Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Amiga Kit Amiga Store Iridium Banner AMIStore App Store A1200/A600 4xIDE Interface

AuthorTopic: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me  (Read 11589 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline SlimJim

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #30 on: October 13, 2002, 01:54:05 PM »
Regardless of ANY other issues, you shouldn't let yourself being worked up over posts from Neko. Matt Sealey is evidently a very knowledgeable persion (in many different issues), but he is so constantly angry at everything and everyone that any facts he may have is conceiled in a red veil of shouts and insults - is he still banned from the AmigaONE mailinglist? I havent's kept tabs .
 
Reading those poison-dripping posts over the years
(especially over at Moobunny where he has his loyal little court of hateful followers - some of which appear here as well) is actually pretty gruesome. Nowadays he don't appear all that often in the forums where I am. I'm content to see him mostly as an interesting curiosity.  
- and this is the _personal_ impression from someone who hasn't even been flamed by him ever...
 
Regardless of what I personally think of your journalism, Mike, you shouldn't give in due to Neko-semantics. Just learn to select the constructive criticism of those with good intentions (you should generally know who _haven't_ by now...) and evolve as a writer. If someone says you're biased - from any "camp" - be humble and assume they're right. Consider how you might improve the wording next time. First rule of a journalist - don't give up (or was it "bring forth the truth"? - oh well...)
.
SlimJim
 

  • Guest
Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #31 on: October 13, 2002, 01:57:10 PM »
LOL. No offense to AROS intended, of course :)

Of course without a real implementation on a well-used box, code just stays buggy. MorphOS (and the recent AROS "Workbench") do a lot to find these bugs and misimplementations.

It's a good thing that the bugs are found/fixed, it would be terrible if all the bugs were behind an impenetrable wall of Belgian Lawyers and dodgy twin coders and were never considered :)
 

Offline DaveP

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #32 on: October 13, 2002, 01:58:11 PM »
Wise words from Jim there. This I take issue with:

". First rule of a journalist - don't give up"


No.

"Its get your copy done in time for last orders at the bar and damn the consequences."

But then I speak only from experience at the FT.
Hate figure. :lol:
 

Offline MikeB

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #33 on: October 13, 2002, 02:06:01 PM »
@ Fabio

You haven't read my postings careful enough  with regard to those threats. You must have overlooked some text or something, or maybe mis-associated something.

With regard to me being biased, I truly don't understand why you think I would ever have claimed not to be biased.

In fact, I have stated in the past that IMO everyone is biased to some extend. I try not to be, but I and most people know I often write things from an AmigaOS fan perspective.
 

Offline SlimJim

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #34 on: October 13, 2002, 02:11:20 PM »
"Its get your copy done in time for last orders at the bar and damn the consequences."
 
Hehe. I should have known there was a relation between the declining newpaper quality and the legal closing-time of bars...
:-)
.
SlimJim
 

Offline MikeB

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #35 on: October 13, 2002, 04:57:36 PM »
I will be going to Aachen, and then I will evaluate further what I should do. Thanks to everyone who has been emailing me with your support and advice.

Good bye for now.  :cry:
 

Offline z5

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2002, 05:20:05 PM »
@MikeB:

I've always enjoyed your articles on Osnews. While it was obvious that you were a real AmigaOS fan (OS4/DE/AmigaInc), the articles were always very well written. Maybe a bit too positive for my taste (especially about Amiga Inc and their DE).

I have not read the article on Morphos but maybe it was just not such a good idea for you to write an article on something you are not that fond about (judging by the reactions), especially on a site like OSnews. Certainly you should have known that you would receive a lot of criticism, considering that there are "sometimes extremely funny but utterly useless" flamewars going on at ANN nearly every day.

So what? You learn from everything. The "Amiga community" has become very small and bitter, which is no surprise considering all the setbacks, the dissapointments,... Only new machines and a new OS may take away this negativity.

There are still a lot of nice Amiga people, like here on Amiga.org. So don't take it too personal. I have been dissapointed in forums like ANN, but i've learnt to just enjoy the nice and sensible comments and topics. Quite frankly, i don't care much about what people write on Morphos and OS4 anymore. I just wait until and if both products ship. The rest is just speculation, mud throwing and pure waiste of time.

Sometimes you win, sometimes you loose. And if you do, learn from it and don't make the same "mistake" again.

All the best.
A.miga D.emoscene A.rchive: Relive the dreams...
 

Offline AmigaMac

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2002, 05:54:25 PM »
I personally think Amiga and the community is afraid to take Wintel head on, or there would be so much more optimism here in AmiLand!  You people tend to forget that there are newbees here that are waiting for Amiga Inc (or Hyperion and Eyetech) to deliver on their promises just the same as you are.  Yeah it would have been nice to have those machines running AOS4 on our desks by now, but like they say... "best things come to those who wait"!

With the bad attitude is only satisfying those of Wintel... Microsoft and Intel, if you give up on your beloved system, then you're more than likely to go (or return) to the PC platform and start lining the Evil Empire's pockets like they want you to do in the first place!  Bill Gates' dream (in the 80's) was to have Windows PCs in every home running all his software and I doubt that attitude has changed much since then!  So you can give up and make Bill's dream come true, or you can be the same stubborn and optimistic Amigans you once were and keep the faith alive, the choice is yours!!!

 :-D
 

Offline SlimJim

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2002, 08:32:27 PM »
[...]"best things come to those that wait"!...
 
That's a rare quote in those grim amiga days. Keep that flame of hope of yours burning, man!
:-)
.
SlimJim
 

Offline redfox

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2002, 09:56:25 PM »
Is this the "let's put each other down" club?

I thought that was over on ann.lu !

I still haven't figured out if you are all joking or if some of you are actually serious.
 

Offline jtsiren

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #40 on: October 14, 2002, 01:28:46 AM »
I'm sorry Mike, but I too have to join those who consider your articles a little biased. You seem to treat material coming from Amiga Inc. very positively whereas your comments about the competing product seem lukewarm at best. You obviously made an effort to be objective and avoid passing too much judgement in your MorphOS article, but, well, there is still a distinctly different feel to the article than to those about Amiga Inc.'s activities.

And I'm having a hard time believing this is just because one product is better than the other.

Make of it what you will, I just wanted to let you know that I have to agree with people who have observed a bias. The fact that you do try doesn't really remove the bias even with the best of intentions, and I wonder if that has some effect on the way you perceive e.g. communications from the Thendic France camp as well.

I also have to agree with the people saying provide proof or take back your comments about threats. You already broke confidentiality (if there ever was such assumed) by saying threats were made. Not substantiating them is like writing a blank check. People are now free to think the worst or the best, even if reality is nowhere near their imagination. And what is this FUD you refer to? Please substantiate.

Lastly, I wonder if you consider Amiga Inc.'s or Hyperion's allegations about MorphOS as FUD? And if so, or if not, how would you compare those to any alleged FUD by Thendic France or their partners?

Anyway, I do wish you the best of luck with your articles and your hobby.
 

Offline Paul_Gadd

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #41 on: October 14, 2002, 01:55:32 AM »
How can anyone take the Morphos article or any other amiga related articles seriously when they are writen by clearly a obsessed amiga inc fan,

People should never write ONE SIDED reviews.
 

Offline Seehund

Re: Loosing faith in the Amiga "community", like so many before me
« Reply #42 on: October 14, 2002, 02:15:38 AM »
Quote

DaveP wrote:

Forget the "community" it doesnt exist and never has done - its just a bunch of computing users with something quite small in common.


Well, "the community" exists, but just as you say it's only defined by the individual members' ownership of and/or interest in Amiga related technology. Nothing else.

I get the feeling that some people use too many variables to define the "community", and they seem to have a hard time to accept that the individual "members" (users and developers) may have entirely different opinions on matters way beyond the "owning/being interested in Amiga related technologies" bit.

Saying that "I'm leaving the community" is silly IMO, it's not an organisation, it's not a party.

I think that the confusion, the sickening trademark cultism and the sectarianism is probably nourished by the tiny number of community members. There's so few people left, so different opinions are more easily accentuated, and to the imagined "camps" diversity appears as threats. Companies starting to use the term "The Community" instead of "our customers", "our market" (or in the worst cases even "the fanatic sheep who would buy anything as long as it's got a certain trademark") certainly doesn't help.




Anyway, I rather liked Mike's article, at least the paragraph of it that actually provided "A Closer Look at MorphOS on the Pegasos". ;) I could have lived without the stolen-sources-crap (a note that the original article now has been edited from outright accusations to mere innuendo would be nice). I also wonder why there are no links directly to web shops selling the actual product, as I seem to remember a third of another, longer article being devoted to selling T-shirts. ;)
[color=0000FF]Maybe it\\\'s still possible to [/color]save AmigaOS [color=0000FF][/size][/color]  :rtfm:......
 

Offline Waccoon

Amiga "community"? What's that?
« Reply #43 on: October 14, 2002, 03:56:47 AM »
Every "community" has its mix of grouchy and dedicated people.  If you think Amigans are uptight and snobbish, take a look at the Linux forums, Mac forums, etc.

I judge a community based on the kinds of products they release and support.  Years ago, the Amiga community was tops because of the public domain scene, and the sheer variety of software that was being produced both commercially and for free.  You didn't see programs like OctaMED and AMOS on the PC.  It's been a long time since anyone has really made a new, groundshaking product for the Amiga.  All the *good* coders have gone to other OS's.

Amiga isn't much of a community as it is a fan club.  Having joined and left the "furry" fandom many times myself, believe me, I know all there is about infantile whiners who only wish to stuff their two cents down other people's throats without actually doing anything to solve problems.

Really, though, we can't expect much from the Amiga community when Amiga Inc. itself isn't participating too much.  Where are those executive updates?  Where are the dev tools?  Where are the "free for a year" SDK updates?  Yes, it takes time and money, but that's what business is about.  You can't just work in a basement and hope the PR problems work out by themselves.  If Amiga lets their community stew in a pool of cluelessness, we can't be surprised if it's overrun by whiners and rumor mongers.

Ironic, isn't it?  In the midst of the information age, companies require developers to sign NDAs, keep quiet about weekly events, and nobody really knows what's going on.  So we all have to pick fights with each other.

I'm not relying on the existing Amiga community for anything.  I'm just sticking around to see if Amiga releases any new products and can rebuild a new community.  In the menatime, I'll be working on my frustrating but productive Windows machine.
 

Offline KapitanKlystron

Re: Amiga "community"? What's that?
« Reply #44 on: October 14, 2002, 04:21:38 AM »
@Waccoon.

That was really well put. I don't think I could agree with you more. I think there are an awful lot of folks here that would agree with you.