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AuthorTopic: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks  (Read 5516 times)

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Offline Gulliver

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #30 on: January 18, 2010, 04:05:30 AM »
@LoadWB

You are taking it out of context. To keep it small and simple:
How can an Amiga web site do not support Amigas?
Okay, if you have a really expanded one you can... but NOT an original Commodore-Amiga.


Website should then be renamed Amiga-like.org or Amiga-ish.org or even AmigaNG.org :)
 

Offline Marcb

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2010, 06:00:49 AM »
@Thread
Life really is too short to keep rehashing old arguments, however, (:))
I understand the point of view of those who say an Amiga site should support Amiga browsing but as with most things in life, the website is designed for the ease of use of the majority. (Kinda like this democracy thing we all seem to like)
 
People viewing Amiga.org with a classic Amiga are in the minority therefore they are not catered for.
 
I guess the reason we all continue to argue about the same old things is because as Amiga users we are by definition unhappy with change. ;)
"...but some animals are more equal than others."
 

Offline Karlos

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2010, 08:08:42 AM »
Quote from: CountRaven;538829
I wonder what kind of "software machine" / "method" is used behind http://www.amigaworld.net and http://www.amigans.net making them viewable to IBrowse....


Exactly the same thing that used to be behind here before the server upgrade (ie XOOPS).

However, this site was significantly older than either of the other two and locked into an obsolete version of XOOPS that couldn't be readily upgraded. When the hosting company set a deadline to upgrade to PHP5, that was a death warrant to the version of XOOPS that was in use. There are newer versions of XOOPS, but they are no more IBrowse friendly than vBulletin is.

Comparing old browser compatibility on this site to amigaworld.net is pointless. They are running an IBrowse friendly version of XOOPS because they are still in a position to.
int p; // A
 

Offline CountRaven

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2010, 09:33:12 AM »
So if we now want to setup a forum friendly for IBrowse should we use vBulletin???
Peg2, Amiga 500, Amiga 600, Amiga 1200D-030, Amiga 1200PPC, Amiga 4000PPC, CD32, 2xCDTV, Sam 440EP, Efika, AmigaOne XE.

http://www.amigaplanet.gr
 

Offline Karlos

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #34 on: January 18, 2010, 10:11:08 AM »
Quote from: CountRaven;538870
So if we now want to setup a forum friendly for IBrowse should we use vBulletin???

Nope, you should find an older version of xoops, or write your own. Present versions of vB/XOOPS tend to be aimed at browsers that support things that have been considered standard over the last decade.
int p; // A
 

Offline amigadave

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Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #35 on: January 18, 2010, 10:13:33 AM »
Quote from: Gulliver;538835
@LoadWB

You are taking it out of context. To keep it small and simple:
How can an Amiga web site do not support Amigas?
Okay, if you have a really expanded one you can... but NOT an original Commodore-Amiga.


Website should then be renamed Amiga-like.org or Amiga-ish.org or even AmigaNG.org :)

The original Amigas were not equipped to run current web browsers even when they were new and still being sold in stores.  If you want a half-way decent web browsing experience using an Amiga(Like) OS then buy a SAM440ep/flex, or a used Pegasos, or G4 MacMini and run OWB web browser.  It still won't be a current web browser experience like what you would expect to get on Windows, MacOSX, or Linux, but OWB runs great on my 1.5GHz G4 MacMini running MorphOS2.4!  I have read that NetSurf is also becoming a better program very quickly and some people are very happy using that.

OWB on my 1.5GHz G4 MacMini is faster than Firefox3.5 on my 3.0GHz Quad Core Extreme Windows Vista Ultimate PC, though it does not have all the bells and whistles yet.

Personally, I could do with a bit less of those bells and whistles on the Internet, but what the Internet has become will not stride backwards and will continue to become more complicated and more of a mess with the passing of time.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2010, 08:39:21 PM by amigadave »
How are you helping the Amiga community? :)
 

Offline Gulliver

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #36 on: January 18, 2010, 10:25:47 AM »
So to sum up, upgrade or die :(
 

Offline CountRaven

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #37 on: January 18, 2010, 10:32:27 AM »
Quote
So to sum up, upgrade or die
Perhaps this should go for the 68k browsers and not the machines.
Peg2, Amiga 500, Amiga 600, Amiga 1200D-030, Amiga 1200PPC, Amiga 4000PPC, CD32, 2xCDTV, Sam 440EP, Efika, AmigaOne XE.

http://www.amigaplanet.gr
 

Offline DiskDoctor

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #38 on: January 18, 2010, 11:44:26 AM »
I once wrote here (a year ago actually) that redirecting ancient browsers to mobile content might do the job.  But there are tests required, this new CMS supports mobile rendering also.

Better this than nothing.  And it still may work.
Was: Mac Mini PPC running MorphOS 2.4
Now: Amiga Forever 2010 with AmiKit and AmigaSYS
Not used: Icaros Desktop 1.2 (reason: no wifi)
Planned soon: an OS4 system
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Offline nicholas

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #39 on: January 18, 2010, 01:38:56 PM »
OWB has been available for AROS for ages has it not?

Surely if it compiles on an OS3.1 clone it will compile on the actual OS3.1?
“Een rezhim-i eshghalgar-i Quds bayad az sahneh-i ruzgar mahv shaved.” - Imam Ayatollah Sayyed  Ruhollah Khomeini
 

Offline Karlos

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #40 on: January 18, 2010, 02:10:30 PM »
Quote from: nicholas;538888
OWB has been available for AROS for ages has it not?

Surely if it compiles on an OS3.1 clone it will compile on the actual OS3.1?


Perhaps it has dependencies on AROS features not available on 3.1?

In any event, it might prove too slow for any real m68k CPU.
int p; // A
 

Offline Tomas

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #41 on: January 18, 2010, 04:23:33 PM »
OWB works just fine.. Which should run fine on ppc equipped classics as well. You cant really expect full support for browsers that has not really been updated in a decade.
Soon we will have firefox"timberwolf" on OS4.x capable machines as well.
 

Offline Tomas

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #42 on: January 18, 2010, 04:28:28 PM »
Quote from: Gulliver;538835
@LoadWB

You are taking it out of context. To keep it small and simple:
How can an Amiga web site do not support Amigas?
Okay, if you have a really expanded one you can... but NOT an original Commodore-Amiga.


Website should then be renamed Amiga-like.org or Amiga-ish.org or even AmigaNG.org :)
I guess you would expect commodore oriented sites to fully support c64/c128 as well? If you fully support such outdated browsers you would ruin the experience for 99% of the users since nearly all use modern browsers these days. OS4.x is just as much "amiga" as the classic. You can still use this site if you change to the mobile version anyways.

There is nothing stopping you from adding functionality to for example Aweb yourself..
 

Offline LoadWB

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #43 on: January 18, 2010, 04:36:24 PM »
Quote from: Karlos;538863
Exactly the same thing that used to be behind here before the server upgrade (ie XOOPS).

However, this site was significantly older than either of the other two and locked into an obsolete version of XOOPS that couldn't be readily upgraded. When the hosting company set a deadline to upgrade to PHP5, that was a death warrant to the version of XOOPS that was in use. There are newer versions of XOOPS, but they are no more IBrowse friendly than vBulletin is.


Even if AO could have colo'd its own box (some places are pretty cheap, $100/mo sans management,) I believe the security implications of running PHP4 and older XOOPS would be too large to be worth it.

People tend to not realize that older technology is often abandoned for security issues and not simply functional issues.  For instance, the Windows 9x kernel is dead and no longer supported because in the face of modern cyber-warfare, it is worse than Swiss cheese and does not have the internal framework necessary to provide the hefty security needed to survive.

One would not mount a deadbolt on a straw door.  Sure, one could put a reinforced backing on the straw door, but the frame would no longer support the door, nor the house support a reinforced frame, and so on.  At some point you just need to replace the whole thing.

Bear in mind, while it does lack important features such as protected memory, I speak not specifically to the Amiga.  More so, I speak to the Amiga-era frameworks and applications, such as PHP4 and XOOPS, which had to be moved beyond.
 

Offline nicholas

Re: Amiga.org - Ibrowse and Aweb support sucks
« Reply #44 on: January 18, 2010, 05:29:46 PM »
Quote from: Karlos;538890
Perhaps it has dependencies on AROS features not available on 3.1?

In any event, it might prove too slow for any real m68k CPU.

OpenSSL, Curl, Fontconfig, ICU, SDL and of course MUI seem to be the main dependencies.

I'm not sure whether an 060 could handle the resources required, but PUP/WOS machines maybe? UAE/Amithlon machines obviously would have no speed issues.

Anyhow, i suppose the only way it would ever be seen would be if a developer needed that itch to be scratched and ported it. :)

http://sszymczy.rootnode.net/index.php?menu=projects&submenu=owb
“Een rezhim-i eshghalgar-i Quds bayad az sahneh-i ruzgar mahv shaved.” - Imam Ayatollah Sayyed  Ruhollah Khomeini