they thought they could get away with it. It doesn’t matter if they thought it the law was stupid. A lot of people think drunk driving laws are stupid too.  

Think about all of the work that Amiga software developers invested making games and software. I’m a beginning software developer, and I can’t imagine the creativity, work and effort that went into making some of those amazing games that I pirated in the late eighties. Music is no different. Most artist work hard for years and from a very early age before they “make it” Well, shame on me for stealing those great games. But now I know better, so shame on every one else!!
 

Offline amigamad

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2003, 06:53:12 PM »
Well i have a psion wavefinder that streams digital radio through the pc the software included allows recording of any stream in mp3 . :-o
I once had an amigaone xe but sold it .

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Offline MarkTime

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2003, 09:16:05 PM »
I don't think you've captured my idea entirely.

What I am saying is, that the Radio spectrum is a distribution methodology for songs right now.

It is, of course, that is what its intended to be...
but Radio stations are not going to add technology for making the copying of songs easier...no way...never happen.

I don't think.

But it doesn't mean, with clever technology, someone couldn't have a database of song, and have a file recognition alogorithm (something much easier to do than speech recognition, and probably already a unique, patentable invention).

Hey, you can't patent an idea, and there would be so many techniques for doing this, I'm not terrible worried if someone works on it before me.

But anyway, NO....this doesn't keep artists from earning money.

Now, to those who remember you can still copy a CD...

again, I want to stress, this isn't about copying or piracy....not exactly, what makes fileswapping illegal is that you distribute your songs.

This keeps the distribution part of things squarely part of the existing radio networks....with no modifications.

The technology is simply a way of determining when a song starts, when it ends....and using a recognition algorthm to catalogue the song, give it a unique identifier.

Of course, then what is the songs title and what is the artist?  That database would be maintained by a  commercial entity that sold subscriptions.

To the end user, they don't care, all they know is they want a song, they get the song....but it all works via the existing radio system, so its legal.

OK, it would be the quality of radio...but hey, radio has survived a long time, with that restriction.  Besides, I would want people to still buy CD's.....this would really work for the RIAA, even if they would hate it.

So....hey I want feedback, even people telling me I'm crazy...maybe I can flesh out the idea even better.
 

Offline MarkTime

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2003, 09:19:19 PM »
@amigamad,

Hey if you can record your digital radio straight to MP3, and it includes the title and artist?  And you can get on digital radio all the songs you could get in kazaa?

If so, all thats left is for someone to right a little program to start recording the songs automatically for later retrieval...I would think, and turn it into a TiVO like device.

wa-la, you get all your songs for free.

But you know, that wouldn't last long before RIAA shut it down.

I dare them to try and shut down the radio broadcast networks (talk about shooting themselves in the foot).
 

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Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2003, 09:24:11 PM »
Quote

MarkTime wrote:
@amigamad,

Hey if you can record your digital radio straight to MP3, and it includes the title and artist?  And you can get on digital radio all the songs you could get in kazaa?

If so, all thats left is for someone to right a little program to start recording the songs automatically for later retrieval...I would think, and turn it into a TiVO like device.

wa-la, you get all your songs for free.

But you know, that wouldn't last long before RIAA shut it down.

I dare them to try and shut down the radio broadcast networks (talk about shooting themselves in the foot).


Ahhh, but you live in the US... the Radio in the UK sucks... if you put the radio on all day, you may only hear 5 different songs, at best... and you will hear the same five all week...

Offline MarkTime

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2003, 09:26:47 PM »
Let me try and explain my idea...one more time, maybe make it clearer.

Let's say you want to have "Call & Answer" by the Barenaked Ladies.

Well it plays on the radio sometimes.  You put in your 'kazaa' like program you want "Call & Answer" by Bareneaked Ladies.

Well, you may have it already....you see you set your ...lets call it 'RiVO' (name will change) to record your favorite radio station, and it is busy scanning the radio (via your capture card) and recording songs.

It uses clever technology to know when the song starts, when it ends, and it uses an algorithm to give each song a unique identifier, it then matches that number against a public internet database, and wa-la...you have a steadily growing collection of songs on your hard drive.

If you don't have it, or don't want it to fill your hard drive like that...you just tell it to look for that song.

In the background, your RiVO is busy, working away day and night scanning the radio spectrum, but not saving the song...but then one day
at 11:00PM September 23rd, on KWAVE FM, the song is played.

Your RiVO records it....just like a VCR recording a television program.

It records it for later playback...saves it in MP3...it can even play back on your iPOD...

its all completely legal stuff.....but it works a lot like Kazaa, or so it seems...to the end user.

But its nothing like Kazaa...its using the radio broadcast networks, and just recording songs for playback later.

Legal.  Moral.  Ethical.....very useful in a post-kazaa world.  Not worth it, as long as kazaa is still around.

Good, bad, won't work???
 

Offline MarkTime

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2003, 09:27:27 PM »
AIYEEE....

yes sounds like that would make it very problematic in the UK...five songs all day? wow.
 

Offline AmigaHeretic

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2003, 10:59:22 PM »
I don't think this would be to difficult at all.  Especially if it was XM radio related.  The quality would be quite good and XM radio broadcasts the name of the artist and song.   When the Name and Artist pop up, the software would start recording.  It would stop recording and then start a new recording when the next Name and Artist information come up.

I know most all FM radio stations in the US these days broadcast at least the name of the station and type of music they play (rock, jazz, pop, etc..).  Does anyone know if they broadcast the name and artist of the songs they're playing?
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Offline Tomas

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2003, 11:12:11 PM »
Quote
But different too, because my idea, is through the use of song recognition algorithms, to allow people to record music off the radio in the background.

Then wouldnt you end up with cut off songs? Since the song has to be playing to be identified, unless the radio broadcasters starts to transmit a certain key/code for each song, right before they play it.

If not, it would then have to record all the time, and then delete the songs that does not match.
 

Offline kolla

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2003, 01:23:13 AM »
So what you want is a way to "bypass" the ethical aspect of having a copy of intelectual property you havent bought?

Why?

Btw, the radio channels of norwegian broadcasting are already avaible as mp3 streams, and most of their music programs have their playlists avaible from their home pages.

NRK - streams
NRK playlists check out the "Spillelister" from the DJs and programs.  ;-)
B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC
 

Offline iamaboringperson

Re: Song recognition algorithm
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2003, 04:17:18 AM »
Quote
Btw, the radio channels of norwegian broadcasting are already avaible as mp3 streams, and most of their music programs have their playlists avaible from their home pages.
And I bet it pays the IP owners too! :-)