Amiga.org
Operating System Specific Discussions => Amiga OS => Amiga OS -- Application questions and support => Topic started by: jenfry on February 22, 2010, 03:31:49 PM
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Which is the natural successor of Workbench 3.1?
I'm cleaning up all my old Amiga systems, just only to decide if they can be still useful of ready to be sold...
I'm reading about AmigOS 3.9 and 4.0 (or 4.1?); do they run on standard Amiga hardware or they need PowerPPC accelerator boards?
Jen
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I don't think there is one.
3.9 should run on a 020, 4.0 will need a ppc.
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Which is the natural successor of Workbench 3.1?
I'm cleaning up all my old Amiga systems, just only to decide if they can be still useful of ready to be sold...
I'm reading about AmigOS 3.9 and 4.0 (or 4.1?); do they run on standard Amiga hardware or they need PowerPPC accelerator boards?
Jen
After OS 3.1 came OS 3.5, then OS 3.9 with boing bag 1, 2 and an unofficial boing bag 3 (like service packs).
After 3.9 came OS 4.0, the last official OS to run on classic hardware, but it requires a blizzard PPC or cyberstorm PPC accelerator board.
After OS 4.0 came OS 4.1, then some updates, then OS 4.1 update 1 just recently. Requires AmigaONE PPC hardware or SAM hardware.
There is also AROS (requires x86 hardware) or MorphOS 1.4 PowerUP for classics, again requires blizzard PPC or cyberstorm PPC, however it's only available in demo form.
MorphOS 2.x (upto 2.4 now) is also available on Pegasos PPC hardware and Mac Mini.
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OS 3.9 is the last release which runs on classic Amiga hardware. 4.0 and above need PowerPC processors. 4.0 is available for PowerPC accelerators, 4.1 and on need complete new computers (AmigaOne, Pegasos2, SAM).
Note that 3.9 needs some expansions to run: 68020 processor, 8 MB RAM, hard drive and CD-ROM. It does not run on an unexpanded A1200 for example.
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A very fast response, wow :)
There are still many Amiga users around, I see ;)
OK, I understand that the best solution for my A3000/040 and A1200/030 is AmigaOS3.9 but... What I can really do better with the new operating system than 3.1?
Jen
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Tons! And we're fanatical... Some of us even foam at the mouth! LOL
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A very fast response, wow :)
There are still many Amiga users around, I see ;)
OK, I understand that the best solution for my A3000/040 and A1200/030 is AmigaOS3.9 but... What I can really do better with the new operating system than 3.1?
Jen
Well the Out-of-the-box experience of OS4.0 is much nicer, icons look nicer, there is some new nice software for OS4 or updated versions of older software (AmiFTP, TuneNet, OWB Web Browser, NetSurf), etc.
Not to mention a ton of other improvements, but you can read about it on ACube's site here: http://www.acube-systems.biz/index.php?page=software&pid=3
But if you don't have a PPC accelerator then the highest classic Amiga OS you can use is OS 3.9 BB2 and perhaps also the unofficial BB3 (boing bag 3).
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Note that 3.9 needs some expansions to run: 68020 processor, 8 MB RAM, hard drive and CD-ROM. It does not run on an unexpanded A1200 for example.
Well... it does run on unexapanded A1200, but the installer wont let you install it on one. Most of OS3.9 also runs on 68000, the exceptions being programs that rely on resource.library that is 020+. That includes all programs that use ReAction GUI. I'd love to hear why c:Makedir is 020+ though :)
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A very fast response, wow :)
There are still many Amiga users around, I see ;)
OK, I understand that the best solution for my A3000/040 and A1200/030 is AmigaOS3.9 but... What I can really do better with the new operating system than 3.1?
Jen
Since the machines you listed don't have PPC cards, the 4.0 info is probably not what you were looking for.
As far as 3.9 goes, check out the following link for some information on the updated OS.
http://os.amigaworld.de/index.php?lang=en&page=7
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A very fast response, wow :)
There are still many Amiga users around, I see ;)
OK, I understand that the best solution for my A3000/040 and A1200/030 is AmigaOS3.9 but... What I can really do better with the new operating system than 3.1?
Jen
OS3.9 is really nice - but in my experience and usage, I do not like running it on anything less than an 040. It felt pretty slow on my 40mhz 030 equipped A1200 when I had it and I recently installed 3.9 on my 25mhz A3000 - to which I quickly un-installed it and went back to 3.1. Using a modestly sized hard drive, I did not need, nor enjoy 3.9's automatic resetting of the computer and it's fancy icon scheme is too slow for my tastes on an 030.
3.1 on an 030 is excellent though! IF you want 3.9 like operations, there's tons of "plug-ins" and apps you can download from Aminet, etc. if you want to tweak 3.1 'til your hearts content. That's what I've done and am extremely happy with the results.
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Thank you all for the response.
I will check the links you wrote for my attention about 3.9...
I'm slowly entering into that 'old' situation, where the computer is hot not for what I do with it, but hot for the look ;)
In the past I spent much of my time resizing windows, cleaning up the icons, optimizing the libraries, etc. etc. :-d
Jen
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To be honest os 3.5 and 3.9 are really nothing more than a copy of os 3.1 somebody at H&P customised. They look nice, and have some nice software, but they offer nothing new if you already have a good 3.1 setup.
3.1 + MUI + Classact (reaction) + any TCP/IP stack for networking (I use the one from the 3.9 cd) = Runs more software than 3.9 does, out of the box. If its a modern program you'll probably end up copying lots of libs from aminet, no matter which os version you use.
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If its a modern propgram you'll probably end up copying lots of libs from aminet, no matter which os version you use.
Truer words haven't been spoken in a long time! Can't tell you how many times I'll go to install something (usually in OS3.9) and be sent on a wild goose chase tracking down libs or whatever. lol Glad it's all readily available, but the practice does get old after a while. Hell, even Amiga specific, modern and currently produced hardware does not come with all the software one needs to install some of this stuff. :mad:
By gum, these things (Amiga's) are supposed to be more user friendly than that! lol
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that reminds me of something thats been in my head for the past week: Why isn't there an amiga package manager? Its far from impossible. just think:
>aminet-install netsurf
checking system... OS IS WORKBENCH, 3.1, M68060, AGA
checking libs... BLAH BLAH MISSING
downloading libs ... DONE
downloading netsurf ... DONE
Netsurf can now be found on your Work: partition, or another if specified at install time.
I'd rather that than spend three days solid googling weird files not even the developers can be arsed to list under system requirements.
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That's not a horrible idea. Hmm....
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that reminds me of something thats been in my head for the past week: Why isn't there an amiga package manager? Its far from impossible. just think:
>aminet-install netsurf
checking system... OS IS WORKBENCH, 3.1, M68060, AGA
checking libs... BLAH BLAH MISSING
downloading libs ... DONE
downloading netsurf ... DONE
Netsurf can now be found on your Work: partition, or another if specified at install time.
I'd rather that than spend three days solid googling weird files not even the developers can be arsed to list under system requirements.
just download a pre-installed workbench envirinment like classicamiga, amigasys or amikit.
back in the day i'd spend ages tweaking everything to squeeze that last drop of speed and functionality, which would often result in conflicts, now I can't be bothered. download and install, yay!
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Windows 95. (A million monkeys with typerwriters...and all that.)
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OK, my .10 cents... (since I want to respond to several points in this thread... :) )
Personally, I only upgraded to 3.5 because of the 'large hard drive support' ... OK, I had a pretty nice 3.1 setup with NSD, seemed like HD's > 4GB worked fine, then suddenly they didn't.... :(
I like 3.9 w/ BB1&2, though I agree with Save 2600... I wouldn't want 3.5+ on anything less than an '040....
If you basically like 3.1, check out various software upgrades, etc.... I had 3.1 on my 1200T for Many years, still have it on my 4000/WE '040 .... Otherwise, there is an OS3.9 FAQ out there...
Upgrading to OS3.9 wasn't too hard for me... I had a pretty nice 3.1 system, installed 3.5 over that, twice. (first time was a major PITA), then 3.9... I don't get many 'missing libs' or similar probs....and actually, I still have many files from my OS1.3 days..... (R.I.P. A500 :( )
And yeah, a number of OS 3.9 progs. happily work under 3.1.... like IoTools... Yay!
Hmm, I have to ask a question... When you click an icon in 3.9 it is set as the current dir. , I thought this was in OS3.5+ , or was it also in OS3.1 ??
I also Wish for an Amiga 'package manager' or something..... I don't have a lot of probs. installing software, but when I do, they are a major Pain.....
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just download a pre-installed workbench envirinment like classicamiga, amigasys or amikit.
That's not really any kind of solution at all.
"hey can you help me fit an alarm to my '63 Zodiac?"
"Just buy a brand new car from any fine ford dealer!"
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that reminds me of something thats been in my head for the past week: Why isn't there an amiga package manager? Its far from impossible. just think:
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I'd rather that than spend three days solid googling weird files not even the developers can be arsed to list under system requirements.
Would this package manager still depend on the same developers?
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I'd imagine the package manager delvelopers would probably ask for a list of required libs and other files from the other devs.
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@Hell Labs
Amigasys 4 has an autoupdate feature which is similar in principle to Windows Update. Maybe a full blown package manager could be something for inclusion in the next version of AmigaSys?
Weed
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That would be a great feature.
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or if someone could port this to classic:
http://www.amiupdate.net/
Weed
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that reminds me of something thats been in my head for the past week: Why isn't there an amiga package manager? Its far from impossible.
I'm thinking about clrmamepro, I think it does the same with the mame rom sets.
Jen[/SIZE][/FONT]
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Your font! It burns!
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That's not really any kind of solution at all.
"hey can you help me fit an alarm to my '63 Zodiac?"
"Just buy a brand new car from any fine ford dealer!"
WTF?
You're not getting a new computer, you're getting all the updates you need to to improve the functionality and perfromance of your machine without having to go out and hunt them down, configure them, work out the conflicts, all you need is a Workbench 3.1 disc or ADF. How easy is that?
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@Hell Labs
Amigasys 4 has an autoupdate feature which is similar in principle to Windows Update. Maybe a full blown package manager could be something for inclusion in the next version of AmigaSys?
Weed
Amikit too.
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WTF?
You're not getting a new computer, you're getting all the updates you need to to improve the functionality and perfromance of your machine without having to go out and hunt them down, configure them, work out the conflicts, all you need is a Workbench 3.1 disc or ADF. How easy is that?
Terrible? There's more work there doing stuff like disabling eyecandy bollocks and tweking it so it'll actually run at a usable speed on real hardware, than there is to work your way up from standard 3.1.
The exception to that is Cwb because that was made by someone you could describe as "sane".
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Terrible? There's more work there doing stuff like disabling eyecandy bollocks and tweking it so it'll actually run at a usable speed on real hardware, than there is to work your way up from standard 3.1.
The exception to that is Cwb because that was made by someone you could describe as "sane".
Which environment are you talking about?
Amikit, yep you really need an '060 to make this shine. And it doesn't look or feel like an Amiga. But under WinUae its great and looks better than any Linux theme I've seen.
Amigsys and ClassicWB have versions optimised for whatever hardware you have. I have a 2 meg version of classicwb and it flies on an A1200, and has most of the essentials covered.
AIAB is great too on low end hardware
Really an '030 and some fast ram with classic wb will give you all the functionality of AmigaOS 3.5+, with all the patches that would take you a lot of time to get done yourself, and its faster.
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I already said "The exception to that is Cwb because that was made by someone you could describe as "sane"."
So really, you're preaching to the converted. and I've seen a thread where somebody ran amikit on an 060 and it was balls slow, i'm talking whoops-windows-xp-sp3-on-pentium-133mhz-64mb slow.
Can amiga in a box even be downloaded any more? last I tried it was gone.
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OS3.9 is really nice - but in my experience and usage, I do not like running it on anything less than an 040. It felt pretty slow on my 40mhz 030 equipped A1200 when I had it and I recently installed 3.9 on my 25mhz A3000 - to which I quickly un-installed it and went back to 3.1.
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Hmmmm - I mainly use OS 3.9 on my A4000PPC. On the 68060@50mHz the speed is quite acceptable, but this may be due to the fact that my harddrives are attached to the UW-SCSI host adapter.
Initially I had an HD attached to internal IDE and that way the system was not so responsive. So I switched to SCSI and disabled the IDE...
I also have an 40mhz 030 equipped A1200 with OS 3.9., but haven't used it for years. I can remember that it was of course slower than the A4k, but I would think dropping the IDE in favour of an SCSI host would most likely speed up the system equally.
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>aminet-install netsurf
I actually would love that idea!! wonder if it is possible to have sometime in the future. The only problem that I can see is that many of the install scripts would need to change. At least in order to be able to un-install what has been installed.