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AuthorTopic: Video: AROS 68K Booting  (Read 7948 times)

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Offline Khephren

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2010, 02:09:03 PM »
Does this mean we could have a new ROM chip fror classics, with new stuff built in?
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2010, 02:11:01 PM »
Quote from: Khephren;592783
Does this mean we could have a new ROM chip fror classics, with new stuff built in?
Yup. Without copyright issues too.

Offline Piru

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Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2010, 02:18:31 PM »
Quote from: Khephren;592783
Does this mean we could have a new ROM chip fror classics, with new stuff built in?
That remains to be seen. There needs to be some serious optimization or other trickery applied to make it possible, as currently the image is way larger than 512KB.

One possibility could perhaps be to use LZMA compression for the image, but this would mean losing quite some RAM for the decompressed KS ROM.

Since UAE has no such size limitations (or the limitations can easily be worked around by locating part of the KS ROM elsewhere in memory) it will easily benefit from the new AROS KS ROM. Classic KS ROM replacement will take some more effort.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2010, 02:21:48 PM by Piru »
 

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Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #18 on: November 18, 2010, 02:39:37 PM »
Piru is quite right, space is an issue. But there are options being explored... I'm sure he would love to see the discussion on the Dev list ;) ;) hehehe...

Also I believe that All Amiga's apart from some early ones can actually support 1MB ROMs...

Offline Karlos

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2010, 02:47:23 PM »
Can you not just put the absolute minimum required, including disk IO support into the ROM and then load all the additional kickstart resources from the HD?

Obviously this assumes you have a classic with some sort of hard disk / CF / whatever.
int p; // A
 

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Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #20 on: November 18, 2010, 02:50:42 PM »
Quote from: Karlos;592800
Can you not just put the absolute minimum required, including disk IO support into the ROM and then load all the additional kickstart resources from the HD?

Obviously this assumes you have a classic with some sort of hard disk / CF / whatever.
That's easy and will probably be used by most people... But Toni and Jason both want to see just how close to the original ROMs they can get, for maximum possible compatibility :)

Offline Heiroglyph

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #21 on: November 18, 2010, 03:09:03 PM »
Quote from: bloodline;592798
Also I believe that All Amiga's apart from some early ones can actually support 1MB ROMs...


I think I'm out of luck with a 4000T.  If I remember correctly, these are extremely hard to upgrade to 1MB.  The extra lines aren't anywhere near the ROM chips.

I do have a hard drive and Deneb with plenty of flash so it's not a big loss.
 

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Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #22 on: November 18, 2010, 03:15:42 PM »
Quote from: Heiroglyph;592810
I think I'm out of luck with a 4000T.  If I remember correctly, these are extremely hard to upgrade to 1MB.  The extra lines aren't anywhere near the ROM chips.

I do have a hard drive and Deneb with plenty of flash so it's not a big loss.
With an A4000 you would use diskbased modules anyway... Only a minimal ROM required :)

Offline little

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #23 on: November 18, 2010, 03:29:02 PM »
Quote from: Piru;592789
There needs to be some serious optimization or other trickery applied to make it possible, as currently the image is way larger than 512KB.
Is that feat really needed? The only reason I can think for wanting AROS in classic amiga (expanded or not) is to get new features for the operative system beyond what 3.9 may offer. Instead of attempting to fit everything in less than 512kb, wouldn't it be easier to boot (from a hard disk) 68k AROS using the original kickstart ROM?
 

Offline Christian Johansson

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #24 on: November 18, 2010, 03:29:37 PM »
Quote from: Heiroglyph;592810
I think I'm out of luck with a 4000T.  If I remember correctly, these are extremely hard to upgrade to 1MB.  The extra lines aren't anywhere near the ROM chips.

I do have a hard drive and Deneb with plenty of flash so it's not a big loss.


You could use a Kickflash card perhaps.
 

Offline dammy

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #25 on: November 18, 2010, 04:26:39 PM »
Quote from: little;592815
Is that feat really needed? The only reason I can think for wanting AROS in classic amiga (expanded or not) is to get new features for the operative system beyond what 3.9 may offer. Instead of attempting to fit everything in less than 512kb, wouldn't it be easier to boot (from a hard disk) 68k AROS using the original kickstart ROM?


I think their goal is eventually to get to the point where people can start coding upgraded kickstart ROMs for the different series/revisions again.  Imagine if you will, new updated kickstart/workbench coming from the classic community and not from AI.  Why be content with today's kickstart?
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Offline little

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #26 on: November 18, 2010, 05:16:07 PM »
Quote from: dammy;592829
Why be content with today's kickstart?

Why not? Look at the x86 bios, I can't think of any new features since the days of the 386, at most it supports new hardware, which is not an issue with classic amiga models. All new features can be implemented in the AROS. There might be some small issues, like having to create a boot partition in big hard disks or hard disks with newer filesystems, but having modern/free software makes it worth it.
 

Offline trekiej

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #27 on: November 18, 2010, 05:29:06 PM »
Booting into vga or ntsc would be nice on an A1200.
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Offline dammy

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #28 on: November 18, 2010, 05:32:48 PM »
Quote from: little;592839
Why not? Look at the x86 bios, I can't think of any new features since the days of the 386, at most it supports new hardware, which is not an issue with classic amiga models. All new features can be implemented in the AROS. There might be some small issues, like having to create a boot partition in big hard disks or hard disks with newer filesystems, but having modern/free software makes it worth it.


That's my point, there are reasons to want updated kickstart on the classic Amigas.
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Offline Heiroglyph

Re: Video: AROS 68K Booting
« Reply #29 on: November 18, 2010, 05:33:33 PM »
Quote from: little;592839
Why not? Look at the x86 bios, I can't think of any new features since the days of the 386, at most it supports new hardware, which is not an issue with classic amiga models. All new features can be implemented in the AROS. There might be some small issues, like having to create a boot partition in big hard disks or hard disks with newer filesystems, but having modern/free software makes it worth it.


But Kickstart is way more than just the BIOS, it's also the core of the OS.

Personally I'd like to boot directly into my RTG screen without having to screw with flickerfixers or ancient monitors and you can't do that unless Kickstart includes RTG.