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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Hardware Issues and discussion => Topic started by: kernal on June 13, 2019, 12:27:42 AM

Title: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: kernal on June 13, 2019, 12:27:42 AM
I have a Phase5 Blizzard 2060 with a 68RC060 processor in it running at 50Mhz.

My Amiga 2000, which is running OS3.5 crashes at various times after running setpatch. I know what your thinking.... that I don't have the right 68060 libraries loaded. But I have 68060 libraries installed as they should be, but they will only load properly with data cache turned off.

What I have discovered is that if I boot the computers with Caches turned off (selected on boot screen when holding both mouse buttons down). It will boot up fine, although because there is no caches it is extremely slow. Once I am booted up I can use CPU060 (Phase5 utility) to turn on Instruction Cache (an increase from about 5MIPS to 23MIPS) , and it still runs fine with no issues. If I turn on the data cache, it will sometimes crash instantly, other times it will run for a bit and then crash. Even simply moving a window will crash it when data cache is enabled.

I'm now starting to think that the data cache portion of the 68060 is detective. Is this a possibility? Has anyone else seen this problem?

Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: amiga1260 on June 13, 2019, 04:20:37 AM
I had this problem also with my Blizzard 1260. You need to change the Mask Tranfer rate to 00x1fe00 of the boot partition and reinstall AmigaOs 3.5.
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: Thomas Richter on June 13, 2019, 10:25:06 AM
I had this problem also with my Blizzard 1260. You need to change the Mask Tranfer rate to 00x1fe00 of the boot partition and reinstall AmigaOs 3.5.

I actually doubt that. The mask value would indicate that the 2060scsi has the same issue than the AmigaOs "IDE" scsi, but that would surprise me since SCSI doesn't have a "magic 256 block boundary", unlike IDE. The reported issue looks either like a defunct 68060.library (note that the MuLib-Libraries are actually developed on a 2060, so known-working with this setup), but more likely a defective RAM / hardware issue.
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: Rotzloeffel on June 13, 2019, 01:09:59 PM

My Amiga 2000, which is running OS3.5 crashes at various times after running setpatch. I know what your thinking.... that I don't have the right 68060 libraries loaded. But I have 68060 libraries installed as they should be, but they will only load properly with data cache turned off.


Yes, because you installed the wrong 68060.library and or forgot to install the "dummy" 68040.library wich is obsolet on 3.9 with boingbag 2 but not with 3.5!... the 68060.library of the Blizzard 2060 is not the same as for a cyberstorm 060. Blizzard 2060 came with a different install-Disk! You can use the Blizzard 2060 System Disc from here: http://phase5.a1k.org/ or, as Thomas suggested you can use the MuTools from aminet: http://aminet.net/package/util/libs/MMULib

 
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: kernal on June 13, 2019, 02:48:58 PM
Quote
Yes, because you installed the wrong 68060.library and or forgot to install the "dummy" 68040.library wich is obsolet on 3.9 with boingbag 2 but not with 3.5!... the 68060.library of the Blizzard 2060 is not the same as for a cyberstorm 060. Blizzard 2060 came with a different install-Disk! You can use the Blizzard 2060 System Disc from here: http://phase5.a1k.org/ or, as Thomas suggested you can use the MuTools from aminet: http://aminet.net/package/util/libs/MMULib

No, like I said, I have the right libraries and I I have also tried various versions as well. The libraries actually load and show that it is a 68060 etc etc... I have the dummy 68040. Everything works but crashes randomly unless I disable data cache. Also, I have installed the MMULib.

If it is a hardware issue, is it more likely the board itself or the CPU? I was thinking since the data cache is built into the chip I may be able to resolve with a new CPU?
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: giZmo350 on June 13, 2019, 03:22:12 PM
I have the same Blizz 060 @50MHz (I'd have to check the exact chip number) in my A2000, so I'm following this with great interest as I've never really tried to optimize the speed of the chip. I'm pretty sure I'm running the P5 060 library. I am however, running OS3.9.  I'm also running BB2 (no BB3 or BB4). I checked and I have a 68040.library in libs though and not sure where it came from - I probably put it there thinking I needed it(?) - but according to Rotzloeffel, I don't - I wonder why. I have not yet installed MMULib yet but really want to - as it really helped out my A1200. BTW, when I first read your post I thought it might be a memory problem too. Another thought.... was your card shipped as an 060 or upgraded from an 040 to an 060? I would hate to think if you maybe have a fake 060 processor. Plus, if it was upgraded I hope all the necessary components were added and the resistor under the chip is configured correctly. I upgraded mine from an 040 to an 060. Just a thought. I'm going to have some spare time this afternoon so, if there's any tests you would like me to run, or something you'd like me to check, I'll be free.  8)
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: kernal on June 13, 2019, 03:48:38 PM
Quote
I'm going to have some spare time this afternoon so, if there's any tests you would like me to run, or something you'd like me to check, I'll be free.  8)

Sure, that would be great. First, for comparisons sake can you run SysInfo and tell me what MIPS your getting? If both your datacache and instruction cache are on you should be getting around 39MIPS. Also, if you could get the version of your setpatch and all 680x0 libraries. You should have a 68040 dummy library (very small) and at least a 68060 library. I think maybe some of the newer setpatches will load the 68060 without the dummy library, but I'm not 100% sure.  You could also run CPU at the in the C: folder and tell me what that tells you...

Thanks a bunch!

P.S.   The card was shipped with an O60 and has all the right components on it...
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: giZmo350 on June 13, 2019, 08:33:11 PM
Hi kernal, as for libs installed now,

setpatch = v44.38
68060 = v46.4
68040 = v43.0
mips reported as 39.04

When I run sysinfo v4, the instruction and data =  burst & cache report as all "ON". However, IBurst and DBurst buttons are greyed out (I don't remember them greyed out! - Frustrating!).

When I run the CPU command it states:

INST: Cache & Burst = ON
DATA: Cache & Copyback = ON

Also CPU states that DBurst = Off (not happy about that)

Is there a way to get more detailed information about lib versions and provider of the lib?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

OK, since my first post above dashed lines, I dropped THoR's MMU.library and 68060.library into libs (renamed old 68060 and 68040 so they won't load), the version of 68060 still reports v46.4. Wonder where I got the first 68060.library. Not running 68040.library now.

Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: Thomas Richter on June 13, 2019, 09:29:46 PM
OK, since my first post above dashed lines, I dropped THoR's MMU.library and 68060.library into libs (renamed old 68060 and 68040 so they won't load), the version of 68060 still reports v46.4. Wonder where I got the first 68060.library. Not running 68040.library now.

The latest 68060.library from the Mulib package is 46.3. So, apparently, this library comes from a different place.
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: giZmo350 on June 13, 2019, 09:44:01 PM
OK, since my first post above dashed lines, I dropped THoR's MMU.library and 68060.library into libs (renamed old 68060 and 68040 so they won't load), the version of 68060 still reports v46.4. Wonder where I got the first 68060.library. Not running 68040.library now.

The latest 68060.library from the Mulib package is 46.3. So, apparently, this library comes from a different place.

Well, that's strange. I copied it right from the libs drawer from your MMULIB package.

libs
version 68060.library = v46.4

sysinfoV4 = 68060 v46.4

libs:version mmu.library = v46.18
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: kernal on June 14, 2019, 03:20:33 AM
Thanks giZmo350,

Out of curiosity, what is your MIPS reading on SysInfo4?
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: giZmo350 on June 14, 2019, 03:39:56 AM
Out of curiosity, what is your MIPS reading on SysInfo4?

Anywhere between 38.97 and 39.04.

Are your IBurst and DBurst buttons greyed out (inactive) when you run SysInfo4? Just curious.
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: paul1981 on June 14, 2019, 02:54:53 PM
Looks like an old cpu command you're running there gizmo as branch cache wasn't listed and heaps of other settings. cpu060 or cpu60 should replace that as they can understand the 060. I wonder what else is old on your 3.9 setup?
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: giZmo350 on June 14, 2019, 03:32:21 PM
Looks like an old cpu command you're running there gizmo as branch cache wasn't listed and heaps of other settings. cpu060 or cpu60 should replace that as they can understand the 060. I wonder what else is old on your 3.9 setup?

The OS3.9 was installed stock right off the CD a few years back w/BB1 & 2. Like I said earlier, I haven't tried to "speed up" the system at all (did install MMULib yesterday) 'cause I really don't know where to get new patches (except maybe AmiNet) to replace old libs, etc. or even what individual patches there are. This is where I struggle with my systems. I'm a H/W guy and pretty much just install the OS's, get it all functional then leave it at that. Any help to optimize my OS3.9 install is gladly accepted.  ;)

BTW, when you state "cpu060 or cpu60 should replace that" do you mean that there is a patch that can be installed to replace the CPU file currently on the system? What else is old on the system? Well, probably everything as the only thing I did was install BB1&2 and left it that. Too many scary tales of BB3&4.  :-\ Is there a site or something that you could recommend to get me "up to date"?

Also, pretty much the same thing with my A1200 that has the ACA1233N w/OS3.5. But that just works great so I'll leave at that. However, I like to help Amigan's out with their hefty machines but sometimes fail at that 'cause my A2000 may be too out of date without necessary patches.

But I digress, I should start a new thread as I don't want to hijack kernal's thread.  ;)
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: paul1981 on June 14, 2019, 03:57:28 PM
AFAIK cpu60 is the Apollo 060 CPU command, and cpu060 in the Blizzard 060 CPU command. When those 060 cards came out the standard Commodore cpu command from OS3.1 could only understand the 68040 as the 68060 didn't exist at the time, so that's the story of the cpu commands! There are probably others on aminet but in my 3.1 system I still have the old 3.1 cpu command, but I have the cpu60 command to hand too in c: . This is perfectly normal and what both the Apollo and Blizzard software installers do (the install disk).
Because the output of your cpu command made no mention of extra 68060 features I therefore assume you are running an old (maybe 3.1) cpu command. Personally, I am not a 3.9 user so I have no idea what it shipped with regarding the cpu command. Also, it means I can't really help you much with 3.9 patches and such. I would guess though that 3.9 comes with its own 68060 library and 68060 compliant cpu command. Try typing 'version c:cpu full' and see what it says.
I am actually a 3.0 user as I reluctantly had to upgrade my roms to 3.1 for my FastATA to work (computer wouldn't boot otherwise, just hung on a black screen).

There's no need to update your system at all though really. If it isn't broke, don't fix it! I have a 1.3 A500 with internal 2.5" HDD...and do I want to update that? No way. I particularly like that one because it is old and I don't have to think about updates. I can make the best 1.3 install ever in the whole world (eventually).  ;)
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: giZmo350 on June 14, 2019, 04:12:58 PM
AFAIK cpu60 is the Apollo 060 CPU command, and cpu060 in the Blizzard 060 CPU command. When those 060 cards came out the standard Commodore cpu command from OS3.1 could only understand the 68040 as the 68060 didn't exist at the time, so that's the story of the cpu commands! There are probably others on aminet but in my 3.1 system I still have the old 3.1 cpu command, but I have the cpu60 command to hand too in c: . This is perfectly normal and what both the Apollo and Blizzard software installers do (the install disk).

Thanks much for the reply Paul! Ahh, I didn't think about the Blizz install disk as I never even used it. I'll check that and AmiNet out!

I would guess though that 3.9 comes with its own 68060 library and 68060 compliant cpu command. Try typing 'version c:cpu full' and see what it says.

Will do!

There's no need to update your system at all though really. If it isn't broke, don't fix it!

That's usually my philosophy too. But when THoR stated that I reported his 68060.library as the wrong version, that concerned me.

I have a 1.3 A500 with internal 2.5" HDD...and do I want to update that? No way. I particularly like that one because it is old and I don't have to think about updates. I can make the best 1.3 install ever in the whole world (eventually).  ;)

You have OS1.3 on a HDD? I WILL start a new thread about that! I have another A500 that I want to create a bootable 1.3 install on but not quit sure how to do it.  ;)

Now to leave the upstairs computer room and head back down to the basement computer lab (I have Miggy's everywhere!)! I'll start a new post. @ kernal... let me (us) know if you require further help on this thread!  8)

Thanks again Paul!
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on June 14, 2019, 07:48:37 PM

Is there a way to get more detailed information about lib versions and provider of the lib?


If you're just looking to get more info about lib versions and provider of the lib, I recommend VersionWB:

http://aminet.net/package/util/sys/VersionWB

I've used that for years.  Have it scripted into my DirWork toolbar so that I just click on the name of the lib and click the Version button, and up pops VersionWB with all the details.

...and no, I couldn't remember that off-hand.  Was just randomly coming to this forum after being gone for what feels like forever, and saw this question.  I actually had to fire up my Amiga to remember the name of the darn command, LOL.  :D
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: paul1981 on June 15, 2019, 12:13:25 AM
This is for you giZmo (well actually you're not having it it's mine).
My 1.3 68000 A500 with 1.4GB internal 2.5" HDD and currently 1MB Chip RAM with RTC. I have one of those Gary adapter 2MB boards which I think will yield an extra 800K of slow RAM when I get around to fitting it. I've reduced the picture size a bit now...
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on June 15, 2019, 02:18:39 AM
'cause I really don't know where to get new patches (except maybe AmiNet)

Here's one good site:

https://amiga.foul.fr/index.php

No docs.  Go hard or go home.  ;)
Title: Re: Phase5 Blizzard 2060 problems
Post by: paul1981 on June 15, 2019, 12:05:06 PM
I'd like to make a complaint about the photo attachment section on this website. It seems it's just one thing after another here and it's getting pretty tiring. I uploaded a photo of my mint Amiga 4000/040 and when it appeared on amiga.org it looks like an Amiga 500.