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Author Topic: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?  (Read 22567 times)

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Offline Hattig

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #29 on: August 24, 2012, 06:18:48 PM »
Quote from: commodorejohn;704993
The question is what's going to happen when the novelty wears off, tablets are no longer "cool," and people start assessing them based on their actual usefulness and not just their specs compared with other tablets


Tablets are taking off as media consumption devices. If there's anything that the TV has taught us, it is that people love consuming media. Tablets are great at this. I see no reason for them to lose popularity.

However like TVs the upgrade cycle could be quite long, because there won't be a real need for the upgraded tablets coming out, much like if you aren't itching to buy the latest SmartTV because your current one is perfectly adequate. All tablets can do is get better displays, get lighter/thinner, and get faster.
 

Offline tone007

Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #30 on: August 24, 2012, 08:02:07 PM »
Quote from: commodorejohn;704980
Tablet = laptop - keyboard - useful OS - freedom of choice in software - hard drive. Yeah, that's innovation.


Usually I can see where you're coming from, but during this line in particular you must have been drunk or half asleep.

Right, no keyboard, kind of a pain sometimes, but as for freedom of choice in software, have you seen the Android market (and to a lesser extent in terms of freedom, the iOS AppStore?)  Think Ubuntu Software Center, tons of apps you can install with one or two clicks.  Even without the tons of stuff available there, there's additional software you can throw onto these devices.

Useful OS?  Linux not good enough for you?  All the OS needs to do is run the desired apps, but if you really want to make it more like a "real" computer, you can always drop to a shell.

No hard drive?  Sure, no spinning platter, but who the hell wants one of those anymore, especially on a portable device?  Solid state storage works just fine, and throws across the room happily.  Obviously if you need terabytes of stuff in your hand at any given time you'll need something more, but as mentioned previously tablets aren't PC replacements and are geared more towards accessing content stored elsewhere.

Tablets <> PCs, right, and most of what you can do on a tablet can be done on a smartphone, sure, but if you can get past the lack of keyboard you really can get stuff done with a tablet without straining yourself.
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Offline Kremlar

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #31 on: August 24, 2012, 08:19:26 PM »
@commodorejohn
 
Quote
Tablet = laptop - keyboard - useful OS - freedom of choice in software - hard drive. Yeah, that's innovation.

Actually, it is.  It's 95% of what people want to do in a simplified, easier to use, more reliable, and less expensive package.  That's innovation.  Bigger is not always better.
 
 
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Ahh, "the cloud," that magical invention of magic wherein your data ascends to a higher plane of existence, free from the toil and suffering of this physical world, to a Gnostic sort of heaven where it is freed from the corruption of the flesh forever and exists in a transcendent state of Pure Mind. Come one, come all, to the Temple of the Cloud, to speak with your data through the Spirit Links!

What's that? You say that it's not absolved of its physical nature? That it has been spirited away to a data center in Texas? But, but, that's a real place! Things can happen to it there! Why, if the Internet weren't faster than a hard drive, there wouldn't be any advantage at all to "the cloud!"

Actually, data hosted in a true cloud is not at any single data center - the data exists in many so that no single data center failure would cause a disruption.  
 
"The Cloud" may just be a buzzword, but the reality of what it is and its advantages cannot be ignored.  Taking a photo on your phone, then going home and picking up your tablet and having it be there - that's cool, and that's made possible by "The Cloud".  
 
"The Cloud" has made it easy for everyday people to have instant access to their email, contacts, calendar, etc. - from multiple devices, all in sync.  Update your calendar on your phone and come home and your PC will have the appointment as well - all without syncing via cable.  
 
"The Cloud" has allowed people to backup their important data to an off-site location with ease.  People who probably never would have backed their data up before because they can't be bothered with manually backing up their data, swapping hard drives, taking a copy off-site, etc.
 
Are their downsides?  Sure.  Hey - I'm old school too.  I like to know where my data is, I like having my backup in my hands so I know it's safe.  But the reality is "The Cloud" has brought us so many capabilities that make technology so much more useful it's not even funny.
 
 
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Simple: I look beyond current sales figures, not relying on the assumption that things will continue forever as they have for the last two years (in which case tablet sales would outpace global population growth by something like 25x,) and consider the ultimate long-term usefulness of the thing: it is no more capable than a laptop (typically less,) not very much cheaper, and typically a worse deal in terms of power-for-money. Its sole advantage is that it's lighter, which laptops are continually working towards anyway. Eventually they will reach a saturation point of "light enough," and tablets will have no more advantages left, Q.E.D.

It may not be more capable than a laptop, but it's a heck of a lot more convenient.  My notebook sits on a shelf 99% of the time since I purchased my iPad.  The reality is that most things I want to do on my notebook I can do so much more effortlessly on my tablet.  I can browse the web in bed, or while eating lunch, or while taking a crap if I'd like.  ;)  They're instant on - so easy to pick up, tap my email icon, and read my email than grabbing my notebook, waiting for it to come out of sleep mode, opening Outlook, waiting for it to sync, etc.  
 
The lack of a keyboard sometimes stinks, but to be honest if I need to do some real work I go to my office where I have a nice keyboard, nice mouse, and dual screens.  We'll have to wait and see how Microsoft's tablet with cover/keyboard works out, but personally I don't like typing on my notebook keyboard much more than typing on my tablet's on-screen keyboard.

For me, and for many people, notebooks are getting squished between tablets/smartphones and desktop PCs.  I don't see the desktop PC going anywhere anytime soon, though people are keeping them longer and the new customer growth potential is not there so new sales growth will suffer.  People are buying tablets for their kids instead of PCs, and the family shares a PC.  I do see the notebook market shrinking as tablets advance.
 

Offline Fransexy_

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #32 on: August 24, 2012, 08:53:42 PM »
Quote from: VingtTrois;704968
+1
I would like a TABLET with AMIGA X1000 technologies inside! Is it possible? :biglaugh:


Why not? PWRficient and Xmos are low power chips, xmos is used in a few expansions gadgets for the iphone. So you say it as a joke but technically is not impossible, economically? unless you are Microsoft or Apple the only 2 companies captable of spend millions for create a need for a solution that have not a problem then no
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Offline minator

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #33 on: August 24, 2012, 09:23:56 PM »
Quote from: Fransexy_;705032
Why not? PWRficient and Xmos are low power chips, xmos is used in a few expansions gadgets for the iphone. So you say it as a joke but technically is not impossible,


It was very low power in it's day but tablets are something else altogether.  They require much lower power and PWRficient is well above that level.

It could probably be done but you'd have to reduce the frequency by a hefty margin and cut the memory speed right down.  You'd probably still need a big battery and a fan though.

The processors on the Sam boards are much more suitable for tablets.
 

Offline persia

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #34 on: August 24, 2012, 09:26:09 PM »
Simplicity is the reason tablets sell well, no mouse, no keyboard, no fancy gui, just you and your fingers and an app.
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Offline Fransexy_

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #35 on: August 24, 2012, 09:31:45 PM »
Quote from: minator;705037
It was very low power in it's day but tablets are something else altogether.  They require much lower power and PWRficient is well above that level.

It could probably be done but you'd have to reduce the frequency by a hefty margin and cut the memory speed right down.  You'd probably still need a big battery and a fan though.

The processors on the Sam boards are much more suitable for tablets.


Of course for tablet usage you have to reduce the frequency but at 1 or 1,2 GHZ surely is enough faster to compete to ARM and equal in power consumption, after all the Apple ARM chips have Pa Semi technology in it
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Offline adonay

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #36 on: August 24, 2012, 09:33:36 PM »
Quote from: persia;705038
Simplicity is the reason tablets sell well, no mouse, no keyboard, no fancy gui, just you and your fingers and an app.


My tablet came with a keyboard.
I have replaced my laptop with the tablet . I can even plug in a Hardrive or a wireless mouse and  micro  +normal sd cards.
It works great on web. Makes no noise, no heat and can do all my office work i do offshore "raports" etc.
Has a quadcore cpu that seem to handle all lesser tasks ok.
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Offline kedawa

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #37 on: August 24, 2012, 10:05:56 PM »
So how about that OS4 Netbook or that mythical FPGA super Amiga I've heard so much about?

As far as I'm concerned, anything running OS4 is an expensive novelty that I just can't justify purchasing, but an FPGA successor to the classic Amiga is an expensive novelty which I will find a way to justify purchasing.
 

Offline commodorejohn

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #38 on: August 24, 2012, 10:24:23 PM »
Quote from: tone007;705026
Usually I can see where you're coming from, but during this line in particular you must have been drunk or half asleep.
Nah, I drink in the evening, and I'd had my morning coffee by that point.

Quote
Right, no keyboard, kind of a pain sometimes, but as for freedom of choice in software, have you seen the Android market (and to a lesser extent in terms of freedom, the iOS AppStore?)
Android is better on this point, yes; centralized software distribution still makes me leery. In any case, the iOS App Store is exactly what I was talking about.

Quote
No hard drive?  Sure, no spinning platter, but who the hell wants one of those anymore, especially on a portable device?  Solid state storage works just fine, and throws across the room happily.
SSDs work just fine, yes - except that they're many times more expensive per megabyte. People brag about 64GB tablets - ooh, wow, that's over half of what my low-end laptop I purchased three and a half years ago came with!

And if you're worrying about it surviving being thrown across the room, drive technology is not your chief problem.

Quote
Obviously if you need terabytes of stuff in your hand at any given time you'll need something more, but as mentioned previously tablets aren't PC replacements and are geared more towards accessing content stored elsewhere.
See, this is what irks me about this debate: tablet evangelists keep moving the goalposts. "They're going to replace desktops," "hey, you can't compare them to desktops, they're not meant to replace them!" "They're going to replace netbooks," etc. etc. etc.

Quote from: Kremlar;705028
Actually, it is.  It's 95% of what people want to do in a simplified,  easier to use, more reliable, and less expensive package.  That's  innovation.  Bigger is not always better.
"It's 95% of what people want to do" because that's what Apple told people they wanted. Nobody was clamoring for a device that did less for more money per GB/GHz. Bigger is not always better, but a device doesn't have to be big to be full-featured.
 
 
Quote
Actually, data hosted in a true cloud is not at any single data center -  the data exists in many so that no single data center failure would  cause a disruption.
Right, of course. That privilege is reserved for man-made disasters.
 
Quote
"The Cloud" may just be a buzzword, but the reality of what it is and  its advantages cannot be ignored.  Taking a photo on your phone, then  going home and picking up your tablet and having it be there - that's  cool, and that's made possible by "The Cloud".
 
"The Cloud" has made it easy for everyday people to have instant access  to their email, contacts, calendar, etc. - from multiple devices, all in  sync.  Update your calendar on your phone and come home and your PC  will have the appointment as well - all without syncing via cable.
Yes, The Cloud frees mankind from the tyranny of Cables. And, you know, leaves you stuck depending on wifi and/or cell reception, which as we all know is omnipresent, cheaper and faster than cables, and completely reliable. BEHOLD THE FUTURE.
 
Quote
"The Cloud" has allowed people to backup their important data to an  off-site location with ease.  People who probably never would have  backed their data up before because they can't be bothered with manually  backing up their data, swapping hard drives, taking a copy off-site,  etc.
Yes, it's now easy to back up your data - because copying files to another drive was totally arcane and unfathomable, and commercial backup software totally didn't exist. Now you can back up your data over a slower connection to a service that can freely mine your data as it sees fit and probably stipulates that in its license so you can't complain about it, and is open to the Internet so a mildly clever hacker can get to it! That's progress!
 
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It may not be more capable than a laptop, but it's a heck of a lot more  convenient.  My notebook sits on a shelf 99% of the time since I  purchased my iPad.  The reality is that most things I want to do on my  notebook I can do so much more effortlessly on my tablet.
Well, that's lovely for you then.

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I can browse  the web in bed, or while eating lunch, or while taking a crap if I'd  like.
As can I, with my laptop - and I can type a response, on a real keyboard, without needing a third-party peripheral. Also I can run software from absolutely any source without needing to hack the OS to install it.
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Offline Kremlar

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #39 on: August 24, 2012, 10:51:18 PM »
Quote
SSDs work just fine, yes - except that they're many times more expensive per megabyte. People brag about 64GB tablets - ooh, wow, that's over half of what my low-end laptop I purchased three and a half years ago came with!

Reality is most people don't need the kind of storage larger HDDs are touting today. Some do, yes, but I'd venture to guess that the vast majority of people have less than 100GB of data on their home PCs and less than 50GB on their office PCs. 128GB SSDs are well under $100 now, and dropping like a rock.
 
 
Quote
And if you're worrying about it surviving being thrown across the room, drive technology is not your chief problem.

I've dropped my smartphone and tablet countless times, and with a decent case your screen is protected - I've never broken mine. Now, if it wasn't solid state it would be a different story.
 
 
Quote
"It's 95% of what people want to do" because that's what Apple told people they wanted. Nobody was clamoring for a device that did less for more money per GB/GHz. Bigger is not always better, but a device doesn't have to be big to be full-featured.

Uhh, no. 95% of what most people want to do is web browsing, email, calendar, contacts, games. All covered by a tablet or smartphone.
 
 
Quote
Yes, The Cloud frees mankind from the tyranny of Cables. And, you know, leaves you stuck depending on wifi and/or cell reception, which as we all know is omnipresent, cheaper and faster than cables, and completely reliable. BEHOLD THE FUTURE.

It's more than just cables, though that is a major reason. Do you know how many people I deal with that haven't synced their smartphones in months, then lose them? All data lost. With a cloud sync that isn't an issue. I want my calendar synced instantly so my co-workers can see my schedule - I don't want to have to wait until I get back to the office and manually sync via cable. Plus many more reasons.
 
 
Quote
Yes, it's now easy to back up your data - because copying files to another drive was totally arcane and unfathomable, and commercial backup software totally didn't exist. Now you can back up your data over a slower connection to a service that can freely mine your data as it sees fit and probably stipulates that in its license so you can't complain about it, and is open to the Internet so a mildly clever hacker can get to it! That's progress!

Actually, yeah it is. Yes, for some people copying data between drives, rotating the drives, and keeping one somewhere off-site is a big deal. Connection speed for most is not a big deal because once the initial backup is done only changed data is sent across the wire. I hear of people losing external hard drives, flash drives and smartphones all the time. I can't say I've ever heard of a decent online backup service getting hacked (like Mozy). And no, keep your tin foil in the drawer - they won't mine your data.
 
 
Quote
As can I, with my laptop - and I can type a response, on a real keyboard, without needing a third-party peripheral.

I could take my desktop to bed too, but that wouldn't be very practical. I could also carry around my notebook all day but the reality is a tablet is far more convenient.
 
 
 
Honestly it seems like you've simply reached that age where you "don't need any of that new fangled technology". Hope that never happens to me.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2012, 11:12:27 PM by Kremlar »
 

Offline Digiman

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #40 on: August 24, 2012, 11:20:20 PM »
Quote from: persia;704963
I had to check wether this was Amiga.org or OldDuffers.org, it's funny how fans of a computer that changed the world 25 years ago now piss and moan about tablets, the most transformative innovation in the computer world in the last two decades.

Wake up and smell the coffee, if there even is a netbook market in 2015 it'll be lumped in the "other" category as statistically irrelevant.


Tablet PCs from Fujitsu are great, these 8" tablets are useless for the most part. Maybe every prick who buys a Toyota Corolla buys one for every member of his family but high sales clearly have nothing to do with the worth of a product ;)

100 million morons/7.5 billion people on earth means FA to me.
 

Offline Kremlar

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #41 on: August 24, 2012, 11:23:03 PM »
Quote
I had to check wether this was Amiga.org or OldDuffers.org, it's funny how fans of a computer that changed the world 25 years ago now piss and moan about tablets, the most transformative innovation in the computer world in the last two decades.
 
Wake up and smell the coffee, if there even is a netbook market in 2015 it'll be lumped in the "other" category as statistically irrelevant.

Thumbs up!
 

Offline kedawa

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #42 on: August 24, 2012, 11:43:24 PM »
I don't understand why people are in such a rush to become dependant on a network and cloud services that they don't actually need.  The idea of having to pay for data access so that I can get my files to my device from the 'cloud' is just absurd to me.  Give me enough space to store everything I need so I don't need to get gouged by the telcos when I want to listen to an mp3 on the bus.

You want to talk about convenience?  Why can't these devices sync wirelessly to my home server directly instead of using some dubious online service?  I'll tell you why: greedy tech companies want to monetize things that are currently free.  This is why I don't like android.  Sure, it's a solid enough platform, but it's controlled by a company that ultimately wants to sell advertising and services, not hardware.  The new Nexus tablets don't even have SD card slots, presumably so the user is forced to constantly shuffle data in and out of the cloud.

The funny thing is, though, I can't wait for these devices to become the standard for the average user, so that desktops can get back to being awesome workstations for geeks instead of the continually dumbed-down internet box for grandma.
 

Offline Kremlar

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #43 on: August 24, 2012, 11:47:24 PM »
Quote
I don't understand why people are in such a rush to become dependant on a network and cloud services that they don't actually need. The idea of having to pay for data access so that I can get my files to my device from the 'cloud' is just absurd to me. Give me enough space to store everything I need so I don't need to get gouged by the telcos when I want to listen to an mp3 on the bus.

Who says they're in a rush and paying for it? I'm not sure if there's big money in pay cloud services right now, outside of the corporate market maybe. Services like iCloud are offered free of charge - value adds.
 
 
Quote
You want to talk about convenience? Why can't these devices sync wirelessly to my home server directly instead of using some dubious online service? I'll tell you why: greedy tech companies want to monetize things that are currently free.

They can! Just build the software and infrastructure. I sync all my devices with my own Exchange server. I can't see a reason why someone couldn't build an app to sync data elsewhere, you just have to write the software to do it.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2012, 11:52:20 PM by Kremlar »
 

Offline desiv

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Re: Any news on future release of OS4 netbook or on Natami?
« Reply #44 from previous page: August 25, 2012, 03:25:28 AM »
Quote from: kedawa;705066
Why can't these devices sync wirelessly to my home server directly.
The security architect part of me just died a little when you said that..

;-)

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