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AuthorTopic: Amiga in Your very cellphone  (Read 4408 times)

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Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2009, 04:19:43 PM »
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DiskDoctor wrote:
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bloodline wrote:

WinMobile is a horrible and dated OS... M$ have a dinosaur with it... it's not as nice as either Symbian or OSX... I have yet to use Linux (aka android etc) on a mobile platform


I DO agree it's dull and targeted to elderly mid-level managers but, as I was saying...  It is a matter of a market share, for a start.  If it succeeds, you will notice mobileUAE on all the platforms, all of a sudden...


It has nothing to do with Being dull... it's old, it uses old paradigms, old APIs... imagine running Win3.11 on your latest PC... That's what WinMobile is like, when compared with modern Mobile OSs... like OSX for example.

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WinMobile Shmobile... but if it (UAE) works...  One guy here (did you?) mentioned Pocket UAE was cool on old Pocket PC.  So what's the story?  Hatred to Bill??


??? :-? Yes, I used to run PocketUAE on my old iPAQ 4150... so what? Amiga software isn't suited to the mobile platform, they prefer joysticks, mice and keyboards... not touch screens... Amiga software is not meant to be used in a mobile environment and really needs reworking to get the best out of it... you can search the photo archive on this site to see photos of my running PocketUAE, games and the OS.

Amiga software, via UAE/etc... is not going to be popular on any mobile platform FULL STOP... Also I like my mobile games to be 3D now... it's just more fun on my iPhone.

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You are quite right, I can develop anything I like. I have the iPhone SDK here. But I can only distribute my Apps to other iPhone (and iPod touch) users via Apple. I can give my app to 100 other people, as per my SDK licence, and as long as I can have physical access to their phone/ipod...

Apple will not publish an App that violates their Terms and conditions. And right now their terms and condition do NOT allow Emualtors.



This sucks then, but... what makes an emulator an emulator???  If you sell iUAE BUNDELED and bound with specific game blah blah blah... it is not an emulator anymore!! :) Like this iPhone Pinball Dreams mentioned here... And Apple lawyers could then go and funk theirselves!


Read the SDK licence, you basically can't interpret code via any other method than using the APIs and Frameworks provided by Apple... and until Apple provide a 68k emu framework with OSX... that puts UAE out...

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Native ports... how many?  And sum all the figure$... :(


There are over 20000 Apps avaiable for the iPhone/Ipod touch, right now... I can't count them all...


True but what I meant was the amount of $$ that has (will/would) to be spent to have a 50-games Amiga collection "for the native os" - 500$??


Oh... no idea... if you had the original source and data files... it probably wouldn't take more than a month to port an Amiga game to the iPhone... a bit longer to beta test it... Most amiga Games were not that complex...

Offline LoadWB

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2009, 04:38:57 PM »
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Pyromania wrote:
@DiskDoctor

Nice post except for the Windows Mobile part. Win Mobile is almost already dead and it would be a waste to put any resources there. Amiga Forever could have features added to the next version to support Amiga emulation on cell phones if it's developer is interested in going that route.


You kidding me?  Windows Mobile is all over the business world.  There are multiple vendors supporting it and, in my experience, there is nothing yet that compares in business functionality -- Exchange ActiveSync, Pocket Office applications, and a familiar interface for the technically unadaptable.

Now, I know EAS is licensed by Apple and works well on the iPhone, and kind-of works on PalmOS.  I have discovered that almost all of my customers who started "playing" with the iPhone went back to their Windows Mobile when the novelty wore off: drastically different and unfamiliar interface, cannot load wanted software (Garmin, etc.,) and restrictive software installation policies.  Plus, the remote wipe and security control feature is very well appreciated.

Windows Mobile 6.2 is available now, and Windows Mobile 7, which is expected to be a convergence between the Zune and smart-phone paradigms is expected very soon.  The Zune aspect will be a long sought-after media capability for the WM operating system.

So, no, WM is far from dead.  The iPhone still has a little ways to catch up before it will be an all-around contender, as does LiMo and Android.  Microsoft and RIM (BlackBerry) have the all-inclusive solutions right now, and are really the only major competition for each other.
 

Offline LoadWB

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #17 on: February 13, 2009, 04:43:00 PM »
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bloodline wrote:

Amiga software, via UAE/etc... is not going to be popular on any mobile platform FULL STOP... Also I like my mobile games to be 3D now... it's just more fun on my iPhone.


Are you not, then, completely ignoring the success of the so-called "retro" games market?  Retro-arcade bundles and downloadable games for consoles are doing very well.  Not to mention the MAME universe, and so on.

A good game does not rely solely on its graphics abilities, but on the timelessness, ingenuity, and playability of the game.
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2009, 04:51:06 PM »
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LoadWB wrote:
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bloodline wrote:

Amiga software, via UAE/etc... is not going to be popular on any mobile platform FULL STOP... Also I like my mobile games to be 3D now... it's just more fun on my iPhone.


Are you not, then, completely ignoring the success of the so-called "retro" games market?  Retro-arcade bundles and downloadable games for consoles are doing very well.  Not to mention the MAME universe, and so on.

A good game does not rely solely on its graphics abilities, but on the timelessness, ingenuity, and playability of the game.


I said nothing about the quality of gfx provided Amiga games! Reread my post! The input method of Amiga games needs to be reworked for mobile platforms, which are predominantly touch screen!

Offline DiskDoctor

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2009, 05:57:44 PM »
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bloodline wrote:

It has nothing to do with Being dull... it's old, it uses old paradigms, old APIs... imagine running Win3.11 on your latest PC... That's what WinMobile is like, when compared with modern Mobile OSs... like OSX for example



This is actually 99% true, I do not claim Windows Mobile is a good technology (it used to be 8 years ago), all I say is IT/mUAE WOULD WORK fine! Check out recent WM games!  They're cool and 3D as well.  Or maybe... I'm such an IT ignorant I cannot comprehend the difference between native/API-using software and a virtual machine which any emulator in fact is... My apologies if this is the case, always learning something... especially here.

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???  Yes, I used to run PocketUAE on my old iPAQ 4150... so what? Amiga software isn't suited to the mobile platform, they prefer joysticks, mice and keyboards... not touch screens... Amiga software is not meant to be used in a mobile environment and really needs reworking to get the best out of it... you can search the photo archive on this site to see photos of my running PocketUAE, games and the OS.



Then how can you explain sales of mobile arcade games' figures???
Don't give up on mobile!!  It will, too, eventually get you.

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Amiga software, via UAE/etc... is not going to be popular on any mobile platform FULL STOP... Also I like my mobile games to be 3D now... it's just more fun on my iPhone.



Amiga software IS popular on mobile. Or at least is significantly present there.

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Read the SDK licence, you basically can't interpret code via any other method than using the APIs and Frameworks provided by Apple... and until Apple provide a 68k emu framework with OSX... that puts UAE out...



You say... I say... how about making a complier (www site/service) that combines m-UAE, any Amiga classic / adf game, yielding mobile OS proper API-compliant binary??  How's that hack?  Native binary, man, Apple lawyers would have to shove this very license of theirs  up their you-know-where.

*

As for the proper (non-emulated) Amiga games' direct porting...  This is effort anyway, this month or so you're mentioning.  Doing it once - fine.  Do it every time... no one would!  I'm telling you... There are, really, some 10-15 mobile Amiga games already.  I want a 100.

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LoadWB wrote:

You kidding me? Windows Mobile is all over the business world. There are multiple vendors supporting it and, in my experience, there is nothing yet that compares in business functionality -- Exchange ActiveSync, Pocket Office applications, and a familiar interface for the technically unadaptable.



That's my man!  But seriously: (1) I am far from adoring WM (2) I cannot deny facts or figures about its market presence (3) I really bet on it as a highest growth/share next 3 years.

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A good game does not rely solely on its graphics abilities, but on the timelessness, ingenuity, and playability of the game.



That's right. UI/graphics is just a matter of implementation, compliant or not.  

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bloodline wrote then:

I said nothing about the quality of gfx provided Amiga games! Reread my post! The input method of Amiga games needs to be reworked for mobile platforms, which are predominantly touch screen!



I had Lemmings on my N 6230i s40 device reworked as using joypad instead of mouse...  Seriously, most (90%) Amiga/arcade games used digi joystick - almost all cellphones, not necessarily smart ones have one already.

So doesn't seem a problem to me.  If throng of people can have fun on playing mobile games, they would have even more fun playing those of Amiga.
Was: Mac Mini PPC running MorphOS 2.4
Now: Amiga Forever 2010 with AmiKit and AmigaSYS
Not used: Icaros Desktop 1.2 (reason: no wifi)
Planned soon: an OS4 system
Shortly then: a MOS notebook (wifi is a must-have)
 

Offline persia

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #20 on: February 13, 2009, 06:35:42 PM »
My impressions come from running Windows Mobile 6.1 on an HTC Kaiser.  It sucks bigtime compared to iPhone, only a little script called iFonz made it tolerable.  It is a lot like MS Windows 3.11, it's like a desktop computer on a phone, you are forever using that idiotic stylus.  

It was only after the Kaiser experience that I understood why iPhone sells more than WM phones.

On a positve note. I haven't actually sold the Kaiser yet so I've been playing with Android on it (yes it does work - to a certain extent, I flashed it with a lighter rom and it boots directly into Android.  Sometimes for kicks I even put my SIM card into it and make a call or two...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

What we\'re witnessing is the sad, lonely crowing of that last, doomed cock.
 

Offline DiskDoctor

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #21 on: February 13, 2009, 07:01:05 PM »
WM sucks thoroughly compared for iPhone, also Symbian, Android maybe.

But we're off the topic now --> I can talk but let us shift to the other forum since it is about emulation :)

My summary on UAE mobile again:

- Windows Mobile: targeted for business mainly, big figures sold, high growth, lots of devices and vendors already, reliable and stable system, current games are great, despite of the whole system mUAE would work fast and smooth
- iPhone OSX: best gaming performance (ever!), significant market share (3rd not counting BB), but legal issues
- Linux (what's a LiMO anyway?): good idea, several handhelds but yet too few, future uncertain (remember Linux), UAE seamless portability
- Symbian: main WM rival, nice devices (mainly Nokia, some SE, a few Motorola and Samsung), great UI / performance (worse than iPhone, though), great gaming / dev capabilities, my 2nd favorite
- BlackBerry: not a mortal man uses it, except for the US
- PalmOS: dead and PalmWEB changed flags to Linux
- J2ME: no controll over device UI, low-end etc...

I really hope (and would donate such project or do some myself) this whole mUAE idea works.

Remember: This may be a GREAT CHANCE FOR AMIGA TO APPEAR ALL OVER AGAIN!
Tomorrow. On a mobile near you.

*EDIT Would someone PLEASE help me on these smilies/saddies?? I don't get it how to place them.
Was: Mac Mini PPC running MorphOS 2.4
Now: Amiga Forever 2010 with AmiKit and AmigaSYS
Not used: Icaros Desktop 1.2 (reason: no wifi)
Planned soon: an OS4 system
Shortly then: a MOS notebook (wifi is a must-have)
 

Offline warpdesign

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #22 on: February 13, 2009, 07:26:35 PM »
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Also, Amiga emulation on cellphones would SURELY make an Amiga platform alone more recognizable... and more popular!!!!

How the hell would Amiga emulation make Amiga more popular ?

Btw, sounds like a McEwen speech: have you ever considered working for him ?
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2009, 07:32:31 PM »
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DiskDoctor wrote:
WM sucks thoroughly compared for iPhone, also Symbian, Android maybe.

But we're off the topic now --> I can talk but let us shift to the other forum since it is about emulation :)

My summary on UAE mobile again:

- Windows Mobile: targeted for business mainly, big figures sold, high growth, lots of devices and vendors already, reliable and stable system, current games are great, despite of the whole system mUAE would work fast and smooth


Well PocketUAE is here now for WM... it has been around since 2004... it has never been popular.

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- iPhone OSX: best gaming performance (ever!), significant market share (3rd not counting BB), but legal issues
- Linux (what's a LiMO anyway?): good idea, several handhelds but yet too few, future uncertain (remember Linux), UAE seamless portability
- Symbian: main WM rival, nice devices (mainly Nokia, some SE, a few Motorola and Samsung), great UI / performance (worse than iPhone, though), great gaming / dev capabilities, my 2nd favorite
- BlackBerry: not a mortal man uses it, except for the US
- PalmOS: dead and PalmWEB changed flags to Linux
- J2ME: no controll over device UI, low-end etc...

I really hope (and would donate such project or do some myself) this whole mUAE idea works.

Remember: This may be a GREAT CHANCE FOR AMIGA TO APPEAR ALL OVER AGAIN!
Tomorrow. On a mobile near you.


Please be real! :-)

The Amiga (no matter how much we love it) is never going to be a popular platform again.

The only people interested in the Amiga now are us, and there are probably only about 6000 max left.

If you have ever played games like Enigmo, Rolando or TouchPhysics on the iPhone you will see how modern games take advantage of modern interfaces (as available on modern devices) like touch screens, tilt sensors and audio input... not to mention that the "always on" internet connection of the iPhone allows for great multiplayer action, including MMORPGs!!! The iPhone also has graphics and audio capabilities that were unthinkable on the Amiga...

The world has moved on... Just as the Amiga moved people on from the days of the Sinclair Spectrum and C64... and the new games which that allowed... Modern platforms will move us on again!

The world has moved on

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*EDIT Would someone PLEASE help me on these smilies/saddies?? I don't get it how to place them.


Smilies have noses... :-)

Offline DiskDoctor

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2009, 08:00:13 PM »
@ warpdesign

I meant recent OS.

Amiga emulation, easily available to anyone of the millions of mobile gamers, would attract the people towards different OS which is AOS4.

I know, I'm evangelizing newer platform here but what I think is... I want my phone to play classic Amiga games, and I want my next desktop to be OS4.  That way out.

One more - think of Amiga Emulation as a mobile virus that spreads the idea all over...

Are you personal about this McEwen stuff??  Maybe yes, I use too much exclamation, capitals or so... I promise to stop.  AInc does nothing for years as far as I know, I just wanted to propose something, right?  So that someone makes some money out it, some of Amiga people have fun, other people get attracted...  Is it a sin?  Or am I a cynic?  What are you on about? Please explain instead of denying.  I HATE denial!

@ bloodline

PocketUAE... WinMobile was NEVER so popular as it is now... Back in 2004... Only hobbyists (IT people, management) had palmtops, majority of the market was rather industrial but time has changed! WMs are now both common and reachable. What else for a base?

Man, don't tell me those things of Amiga demise anymore...  I do believe some freaky Amiga-grown Entrepreneur will buy a McEwen a decent BMV, get the brand and resurrect it - just for fun.  You really never know, history tells it...  Like Java 25 years ago... "unsuccessful project of system for fridges"...

Please do not thrash my weekend!! :-)
Was: Mac Mini PPC running MorphOS 2.4
Now: Amiga Forever 2010 with AmiKit and AmigaSYS
Not used: Icaros Desktop 1.2 (reason: no wifi)
Planned soon: an OS4 system
Shortly then: a MOS notebook (wifi is a must-have)
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2009, 08:23:15 PM »
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DiskDoctor wrote:
@ bloodline

PocketUAE... WinMobile was NEVER so popular as it is now... Back in 2004... Only hobbyists (IT people, management) had palmtops, majority of the market was rather industrial but time has changed! WMs are now both common and reachable. What else for a base?


A few years ago only geeks had Mobile devices... Geeks are prepared to mess around with Emulators... Now the common person has mobile devices... common People don't want emulators, don't care about some old game they never played before, that  they won't have.. You can't sell Amiga games or Amiga ROMs...

The market for UAE on mobile devices is smaller now than it was years ago.

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Man, don't tell me those things of Amiga demise anymore...  I do believe some freaky Amiga-grown Entrepreneur will buy a McEwen a decent BMV, get the brand and resurrect it - just for fun.  


Amiga as a brand is dead, it is worthless. No one will pay what McEwen wants for it.

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You really never know, history tells it...  Like Java 25 years ago... "unsuccessful project of system for fridges"...


Java is 14 years old, and was NEVER meant for fridges.

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Please do not thrash my weekend!! :-)


You can't live in a bubble... face facts and enjoy what the Amiga means to us! Forget about forcing Amiga down the throats of people who don't care and don't want it!

Offline aggro_mix

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #26 on: February 13, 2009, 08:28:06 PM »
One advantage WM has over other mobile OS:es is the integration with Exchange. As the current trend seem to be dropping Lotus Notes (at least in northern Europe) for Micro$oft we will most likely see more phones with WM. I wouldn't be too surprised if there are more re-badged HTC phones than X1 in a near future.
 

Offline bloodline

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Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #27 on: February 13, 2009, 08:32:46 PM »
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aggro_mix wrote:
One advantage WM has over other mobile OS:es is the integration with Exchange. As the current trend seem to be dropping Lotus Notes (at least in northern Europe) for Micro$oft we will most likely see more phones with WM. I wouldn't be too surprised if there are more re-badged HTC phones than X1 in a near future.


My iPhone has Exchange integration... Push Email/Calendar and Contacts, works perfectly and is actually brilliant :-)

Offline DiskDoctor

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #28 on: February 13, 2009, 08:49:19 PM »
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bloodline wrote:

A few years ago only geeks had Mobile devices... Geeks are prepared to mess around with Emulators... Now the common person has mobile devices... common People don't want emulators, don't care about some old game they never played before, that  they won't have.. You can't sell Amiga games or Amiga ROMs...

The market for UAE on mobile devices is smaller now than it was years ago.


No way! If you market stuff properly, mobile people would buy it without giving it a think. I can see how many mobile crap games are being sold in this very second! I see everywhere on a TV five-second ads about Premium texting for 5$ to get a silly James Bond recent game. People drink a beer or two and... have fun or excitement for 5$... no matter all they get is a crap... what matters is the futuristic way they got it...

I really worked for two years in mobile industry and know how many pieces of particular mobile software sold daily needs to yield positive ROI... People WASTE money on mobile, because mobile operators told them VAS is what they want and they did it well.

mUAE if proprietary hopefully, will have guts to get through the whole marketing machine and eventually reach figures.  I see no much distinction between mUAE and any other mobile arcades, I thought it was already said here clearly enough...

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Amiga as a brand is dead, it is worthless. No one will pay what McEwen wants for it.


I don't. But if the guy lets it go, who knows who will eventually pick it next...  We're getting older :-) and richer :-) :-) If I had 10M$ now I would spend all on this Amiga reanimation, believe me.  On the other hand things like this make me keep on tryin'

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Java is 14 years old, and was NEVER meant for fridges.



Maybe an urban legend what I said but it was, indeed, targeted to a set-top
boxes... Maybe the thing before Java name...  I can recall I heard the story during my studies...  What an asshole the lecturer guy!

[/quote]

You can't live in a bubble... face facts and enjoy what the Amiga means to us! Forget about forcing Amiga down the throats of people who don't care and don't want it![/quote]

Hope is never insanity.
Was: Mac Mini PPC running MorphOS 2.4
Now: Amiga Forever 2010 with AmiKit and AmigaSYS
Not used: Icaros Desktop 1.2 (reason: no wifi)
Planned soon: an OS4 system
Shortly then: a MOS notebook (wifi is a must-have)
 

Offline DiskDoctor

Re: Amiga in Your very cellphone
« Reply #29 on: February 13, 2009, 08:57:49 PM »
@ aggro_mix

Exchange Direct Push (a simple rip-off from BlackBerry original technology) works also on Symbian s60 (MfE), Symbian UIQ (RoadSync), iPhone sure, BB too :-)

Marketing Windows Mobile was always about the illusion of uniquity and conformity. Managers are not necessarily techies.

But as a result, the platform grows.  I can see mUAE on any top platform that would boost it up to others.
Was: Mac Mini PPC running MorphOS 2.4
Now: Amiga Forever 2010 with AmiKit and AmigaSYS
Not used: Icaros Desktop 1.2 (reason: no wifi)
Planned soon: an OS4 system
Shortly then: a MOS notebook (wifi is a must-have)