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AuthorTopic: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?  (Read 3560 times)

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Offline paolone

Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #30 on: January 24, 2013, 04:26:23 PM »
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;723767
I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?

Discussions about the death of Windows XP are quite silly on an Amiga related website, IMHO. We should perfectly know nothing dies unless everybody stops using it forever and that won't be the case for Windows XP as well, for many many years.

From a commercial POV, XP has been already dead since the first netbooks with Windows 7 (replacing XP) came out 18-24 months ago.

From a technical POV, it is already dead since it does not support all the features new programs expect in Windows.

From a security POV it will be dead on April 8th, 2014, when Microsoft will release its latest security bulletin still supporting Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 (even if I am not pretty sure both systems will die together, maybe Win 2003 EOL can be anticipated).

But from the users POV it will die only when it won't be useful for anything more. Even into virtual machines. It will take AGES, before people will completely replace their favourite XP applications. Bare reality, however, is that new computers can't use XP directly, nor XP can use latest hardware features, so nobody will buy a new PC to install XP onto it.
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Offline som99

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #31 on: January 24, 2013, 04:27:30 PM »
Quote from: CritAnime;723825
I detested windows 8 however it's slowly growing on me. And I spend more time on the "classic" desktop so I don't deal with metro very much. Thats not to say I outright like it now. I am still not impressed with metro and certain things, like having to go to hot coners to alter settings, still annoy me.

You know you can make your own hotkeys to open what you want without hassle? Could aid your W8 usage :)

For example, you might want a hotkey combination to open the classic control panel?
Well it's easy, right click on the control panel shortcut, select properties, in the "Shortcut" tab you have a field named "Shortcut key:" press either CTRL+Shift or CTRL+ALT and desired key, for example CTRL+ALT+C and press "OK".

Bam when you press CTRL+ALT+C the control panel opens.

You can do this to everything, web URL's, Administrator tools etc etc, nice and easy way to go to whatever you want no matter what Windows version you use, ive been doing this for ages for things like network settings, computer management etc :D
« Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 04:31:52 PM by som99 »
 

ChuckT

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #32 on: January 24, 2013, 04:36:21 PM »
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;723767
I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?


If you buy a new computer, you won't have a choice.  Dell is forcing Windows 8 on everyone.

Go to your local software store and see what the oldest Windows software you can buy is.  Can you get new software for Windows 95?  The answer will probably be "no".  Pretty soon the stores will stop selling software for Windows XP and your answer will be "Windows XP is broken".

The other issue is length of life on hard drives.  They have surface mount components and they don't all last beyond 5 years.
 

Offline B00tDisk

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #33 on: January 24, 2013, 04:55:53 PM »
Quote from: AmigaClassicRule;723767
I mean I love Windows 7. Windows 7 is an awesome operating system and I hate Windows 8 with the greatest of passion, but Windows XP is a great Windows OS too and wondering if it is really dead now?


It isn't dead so long as you keep it behind a meaty firewall and so forth.  Same goes for Win2000, for that matter.  Keep them protected and they'll continue to serve.  My retro-game box runs Win98 and never, ever connects to the internet for any reason whatsoever.  I've got the "Windows 98 Storage Driver" for USB and I sneakernet any files I need to it.

WinXP and 2k (well, maybe 2k) aren't that dire yet, so, enjoy.

You just won't get any patches for any particularly egregious bugs or problems with the core OS itself.
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Offline B00tDisk

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #34 on: January 24, 2013, 04:57:00 PM »
Quote from: rvo_nl;723788
XP was a very solid OS but win7 and win8 are a lot better, IMO. especially with classic shell installed, windows 8 is very nice. It removes the new interface and brings back the old start menu. Just my opinion.

I just wish there was a way to reenable Aero Glass :(
« Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 05:06:24 PM by B00tDisk »
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Offline AmigaClassicRule

Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #35 on: January 24, 2013, 05:04:34 PM »
Quote from: B00tDisk;723834
I just wish there was a way to reenable Aero :(

Personally, I love Windows 7 as much as I love Windows XP and I will migrate to Windows 7. I want to see if I can skip Windows 8. Hopefully Windows 9 will be better. I treat Windows 8 as I would Vista and Windows ME.
 

Offline som99

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #36 on: January 24, 2013, 05:27:36 PM »
Quote from: ChuckT;723830
If you buy a new computer, you won't have a choice.  Dell is forcing Windows 8 on everyone.

Go to your local software store and see what the oldest Windows software you can buy is.  Can you get new software for Windows 95?  The answer will probably be "no".  Pretty soon the stores will stop selling software for Windows XP and your answer will be "Windows XP is broken".

The other issue is length of life on hard drives.  They have surface mount components and they don't all last beyond 5 years.

What forces you to use W8 on DELL computers? I suspect you are talking about laptops since most enthusiast computer users put together their own desktops, but sure OEM laptops will move to newer OS but you can still format the drive and install whatever OS you want as long as there is drivers available (currently not much of an issue) also who buys OEM desktops?

Also due to the limits of the 32-bit kernel in Windows XP you have no real reason to buy a brand new laptop to use Windows XP on as long as there is working second hand ones.

What is the issue with hard drives? Are you talking about hard drives or solid state drives?
Since I got tons of more then 5 years old hard drives running 24/7 in my file server without issues, the biggest killer of hard drives is heat which is a problem for laptop users.

Running old software on newer OS is no issue, I use VMware to run DOS and Windows 3.11/95/98/2000/XP etc and run all legacy software I want without trouble, you can use whatever virtual box you want for that but VMware is Superior on many aspects and have DX9 support.

Besides software using later DirectX version (mostly games) than you can use on Windows XP much software will still run under Windows XP for quite some time, the gap between Windows 9x and NT based are mostly caused by the move to the NT based kernel of Windows XP so such dramatical compability issues will not be as apparent between XP and 8 before the leap to 64-bit software kicks in.

So I still do not see the issue, if you want to run unsupported legacy software you can, most things will run for quite some time on Windows XP still.

The biggest problem I can see is when new hardware do not get drivers for Windows XP but it wont be an issue since the Windows XP kernel is getting more and more outdated for new hardware anyways so XP wont be optimal anyways and if you want to keep using it you could run it trough virtual box or keep XP supported hardware.

Since there are already limited by the 32-bit version of Windows XP from both new CPU pov and the limited RAM capabilities including VRAM (not counting the broken 64-bit version of XP with very limited driver support) you will be forced to move to a new OS by time but only if you are in need of hardware not supported by XP.

So yes, Windows XP will die out due to new hardware and higher software requirements by time, but nothing stops you from running it on a VM or keeping XP supported hardware for a XP computer.

So bottom line, XP is a decent OS yes but getting to old, nothing stops you from using it for quite some time, if you are not limited by the 32-bit kernel keep using as long as you want.
But it will be outdated as time progress but I predict most software will keep running for quite some time on it.

Getting outdated, yes.
Dead, no since it depends on the user.

WOW, i wrote a lot of text here, hope it's understandable and not to much off-topic :)

Edit: Also as it looks now with possible release of Windows Blue this summer with cheaper more frequent upgrade releases it seems Windows won't get better and I hope to god Linux will rule the desktop market in 5-10 years time due to Microsofts new approach!
« Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 05:36:07 PM by som99 »
 

Offline adonay

Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #37 on: January 24, 2013, 05:40:45 PM »
I love windows 8 never felt windows 7 was anything other than a new vista.
However i used windows xp last summer on my old work laptop "car diagnostics" and mapping Standalone ECUs.
I kind of wished that XP was dead because 4 days with that crap and the unstability told me that windows have only improved over the years.

Anyways before i upgraded to windows 8 on that laptop i reinstalled a fresh version of XP and i am sure that win8 is faster on that computer. (panasonic TB CF-74).
Never looked back and never will..
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Offline som99

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #38 on: January 24, 2013, 05:45:25 PM »
Quote from: adonay;723840
I love windows 8 never felt windows 7 was anything other than a new vista.
However i used windows xp last summer on my old work laptop "car diagnostics" and mapping Standalone ECUs.
I kind of wished that XP was dead because 4 days with that crap and the unstability told me that windows have only improved over the years.

Anyways before i upgraded to windows 8 on that laptop i reinstalled a fresh version of XP and i am sure that win8 is faster on that computer. (panasonic TB CF-74).
Never looked back and never will..

On somewhat new hardware XP is outdated yes, but if you are using older more performance limited hardware XP is more fitting then 7/8 (also much old hardware do not get drivers for new OS versions anymore).

So there still is some need for XP. As I wrote a few posts back I would never run W7/8 on my torrent seedbox since the hardware is to weak.
For the big mainstream masses that only have new hardware the need for XP is gone.

I ordered a new SoC Asus C8HM70-I/HDMI with a dual core 1,1GHz Intel Celeron 847 today for my car, it will be fun to see how a 17w TDP computer handles the newer OS:es.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2013, 05:48:57 PM by som99 »
 

Offline AmigaBruno

Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #39 on: January 24, 2013, 06:07:45 PM »
I think this is a pretty stupid topic to post on an Amiga forum!

To sum up, I use Linux OS most of the time. I first used it in 1999, when I was pressured into getting a PC because I couldn't afford all the Amiga upgrades I'd need to get onto the Internet. Back in 1999, I tried a few different Linux distros, but I couldn't connect to the Internet with them, because I had a modem which had something missing which a Windows driver made up for. This is called a "Winmodem". Later on, I got an external modem and was able to get online using Linux. Later still, I got a new laptop with Windows XP Media Center Edition, which encouraged me to fill up the hard drive with various stuff, then I soon realised I didn't have enough space to install Linux, so I forgot about it. Later still, I was living in temporary accommodation and watching a DVD on that laptop which I'd recorded off air in as low quality as possible to fit 6 hours onto the DVD. While in the middle of viewing it, Windows XP Media Center Edition decided it didn't like it, then crashed. It failed to reboot, because a very important file called something like System32.dll was missing or corrupted! I then faced a choice of using the manufacturer's System Restore DVD, which I soon realised would wiped out various data which I hadn't got round to backing up. The solution was to use a CD or DVD with a live version of Puppy Linux, because it's a small distro which loads into RAM, leaving the DVD-R/W drive free to copy my data onto. At that time, I needed to get online using a 3G dongle, so I eventually found I was able to do this using Ubuntu Linux, but not PC Linux OS. This is why I use Ubuntu Linux. Of course, Ubuntu Linux now seems to be dominating the World of Linux and could even wipe out all other Linux distros, so that may be a good reason not to use it any more. I think that Aeros OS, combining Aros OS with Linux sounds interesting http://www.aeros-os.org/ .

As for Windows XP, there are various interesting games such as The Sims, The Sims 2, and The Sims 3, which can only be run under Windows, so this is the only good reason to use Windows at all. Check the system requirements to see if they require a Windows Version later than XP. I think that anything else can be done either on Aeros OS, or Linux. Someone is trying to develop an open source alternative to MS Windows, which they call ReactOS http://www.reactos.org/en/index.html .
 

Offline som99

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #40 on: January 24, 2013, 06:53:36 PM »
Quote from: AmigaBruno;723843
As for Windows XP, there are various interesting games such as The Sims, The Sims 2, and The Sims 3, which can only be run under Windows, so this is the only good reason to use Windows at all. Check the system requirements to see if they require a Windows Version later than XP. I think that anything else can be done either on Aeros OS, or Linux. Someone is trying to develop an open source alternative to MS Windows, which they call ReactOS http://www.reactos.org/en/index.html .


There is loads of new games not possible to run under Linux, later DirectX based games do unfortunately not play nice with linux at all. OpenGL has a bright future tho and Steams move to Linux will speed things up so if we are lucky it will be a better future for gaming and Linux.

Also my wife plays the sims 3 on Linux, she has Linux mint installed and I got the sims 3 running for her under both the new Whine and PlayOnLinux but ofc there is performance loss. So I do not know why you think the sims do not run under Linux.

There are tho other reasons why I can't mainly only use Linux beside games, I have dual boot of both windows and Linux but as I have two AMD Radeon HD 7970 graphics cards and Linux works like crap on my main workstation due to those cards drivers are a mess under Linux right now.

Drivers are a big issue when using high end stuff under Linux and is one of the biggest obstacles for many people.
 

Offline commodorejohn

Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #41 on: January 24, 2013, 07:05:15 PM »
Quote from: ral-clan;723797
In fact, I've been thinking about what will happen when / if I actually need to upgrade my hardware.  I'd like to find a more modern system that will STILL run Windows XP - mainly for the sole attraction of the additional CPU cores that will make my existing video editing software etc. even faster.
You have to check into the hardware and make sure there are drivers available, but I've been pleasantly surprised by how much newer hardware still does support XP. Enough that I can probably keep going for the foreseeable future on refurbished laptops, anyway.

I'm still running XP on both my daily-driver laptop and my gaming PC - never touched Vista, and 7 has too much needless screwing around with UI stuff, only some of which can be fixed with third-party patches. XP runs all my software and lets me use the interface I'm familiar with from over fifteen years of running Win95 derivatives instead of forcing me into the New Way of doing things; why would I upgrade?

(I'm curious, though, I've heard that you can take the explorer.exe from XP and run it on 32-bit 7 - if that works, I might give it a shot. But at the moment I don't have a free machine to experiment with...)
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Offline som99

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Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #42 on: January 24, 2013, 07:08:37 PM »
Quote from: commodorejohn;723851
I'm still running XP on both my daily-driver laptop and my gaming PC - never touched Vista, and 7 has too much needless screwing around with UI stuff, only some of which can be fixed with third-party patches. XP runs all my software and lets me use the interface I'm familiar with from over fifteen years of running Win95 derivatives instead of forcing me into the New Way of doing things; why would I upgrade?


What games do you play on your gaming pc?
What specs are your gaming pc?
Are you using 32 or 64 bits windows xp?
 

Offline eliyahu

Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #43 on: January 24, 2013, 07:25:49 PM »
@thread

just an FYI: i've moved this thread to the 'other operating systems' forum since it wasn't specifically amiga related. shouldn't affect anything, though, in the thread itself. thanks!

-- eliyahu
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Offline commodorejohn

Re: Completely off topic...but is Windows XP dead?
« Reply #44 on: January 24, 2013, 07:44:26 PM »
Quote from: som99;723852
What games do you play on your gaming pc?
What specs are your gaming pc?
Are you using 32 or 64 bits windows xp?
32-bit XP, on a P4-2.8GHz (Prescott something-or-other) with 4GB DDR400 (just under 3GB recognized, but with all four it means I get dual-channel memory access) and a GeForce 7600 GT (8x AGP.) Aside from an attempt at Skyrim (the CPU and GPU aren't really up to it,) the newest thing I play on it is Oblivion. (I'm working on a heavily modded-up Morrowind install, though, I'm curious to see whether that will end up being more of a workout for the system...)

I'm looking at boosting it to a Core 2 board in the near future; I've already got a PCIe GeForce 8400 something-or-other to go with it.
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"\'Legacy code\' often differs from its suggested alternative by actually working and scaling." - Bjarne Stroustrup