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The "Not Quite Amiga but still computer related category" => Amiga Emulation => Topic started by: Blizz1220 on April 09, 2015, 11:18:08 AM

Title: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on April 09, 2015, 11:18:08 AM
... and are working hard to create compelling new hardware :roflmao:

http://www.commodoresmart.com/

Since they claim to be SMART(tm) this should be fun at least :)
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: jj on April 09, 2015, 11:57:18 AM
Uk  company as well .  interesting
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: spudje on April 09, 2015, 12:03:19 PM
Wow, android phones.... :hammer:

So we will see two (revived) companies, who both once revolutionised computing in their own way, battling each other in the margins of the market, Palm vs Commodore.. :angry:
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Ral-Clan on April 09, 2015, 12:36:42 PM
Either this "company" ripped off this industrial designer's fantasy Commodore 64 phone mock-up images:

http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2015/02/a-commodore-64-smartphone-is-what-your-retrocomputing-soul-craves/

or this is a fake site put up by that very same industrial designer to showcase his fantasy phone.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: spudje on April 09, 2015, 12:39:41 PM
Or.. somebody actually retrieved the rights to build a phone conform the design and also bought commodore trademarks...

At least we have another enjoyable chapter in the Commodore soap... sit back and enjoy (the popcorn).
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Matt_H on April 09, 2015, 12:51:45 PM
Popcorn indeed. Amiga-news.de has more (http://amiga-news.de/en/news/AN-2015-04-00018-EN.html) on this.

They changed the logo again, too. I think the previous iteration of Commodore italicized it, this time "ommodore" is aligned with the middle of the C instead of flush with the bottom. I wonder if this is just someone being "creative" or if there's a legal reason.

Either way: an Android phone with some Commodore inspired stylings. Yawn. It reminds me more of Commodore's forays into the PC clone market than any of their "real" systems. Gonna need some far more exciting software for me to be interested. How about Sailfish?
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: AndyFC on April 09, 2015, 01:43:06 PM
This company is registered at the same address:
http://www.londonpresence.com/about-us/

Basically a forwarding company. Commodore Smart could be based anywhere!
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: alphadec on April 09, 2015, 03:00:08 PM
Quote from: Blizz1220;787595
... and are working hard to create compelling new hardware :roflmao:

http://www.commodoresmart.com/

Since they claim to be SMART(tm) this should be fun at least :)


and here is a new amiga!, enjoy!. :)

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Amiga-Sentio-BR-Series-27-All_115005421.html
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on April 09, 2015, 03:10:47 PM
Okay , scam confirmed , thank you all :)
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: alphadec on April 09, 2015, 03:49:50 PM
Quote from: Blizz1220;787608
Okay , scam confirmed , thank you all :)


This is what happens when Bill.MCe are licencing our brand "amiga" to any who can pay.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Rob on April 09, 2015, 06:10:11 PM
Quote from: Blizz1220;787608
Okay , scam confirmed , thank you all :)


I've often wondered if the iContain deal was just a shell game to get Barry to cough up some extra money.  If you remember CUSA originally only had exlusive rights to make Amiga branded all in one keyboard computers and later Barry was saying that he had a license that granted exclusive rights to Amiga branded computers.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on April 09, 2015, 09:21:50 PM
No idea what that "All rights reserved" means.

http://www.commodorecorp.com/ should hold C=
trademark.

Looking at their site tells what they do with it
just try to browse.

EDIT:
This is the company that designed it :

http://givingshape.blogspot.com/2015/02/commodore-smart-new-concept.html
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: agami on April 10, 2015, 03:13:40 AM
Because what the world needs, is another smartphone running Android.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: slaapliedje on April 10, 2015, 05:11:35 AM
I vote we just get a sticker making setup and start sticking the boing ball on everything.  I want some 'Amiga' Tires on my car.

I agree with Matt_H, at least put Sailfish on it or something.  It isn't like there aren't already a billion crappy android devices.

slaapliedje
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: James2002 on April 10, 2015, 05:22:33 AM
I think there is branding issue with that. I wont be surprise if the worthless Commodore international  sues their asses. My problem with Commodore International is that they are not doing anything with the brand name.  I think it get silly on people trying to revive the name.  It don't even have the proper trademark either. If they going to use the Commodore trademark they have to get permission from Commodore International.

If I was only into programming and electronics I could make a off the shelf computer. LOL I could put some fake badges on it LOL
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: ChuckT on April 10, 2015, 03:57:43 PM
Quote from: Blizz1220;787621
No idea what that "All rights reserved" means.

http://www.commodorecorp.com/ should hold C=
trademark.

Looking at their site tells what they do with it
just try to browse.

EDIT:
This is the company that designed it :

http://givingshape.blogspot.com/2015/02/commodore-smart-new-concept.html


It looks pretty but it is just another Android phone to me.  I'm looking for new hardware and have been buying books on ARM processors so my plan is to be a producer and not a consumer unless I am buying raw tech.  The maker and D.I.Y. movement has more going on right now so join the maker movement.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Duce on April 10, 2015, 05:38:46 PM
That's perhaps the most hideous looking smart phone I've seen in years.

And I say that as someone who owned a Blackberry Storm, lol.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Ral-Clan on April 11, 2015, 01:36:32 PM
The funny thing is that the designer of this phone says he based it on the look of the C64. I don't see that at all....maybe there are some elements of the Commodore tank mouse, but thats more connected with the Amiga than the C64.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: QuikSanz on April 11, 2015, 07:18:13 PM
I think I'll stick with the Galaxy Mega.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: ferrellsl on April 11, 2015, 08:28:52 PM
Bad business move.  Why christen your company with the name of a failed enterprise?  That's like naming a new cruise ship the Titanic.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: James2002 on April 12, 2015, 05:08:10 AM
Quote from: ferrellsl;787688
Bad business move.  Why christen your company with the name of a failed enterprise?  That's like naming a new cruise ship the Titanic.


They want to walk on water. Slowly sink to the  bottom of the sea.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Rob on April 12, 2015, 07:16:23 AM
Quote from: ferrellsl;787688
Bad business move.  Why christen your company with the name of a failed enterprise?  That's like naming a new cruise ship the Titanic.


There was an Aussie billionaire planning to build a replica Titanic but I just read that it is on hold because he is having financial difficulties.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: EvilGuy on April 12, 2015, 08:26:47 AM
Quote from: ferrellsl;787688
Bad business move.  Why christen your company with the name of a failed enterprise?  That's like naming a new cruise ship the Titanic.


They've already got a bit of free publicity amongst some die-hards..
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: stefcep2 on April 13, 2015, 02:03:36 AM
Quote from: Rob;787709
There was an Aussie billionaire planning to build a replica Titanic but I just read that it is on hold because he is having financial difficulties.


He won a seat at the last Federal election and is now a sitting MP.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: spudje on April 25, 2015, 11:23:49 AM
The website is down already. I didn't even finish my popcorn...
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: James2002 on April 25, 2015, 03:03:49 PM
Quote from: spudje;788383
The website is down already. I didn't even finish my popcorn...


I guess there was legal threat against them. That's why it got taken down so fast.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Karlos on April 25, 2015, 04:35:20 PM
Comoodore?

I thought the Gateway era was almost legend by now?
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Vlabguy1 on June 27, 2015, 03:56:56 AM
Quote from: James2002;788389
I guess there was legal threat against them. That's why it got taken down so fast.


Is the site back up??
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Lurch on June 27, 2015, 06:49:54 AM
The website never went down, it's still there :-)
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Lurch on June 27, 2015, 06:52:58 AM
They are going to be releasing a C=64 inspired phone. What a joke. There is even one called  pet ;-)

Just check out their FB page.

https://www.facebook.com/cbm.commodore/videos/1600675900172788/
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on June 27, 2015, 11:21:41 AM
Yes , and it's plain black with Android nothing like the ugly
Amiga mouse design but it looks just like regular phone with
C64 Logo engraved on it.

More interesting is to see will it see the light of day considering
they decided to ignore whomever claims Commodore trademark
and are happily going along.I don't think they will make anything
remotely interesting ever though.

Someone who has a Facebook could tell them that handheld C64
like Gameboy would probably be a lot more interesting.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Vlabguy1 on June 27, 2015, 03:16:21 PM
I honestly would buy the phone...put a decent camera on it and I'm in... Just carries my love for retro stuff.

Rich
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: MiAmigo on June 28, 2015, 02:55:11 AM
So...this isn't that company that's selling bogus C=64s made from old intel i7 parts? I need a score sheet to keep track of all the Amiga and Commodore entities!:confused:
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: number6 on August 12, 2015, 11:07:55 PM
@thread

Opposition filed (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=40&viewmode=flat&order=0#766183)

more (http://www.amiga-news.de/en/news/AN-2015-08-00032-EN.html)

#6
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Pyromania on August 12, 2015, 11:30:33 PM
This is Barry interesting.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: eliyahu on August 12, 2015, 11:46:29 PM
@number6

so then the notion that these guys had permission to use the commodore marks is now finally refuted?

edit: never mind. from a press release (http://www.ukprwire.com/Detailed/Technology/Infringement_COMMODORE_trademark_by_CBM_ltd_UK_358550.shtml):

Quote
Recently, various computer magazines and other news agencies announced  that Commodore Business Machines Limited in the United Kingdom  is planning to market one or more mobile telephones under the COMMODORE  trademark.

C=Holdings B.V. hereby announces that it has not granted any rights to  CBM for making use of the COMMODORE trademark, nor that C=Holdings B.V.  has any involvement in the development and marketing of its products.  C=Holdings B.V. will vigorously defend its rights in this matter.
quelle surprise.

-- eliyahu
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Oldsmobile_Mike on August 13, 2015, 12:19:33 AM
:laughing:
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: psxphill on August 13, 2015, 01:32:40 AM
Quote from: Pyromania;793853
This is Barry interesting.

What do you mean by that?

http://www.zdnet.com/article/barry-altman-ceo-of-commodore-usa-passes-at-age-63/
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: orb85750 on August 13, 2015, 04:10:31 AM
Quote from: ferrellsl;787688
Bad business move.  Why christen your company with the name of a failed enterprise?  That's like naming a new cruise ship the Titanic.


I can't wait to get the new Colecovision phone.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Duce on August 13, 2015, 04:15:28 AM
If people are hell bent on showing their "Commodore patriotism", save yourself the trouble and just get one of the new Moto phones with "Commodore" engraved on the back case cover.  The new Moto G and Moto X are terrific phones and the lower end model is not only cheaper, but about 2x the phone this hokey "Commodore" phone is.  Remember, this phone these guys are trying to flog you is just a rebadged Chinese phone that you can find online for half the price, but hey, if you want to pay 2x for a low end phone for a Commodore screened on logo (that's optimistic, I wouldn't be surprised if it's actually a decal/sticker anyways), she's a free market world.


A Moto phone with Commodore engraved on the back is about as legit as this C= phone is, it seems, lol.

http://tinypic.com/r/10hreqv/8
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on August 13, 2015, 06:05:15 AM
Yes , I agree with Duce.

What I want to see out of this is will someone fight Aros ROMS that are
used for emulators and if even older copyright troll company with no
products but much legal expertise will be able to prove they are the
rulers of word "Commodore".

As for the phone I'm pretty sure that someone out there will buy it
(power of mass marketing) and I would be even willing to bet that it
will be sold in more than 200 less than 2000 units.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: gertsy on August 13, 2015, 10:08:15 AM
Quote from: Rob;787709
There was an Aussie billionaire planning to build a replica Titanic but I just read that it is on hold because he is having financial difficulties.


And now I'm gonna have to think of a new name. Why didn't someone tell me it sank...!
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: whabang on August 13, 2015, 12:37:32 PM
Domain registered through an Italian registrar and hosted by an Italian company. Admin contact, Massimo Cangiani.

Yeah, looks legit. :laughing:

EDIT: Because of the UK address - no offence meant to the Italians. :P
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: whabang on August 13, 2015, 12:44:01 PM
I asked the registrar to have a look at the domain name owner. Should be interesting to see what happens. :D
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: VingtTrois on August 13, 2015, 04:59:14 PM
@eliyahu: :banana:

Quote
That’s where things stood until March, when Massimo Canigiani and Carlo Scattolini registered Commodore Business Machines Limited in the UK. The Italian entrepreneurs claim to have acquired rights for the brand and trademark in the mobile industry in 38 countries, including the US.

http://www.wired.com/2015/07/commodore-smartphone/
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Yasu on August 13, 2015, 11:56:33 PM
Why do we even care? It could just as easily be called the Pepsi Phone, The Mazda Phone or the Communist Party of Chine Phone for all I care.

It's a generic smartphone running Android. Nothing exciting going on here.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Duce on August 14, 2015, 04:43:40 AM
No, it's not exciting, or even vaguely relevant, even.  It is just another low end Android phone with a decal or screened logo on it.  But...

In a hobby where a lot of people would buy a used roll of bathroom tissue in the name of "supporting Commodore" if it had the Boingball printed on it, it is pretty important to mention potential cash-grabs, esp. when it involves legal issues in regards to licensing.  We've had "noble companies" grave robbing the marque for years now, so this isn't anything we haven't seen before.  That hasn't kept people from opening their wallets for overpriced, underpowered and questionably licensed stuff before, though.

It's a cheap Android phone - available for a hundred bucks on Alibaba.  With a C= logo on it that apparently the sellers never bothered properly licensing.

There was a fair number of people here even on A.org willing to throw $400 at this phone in some vain attempt at retro chicness, or otherwise honoring the memory of a once great company, or simply reliving some of their youth spent with the real C= machines.  Whatever the reason, it's pretty important to know that this is just another scam cash grab.

It's a free market.  If overpaying for a low end phone to a company that seemingly never did the proper legalwork in regards to trademark licensing gets you off, buy the phone.  I'd honestly be curious to see how happy people are with it, because the hardware itself under the "real" name (Orgtec WaPhone) gets paltry reviews at best.  I doubt a screened on Chickenlips logs will change that much :)

Me, I'll stick with my new LG G4.  My boingball wallpaper and Amiga emulators give me all the Amiga "fix" I need on it, and such things didn't cost me a thin dime past what I paid for the phone ($200 on 2 yr contract, $45 a month contract costs, unlimited text/voice, 10 GB data).
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: whabang on August 14, 2015, 01:48:14 PM
Trademark application opposed.
https://oami.europa.eu/eSearch/#details/trademarks/013930276
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: TheMagicM on August 14, 2015, 02:04:42 PM
Quote from: whabang;793914
Trademark application opposed.
https://oami.europa.eu/eSearch/#details/trademarks/013930276


LOL.   Excellent.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Paulie85 on August 15, 2015, 01:09:14 AM
Quote from: Duce;793896
No, it's not exciting, or even vaguely relevant, even.  It is just another low end Android phone with a decal or screened logo on it.  But...

In a hobby where a lot of people would buy a used roll of bathroom tissue in the name of "supporting Commodore" if it had the Boingball printed on it, it is pretty important to mention potential cash-grabs, esp. when it involves legal issues in regards to licensing.  We've had "noble companies" grave robbing the marque for years now, so this isn't anything we haven't seen before.  That hasn't kept people from opening their wallets for overpriced, underpowered and questionably licensed stuff before, though.

It's a cheap Android phone - available for a hundred bucks on Alibaba.  With a C= logo on it that apparently the sellers never bothered properly licensing.

There was a fair number of people here even on A.org willing to throw $400 at this phone in some vain attempt at retro chicness, or otherwise honoring the memory of a once great company, or simply reliving some of their youth spent with the real C= machines.  Whatever the reason, it's pretty important to know that this is just another scam cash grab.

It's a free market.  If overpaying for a low end phone to a company that seemingly never did the proper legalwork in regards to trademark licensing gets you off, buy the phone.  I'd honestly be curious to see how happy people are with it, because the hardware itself under the "real" name (Orgtec WaPhone) gets paltry reviews at best.  I doubt a screened on Chickenlips logs will change that much :)

Me, I'll stick with my new LG G4.  My boingball wallpaper and Amiga emulators give me all the Amiga "fix" I need on it, and such things didn't cost me a thin dime past what I paid for the phone ($200 on 2 yr contract, $45 a month contract costs, unlimited text/voice, 10 GB data).




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCBOp-4U8OM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCBOp-4U8OM)


!
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Duce on August 15, 2015, 04:25:05 AM
I'm not stopping anyone from buying one, Paulie.  I've been called a D*ck, and far worse, today alone.  :)  My apologies if I am coming off as patronizing to anyone sincerely interested in a "badged" device like this.  It's a free market, and all that.

What gets me mostly is news sites like Wired and their original article on this device that read like ad material.  Wired should be ashamed of the initial article they wrote on this.  A noobie copy intern would have wrote a better researched article.

No one bothered to dig into the fact it *is* a rebadged China phone at 2x+ the price.  It's easy to identify what the device actually is, a WaPhone.  No one at Wired bothered to check the legality of the license this new company has.  No one at Wired bothered to take into account that these guys had already reportedly screwed over a quite well known designer over what was quite frankly (the C64 phone mock up), an abortion of a design.  The whole article was linkbait solely written to get all the C= aficionados all worked up and thinking Commodore was back, ready to save the marque and brand and restore the grand hope of The Faithfuls.  One of which I am.  it was easier for Wired to take the lowbrow clickbait route, and Wired usually isn't too bad in that regard.  A bit of a let down is all, and I say that as someone who has subscribed to the print version of the magazine since the first issue 20+ years ago.  A subscription I won't be renewing.

It's a low spec phone.  If you are after a low to low/mid range at best - specc'ed Android phone, you can get one for $70 off contract that has similar specs from any US carrier.  S4's and S5's are even going for free these days with a contract on my own carrier, and despite the age, far better devices.  These C= phones are what I'd consider "burner phone" specs for $400.

Just do your homework and look past the write up on Wired, is all I suggest.  if the device suits your needs and is something you feel you want to support, the $400 cost or nothing I say is going to stop anyone.  But I do believe in truth in advertising, and it's my own opinion the device and company as a whole is just another one of the cash-grabs we're unfortunately so accustomed to in this scene.

I just don't like seeing anyone taken for a ride due to fond memories of their computing youth over what's really just a $400 screened on (decal maybe?) logo when you can buy a far better device for half the price, and in fact, you can buy the same phone sans Chickenlips logo for $100.

Anyone that does get one, please do post a review.  Do your homework on MediaTek chips before buying, though.  I say that as someone who's currently using a MediaTek chipped phone (Alcatel, mind you, not an Orgtec) as a paperweight.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on August 15, 2015, 08:04:53 AM
@Duce

Well if you got a lot of complaints that means you must be
doing something right :roflmao:

I have a friend who is journalist and many a times he would
write inspiring articles about places he never even visited.
Journalists usual response to these kind of things is inviting
person(s) of importance to an interview and if you have two
sides both will claim they are the only one right , reading
between the lines doesn't help there.

There was no confirmation of Aros team helping this in any
way on forums and apart from authors of emulators to be
used these new people declare to be C64 and Amiga fans but
fail to show much facts for it apart from "Commodore is cool -
retweet this".
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: number6 on August 16, 2015, 09:27:51 PM
@thread

Quote
Cloanto on CBM/Amiga Copyrights

 Cloanto confirms that it has not granted any rights for making use of CBM/Amiga copyrights in recently announced smartphones.

 Aug. 16, 2015 / PRZen / LAS VEGAS -- Cloanto Corporation is the holder of the international copyrights for all copyrighted and copyrightable works created by the original Commodore/Amiga companies up to 1993, as recorded at the United States Copyright Office. These include ROM, operating system, boot code, application software, documentation, multimedia and other components as included in licensed packages such as Amiga Forever and C64 Forever.

Recently, some publications and news agencies reported that "Commodore Business Machines Ltd" (United Kingdom) might be selling, planning to sell or collecting money for orders of smartphone devices that claim to include software emulations of the PET, C64 and Amiga computers.

For the avoidance of doubt, Cloanto hereby confirms that it has not granted any rights to said UK company for bundling or otherwise distributing the original, copyrighted ROM and OS software code used by the PET, C64 and Amiga systems and their emulations.

etc.

Source (http://www.digitaljournal.com/pr/2645462)

#6
Title: Cloanto on CBM/Amiga Copyrights
Post by: Pyromania on August 17, 2015, 02:01:52 AM
News from Digital Journal

http://www.digitaljournal.com/pr/2645462

"Aug. 16, 2015 / PRZen / LAS VEGAS -- Cloanto Corporation is the holder of the international copyrights for all copyrighted and copyrightable works created by the original Commodore/Amiga companies up to 1993, as recorded at the United States Copyright Office. These include ROM, operating system, boot code, application software, documentation, multimedia and other components as included in licensed packages such as Amiga Forever and C64 Forever."

Click on link above to go to complete article.
Title: Re: Comoodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: OlafS3 on August 17, 2015, 10:26:34 AM
Quote from: number6;794021
@thread


etc.

Source (http://www.digitaljournal.com/pr/2645462)

#6

noone needs for that material from Cloanto...
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: spudje on August 17, 2015, 03:03:59 PM
This is turning into a nice soap :D

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CMecDaRW8AAiBoN.jpg)
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: eliyahu on August 17, 2015, 05:07:27 PM
@thread

looks like the tech 'press' is starting to pick up the story. via number6 at AWN (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=60&viewmode=flat&order=0#766561):

Quote
It seems that the Italian bloke who wanted to release a Commodore phone might be in a little hot water with people who own the trademark.

Italian Massimo Canigiani declared himself as the new owner of the  Commodore trademark. His newly established British based "Commodore  Business Machines Ltd" was going to sell Commodore Smartphones to retro  enthusiasts.

 It now appears that Canigiani didn't actually acquire the existing  trademark, he simply tried to have a new one registered. The application  is available publicly in the European trademark database but now it is  listed as "application opposed."
http://www.techeye.net/mobiles-2/commodore-phone-in-trademark-war

-- eliyahu
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: OlafS3 on August 17, 2015, 05:24:05 PM
Quote from: eliyahu;794072
@thread

looks like the tech 'press' is starting to pick up the story. via number6 at AWN (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=60&viewmode=flat&order=0#766561):

 http://www.techeye.net/mobiles-2/commodore-phone-in-trademark-war

-- eliyahu

it is either becoming a soap opera or mudslinging
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: eliyahu on August 17, 2015, 05:31:08 PM
@OlafS3

it sure seems that way. at first i figured something wasn't quite right since i couldn't imagine paolo being involved with something that wasn't on the 'up and up,' but then we have his statement (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=60&viewmode=flat&order=0#766497) on AWN, cloanto's sudden insertion into the whole thing, and... i don't know what to think.

if nothing else it shows that there are folks who feel the AROS kickstart replacement ROMs are solid enough for commercial purposes. that's a good sign, at least. :)

-- eliyahu
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: OlafS3 on August 17, 2015, 05:35:24 PM
Quote from: eliyahu;794079
@OlafS3

it sure seems that way. at first i figured something wasn't quite right since i couldn't imagine paolo being involved with something that wasn't on the 'up and up,' but then we have his statement (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=60&viewmode=flat&order=0#766497) on AWN, cloanto's sudden insertion into the whole thing, and... i don't know what to think.

if nothing else it shows that there are folks who feel the AROS kickstart replacement ROMs are solid enough for commercial purposes. that's a good sign, at least. :)

-- eliyahu

one benefit at last :) and free of copyright... I hate all those "closed" or "copyright" fuss
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on August 17, 2015, 08:36:20 PM
Also the fact that some of those press releases have
legal aspects to them but most people try to simplify
them and just want to know "who is Commodore now and
what have they been doing all these years".

Regardless of the phone I like CBM as a company now if
for nothing else a moral principle.It all came down to how
people react to "legal" aspects of things.Some asked for
permissions (where there was no need) , others dropped
projects.If Commodore Corp said they will sue you if you
make T-Shirt you might decide not to but what would you
do if they wanted your house and car instead ? Would you
just hand over keys to whomever ?
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: gertsy on August 18, 2015, 08:59:35 AM
Quote from: Blizz1220;794101
Also the fact that some of those press releases have
legal aspects to them but most people try to simplify
them and just want to know "who is Commodore now and
what have they been doing all these years".

Regardless of the phone I like CBM as a company now if
for nothing else a moral principle.It all came down to how
people react to "legal" aspects of things.Some asked for
permissions (where there was no need) , others dropped
projects.If Commodore Corp said they will sue you if you
make T-Shirt you might decide not to but what would you
do if they wanted your house and car instead ? Would you
just hand over keys to whomever ?


I Agree.!
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: OlafS3 on August 18, 2015, 09:38:54 AM
on amigaworld someone speculates about that Cloanto tries to hinder the commercial use of Aros rom replacements

my answer:
Reverse engineering is permitted, there is even a windows clone reverse engineering windows and Microsoft certainly has good attorneys. They will never come through with it if they try to go against use of aros rom replacements. But it can be that they want to stay exclusive resource for commercial amiga emulation and are not happy. Perhaps others will become aware of Aros rom replacements then too and noone needing Amiga forever anymore.
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on August 18, 2015, 10:42:59 AM
Reverse engineering is allowed in some countries while it's now
allowed in others.Also , depends on what you are reverse engineering ,
if it's patented or copyrighted in US than it's now allowed but was
known to happen.

Fact that Microsoft didn't sue doesn't mean it won't if Windows clone
ever becomes a threat.Press misquoted (as usual) what Cloanto had
to say.Cloanto said that it has nothing to do with CBM and it's emulation
offering.

Important to notice here is that emulators on smartphone are not easily
confused with Amiga or C64 Forever nor are in direct competition.
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: OlafS3 on August 18, 2015, 10:50:56 AM
Quote from: Blizz1220;794147
Reverse engineering is allowed in some countries while it's now
allowed in others.Also , depends on what you are reverse engineering ,
if it's patented or copyrighted in US than it's now allowed but was
known to happen.

Fact that Microsoft didn't sue doesn't mean it won't if Windows clone
ever becomes a threat.Press misquoted (as usual) what Cloanto had
to say.Cloanto said that it has nothing to do with CBM and it's emulation
offering.

Important to notice here is that emulators on smartphone are not easily
confused with Amiga or C64 Forever nor are in direct competition.

I have just searched for the original text... so it can be seen so. The only thing I wonder why at all (at least amiga related)

the situation around the C64 roms seems even more confusing and there are no reimplementations/replacements

LAS VEGAS - Aug. 15, 2015 - PRLog (http://www.prlog.org)  -- Cloanto Corporation is the holder of the international copyrights  for all copyrighted and copyrightable works created by the original  Commodore/Amiga companies up to 1993, as recorded at the United States  Copyright Office. These include ROM, operating system, boot code,  application software, documentation, multimedia and other components as  included in licensed packages such as Amiga Forever (http://www.amigaforever.com) and C64 Forever (http://www.c64forever.com).

Recently,  some publications and news agencies reported that "Commodore Business  Machines Ltd" (United Kingdom) might be selling, planning to sell or  collecting money for orders of smartphone devices that claim to include  software emulations of the PET, C64 and Amiga computers.

For the  avoidance of doubt, Cloanto hereby confirms that it has not granted any  rights to said UK company for bundling or otherwise distributing the  original, copyrighted ROM and OS software code used by the PET, C64 and  Amiga systems and their emulations.
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Blizz1220 on August 18, 2015, 10:55:34 AM
To emulate C64 you need BASIC.ROM and KERNAL.ROM at
least so it's pretty much same situation.Some emulators had
replacements (even going so far to state that these files won't
work on real machine for legal reasons).
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: eliyahu on August 18, 2015, 02:18:52 PM
Quote from: OlafS3;794142
on amigaworld someone speculates about that Cloanto tries to hinder the commercial use of Aros rom replacements

my answer:
Reverse engineering is permitted, there is even a windows clone reverse engineering windows and Microsoft certainly has good attorneys. They will never come through with it if they try to go against use of aros rom replacements. But it can be that they want to stay exclusive resource for commercial amiga emulation and are not happy. Perhaps others will become aware of Aros rom replacements then too and noone needing Amiga forever anymore.
i seriously doubt michael would object to the use of the AROS ROMs. more likely the issue is that cloanto don't know what will be included in the software image of the phone and they wanted to clarify that any purported emulation capability of either the amiga or C64 would have to be done without their intellectual property (unless licensed). it's probably just down to a lack of communication... at least i hope.

-- eliyahu
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: OlafS3 on August 18, 2015, 02:46:07 PM
Quote from: eliyahu;794161
i seriously doubt michael would object to the use of the AROS ROMs. more likely the issue is that cloanto don't know what will be included in the software image of the phone and they wanted to clarify that any purported emulation capability of either the amiga or C64 would have to be done without their intellectual property (unless licensed). it's probably just down to a lack of communication... at least i hope.

-- eliyahu

I hope so too... up to now I have a positive view of them. Perhaps really a misinterpretation
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: number6 on September 26, 2015, 01:59:56 PM
@thread

Podcast (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=120&viewmode=flat&order=0#769210)

#6
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: number6 on October 18, 2015, 05:00:57 PM
@thread

Paolo confirms the phones have started shipping (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=160&viewmode=flat&order=0)

#6
Title: Re: Commodore Business Machines live again !
Post by: Vlabguy1 on October 18, 2015, 05:51:24 PM
Quote from: number6;797620
@thread

Paolo confirms the phones have started shipping (http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=40391&forum=2&start=160&viewmode=flat&order=0)

#6


And can anyone confirm which networks these phones are compatible with??

Rich