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AuthorTopic: Windows fudges it again  (Read 4406 times)

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Offline Tension

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2010, 01:03:34 AM »
Quote from: tone007;594391
Windows is great!


LOL u troll  :)

Offline tone007

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Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2010, 01:44:35 AM »
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Offline Arkhan

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2010, 05:07:42 AM »
Quote from: TheGoose;594302
I do agree, people I work with (in a university) don't know how to use Excel or Word to any better degree than they did in 1995. Or use a computer in general with any more proficiency than they did in 1995. They are no better with a quad-core machine than a 486. CPU Power is really just off-set with glossy icons and sliding screens and widgets. How is that "Advancement"?


because there are people using computers for other things besides jacking off in Office?  Important things!

You want NASA to run on 486s, or your bank?   How about the hospitals?

Yeah lets just throw out all the newest technology and slam down some frigging IMSAIs all over the place, just because the people you work with are frigging retards.


If you can afford >4gb of RAM, you can probably afford a 64bit CPU and OS installation, so stop whining and fix the problem.
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Offline kedawa

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2010, 05:30:30 AM »
except cyberporn generally requires more computational power than office work, so...
 

Offline jj

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Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2010, 10:15:20 AM »
Did you all read the aracticle all way through ?????
 
Even with a 64bit OS it goes on to say that 8G is the sweet spot and there is still an advantage if you have anymore than this to assign it to a ram disk and put swap file/temp files there.
 
And yes Windows is a good OS, if you cant see that then blinkers much
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Offline gertsy

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Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2010, 10:30:44 AM »
Quote from: JJ;594420
Did you all read the aracticle all way through ?????
 
Even with a 64bit OS it goes on to say that 8G is the sweet spot and there is still an advantage if you have anymore than this to assign it to a ram disk and put swap file/temp files there.
 
And yes Windows is a good OS, if you cant see that then blinkers much


I have no problem with Windows.  Ive used it constantly in my work and at home since 3.0 and 3.11. Before that DOS.  Yes I'm old.
But just the ring of "8GB is the sweet spot" makes me laugh.  Just think how much end user data would be in 8 GB.  We are talking encylopedias of information.  
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Offline jj

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Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2010, 11:17:44 AM »
All depends what you use your pc for I suppose.
 
This article is biased towards the latest and greatest games and things that use a large amount of data like video etc
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Offline kedawa

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #22 on: November 27, 2010, 01:49:34 AM »
Quote from: JJ;594420
And yes Windows is a good OS, if you cant see that then blinkers much

Windows is a good product.  It's not great, mind you, and it's not without glaring faults, but it's good enough.  The company that produces it, on the other hand, is whole other story..
 

Offline stefcep2

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #23 on: November 27, 2010, 03:10:12 AM »
Quote from: Arkhan;594407
because there are people using computers for other things besides jacking off in Office?  Important things!

You want NASA to run on 486s, or your bank?   How about the hospitals?

WTF?  The number of people that work for NASA or a bank are minuscule subset of the world's computer users.  Just coz they might find a use for more than a gig of two of ram doesn't mean 99.99% of everyone else will.

And what were the specs of the computers used to send men to the moon?
 
Most hospitals around us run fairly low spec'd machines, beacsue its all they need for a patient database-yeah and i know about remote live video for diagnostics is A Good Thing, but its a niche thing that is mostly never needed.

Quote
Yeah lets just throw out all the newest technology and slam down some frigging IMSAIs all over the place, just because the people you work with are frigging retards.

Newer technology has its place-in the not too distant past, there were users who NEEDED the power of a Cray, now people are logging on to facebook or watching a poor quality you-tube of someone's cat with the a better-specced machine, saying they NEED that 8 Gig 8 core behemoth.

Quote
If you can afford >4gb of RAM, you can probably afford a 64bit CPU and OS installation, so stop whining and fix the problem.

AAh the motto upon which the PC market is built on:"If it doesn't run fast enough, buy new hardware", which really  means "make it run slow, so you HAVE to". And the only reason why people accept it is because its cheap to upgrade so people just shrug and do it.

Except there is a looming shortage of rare earth metals, so unless they find another way to make the circuitry, it aint gonna be so cheap to upgrade forever.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2010, 03:13:41 AM by stefcep2 »
 

Offline psxphill

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #24 on: November 27, 2010, 03:55:27 AM »
Quote from: stefcep2;594602
AAh the motto upon which the PC market is built on:"If it doesn't run fast enough, buy new hardware", which really means "make it run slow, so you HAVE to". And the only reason why people accept it is because its cheap to upgrade so people just shrug and do it.
 
Except there is a looming shortage of rare earth metals, so unless they find another way to make the circuitry, it aint gonna be so cheap to upgrade forever.

Obviously most people will take the cheapest route to better performance. I don't buy into the conspiracy theories that anyone is trying to force you to upgrade by making their software slow. It is impossible to write software that does more, without requiring more processor power.
 
Some software is poorly written, but writing it better would take more time and money. If you're trying to get software to market, then you have to ship it sometime. Nobody has unlimited pots of money, not even microsoft. You can't solve the time problem with money either. Even if you don't run out of money, is anyone going to pay your extortionate prices for software if you spend ten times longer to write the software by making it run slightly quicker?
 
There is a huge difference between modern hardware and 1992 amigas, but there is a huge difference between what you can do with them. My 50mhz 68030 struggled to play mp3's, I dread to think what it would make of a bluray. No matter how much you tried to optimise it, you'd get nowhere. AGA can't even output 1080p60.
 
I still get enjoyment out of my C128, so I can see why 8gb of ram would seem outrageous in comparison. However I don't try to import 2gb of price matrixes on it either.
 

Offline kedawa

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #25 on: November 27, 2010, 04:11:23 AM »
I don't think I'd even want to play MP3s on an Amiga.  Stick a modern HDD in one and you could have a sizeable collection of uncompressed music that requires very little computational power to play.
 

Offline Arkhan

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #26 on: November 27, 2010, 05:54:09 AM »
Quote from: stefcep2;594602
WTF?  The number of people that work for NASA or a bank are minuscule subset of the world's computer users.  Just coz they might find a use for more than a gig of two of ram doesn't mean 99.99% of everyone else will.

NASA sends humans into space.  They need state of the art technology.   If I were an astronaut and I saw a C64 w/ cables and shit hanging out of the back as the device responsible for sending me hurtling through the atmosphere, I would quit my job immediately.

Quote

And what were the specs of the computers used to send men to the moon?

Yes, that was STATE OF THE ART.  It was also dangerous, risky, and HOLY SHIT caliber to do what they did back then..  Theres alot better technology now.  Lets use it, k?   We don't need another Apollo 13 debacle because nostalgic zealots don't want to use new gear and would rather use Fossiltron9000 to send people to the moon.

Quote

Most hospitals around us run fairly low spec'd machines, beacsue its all they need for a patient database-yeah and i know about remote live video for diagnostics is A Good Thing, but its a niche thing that is mostly never needed.

I worked for the Cleveland Clinic.  Its a pretty big deal, that clinic.  They exist overseas.   They're everywhere.  They don't use low spec'd machines.  Shit is top notch.   It's like that for a reason.   Cutting edge technology = success and efficiency.   Good luck running patient databases on a Pentium II w/ 128mb RAM.  

Or those real-time monitoring databases with alert software.  Yeah that will go well.

"HOW DID THE PATIENT DIE?"  

"WELL YOU SEE, THE AMIGA CRASHED BECAUSE WE DIDNT HAVE ENOUGH RAM TO DO A TRIPLE BYPASS SURGERY AND STORE ALL THE DATA IN REAL TIME AND THEN THE MONITORS FROM 1982 STARTED FLICKERING AND WE COULDN'T SEE HIS VITALS.  WE THOUGHT MAYBE THE 286 RUNNING ALL THE OTHER GEAR WOULD WORK OUT BUT WIN 3.1 CRASHED. SRY"

Quote

Newer technology has its place-in the not too distant past, there were users who NEEDED the power of a Cray, now people are logging on to facebook or watching a poor quality you-tube of someone's cat with the a better-specced machine, saying they NEED that 8 Gig 8 core behemoth.

No they're not.  Sounds like you're just jealous your Amiga doesnt run youtube so well.


Quote

AAh the motto upon which the PC market is built on:"If it doesn't run fast enough, buy new hardware", which really  means "make it run slow, so you HAVE to". And the only reason why people accept it is because its cheap to upgrade so people just shrug and do it.

Yet again, you bust out the fail.  What do you do when your Amiga isn't fast enough?  YOU BUY MORE RAM AND ACCELERATORS.  JUICE IT UP, GO GO GO.  

The "if it isnt fast enough, upgrade" motto has existed since computers were made.  Apple, Commodore, Amiga, IBM, all of them.  Quit being a bigot.  You updated your Amiga at least once when it needed more oomph, and you know it.

Quote

Except there is a looming shortage of rare earth metals, so unless they find another way to make the circuitry, it aint gonna be so cheap to upgrade forever.


get out.  I think there are chimps with higher levels of thought than you. :laughing:
I am a negative, rude, prick.  


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Offline ElPolloDiabl

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #27 on: November 27, 2010, 10:19:42 AM »
Let me just finish... Yeah read the whole article it is interesting. By installing a RAMDisk you can use more than the 3GB of memory in 32 bit windows. Also with the virtual memory turned off it crashed in some tests. Unacceptable and kludgy.

I'm sticking with 32-bit for at least two more years, I shouldn't have to mess around with virtual machines to run old software, one example being Mavis Beacon typing of Windows 95 era. Pirates from Windows XP era is another example that doesn't like 64-bit.

The only thing that ever requires more than 3GB is some seriously huge productivity stuff. Why not just keep that away from your general purpose home computer.

Lastly: Hey if apple could have seamless emulation why can't windows?
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Offline HenryCase

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #28 on: November 27, 2010, 10:31:29 AM »
Quote from: ElPolloDiabl;594640
Lastly: Hey if apple could have seamless emulation why can't windows?

Windows 7 has an Windows XP compatibility mode:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/features/windows-xp-mode.aspx
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Offline psxphill

Re: Windows fudges it again
« Reply #29 on: November 27, 2010, 12:12:31 PM »
Quote from: kedawa;594611
I don't think I'd even want to play MP3s on an Amiga. Stick a modern HDD in one and you could have a sizeable collection of uncompressed music that requires very little computational power to play.

Isn't it hypocritical to put a modern huge hard drive in an amiga to allow you store audio in an inefficient format? If using modern hardware in a PC is so bad.
 
Quote from: ElPolloDiabl;594640
Also with the virtual memory turned off it crashed in some tests. Unacceptable and kludgy.
 
I'm sticking with 32-bit for at least two more years, I shouldn't have to mess around with virtual machines to run old software,

Yeah, I wouldn't disable virtual memory or limit it to a ram disk, no computer handles resource exhaustion well. The reason of course is that it's very expensive to write software that copes, when the easier solution is to make sure you have a large enough margin that you don't need to worry.
 
Windows handles low memory situations better than AmigaOS ever did. I don't use virtual machines for compatibility, because there isn't any old software that I would want to use. If a company doesn't think it's worth making a windows 7 64 bit compatible version then the software probably isn't very useful.
 
Windows 7 64 is generally more stable than 32 bit. Device drivers must be signed & they seem to get tested better. It's also more resistant to virus'
 
Going from kickstart 1.2 to 1.3 affected compatiblity, so did going from 1.3 to 2 & 3. The solution to that was a kickstart switcher, or softkicking/loading via mmu. I don't see how this would be different to a dual boot or virtual machine.
 
The main difference between windows and amigaos, is that windows is under active development to keep it modern. For amigaos we have 4.0, which needs to use a virutal machine to run old software.
 
Windows 7 64 bit ultimate/enterprise comes with xp mode, which pretty seemlessly runs software in a VM (like MacOS does for old software). You can have 32 bit applications in windows on your desktop, 32bit tray icons even appear in the system tray.