Amiga.org
Operating System Specific Discussions => Other Operating Systems => Topic started by: Tension on March 31, 2010, 12:31:40 AM
-
I've always loved my PS3, but Sony have decided to shaft their customers thusly:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8594720.stm
What a load of scumbags.
-
Well, that's what happens when you buy proprietary hardware/software from the same vendor - no choice except what they choose to do. Same thing for an Xbox and Wii. Only what MS and Nintendo want will go on those systems.
Though, I can't blame Sony... piracy is a real threat for a company who loses money on hardware to make it up on the software. If a PS3 could be "unlocked" easy enough - you would see spike in hardware sales with no corresponding software sell spike.
But for someone who bought it for Yellow Dog Linux http://www.yellowdoglinux.com/support/hardware/sony.shtml they are screwed and that isn't right.
So yes they are bastards!
:)
-
Yea i'm not gonna upgrade mine, but there will come a time when I want to play a new game and I will be forced to upgrade to the new firmware from the BD first.
Absolutely Gobsmacked!
-
I don't see what the big deal is, tbh. Can you still play games on it? Use your machine for what it was intended and dry your eyes.
So what if Sony dictates what can or can't be done on its machine?
You don't buy a DVD player then bitch that it doesn't make toast. Play games on your PS3 and be happy.
-
How many times does Sony have to screw their customers before folks stop buying their stuff? I know, infinity. Haha, people never learn.
-
You have your computers for install linux or the os you want... ps3 for god of war 3!
-
Use your machine for what it was intended and dry your eyes.
It was intended to run Linux fool.
-
Sony modified the hardware and bios of the psx ps2 and ps3 numerous times. I think they should realize by now that nothing they do will stop the hackers. pissing off (on) your loyal customers is not the way to go especially since it won't have the effect you want anyway.
Nintendo has done the same thing with the wii updates. They release an update, the hackers find a way around. I don't really mind since I only install the upgrades I have to, but it still doesn't make any sense.
How many of us have had software for our amiga that is on a dying disk and the only way to copy the disk is a hack, since the publisher didn't provide a way and copy protection prevents the os.
This crap has been going on for a long time.
-
Well, I heard of Linux Mint, but not Linux Fool :)
Seriously though, you're gobsmacked? Over a games machine OS?
Is that the biggest thing you have to be worried or upset about in your life?
I'd trade your woes for mine anyday..
-
You have your computers for install linux or the os you want... ps3 for god of war 3!
Problem is, Sony actually marketed this thing as a cheap developer machine for folks who wanted to jump on the cell bandwagon and promoted linux on the device. Now they've changed their minds. Once again, Sony fraks their users.
-
Well, I heard of Linux Mint, but not Linux Fool :)
Seriously though, you're gobsmacked? Over a games machine OS?
Is that the biggest thing you have to be worried or upset about in your life?
I'd trade your woes for mine anyday..
Are you trying to flame me?
Frak off and die.
-
LOL only 7 posts to go
-
Sony modified the hardware and bios of the psx ps2 and ps3 numerous times. I think they should realize by now that nothing they do will stop the hackers. pissing off (on) your loyal customers is not the way to go especially since it won't have the effect you want anyway.
Nintendo has done the same thing with the wii updates. They release an update, the hackers find a way around. I don't really mind since I only install the upgrades I have to, but it still doesn't make any sense.
How many of us have had software for our amiga that is on a dying disk and the only way to copy the disk is a hack, since the publisher didn't provide a way and copy protection prevents the os.
This crap has been going on for a long time.
True, but I think this is the first time they've actually removed a feature that they were previously using as a selling point.
Plus the fact that we wont be allowed to play online without "updating" really is a pisser.
-
I see this very positively - Sony gets bad rap all over the place, there will most likely be class action lawsuits against Sony, the incentive to crack PS3 for real is even higher, piracy of PS3 games will flourish - all in all - I like it. Maybe I'll even buy a PS3 again, eventually.
And people say I'm a cynic? :)
-
Are you trying to flame me?
Frak off and die.
actually i think he was trying to point out that you're being dramatic.
PS3 wasn't made to run Linux. It was made to play metal gear solid 4, time crisis 4, FF13, and various other epic games, on gigantic HDMI TVs with surround sound.
If you do not agree, then PS3 is not for you.
-
actually i think he was trying to point out that you're being dramatic.
PS3 wasn't made to run Linux.
Well, that would be true if it wasn't for the fact that Sony themselves provided Linux distro for it and also advertised and sold the PS3 as a developer platform.
It isn't new for them, they also made a Linux kit for PS2, and just like now, they pulled out of it with the release of the "slim" device.
It was made to play metal gear solid 4, time crisis 4, FF13, and various other epic games, on gigantic HDMI TVs with surround sound.
If you do not agree, then PS3 is not for you.
You've obviously been out of the loop regarding the PS3 - there are enough revisionists around in the world, please do some research before posting. For example you can start with Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OtherOS).
And for the record - I think PS3 all in all sucks bigtime, I had one for a while and was not satisfied at all. :)
-
it wasn't MADE to run Linux. It was just an OPTION. One that set it apart from the 360 and it's locked-in setup. A neat selling point for those people out there that have to put Linux on everything known to man.
Sony didn't sit down at the big ol' conference table and go
"guys, we need to make a 600$ console designed around the fact that it can run a free OS. Its the future of game consoles. Our propriety software isn't important."
I don't give two shits what Wikipedia says about "other OS" and crap for the PS3. Yeah, you can put Linux on there. Yeah, its neat. Yeah, tinkering and homebrewing can happen because of it.... but.....
PS3 development under random Linux distros sucks. Ever try it? I have. You don't get full fun of the hardware, and it's mostly a hobby/tinkering sort of thing. You can get the same performance out of a PC from the early 2000s.
If you want to really develop for the thing, you have to go legit. I've had ps3 since launch day and have been messing with Linux and development on it since it was possible as well...
So, uh, take your "research" comment, and kindly shove it.
-
Sleazebags, this is why Sony SUCKS! THEY MUST DIE AND ARE EVEL!! Look up Mash it Up smashing PS2, tells you why the DC was better.... by smashing. Actually, sony's consoles have been underpowered since PS1;
PSX: 34mhz MIPS 2mb
Saturn: 2x SH-2 28mhz each 2mb each
PS2: 298mhz 64-bit 2mb VRAM 32mb RDRAM
DC: 200MHZ 64/128 SH-4 4mb VRAM 16MB SRAM
And the games were weaker:
PSX: Grandia: Washed out and crackly sound/GFX, heavy pixelation
Saturn: Grandia, cleaner, better smoothness, lower pixelation
PS2: Dead Or Alive 2: Inferior GFX to Naomi
DC: On par with NAOMI
-
Problem is, Sony actually marketed this thing as a cheap developer machine for folks who wanted to jump on the cell bandwagon and promoted linux on the device. Now they've changed their minds. Once again, Sony fraks their users.
I dont know the marketing of ps3 on the united states but in europe, ps3 is sold like a games console (that is) and in some forums you can learn to install some linux distribution on it, nothing more.
Im not sure but you cant access to all ps3 resources with linux.
-
it wasn't MADE to run Linux. It was just an OPTION. One that set it apart from the 360 and it's locked-in setup. A neat selling point for those people out there that have to put Linux on everything known to man.
Sony didn't sit down at the big ol' conference table and go
"guys, we need to make a 600$ console designed around the fact that it can run a free OS. Its the future of game consoles. Our propriety software isn't important."
I don't give two shits what Wikipedia says about "other OS" and crap for the PS3. Yeah, you can put Linux on there. Yeah, its neat. Yeah, tinkering and homebrewing can happen because of it.... but.....
PS3 development under random Linux distros sucks. Ever try it? I have. You don't get full fun of the hardware, and it's mostly a hobby/tinkering sort of thing. You can get the same performance out of a PC from the early 2000s.
If you want to really develop for the thing, you have to go legit. I've had ps3 since launch day and have been messing with Linux and development on it since it was possible as well...
So, uh, take your "research" comment, and kindly shove it.
tsk, tsk.
"it was fully intended that you, a PS3 owner, could play games, watch movies, view photos, listen to music, and run a full-featured Linux operating system that transforms your PS3 into a home computer." -- Sony
The PS3 was marketed as a machine that would pwn the planet, ass rape your living room, have sex with you, solve global warming and yes, run linux. The cell was supposed to be the greatest thing EVAR and the way to get familiar with it was to buy a PS3. Hell, Sony even marketed this as a stepping stone to getting user created games on their service. Promises bigger than even what A-Eon is coming up with right now. And Sony just said "Frak You" to all the folks who bought into it.
-
Sleazebags, this is why Sony SUCKS! THEY MUST DIE AND ARE EVEL!! Look up Mash it Up smashing PS2, tells you why the DC was better.... by smashing. Actually, sony's consoles have been underpowered since PS1;
PSX: 34mhz MIPS 2mb
Saturn: 2x SH-2 28mhz each 2mb each
PS2: 298mhz 64-bit 2mb VRAM 32mb RDRAM
DC: 200MHZ 64/128 SH-4 4mb VRAM 16MB SRAM
And the games were weaker:
PSX: Grandia: Washed out and crackly sound/GFX, heavy pixelation
Saturn: Grandia, cleaner, better smoothness, lower pixelation
PS2: Dead Or Alive 2: Inferior GFX to Naomi
DC: On par with NAOMI
Please dont compare psx vs saturn, saturn came late to the party and dreamcast too early, but if you are a sega fan and comparisions arent fair.
-
I dont know the marketing of ps3 on the united states but in europe, ps3 is sold like a games console (that is) and in some forums you can learn to install some linux distribution on it, nothing more.
Im not sure but you cant access to all ps3 resources with linux.
Its marketed as a game console everywhere! Thats the primary software for the thing. You don't really see the same amount of magazines/site coverage/etc that you do for the media capabilities of the PS3. :) All the extra frills outside of the gaming portion are about on par with all the other random media crap out there for PC. Yeah, its there. Yeah, it works, yeah, its not selling the system.
and no you don't get full ps3 access with linux. It sucks :( . I stopped messing with it recently but I do remember reading that someone had cracked it to where you could..
tsk, tsk.
"it was fully intended that you, a PS3 owner, could play games, watch movies, view photos, listen to music, and run a full-featured Linux operating system that transforms your PS3 into a home computer." -- Sony
The PS3 was marketed as a machine that would pwn the planet, ass rape your living room, have sex with you, solve global warming and yes, run linux. The cell was supposed to be the greatest thing EVAR and the way to get familiar with it was to buy a PS3. Hell, Sony even marketed this as a stepping stone to getting user created games on their service. Promises bigger than even what A-Eon is coming up with right now. And Sony just said "Frak You" to all the folks who bought into it.
tsk tsk what? Where does that quote say WITH LINUX YOU CAN BE JAWESOME DEVELOPER AND MAEK GAMES. It doesn't. A home computer is not a developer computer. you can , for the price of a ps3, have linux and do your normal day to day computer stuff with it, and use the media center like capabilities of it..... but cmon, if Sony released their development kit.... the FULL featured one, for free under Linux, the homebrew market would be as crapped up as the 360 one....
full of crappy games and reskinned tech demos...
Everything that quote says, DID happen for the PS3, and is perfectly fine. Better than the 360's implementation too.
The cell thing IS awesome, for games. I don't think they ever had much intention of using the cell technology for other software. Office suites and stuff for the PS3 would be pretty funny though.
Lots of games make great use of cell power. and like I said, thats what its all designed for. If the thing was designed to be a podunk little media center/internet browser, you'd have something akin to the Wii in terms of power.
-
it wasn't MADE to run Linux. It was just an OPTION. One that set it apart from the 360 and it's locked-in setup. A neat selling point for those people out there that have to put Linux on everything known to man.
No, those were not the target.
Sony didn't sit down at the big ol' conference table and go
"guys, we need to make a 600$ console designed around the fact that it can run a free OS. Its the future of game consoles. Our propriety software isn't important."
Who said so? Again you're just babling. As for who wanted the OtherOS to be there, I bet it wasnt Sony in the first place. More likely it was IBM.
But again - that is beside the point.
I don't give two shits what Wikipedia says about "other OS" and crap for the PS3. Yeah, you can put Linux on there. Yeah, its neat. Yeah, tinkering and homebrewing can happen because of it.... but.....
... but that was also not the point. Nice to see that you admit that you dont give two shits about facts, btw. I suppose that is transferable to other postings you make as well?
PS3 development under random Linux distros sucks. Ever try it?
Sure, and indeed it sucks - hence I gave away my PS3.
I have. You don't get full fun of the hardware, and it's mostly a hobby/tinkering sort of thing. You can get the same performance out of a PC from the early 2000s.
Ah, you need to post on those "we want AmigaOS on PS3" threads. It's not correct to say that "it's mostly a hobby/tinkering sort of thing", that is what the PS3 and Cell is mostly useless for. What is _is_ usable for though, is running dedicated code for various number crunching, something hobby/tinkerers have no use for. And this is also what the PS3 has been used for in a few academic scenarious.
If you want to really develop for the thing, you have to go legit.
Development under Linux on it was always legit.
I've had ps3 since launch day and have been messing with Linux and development on it since it was possible as well...
So have I.
So, uh, take your "research" comment, and kindly shove it.
I will, up yours.
Really, you're missing the entire point here - which wasnt whether the PS3 sucks for running Linux on, or doing development on. The point is that they advertised and sold it also as a developer machine for Cell with Linux as a platform. Peraps this was under preasure from IBM, but that is not really relevant. They are now in effect pulling that option, and alot of people will be pissed about it, and rightfully so.
And, if you've been paying attention, you'd notice that I see Sony's move as a positive thing, since it will only hurt Sony, which I, personally, think is great. :laughing:
-
I dont know the marketing of ps3 on the united states but in europe, ps3 is sold like a games console (that is) and in some forums you can learn to install some linux distribution on it, nothing more.
Im not sure but you cant access to all ps3 resources with linux.
They didn't make much of a point of it mainstream, but I can assure you that it was advertised it in various academic/scientific media. There was a period I was fed up with all the PS3 crap showing up eveywhere.
-
The cell thing IS awesome, for games. I don't think they ever had much intention of using the cell technology for other software. Office suites and stuff for the PS3 would be pretty funny though.
May I again point to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_(microprocessor)), even though you dont give a crap, maybe others do.
Lots of games make great use of cell power.
Really? Are you sure?
and like I said, thats what its all designed for. If the thing was designed to be a podunk little media center/internet browser, you'd have something akin to the Wii in terms of power.
I'm almost tempted to say that it is akin to the Wii in terms of power, when it comes to general use. I have two Wiis with Linux on, and the difference to running Linux on the PS3 is not as big as it should be, considering the numbers. :laughing:
The PS3 was designed to generate a money flow, and part of that deal was to atract developers to Cell. This, for most part, failed, and now Sony is doing a clean-up operation, which also will fail. I like it. :)
-
I dont know why anyone's surprised at this, Sony always -remove- features in their consoles over time.
Hard luck for anyone actually wanting/using those features.
Many of the "more interesting features" are just early-adopter fodder, once the console breaks the mainstream, Sony's loyal, premium-paying fanbase are soon forgotten.
It's a process they've gone through again and again and each generation the suckers come back for more.
-Cell started out as the "be all and end all" of CPU architecture and was quickly proven to be more exotic headache than paradigm shift.
-BluRay was plugged as the must-have format for HD viewing but it's now more meh than yeh.
The shine of Sony's hype soon wears off like chrome plating on cheap plastic.
Personally, I treat consoles as gaming appliances nothing more. If they happen to be able to do other things, take it as a bonus but expect that the copyright owner can at any time take their toys away making the system unusable for those things.
-
I remember them advertising it as a fully capable computer. Looks like false advertising to me.
Gimping everything seems to be popular sport for companies nowadays. No doubt they will reintroduce the feature on an 'upgraded' model and charge you again for the privilege of 'enhanced features'.
-
And where is the academic PS3 dev kit that was in beta last summer, that was meant to allow students and universities to develop applications for the "game OS" directly?
"It's a Sony - Oh, no!"
-
Who said so? Again you're just babling. As for who wanted the OtherOS to be there, I bet it wasnt Sony in the first place. More likely it was IBM.
But again - that is beside the point.
Babbling? I think its a pretty solid remark. To think the console, a VIDEO GAME console, was designed and planned out with Other OS's on it being the top priority, isn't very reasonable. The Playstation is, and will always be, games first, other stuff second. You ever see any of the conferences focusing on OMGLINUX? No. Pretty sure the key emphasis was the gaming platform.
... but that was also not the point. Nice to see that you admit that you dont give two shits about facts, btw. I suppose that is transferable to other postings you make as well?
No, you misunderstand. I give a shit about facts, and am not saying that page is wrong. I just don't go scour wikipedia for factoids to copy pasta into forums to make it look like Im more knowledgeable. Especially because the link you posted about OtherOS wasn't really anything of importance.
Ah, you need to post on those "we want AmigaOS on PS3" threads. It's not correct to say that "it's mostly a hobby/tinkering sort of thing", that is what the PS3 and Cell is mostly useless for. What is _is_ usable for though, is running dedicated code for various number crunching, something hobby/tinkerers have no use for. And this is also what the PS3 has been used for in a few academic scenarious.
its still tinkering no matter how you want to slice it...academia isn't commercial. and, by "hobby" , I am referring to hobby game development. It's a novel idea, but it was limited from the get-go. And uhhhh who are you to say hobbyists/tinkerers don't have a use for running dedicated number crunching algorithms, etc.? You got some surveillance on the entire PS3 development community?
Development under Linux on it was always legit.
My bad, "official". The fully licensed development kit is worlds better than the goofy nonsense you can do with a basement Linux install.
I will, up yours.
Thanks, but no thanks. I'm not into that. I'm sure you'll find someone who is though!
Really, you're missing the entire point here - which wasnt whether the PS3 sucks for running Linux on, or doing development on. The point is that they advertised and sold it also as a developer machine for Cell with Linux as a platform. Peraps this was under preasure from IBM, but that is not really relevant. They are now in effect pulling that option, and alot of people will be pissed about it, and rightfully so.
Lol, you underestimate people and their determination. I won't be surprised when Linux reappears on PS3 sometime in the future either by retracting the kill from Sony (once they get security under control), or by someones brute force. Most likely, the someone will be Geohot again. You did read the information right? Dude's already planning to work around it. Welcome to the world of hackers..?
and I really think the advertising in regards to linux was a nice afterthought. Didn't seem to be the emphasis, ever.
And, if you've been paying attention, you'd notice that I see Sony's move as a positive thing, since it will only hurt Sony, which I, personally, think is great. :laughing:
Oh, so you're one of those biased Anti-Sony people. That explains a lot.
May I again point to Wikipedia, even though you dont give a crap, maybe others do.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_(microprocessor)
Right, you are aware that there is a difference between Cell in a ps3, and cell at large right? By "They" I mean, Sony. With the PS3. The platform we are discussing here. Im sure all of the plans for OTHER applications of Cell besides games were planned with DIFFERENT hardware in mind. Not a video game console. Hell its the second paragraph of the article. Did you read it at all? Or... did you just assume it agreed 100% with what you were thinking and blindly pasted it here.
Personally, I treat consoles as gaming appliances nothing more. If they happen to be able to do other things, take it as a bonus but expect that the copyright owner can at any time take their toys away making the system unusable for those things.
:D Exactly.
-
Seriously though, you're gobsmacked? Over a games machine OS?
Oh the irony of this comment on an Amiga forum!
Amiga is a games machine dammit.
/ducks
-
I don't see the big deal. It IS a gaming machine. Some people are pissed (all 3 of them), I get it, but this shouldn't really come as a surprise - every company does things like that - it reminds of Apple most of all.
-
Just for S & Gs, what are the latest available alternative OSes for the PS3? I installed Xubutu 7.10 last year on mine and was underwelmed by performance.
The stock OS was more responsive (the browser STUNK, though) and cooler. I'm not a gamer, I've only kept the thing around to play Blu Rays and some of the few other compatible media.
-
I don't see the big deal. It IS a gaming machine. Some people are pissed (all 3 of them), I get it, but this shouldn't really come as a surprise - every company does things like that - it reminds of Apple most of all.
Another one that misses the point, and I can't really remember Apple pulling a stunt like this.
-
I use my PS3 primarily as a Blu-Ray player, but I'm sure Sony will kill that feature eventually as well. ;-) (And in the United States, the PS3 is heavily marketed as a Blu-Ray player. Of course, most salesmen will tell you that it can't be better than X dedicated Blu-Ray player, but that's mostly perception. Most people won't have their displays tuned to the point that it makes a difference. The image is awesome on my 55" Samsung 8500.)
A number of universities and governments use PS3s for analytical computing, but with mainstream x64 processors coming with 8, 12, and more cores, and mainstream graphics cards carrying hundreds of stream processors, the Cell (as it exists in the PS3) isn't much of a win apart from the price.
-
Wwhat are the latest available alternative OSes for the PS3?
Any PowerPC Linux will do, as long as you have a kernel suited for PS3, I used Gentoo with certain stuff buildt from a PS3 overlay and git.
I installed Xubutu 7.10 last year on mine and was underwelmed by performance.
Exacly, it's not really suited for general purpose without any support from the GPU. The SPEs need dedicated code, there is little or close to none such code that is of much interest for "most users".
The stock OS was more responsive (the browser STUNK, though) and cooler. I'm not a gamer, I've only kept the thing around to play Blu Rays and some of the few other compatible media.
The most bloated, uncapable and power draining media center you can pick. :laughing:
-
A number of universities and governments use PS3s for analytical computing, but with mainstream x64 processors coming with 8, 12, and more cores, and mainstream graphics cards carrying hundreds of stream processors, the Cell (as it exists in the PS3) isn't much of a win apart from the price.
and with the cost of tuition, its not like the price really matters :D :hammer:
-
Thanks Kolla
I haven't updated my PS3 for a long time. I am currently DLing Update version 3.15, supposedly the last before 3.21 (in which the feature is eliminated) to my Mac. When I get confirmation that there is nothing squirelly about it, I might update one last time. Who knows, maybe YellowDog or some future OS will be worthwhile.
-
Vote with your wallets.
I reject the idea that once I buy a piece of electronics, I am somehow not the owner of that piece of electronics and able to do with it as I please.
-
Another one that misses the point, and I can't really remember Apple pulling a stunt like this.
It's a bad thing that the manufacturer disables some functions that you took as a bonus at the time of purchase (and which few people based their purchase decision on). It's a bad thing that they don't let you decide what functions should the device support or not ta da da da etc. etc. etc. Now seriously - it's Sony, they are famous for their proprietary crap and for doing things their own (bad) way, so did we know this was coming? Of course! Did you believe their advertising that the PS3 was a full blown computer etc.? From what I hear (and read here) installing alternative OSs on it has always been an interesting possibility at best, a useless gimmick at worst. If you or anybody else bought a PS3 as an ultimate can-do-everything device, your naivity knows no bounds. Again - is what they did bad? Sure it is, and maybe worth sueing them over it. Is it such a big deal that I would call anybody a bastard for it? No way. I've seen 5 more interesting and shocking news stories than this in the last half an hour....
Sony are Sony, I wouldn't trust them, but they make awesome gaming devices that's what I would (and am thinking of) buying the PS3 for.
So yeah, it is bad, but if this is the worst of our problems.....
-
True, but I think this is the first time they've actually removed a feature that they were previously using as a selling point.
Plus the fact that we wont be allowed to play online without "updating" really is a pisser.
apart from hardware ps2 compatibility and then software ps2 compatibility
-
apart from hardware ps2 compatibility and then software ps2 compatibility
That's not the same.
When I bought my PS3 I knew those features had already been removed due to cost cutting.
-
So what if Sony dictates what can or can't be done on its machine?
I have an objection to this kind of attitude by the big companies, to be honest. The thing is, it was their machine, when it was in the store. But as soon as I purchase it, it becomes my machine. And I should be able to choose what I want to do with it.
I don't actually have a PS3 so I'm not affected by this particular decision, but I did make the mistake of buying an iPhone which, I've discovered, is not my iPhone after all. I paid for it in good faith, but it's actually Apple's iPhone, not mine. If it were mine, I could decide what applications I wanted to run on it. Instead, Apple tell me what applications I'm allowed to run on it, and which functions I can use and how I can use them. But not to worry, it's just a phone, right? So all I should be concerned about is using the phone features and not whether I'm allowed to use the Bluetooth hardware? Yeah, right. That's certainly the attitude I should be adopting if I go by your "it's just a games console" opinion. But the reality is, the iPhone is a lot more than a mobile phone and I want to use it as such. Just like the PS3 is a lot more than a Games Console.
So yeah, I view this move by Sony as the very same thing Apple is doing with their iPhones. I'm not shedding tears or getting dramatic, there certainly are bigger problems in the world, no doubt about that, but that doesn't mean I have to approve of it :)
Apple Hammer
-
its probably a good thing anyways.
Now it can focus on being gaming hardware, which is more logical, and practical....
theres too many reasons to list why.
-
Well, that's what happens when you buy proprietary hardware/software from the same vendor
Yeah, bastards!
/me goes and switches on my A1200...
-
But are they inglorious?
-
:)
-
I'm red with anger about this decision by Sony! "Other OS" was an advertised feature that influenced my purchasing decision. I spend roughly 50% of my time in the PS3 in the Other OS environment.
I hear a lot of people pointing out that productivity applications on PS3 Linux are rather pointless due to the abysmal performance. What PS3 Linux does fairly well though is emulation. In the last couple months I played through all three Turricans via e-uae. I recently played through TMNT under sdlmame with my neighbor. NES/SNES emulation works well too. Vintage gaming with a Six-Axis on my 52" LCD! That is what drew me to PS3 Linux.
In addition to Vintage gaming, I play online with relatives via the Playstation Network. Now I'm being told by Sony that I have to choose which advertised feature I like better.
I have to reiterate: this was an advertised feature! It's on the box, in the manual, and in Sony's marketing literature!
-
Did anyone actually look at the date?? April 1st. April Fools Day????
I read the article and the first thing that pops out is the April 1st date.
Looks to me like someone is pulling a fast one on the BBC..
I gotta tell you, there are some passionate people here. Maybe if we could get all these passionate people together, would could actually develop some seriously good software for Amiga OS 4.1 or something.
-
I use my PS3 primarily as a Blu-Ray player, but I'm sure Sony will kill that feature eventually as well. ;-) (And in the United States, the PS3 is heavily marketed as a Blu-Ray player. Of course, most salesmen will tell you that it can't be better than X dedicated Blu-Ray player, but that's mostly perception. Most people won't have their displays tuned to the point that it makes a difference. The image is awesome on my 55" Samsung 8500.)
A number of universities and governments use PS3s for analytical computing, but with mainstream x64 processors coming with 8, 12, and more cores, and mainstream graphics cards carrying hundreds of stream processors, the Cell (as it exists in the PS3) isn't much of a win apart from the price.
Same here. I'm not much of a gamer (unless it is WoW on my PC) so my PS3 is attached to my plasma TV for Blu-Ray movies and to stream AVI files wirelessly from my main desktop hard drive to my TV using the Vuze software.
Disabling Linux doesn't bother me (but aren't we all glad that OS4.x wasn't ported to the pS3 ;) ), but they'd better not mess with Vuze.
-
Did anyone actually look at the date?? April 1st. April Fools Day????
I read the article and the first thing that pops out is the April 1st date.
Finally. It surprised me it took 4 pages of this thread before someone noticed that. Obviously this is a prank by Sony. They're probably laughing their asses off right now at forum postings all over the net of people losing it.
-
I doubt they would want to spread bad feeling about their company as an April Fool's joke. The joke would be on them, surely?
-
@ cpfuture: Are you serious? Even I don't find it funny and I'm a nerd. I really doubt overpaid businessmen at Sony would come up with something that lame...
-
I don't see what the big deal is, tbh. Can you still play games on it? Use your machine for what it was intended and dry your eyes.
So what if Sony dictates what can or can't be done on its machine?
You don't buy a DVD player then bitch that it doesn't make toast. Play games on your PS3 and be happy.
I'd complain if I bought a DVD player that was advertised as having an integrated toaster function, and then a firmware update disabled the toaster at a later date.
-
@ Hattig: I hate the smell of burning bread when watching movies, don't you? :D
-
I'm calling this an April Fools joke too.
-
I'm calling this an April Fools joke too.
Come on.
You don't really think Sony would give itself and its shareholders some bad press just for shits and giggles?
-
...channelling...
"We are Sony! You buy our products and we spit on you and you'll like it and buy more of our products because we are number one!"
*pats his VAIO laptop* yeah...
-
A number of universities and governments use PS3s for analytical computing, but with mainstream x64 processors coming with 8, 12, and more cores, and mainstream graphics cards carrying hundreds of stream processors, the Cell (as it exists in the PS3) isn't much of a win apart from the price.
The price in fact is a problem and probably one of the reasons for their decision. Sony looses money with every PS3 they sell, they only make profit with games. All the Linux powered PS3 clusters coming up without games being sold ruin their business case.
-
I bought my PS3 to play games on. SONY make magic kit so if it helps them contunue making fantastic kit and prevent hackers from mucking up my system or disabling the network for some reason then good for them. The PS3 is a games machine... And is sold as a games machine and DVD player. Of late the machine has more browser features and I guess these facilities are ever going to be expanded. If folk want a third party use for any machine then they probably need to use a home grown system unbadged without its own operating system.
So no they are not what you called them. They in fact sell a machine that gives me hours of pleasure... Currently Final Fantasy XIII, before that Bayonetta... next up God of War and on and on.
What I do object to and would use the B word is the BBC iPlayer on the PS3. The BBC should be disbanded or run as a commercial operation and stop taking money from me to support their outdated, bloated, unproductive, self indulgent load of crap. I haven`t watched BBC since 1995 so why should I pay for it. Now that is something worth moaning about.
scuzz
-
@ scuzzb494: Amen...
-
Geohot will figure a way past this. It's foolish. All the people using Linux suffer because some of us want full control of the PS3. I don't want to pirate games, I want direct access to the video hardware. Without that. decent video games and other video intense software cannot be written under Linux.
This is going to be defeated. It's only a matter of time.
-
@Iggy:
Linux on the PS3 runs as a virtual machine under a hypervisor and as such doesn't have direct access to the hardware. The video hardware specifically is gimped to a simple framebuffer without any 3D acceleration. This is presumably to prevent access to people whom aren't licensed to develop for the RSX chip. The basic 2D video is sufficient for Amiga emulation.
@scuzzb494:
The statement "The PS3 is a games machine" is purely subjective. Other OS was a marketed feature.
-
Geohot will figure a way past this. It's foolish. All the people using Linux suffer because some of us want full control of the PS3. I don't want to pirate games, I want direct access to the video hardware. Without that. decent video games and other video intense software cannot be written under Linux.
This is going to be defeated. It's only a matter of time.
and thats when sony will go OOPS and retract everything, lol.
-
"Other OS" was an advertised feature that influenced my purchasing decision. I spend roughly 50% of my time in the PS3 in the Other OS environment
Usually advertised features are subject to change (often without warning), as stated in some minuscule text on the advert somewhere.
http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=52074 (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=52074)
As the thread asks, why do people believe the advertising?
-
Stop complaining :) you at least you do not have the former CEO of COMMODORE FRANCE (George Fornay - 1994) current Vice-President of SONY COMPUTERS EUROPE. He was not appreciated in COMMODORE FRANCE & in France ... shame on us the French, shame on Sony.
If this decision comes from him, then double shame on him and SONY.
-
I haven't looked at Linux on the PS3, but if it really is a hypervisor....
Breaking through the hypervisor to get to the 3D hardware? Yeah, that'll happen anytime... :-)
I'm sure geohot is good, and he can probably get Linux running after they "disable" it, but you'd need a new hypervisor for 3D.
Unless Sony's hypervisor already supports 3D and they just haven't provided a driver..
doubtful
desiv
-
Stop complaining :) you at least you do not have the former CEO of COMMODORE FRANCE (George Fornay - 1994) current Vice-President of SONY COMPUTERS EUROPE. He was not appreciated in COMMODORE FRANCE & in France ... shame on us the French, shame on Sony.
If this decision comes from him, then double shame on him and SONY.
That doesn't surprise me at all. CBM certainly had the knack of pissing off their customers pretty well. Well done George you ****.
-
They didn't make much of a point of it mainstream, but I can assure you that it was advertised it in various academic/scientific media. There was a period I was fed up with all the PS3 crap showing up eveywhere.
And I suspect that anyone using it with Linux for Academic/Scientific uses won't give a damn about not being able to get on-line to play games, and they'll continue to chug along using it with the old BIOS.
-
I'm sure geohot is good, and he can probably get Linux running after they "disable" it, but you'd need a new hypervisor for 3D.
Or just disable the virtualisation completely.
-
Or just disable the virtualisation completely.
Yep.. Probably much more likely, although still will be a huge hack..
Would be great tho..
desiv
-
@Iggy:
Linux on the PS3 runs as a virtual machine under a hypervisor and as such doesn't have direct access to the hardware. The video hardware specifically is gimped to a simple framebuffer without any 3D acceleration. This is presumably to prevent access to people whom aren't licensed to develop for the RSX chip. The basic 2D video is sufficient for Amiga emulation.
@scuzzb494:
The statement "The PS3 is a games machine" is purely subjective. Other OS was a marketed feature.
Your talking FAT here arn`t you. The PS3 has moved on and the hardwear like my original FAT is now out of date. The SLIM never supported the other OS feature as I understand so why is anyone surprised that 3 year old technology is now going to be updated to bring it in line with the slim PS3. Eventually the FAT will disappear as the PS3 has become far more popular since the release of the SLIM... And more changes are in the pipeline. SONY won't make the same mistake again as they did with the XBOX and they will keep the 'gaming console' ahead of the pack. The games are what sells, not the disc player ... and a specialist minority group like LINUX are hardly their concern.... And they can change their mode of operation at any time. I support SONY for their gaming console, always will. So If they think its necessary to move the platform on to compete with crappy Microsoft then I am very very pleased. Seriously if you want LINUX go get a tin box....
The PS3 is internet dependant for gaming now and most stuff won`t run without the Playstation Network which is free. This internet updating tool from SONY keeps both FAT and SLIM healthy, for PS3 browser and gaming purposes. That is the focus, sorry. So the computer will get updated unless you simply disconnect it from the telephone line.
scuzz
-
I am a PS3 owner. I'm quite happy with it as a games machine and I had no real interest in installing Linux. However, if I had installed Linux I would be a bit pissed. it amazes me that so many people think it is acceptable that Sony can do this. Do you own a car? If your car manufacturer came and removed your sunroof would the car still go from a to b ? Of course it would, but you would still be pissed yes?
Another point many people are missing is that Sony claim this is an anti-piracy measure. LMFAO!!!!!!! Who made the chips that modded PS2? Oh yes, my freinds, it was Sony themselves! bloody hypocrisy at its best.
Still, I'm with Kolla on this one, It's not bad news, it is fantastic news. Now the hackers can (and will) target this machine for people like me to rip it apart and play with the innards.
I guess I should point out that I also own an original XBox with an executor 3 chip, modded (clear blue) case and a 200GB drive as well as a recased, pot tweaked, Viper chipped Gamecube. Even my N64 had a V64 Doctor sitting underneath it (illegal in the US but not in the UK I might add).
Thanks Sony, you can have some more cash off me when you make a PS3 mod chip, sell it through a Hong Kong distributer and then shut them down. Lik-Sang anyone?
GO GO Geohot!!! Flame On!!!
-
This reminds me of the HQ100 crt TV from them. It has a SuperFinePitch trinitron tube, the best HD crt tube ever, at least in the consumer market, and also pricey it was. But surprise, the european models with SuperFinePitch tubes (32" and 36" variants of the HQ100 model) don't have HD input!!!!!
It's like selling a car with a super power engine but putting an accelerator that only goes through half the way...
It's most likely some marketing department assholes like what happened in Commodore, coming in and totally wasting a great machine that took a lot of hard work to design by very good engineers and the saddest part is that having an HD input on the HQ100 would probably not even market predate any of their LCD / plasma (they still sold plasmas in 2004 I think) tvs.
The TV probably even has internal HD inputs cause the picture processing upscales the image, so someone could hack it, but probably they were not sold in high enouph numbers to get the attention of good electronics hackers.
-
@ Jose
A lot of hardware manufacturers make a single board with all the features and then they disable some of them for the cheaper versions. This costs them less to produce. I know a guy (who shall remain nameless) who bought a Sony DVCam, bottom of the range. He then googled it and subsequently modded it to unlock ALL the features of the top of the range version (apart from a port he could have soldered in but decided not to as he didn't need it). This does not work with everything however so make sure your sure before opening up any hardware.
-
Well, at the time I managed to find the service manuals for the american and european models and the chassis were different (probably due to different electrical standards too etc.) so it wasn't worth it. If there was a mod available I'm sure I would have tried it. BTW I found out the later Toshiba CRTs accept 1080i signals using a VGA to component video transcoder and some custom settings on Powerstrip (PC program to tweak image parameters, a bit like Picasso96's mode editor). They also accept some interesting frequencies and resolutions like 1200x 833i (probably the limits of the tube). The image needs some tweaking though and since I'm not into electronics (CRT image frequency and timing adjustments etc.) it becomes harder and boring to try to go further...
Very OT I knoew but I had to say it:)
-
Usually advertised features are subject to change (often without warning), as stated in some minuscule text on the advert somewhere.
http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=52074 (http://www.amiga.org/forums/showthread.php?t=52074)
As the thread asks, why do people believe the advertising?
But, it wasn't just an advertised feature, so Sony can't claim that here. If they remove it now, even with proper notice, they still be in violation of an implied warranty of merchantability, especially in places like California (where I happily live). No amount legal wrangling can get around an implied warranty. While Sony may be vulnerable to a class action lawsuit, however, I doubt it will happen. As others have noted, this will just encourage users to find so-called illegal methods of accessing the hardware.
-
@Trev
This change if true only affects FAT PS3's, most or all of those are out of warranty.
-
@Trev
This change if true only affects FAT PS3's, most or all of those are out of warranty.
The implied warranty is separate from the express warranty and is based solely on the product being fit for a particular purpose, e.g. running an alternative operating system. The act of accepting the upgrade's license agreement may qualify as a renegotiation of the terms of the original sale complete with a new implied warranty of mechantability that doesn't include running alternative operating systems. I don't know if you can renegotiate the terms of a sale after the sale has taken place. I'm not a lawyer, but my mother is. I'll ask her. ;-) One thing I do know is a blanket AS-IS disclaimer would not apply to features the product is expressly documented to support.
EDIT: Working around implied warranties is also a key part of advertising. That's why products are always advertised to "MAY" or "HELP" do something instead of actually doing something. Crafty that.
-
Finally. It surprised me it took 4 pages of this thread before someone noticed that. Obviously this is a prank by Sony. They're probably laughing their asses off right now at forum postings all over the net of people losing it.
I eat my own words. They actually did it.
http://www.dtechgadget.com/psa-ps3-firmware-update-3-21-available-now/
-
@cpfuture
Bummer!
-
I have an objection to this kind of attitude by the big companies, to be honest. The thing is, it was their machine, when it was in the store. But as soon as I purchase it, it becomes my machine. And I should be able to choose what I want to do with it.
I don't actually have a PS3 so I'm not affected by this particular decision, but I did make the mistake of buying an iPhone which, I've discovered, is not my iPhone after all. I paid for it in good faith, but it's actually Apple's iPhone, not mine. If it were mine, I could decide what applications I wanted to run on it. Instead, Apple tell me what applications I'm allowed to run on it, and which functions I can use and how I can use them. But not to worry, it's just a phone, right? So all I should be concerned about is using the phone features and not whether I'm allowed to use the Bluetooth hardware? Yeah, right. That's certainly the attitude I should be adopting if I go by your "it's just a games console" opinion. But the reality is, the iPhone is a lot more than a mobile phone and I want to use it as such. Just like the PS3 is a lot more than a Games Console.
So yeah, I view this move by Sony as the very same thing Apple is doing with their iPhones. I'm not shedding tears or getting dramatic, there certainly are bigger problems in the world, no doubt about that, but that doesn't mean I have to approve of it :)
Apple Hammer
Hello! This is our national law here in Greece and as far I remember we are the only E.U country supporting this statement. The machine belongs to the customer from the time of purchase at the store and NOT to the company. This is why it is illegal here in Greece for Apple to sell their IPhones locked. I don't know what Sony does. Truth is that customers don't give a shit here if x,y,z is locked until they face a major problem with (e.g trying to install something essential and found that it is forbidden). Anyway, I do not believe that any customer here will protest against Sony since 99.99% of them buy the console just to play games but if the 00.01% gets them to court Sony will will find themselves in some sort of trouble. If the case goes to the supreme E.U court however I can't predict the outcome since I am not aware of the exact E.U regulation.
-
Your talking FAT here arn`t you. The PS3 has moved on and the hardwear like my original FAT is now out of date. The SLIM never supported the other OS feature as I understand so why is anyone surprised that 3 year old technology is now going to be updated to bring it in line with the slim PS3. Eventually the FAT will disappear as the PS3 has become far more popular since the release of the SLIM... And more changes are in the pipeline. SONY won't make the same mistake again as they did with the XBOX and they will keep the 'gaming console' ahead of the pack. The games are what sells, not the disc player ... and a specialist minority group like LINUX are hardly their concern.... And they can change their mode of operation at any time. I support SONY for their gaming console, always will. So If they think its necessary to move the platform on to compete with crappy Microsoft then I am very very pleased. Seriously if you want LINUX go get a tin box....
The PS3 is internet dependant for gaming now and most stuff won`t run without the Playstation Network which is free. This internet updating tool from SONY keeps both FAT and SLIM healthy, for PS3 browser and gaming purposes. That is the focus, sorry. So the computer will get updated unless you simply disconnect it from the telephone line.
scuzz
That all sounds great accept that it is mostly made up. "The PS3 has moved on and the hardwear like my original FAT is now out of date." is, once again, purely subjective. As a matter of fact, a month ago Sony stated it was committed to supporting Other OS on the legacy models:
http://lists.ozlabs.org/pipermail/cbe-oss-dev/2010-February/007202.html
I support SONY for their gaming console, always will.
This sentiment is actually quite scary! You go right ahead and worship your corporate overlord. Sony is a faceless, soulless, transnational corporation with no love for customers, simply profit. You are probably correct though, that Linux users who also use the Playstation Network are probably a miniscule minority. Whether Sony's behavior is legal or not, I'm sure they have nothing to fear from us.
As a member of the super-majority I'm sure it's easy to tell the minority to suck it up but one day you'll be the minority; yelling from your little soap box while the majority tells you to suck it up and get back to suckling the teet of Sony.
-
I got my PS3 40gb on March 28th now I was going to install Linux onto it, but F**** I cant now, thanks Sony, thanks a lot.
-
Ah well if it's any consolation, Sony have had a tough fight this generation and seem to have a death wish by alienating users every chance they get.
First it was bad pricing and the backward compatability issues, then lack of software and prolonged development cycles...
I doubt they'll ever see the success they had with PS2 repeated.
-
@ zosodk69: you might be surprised, but in every minority there are also those who really do suck up and don't whine in the first place. Not that in this case there is anything wrong with complaining, just don't generalize.
-
@ zosodk69: you might be surprised, but in every minority there are also those who really do suck up and don't whine in the first place. Not that in this case there is anything wrong with complaining, just don't generalize.
But people if they are in the majority or minority shouldn't just bend over and get fd in the a. The more people take it the more it will get done to them in all aspects of life
-
I think them doing this is a reall bad business move. You can get an xbox 360 for 1/3 the price of a ps3 and the games are just as good. Many nerds pay the extra money to get the linux option. It makes for a wonderful computer for your living room to check mail between games, play music, play dvds or divx videos.
As far as the comments about performance. If you tried doing something like rendering a full quality hour long home movie on your ps3,you may see why so
many people rave about linux on ps3. If the video app supports multiple
processor rendering, its absolutely lovely to use.
Steven
-
Actually the price of PS3 slim is very close to the price of X360 Elite (at least it was when Slim was introduced). And all those things you mentioned you can do on a PS3 even without Linux. Of course, I understand that having Linux on it can be useful, I'd probably install it too if it was still possible.
-
I just went through the update and SONY give you the option not to accept the update. They explain exactly what will happen if you accept the update and they warn you of the consequences of updating if you run LINUX on the PS3. So I don`t see how anyone can complain. Its a simple choice ... if you want to use the machine as an entertainment console then accept, cus without it you will not be able to log into the Playstation Network... and play games that sychronise trophies such as Bayonetta.... OR if you want to run daisy chain LINUX etc then dont agree. Your not forced to agree to the update. ITS NOT AUTOMATIC.
I just agreed cus I really want to use the full potential of my PS3 as a games console. Others can use it as they please. You could always get a SLIM for games and a FAT for LINUX. Really don`t see what the name calling is all about.
-
Actually the price of PS3 slim is very close to the price of X360 Elite (at least it was when Slim was introduced). And all those things you mentioned you can do on a PS3 even without Linux. Of course, I understand that having Linux on it can be useful, I'd probably install it too if it was still possible.
The XBOX Elite comes out just a touch more expensive cus you really need the recharger for the batteries for the controller, and XBOX Live isn't free. In the end my XBOX Elite cost more than the PS3 Slim. More annoying is that it turned out to be inferior to the PS3... and all the hype about Bayonetta being better was unfounded. The interface is junk. I put the thing straight back in the box and cancelled my WindowsLive account.
scuzz
-
I just went through the update and SONY give you the option not to accept the update. They explain exactly what will happen if you accept the update and they warn you of the consequences of updating if you run LINUX on the PS3. So I don`t see how anyone can complain. Its a simple choice ... if you want to use the machine as an entertainment console then accept, cus without it you will not be able to log into the Playstation Network... and play games that sychronise trophies such as Bayonetta.... OR if you want to run daisy chain LINUX etc then dont agree. Your not forced to agree to the update. ITS NOT AUTOMATIC.
I just agreed cus I really want to use the full potential of my PS3 as a games console. Others can use it as they please. You could always get a SLIM for games and a FAT for LINUX. Really don`t see what the name calling is all about.
really i don't believe you just suggested buying a ps3 again to keep the functionality intact on your current ps3? i mean come on just because you have no issue losing that functionality don't make everyone like that. and not everyone can afford to keep buying a ps3 to maintain the status quo.
honestly they could have created separate firmware for each model. this would make the current iteration more secure while leaving the function in place for the people that want/ need it.
imagine buying a laptop and the company making it disabled the dvd drive for watching movies on a mandatory bios update. would you be just as passive about that? would you admit the laptop wasn't made to watch dvds suck it up and go buy a real dvd player?
@the whiner complainers
i understand where you are coming from. personally i have no use for consoles in general. but at least attempt to see it from the other side too.
-
really i don't believe you just suggested buying a ps3 again to keep the functionality intact on your current ps3? i mean come on just because you have no issue losing that functionality don't make everyone like that. and not everyone can afford to keep buying a ps3 to maintain the status quo.
honestly they could have created separate firmware for each model. this would make the current iteration more secure while leaving the function in place for the people that want/ need it.
imagine buying a laptop and the company making it disabled the dvd drive for watching movies on a mandatory bios update. would you be just as passive about that? would you admit the laptop wasn't made to watch dvds suck it up and go buy a real dvd player?
@the whiner complainers
i understand where you are coming from. personally i have no use for consoles in general. but at least attempt to see it from the other side too.
Yes I am.... I don't agree that the SLIM and the FAT should be treated any differently. SONY are simply updating the machine to perform no doubt as a more stable and safe product in line with the SLIM. It is for SONY to decide how they best do this, and buying the machine to utilise their PlayStation Network they can impose how the software runs. The fact that you want to run the PS3 outside of the Playstation Network is your choice. Its free so whats the big deal. If you don`t want PS3 Network functionality then don`t update.. it is a simple as that. But why on earth would you lumber the 99 percent of all PS3 gamers with a fix to satisfy a group of people that may ' may ' just compromise the gamiing OS. Don`t get it. And yes go get another PS3 SLIM, or Elite if you are unhappy and wanna use the PS3 Network but keep LINUX... Its only about trophy synchronisation generally and the modern gaming requirements. My gaming is, has, will always be very important to me as it is to loads of folk. LINUX however, can be run on anything, as I understand. Never use it.
The gaming world will not care.
PS: SONY had big problems on February 28th with the FAT only model cus of the variations betwen the two machines. If this fixes problems like that then thank goodness.
-
Sony didn't need to screw with the linux support, it has no effect on their bottom line and has no effect on their network and no effect on the gaming experience. When they launched the device they pimped linux support and lots of folks bought it because of that, now they're flipping those customers the bird. Most of the folks who ran linux on the device also bought games too. Now they have to buy another PS3, one for games, and one for hobby stuff and a few of those are using the machines for educational work.
For those who make comments about how Sony has the right to do this, or how the PS3 is just a games machine and therfore anybody using the device for anything other than games can stuff it, I hope you cry when your favorite game gets net play support dropped because it's not making money any more. And please, don't complain about it on the forums.
-
I don't agree that the SLIM and the FAT should be treated any differently.
Accept the FAT was advertised to include Other OS functionality and the SLIM isn't. They're two different products with two different advertised feature sets. Fail.
And you're being intellectually dishonest by saying this update is optional. By declining this update you're no longer able to participate in online gaming. You're unable to watch future bluray titles which may require a firmware update. You're unable to play games that mandate the new firmware. Fail.
This isn't unique to this board, I'm seeing this sentiment all over the Internet! I find it shocking that people are so anxious to rush to Sony's defense. These are likely the same people that walk around with brand names written in big letters on their cloths. The same people who put Apple[TM] bumper stickers on their car. "It's OK for Sony to do this, just buy a second PS3!" Buy a second PS3? REALLY???
The only people defending Sony's bad behavior are those unaffected.
-
Yes I am.... I don't agree that the SLIM and the FAT should be treated any differently. SONY are simply updating the machine to perform no doubt as a more stable and safe product in line with the SLIM. It is for SONY to decide how they best do this, and buying the machine to utilise their PlayStation Network they can impose how the software runs. The fact that you want to run the PS3 outside of the Playstation Network is your choice. Its free so whats the big deal. If you don`t want PS3 Network functionality then don`t update.. it is a simple as that. But why on earth would you lumber the 99 percent of all PS3 gamers with a fix to satisfy a group of people that may ' may ' just compromise the gamiing OS. Don`t get it. And yes go get another PS3 SLIM, or Elite if you are unhappy and wanna use the PS3 Network but keep LINUX... Its only about trophy synchronisation generally and the modern gaming requirements. My gaming is, has, will always be very important to me as it is to loads of folk. LINUX however, can be run on anything, as I understand. Never use it.
aka http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007392
First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out --
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out --
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out --
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me -- and there was no one left to speak for me.
The gaming world will not care.
and they are not speaking on behalf of the gaming community.
PS: SONY had big problems on February 28th with the FAT only model cus of the variations betwen the two machines. If this fixes problems like that then thank goodness.
no sony had big problems because they screwed up. They are just using things like that to make people want to roll over. just like sony also tried to use piracy to justify adding rootkits to their audio cds. or did you forget that. rootkits that btw caused security holes to be opened.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_CD_copy_protection_scandal
sony is out to protect sony not gamers, not consumers, not you.
-
it has been said several times by several people in this thread that the ps3 is a games console, or made for games or things to that effect.
that is not what sony is selling it as "it does everything" is their slogan and in several of the commercials as well as in some ads "is does linux" was mentioned directly.
they want this to be more than a games machine. that is why they included "other os" if someone bought a machine because of that option and the company disabled it or the entire console or any part of it becuase they refused to update sony should expect lawsuits.
this isnt important to me because i dont like sony. it might not be important to you for various reasons but the fact is sony has done something wrong here and that sucks.
personally all i wanted was a games console, i have a computer for programming and apps and internet and a player for movies, so i got a wii "it does games"
-
aka http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007392
This was EXACTLY what came to my head after reading scuzzb494's post, I just didn't know the author. Well done!
-
Bastards, all of them.
Wait, who are we talking about?
-
This was EXACTLY what came to my head after reading scuzzb494's post, I just didn't know the author. Well done!
Here's a radical thought. Rework the otheros feature so that hacking is not possible.
I can betcha this was 100% Sony America's decision. Typical American approach, closed system, closed standard, remove ps2 capability, remove linux capability, keep the costs as high as the market will bear for as long as possible.
The end result? Sony is in last place. The once impecalbe brand has fadded some.
-
Or just leave law enforcement in the hands of law enforcement. If companies like Sony spent less money seeking their own remedies--corporate vigilantism--prices would be lower and margins would be higher. There must be a win somewhere in their math, however, or they wouldn't do it. They could be bowing to pressure from studios, given the Blu-Ray functionality. (Because you know, it's not like you can't do whatever you want with a Blu-Ray disc on a PC with BD-ROM drive.)
-
Here's a radical thought. Rework the otheros feature so that hacking is not possible.
I can betcha this was 100% Sony America's decision. Typical American approach, closed system, closed standard, remove ps2 capability, remove linux capability, keep the costs as high as the market will bear for as long as possible.
The end result? Sony is in last place. The once impecalbe brand has fadded some.
maybe they are taking it down UNTIL they work out the security stuff. Until then, Resonance of Fate kicks ass. Its better than Linux.
-
http://www.mod-chip.com/ps3/infectus.html
...not long to wait perhaps.
-
So people really don't buy a console;they just pay for a lease of services that can change at the whim of Sony or whomever?
People ought to demand full refunds for Sony's breach of performance for each and every console which was sold with Sony advertising linux functionality concurrent with full use of the other services including online gaming.
I'd love to see a big class-action mega-lawsuit on behalf of ALL Sony "fat" PlayStations against Sony .It should be based on Sony's arbitrary and capricous disabling of advertised and previously functional capabilities of the purchasers' without proof of any wronging by said purchasers and seek full restoration of services,attorney fees,and compensatory and punitive damages .
Remember the Sony rootkit ? Sony deserves to be punished.
-
The best way to punish Sony is to not buy their products. Just dont.
I had a choice for highend laptop recently and automatically ignored Sony as a choice because I object their openly contemptuous marketing tactics.
Sony should stop and ask themselves how the f**k apple stole both online music and second place in handheld gaming from them when they were in both markets first? And how they went from first place in two console generations to last place overnight?
-
But are they inglorious?
Just Inglourious!
I prefer my Wii,reminds me of the early AMiGA days!
Plenty of nice games/Killer Apps (literally : Mad World), innovative interface (Motion plus & Nunchuck), and the most fun of it Homebrew Channel (http://wiibrew.org/wiki/Homebrew_Channel). I`ve already got C64 & Amiga games running on my Wii ;-)
-
why bother suing over the lack of using a free OS?
if you bought the PS3 specifically for Linux, uhhh.....
:roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:
get a computer, do the Linuxing there. Shame on you for buying an "all in one" mediacenterthing without intending to play games on it!
You should try the games! I hear they're pretty great.
-
why bother suing over the lack of using a free OS?
if you bought the PS3 specifically for Linux, uhhh.....
:roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:
get a computer, do the Linuxing there. Shame on you for buying an "all in one" mediacenterthing without intending to play games on it!
You should try the games! I hear they're pretty great.
uhh still stuck on that huh? if the ps3 was bought specifically for linux they wouldn't bother upgrading the firmware. if the firmware wasn't upgraded this wouldn't be an issue. however since this is not what it was specifically bought for, there is an issue that an advertised function has been removed.
just because you don't need this function does not make it a moot point.
-
I think you're talking about something else.
Im talking about if the person complaining bought the PS3 *only* for linux, as that would be kind of a poor idea.
-
I think you're talking about something else.
Im talking about if the person complaining bought the PS3 *only* for linux, as that would be kind of a poor idea.
the point i am making tho is if someone bought the ps3 only for linux. they should have no issues since they won't have to upgrade the firmware.
the ones complaining wants to play games,watch a bd, and use linux. not necessarily at the same time.:lol:
aka: linux is not the goal but is definitely in the picture.
-
it has been said several times by several people in this thread that the ps3 is a games console, or made for games or things to that effect.
that is not what sony is selling it as "it does everything" is their slogan and in several of the commercials as well as in some ads "is does linux" was mentioned directly.
they want this to be more than a games machine. that is why they included "other os" if someone bought a machine because of that option and the company disabled it or the entire console or any part of it becuase they refused to update sony should expect lawsuits.
this isnt important to me because i dont like sony. it might not be important to you for various reasons but the fact is sony has done something wrong here and that sucks.
personally all i wanted was a games console, i have a computer for programming and apps and internet and a player for movies, so i got a wii "it does games"
Not any more... The SLIM does not support Other OS. What you are all missing is the failure of SONY at the time of the FAT to recapture the market from Microsoft. SONY has worked hard to get the machine back on the top shelf and that has been to a greater extent due to the success of the SLIM. The FAT is dead now and the technology needs to be upgraded. SONY are focussing on the future and they are living in today. Sadly that means the 3 year old FAT is not their promoted current technology. They have had to part company with the great ideals to take on the mighty Microsoft. We need SONY to succeed or else we will condemned to a world of MS. LINUX is not mainstream, it is a specialist OS, it is totally irrelevant to the game market today. SONY has at last accepeted their true purpose for the PS3 and now it is thundering through to take control of that market. SONY do not need LINUX. They have not abandoned the FAT... They give you the option not to install the update. And if you want a LINUX PS3 ... then dont update... And if you want to play games go get a SLIM... AND SUPPORT SONY.
You really need to get up to date and see the bigger picture here and on this matter stop wallowing around in obscurity. There is a massive industry at risk here, a commercial interest by a giant that at one point was thinking of ditching gaming consoles. That cannot happen.
MS must not win....
And if you want to see just how many FATs there are still being used just check out the forums for the Monday of April 1st. Had this problem not been resolved by the Tuesday there would have been an uprising. And these guys are not using the machines for LINUX. They are like me gamers. I need my FAT up to date as all these other guys.
-
MS must not win....
Oh and why not?
It's the cheapest in the market, (mine at-least) is pretty reliableand has the best selection of games. I actually think it's the best out of the 3 and for a change Microsoft has actually made a good product. That's from someone who was an (ex) PS fanboy :lol: .
I got a PS1 back in 97/98 time and then a PS2 Jan 2001. Both where hugely great at the time but since I got the 360 before the PS3, I'm more then happy with that personally.
Anyway about the PS3 and Linux support. I think that is a bit bogus of them to do that especially as it was another reason to buy a PS3 in the first place. Still, not the end of the world at all but is yet another attempt at Sony doing what they think is best an p***ing off their customers paying hard erned cash on their hardware.
Maybe they did it because of risk of getting hacked? This is the only reason i'd be happy with, otherwise it's pathetic.
[EDIT] If reliability is an issue for the 360 then they have a pretty comprehensive guarantee, so nothing to worry about.
-
Sony should not be permitted to disable advertised features that no doubt played a part in buyers' choices;it is perfectly acceptable for Sony to stop selling new units that no longer have those features ,and which are not advertised as having those features.
Sony demanding the right to disable advertised features of any product in order to continue using services or functions the users have been promised and have been using is just wrong.
And as much as people love to bash MS,if MS can bring the best product for the market at the best price then MS deserves to win.
I do believe honest competition is good and would hate to see a world where there is only one console,one car company,one language,etc.
-
What's interesting is how quickly Sony can drop support for something they were using as a marketing hook only a short while before. It's unsubtle, and erodes any credibility they still had.
I'm all for Sony doing things like this however, as it will only alienate more consumers and in the long term that will come back to bite them.
Im glad Nintendo have dominated this generation, leaving Sony and Microsoft to scramble about trying to score sloppy seconds.
Maybe it will make them try harder next generation?
-
MS must not win....
atm i have more respect for ms than sony.
-
So, fallout so far includes systems that won't play games, systems with flakely network connections, systems that won't play Blu-Ray discs, and incompatibility with fully licensed third-party peripherals. Good job, Sony! If Sony didn't have a closed, proprietary platform, I'd have more sympathy for them.
-
Well, as most people here knows nothing and I get mad by reading some coments here ill speak up!
First off, I bought mine mostly for Linux (else i could just buy a 360), YES I can use my normal PC for linux BUT I wanted to explore the Cell CPU!
I love to code for linux and I love to code for diffrent CPU architectures! I have worked ALOT on ARM based systems and I wanted to work on the PS3.
I do it because I WANT THE CHALLANGE AND TO LEARN SOMETHING NEW! Since I can't ever afford Sonys SDK, what other choice do I have but to code for linux on the PS3?
The PS3 was marketed alot as a Multimedia all in one gaming console, then the OS part should not dissapere.
There will be a way to bypass the FW/SW protections on the PS3 anyways so why bother remove something they advertised the system with? (*chough* rockstars amount of cash spent on awfull DRM that was cracked near release)
Can you guys even imagine how many man hours that is spent on the YDL for PS3?
All that for nothing, because now you have to pick what you want to do, play the great games or use it as a Linux machine, I FOR ONE payed for both.
It's like getting a new Smartphone, and after a few months you have to pick if you want to use it as a Phone to call/text or if you want to be able to use it as a pocket Web browser, ABSURD.
Im mad. Why can't people understand that this might be a big deal for some people, because they want Linux on their PS3 for some reason? Would you be happy if you bought something like a PS3 over say a xbox 360 because of some strong points like alt OS and then it was removed, I might add that I bought the PS3 near release of the system and I payed shitloads more for it then a xbox 360 cost.
Because some of you do not understand why some PS3 owners get upset dosen't mean we are unjustified to complain.
Think how many people around the world think we amiga nuts are crazy because we do what we do! Including my wife that thinks im nuts and I spend to much money on what in hear eyes are old junk, and many of my friend who thinks im nut and just call it expensive junk, and I desperately defend the AMIGA with fists and claws.....
Think about it.
-
http://www.thinq.co.uk/news/2010/4/7/sony-update-bricks-fat-playstations/
:lol:
-
No one need update to 3.21... you can stay on 3.15 and have full access to PSN.
Check here: http://rvlution.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=123
It works.
-
No one need update to 3.21... you can stay on 3.15 and have full access to PSN.
Check here: http://rvlution.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=123
It works.
Im not willing to use my PS3 against a strangers DSN server. Atleast not untill I have fully investigated if and what kinds of exploits/bugs it can bring, also not before Aaron releases his config to the public.
Basicly his DSN server redicts me to PSN and my PS3 will think it's updated, tho somehow I can not shake the feeling this could lead to PS3 bans if Sony does something about it.
-
Set up your own DNS? Full instructions are given and it is as easy as falling off a log.
-
Set up your own DNS? Full instructions are given and it is as easy as falling off a log.
But what good will that do when games are released for higher FW versions? Also a bigger updatate to PSN and FW will eliminate this method.
-
I don't buy games that require network access (I don't play multiplayer games, obviously), so I'm good to go as long as Sony doesn't force an update. If that happens, I'll just disconnect the PS3 from the network (or prevent it from talking to Sony).
-
I don't buy games that require network access (I don't play multiplayer games, obviously), so I'm good to go as long as Sony doesn't force an update. If that happens, I'll just disconnect the PS3 from the network (or prevent it from talking to Sony).
Sorry but you do not get it :( It's the same as with the PSP, newer games that will come will require the latest firmware post the current one.
So wether you like it or not you have to get this stupid FW sooner or later :(
-
No, I have a choice. I can either buy the game for a different platform, or I can not buy the game at all. I'll then write a short, friendly letter to Sony explaining why I didn't buy the game.
-
No, I have a choice. I can either buy the game for a different platform, or I can not buy the game at all. I'll then write a short, friendly letter to Sony explaining why I didn't buy the game.
There is the problem :( We who do not want the FW update will be forced to buy the game/s for a diffrerent platform or we can just ignore the game, and that's not right at all :(
Also they can never force us to preform a FW update since we have to accept the license agreement.
But still I do not like this a tiny bit, because I do not wan't to buy another console just for a game and I do not want to miss PS3 exclusive titles, so I hope there will be a way around this.
-
I agree with you, but the best way to deal with Sony or anyone else in cases like this is to not buy their products and let them know exactly why you didn't.
-
"No, you didn't. You didn't actually cast the spell, so now there's ogres, alright"? :P
-
You can rest easy now: Geohot on the case...
http://games.slashdot.org/story/10/04/08/0439202/Geohot-Brings-Other-OS-Support-To-PS3-With-Custom-Firmware?art_pos=6
-
You can rest easy now: Geohot on the case...
http://games.slashdot.org/story/10/04/08/0439202/Geohot-Brings-Other-OS-Support-To-PS3-With-Custom-Firmware?art_pos=6
I know he is but the way Sony is handeling this impiles on how they will shit on us customers in the future with their way to solve problems.
They could just improve the FW to patch up the other OS functionallity to fix this but they took the easy way out and now with this who knows what meassures they will take in the future?
So we just have to use custom FWs in the furure and I did now want to go that road, but what choise do I have now when I use my PS3 alot for linux and cell programming?
Edit: well other then custom FWs I have to abandon the PS3 and go back to ARM architecture.
-
Edit: well other then custom FWs I have to abandon the PS3 and go back to ARM architecture.
I think that would be best , don't you.
I doubt that SONY really care about the odd one or two people using their console that want to use LINUX. As said before if you want to use LINUX don't patch and if you love the gaming either patch or just get a slim. There is no big deal here. SONY are no longer supporting The OtherOS function... I support them 100% if it means development of the PS3 as a ' games console '. Linux hackers are just proving what the issues were all about anyway... so whats the big deal.
And for those that will now refuse to buy SONY well I guess that is your loss. Again I doubt SONY will lose any sleep over it.
And as to crapping on costomers... well if the majority felt this way then SONY would be in trouble. But as I said 99% of users of the out of date kit don't use LINUX and 100% of the new SLIM users can't, and yet sales for the SLIM have accelerated away. Buyers voted with their approval of the SLIM that they were not bothered about the OtherOS. The PS4 won't support it so we move one.
scuzz
-
I think that would be best , don't you.
And as to crapping on costomers... well if the majority felt this way then SONY would be in trouble. But as I said 99% of users of the out of date kit don't use LINUX and 100% of the new SLIM users can't, and yet sales for the SLIM have accelerated away. Buyers voted with their approval of the SLIM that they were not bothered about the OtherOS. The PS4 won't support it so we move one.
scuzz
While its a few Linux hackers unfortunately your right, but what if Sony dropped the bluray movie player for security reasons, how would you feel then, when people tell you but its a games console?
Its the thin end of the wedge.
Gaz
-
People were buying PS3s just to run Linux to do massive number crunching tasks, OK maybe only in scientific communities but still, and given that unlike the 360 from Microshits the PS3 is built with quality components such activities were causing a massive loss for Sony. Also half the BluRay rips on Piratebay are probably from a PS3 with Linux (it's piss easy to copy the BD files from PS3 Linux) but they won't publicly admit that.
If you don't like it then sell your PS3 and get a 360 or Wii....trouble is then you have an inferior/more limited machine....with just as much of a locked out system made by peope with disgusting profits from monopolies selling shit products to billions of morons (Gameboy/Windows) ;)
Let's face it for Sony to make a profit on PS3 sales (not a fortune) they need to sell to people who buy lots of games....this is not your average Linux user on PS3.
-
I wouldn't be surprised if OpenCL running on cheap PC hardware/GPU spells the end to the PS3 as a HPC platform, at least.
-
PS3 Linux is quite restricted and not that amazing to be honest....once the novelty wears off you will go and use a proper computer costing a couple of hundred smackers soon enough I bet.
-
It's piss easy to rip a Blu-Ray from any system. Apart from saving face among their fellow studios, that's hardly a valid reason from removing the feature.
Some good could come out of this, though, if it leads to more secure hypervisor implementations.
-
PS3 Linux is quite restricted and not that amazing to be honest....once the novelty wears off you will go and use a proper computer costing a couple of hundred smackers soon enough I bet.
I have a computer that I have invested over 5000$ on last year, this do not mean I will use it instead of the PS3, I got my computer rigged with Linux yes BUT I want linux on my PS3 just because I want to code for the Cell architecture.
No one buys a PS3 to replace their main computer.
It's all in the thrill to learn to code for the PS3.
-
It's all in the thrill to learn to code for the PS3.
There's no thrill, only pain. If you want thrill, you're better off with a cracked open PS3.
Which is why this is a good thing :)
-
Its interesting the number of times Sony, PS3 AND Microsoft and XBOX are mentioned in this thread, yet both platforms are not leading either the home or portable console markets. LOL!
FWIW, Wii is great: enough superb Wii exclusive games, innovative control system, can play some cracking Gamecube games that I own, I can download some of the best-in-genre from the 8-bit, 16 bit and 32 bit console generations, plus homebrew. And 480p with component cables looks good enough to me, and makes the older games look better than on the original consoles. For me its gameplay that matters anyway, but I've seen some Wii games running in Dolphin at 720p, and the game textures look every bit as good as PS3 and XBOX, so its a hardware limitation of the Wii, not a software one. If Nintendo brought out a 720p version of the Wii, all the graphics whores would jump on board and kill off both Sony and MS.
-
Its interesting the number of times Sony, PS3 AND Microsoft and XBOX are mentioned in this thread, yet both platforms are not leading either the home or portable console markets. LOL!
FWIW, Wii is great: enough superb Wii exclusive games, innovative control system, can play some cracking Gamecube games that I own, I can download some of the best-in-genre from the 8-bit, 16 bit and 32 bit console generations, plus homebrew. And 480p with component cables looks good enough to me, and makes the older games look better than on the original consoles. For me its gameplay that matters anyway, but I've seen some Wii games running in Dolphin at 720p, and the game textures look every bit as good as PS3 and XBOX, so its a hardware limitation of the Wii, not a software one. If Nintendo brought out a 720p version of the Wii, all the graphics whores would jump on board and kill off both Sony and MS.
First off PS3 is more then a gaming machine, it's a great multimedia device, I can stream any movie format from my PC trough the network directly to my PS3.
Secondly, I would never ever buy a WII, a hardcore gamer cant sit and flap his arms all day long.
Third, why would I buy a machine that has the same specs as a GC that is from 2001 and has nowhere near the graphics of either PS3 or 360?
Fourth, I can watch Blue ray on my PS3.
Also we where talking about sony and using Microsofts 360 as a alternative, ut the WII is nothing Like the PS3 so how could we mention it? Yes you can play alot of games on the WII with controllers, but then I rather compare it to the PS2.
-
(http://polosbastards.com/pb/wp-content/uploads/2006/05/Warning%20bastards.JPG)
(http://epicurious.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/10/21/article107905902e7b2f700000578360_4.jpg)
-
First off PS3 is more then a gaming machine, it's a great multimedia device, I can stream any movie format from my PC trough the network directly to my PS3.
meh. plenty of cheap media players with bigger storage and networking that work better.
Secondly, I would never ever buy a WII, a hardcore gamer cant sit and flap his arms all day long.
you mean a gamer that likes to pretend he's a soldier/mythical warrior running around killing things. Some of the BEST games in any genre are Wii/Nintendo exclusives.
Third, why would I buy a machine that has the same specs as a GC that is from 2001 and has nowhere near the graphics of either PS3 or 360?
Well Wii is double the power of a GC for a start. Secondly beacsue motion control provides a unique enjoyable experinece. Third the graphics mean NOTHING if the game play is shyte. And as I said 480p looks pretty good, even on a high-def TV.
Fourth, I can watch Blue ray on my PS3.
Sure, if its important to you.
Also we where talking about sony and using Microsofts 360 as a alternative, ut the WII is nothing Like the PS3 so how could we mention it? Yes you can play alot of games on the WII with controllers, but then I rather compare it to the PS2.
The PS2 was inferior hardware to the GC, let alone the Wii.
Look, you're entitled to buy what you want, but people won't buy either a Ps3 or xbox as they do a Wii, by a big margin. The "advantages" of the PS3/XBOX you mention don't matter to many (most?) people buying consoles, the sales figures say so!
And BTW its the Wii that brought about the price crashes of the Ps3 and Xbox, coz MS and sony simply had to do SOMETHING about being smashed in the sales. And for Sony that meant giving you less and less with every release and price reduction. And STILL they can't get the sales they need to be number one. There's a message there somewhere, methinks.
-
@stefcep2
All people know that nintendo wii is for casual gamers, maybe some good ones like super mario galaxy and the other mario but people that want to play real games dont need petz, animalz, wiifits, wiimotes...
@som99
Maybe you know it, but watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-9wLWQ4-uA&feature=player_embedded
-
@stefcep2
All people know that nintendo wii is for casual gamers, maybe some good ones like super mario galaxy and the other mario but people that want to play real games dont need petz, animalz, wiifits, wiimotes...
What's a "real game"?
-
@stefcep2
I prefer to play god of war 3 (by example) than any game that you need to care about horses, cats, dogs or making brain tests, dont need wiisports or wiifits for play, if i can sports i try real life sports.
Wii its wonderfull for nintendo business but nes, snes or gamecube are better like consoles, that is not a ps3/360 vs wii war sorry.
-
@stefcep2
I prefer to play god of war 3 (by example) than any game that you need to care about horses, cats, dogs or making brain tests, dont need wiisports or wiifits for play, if i can sports i try real life sports.
Like I said, PS3/XBOX=soldier/fantasy warrior killing things games ="hardcore". Dweebs pretending to be heroes. By killing things. LOL
The horsez, catz, dogs, puxzzle games cater for a particular audience.
Many other GREAT games cater for others, including dweebs that want to be heroes that kill things, but plenty of other game genres that are just plain FUN.
Wii its wonderfull for nintendo business but nes, snes or gamecube are better like consoles, that is not a ps3/360 vs wii war sorry.
Nintendo's Wii succeeded beacsue they were smart enough to offer a new and different gaming experinece that went beyond the usual "lets put more polygons, more anti-alasing to dress up the same rubbish we've been selling".
-
could be worse, Sony could be making the PSP GO 2 hahahahaha
-
Uhhhh... my head hurts after reading this thread.
I confess that I know nearly nothing about the PS3, or Linux.... (tho, I'm posting this on my Linux machine :) )
But, I will say that Sony does have a history of removing useful features in thier products... I've personally experienced this in everything from open-reel decks to VHS VCR's....
OK, no need to start a 'my console is better than yours' tirade.....
I'd like a Wii someday..... when I can afford it, and a mod chip to play imports..... I'm a shoot 'em up fan (fanatic?) and there's some nice Japanese shmups for the Wii.
-
How about a MSSIAH v. Korg DS-10 (and Korg DS-10 Plus) comparison thread? It's kinda sorts console related. ;-) That's what I'll be up to this weekend when I have a bit of spare time.
-
Like I said, PS3/XBOX=soldier/fantasy warrior killing things games ="hardcore". Dweebs pretending to be heroes. By killing things. LOL
The horsez, catz, dogs, puxzzle games cater for a particular audience.
Many other GREAT games cater for others, including dweebs that want to be heroes that kill things, but plenty of other game genres that are just plain FUN.
Nintendo's Wii succeeded beacsue they were smart enough to offer a new and different gaming experinece that went beyond the usual "lets put more polygons, more anti-alasing to dress up the same rubbish we've been selling".
Then, amiga games like turrican, shadow of the beast and other arcader are for dweebs pretending heroes too?
Maybe if you say some of these funny games i can agree it too.