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Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Gaming => Topic started by: KennyR on June 03, 2003, 11:20:57 PM
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I was just thinking about some computer game landmarks. Can anyone suggest any?
What I mean by landmarks are games that defined a genre. They would not necessarily need to be the first of their kind, just the first that really pressed the genre into our collective concienceness. You don't need to like them. They don't need to be just for the Amiga. You don't even need to have played them. Just suggest some. ;-) (Note that GTA3, UT2003 and Counterstrike aren't landmarks, even if they happen to be popular today).
For example, I can give a few landmark games:
Space Invaders (landmark shooter)
The Bard's Tale (landmark RPG)
DOOM (landmark ego-shooter)
Syndicate
Grand Theft Auto
Civilisation
Populous (landmark "god game")
Any other suggestions?
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Tetris... Pong?
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Mega Lo Maina... 'Cos it was te first game that I actaully paid money for, that was a landmark... :-D
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Megalomania was good but it was not really a landmark - the Amiga market was full of god games at the time. Utopia, Populous, etc.
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KennyR wrote:
Megalomania was good but it was not really a landmark - the Amiga market was full of god games at the time. Utopia, Populous, etc.
I can't think of any other game that I bought in 1990(1?) and I still play now....
Ok, Lemmings then... :-D
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Pac Man & Tetris
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super-mario brothers(one of the first scrolling platformers) that inspired a whole heap more (love em or hate em) platformers
doom or wolfenstein 3d - which ever you think is responsible for so many first person perspective shooters
zork
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Lemmings, Tetris, Pong and Pac Man are all landmark games, definitely. :-)
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Ah, Wolfenstein - yes, that was the first ego-shooter but not really a landmark because it wasn't so impressive, and didn't really launch the ego-shooter as a game type. Its successor DOOM I would say was the landmark.
Super Mario Brothers (or just Mario Brothers at first?) is also a landmark, as is certainly Zork.
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Here goes mine in approximate chronological order:
1) Pong = Okay so it wasn't quite the first, but it's close enough for me.
2) Space Invaders = The original shoot-em-up
3) Pacman = The first cult game character
4) Elite = Exploration? Comnbat? Trading? All there and has yet to be bettered IMHO
5) Outrun = This is what I'll be spending my pennies on in an arcade
6) Tetris = Defined the puzzle genre thanks to it's simplicity and availability on many platforms
7) Xenon II = Proved games could be cool thanks to the admittedly tenuous Bomb the Bass tie-in
8) Shadow of the Beast = Set a precident for eye/ear candy over content. Sold many Amigas!
9) Mortal Kombat/Street Fighter = Defined the term "Special Move"
10) Wolfenstein = Original FPS
11) Tekken = Took the beat-em-up genre to a new level
12) Gran Turismo = Inspired thousands to buy Vauxhall Novas (old Opel Corsas) and fit howitzer sized exhausts
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Spacewar!
Donkey Kong / Mario Bros
Dragon Quest
Super Mario 64
Gauntlet
Elite
Tetris
Civilization
and a bunch of games I forgot. :-D
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It's not a computer game..... it's only computer
And that's AMIGA!!!
THAT'S a landmark for me... and you can't change it
For game how about Defender Of The Crown? Strategy mixed with Action... Superb game...
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Powermonger comes to mind.. First god/rts game in 3D ?
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Weird Dreams,For being, Well..... WEIRD!! :-D
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Nobody said anything yet about Dune 2 or Monkey Island? Hmm... I was playing Dune 2 until the next morning, wondering how I would resist during the next (boring) school hours... It started the real-time strategy genre, for sure...
And Monkey Island? I started to learn english with with it, playing a little, pausing, checking the dictionary... Ok, it didn't start anything originally, but during the time it was played, it was the greatest adventure game, something everything else was compared to...
Maybe I'm subjective, in fact, for sure I am, but for me, these games are important landmarks...
Now I'm so nostalgic, I'm pressing the submit button and getting the emulator back ASAP...
See you next morning :-)
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No. Populous came before Powermonger, and by quite a bit.
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Monkey Island was a good game, but it did not define the point-and-click adventure. I've no idea what did, but perhaps earlier games like Maniac Mansion. Remember, a landmark game doesn't need to be a good game, and not all great games are landmarks.
As for Dune2 - I'm unsure. Was it really the first RTS?
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KennyR wrote:
Monkey Island was a good game, but it did not define the point-and-click adventure. I've no idea what did, but perhaps earlier games like Maniac Mansion. Remember, a landmark game doesn't need to be a good game, and not all great games are landmarks.
As for Dune2 - I'm unsure. Was it really the first RTS?
Well, for sure Monkey Island wasn't inventing anything new, that's why I said in my post that it was for *ME* an important landmark...
About Dune 2, yes, it was the first in its genre... Just think about how many games, clones (warcraft comes to mind first), were influenced by it...
If I have to think as an impartial man, I have to say, it looks like Doom also deserves the crown.
About adventure games? Who knows, maybe Zork?
Maybe I can't see the whole picture because I got my first computer in 88, and didn't get to play Pacman, Space Invaders or Pong when they came out?
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No. Populous came before Powermonger, and by quite a bit.
Yes, but there are some big differences, Powermonger is less god more rts, and is not 3D (Well, you know what I mean, polygon stuff)
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Dragon's Lair(It's in the smithsonian w/ Pac-Man and Pong)
Civilization
Wing Commander
Wolfenstein 3-d
Speedball (for being the only fun sports type game ever made, I hate sports games)
Whatever the first of the cinemaware movie type games is
Zork
Elite
Maniac Mansion
Kings Quest
Fallout (for redefining the modern RPG)
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Double Dragon
Street Fighter II
Diablo I (now you have 20000 clones of it, even Vampire Redemption)
Starcraft (ok, it's modern but I think that it was the first time the different razes you could choose were truely different... in other games like dune2 or warcraft2 the razes were too similar and played almost the same...)
Pang
Dungeon Master
Super Mario Bros
Monkey Island (it wasn't the first, but I think that graphic adventures became quite popular thanks to this game)
Quake3 (ego shooter but with only deathmatch)
Tomb Raider (I guess Max Payne wouldn't be here without it)
I would say Half-Life, but I would put it in the Wolf3D genre...
Sim City
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One of the landmark games technically is certainly Dungeon
Master, the first real "first person" real-time game. And still
better than most of those that followed.
.
SlimJim
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12) Gran Turismo = Inspired thousands to buy Vauxhall Novas (old Opel Corsas) and fit howitzer sized exhausts
Yeah. I've heard that the next version will have a special mode where you can drive over-customised Ford Fiestas whilst playing bad Garage music very loudly along Southend seafront at 5mph :lol:
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@Crumb
Quake3 definitely isn't a landmark, IMO. Most of your others I agree with, except the newer ones I haven't played. (And popularity has nothing to do with it, as I said.)
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"Eye Of The Beholder 2", allthough the first one also was great, for me, the sequel was the landmark. Eye of the beholder was still considered one of the best games made years after its release.
"Pirates!", so many hours after hours of playing. Wow, noone have made a game like that ever since. Even the C64 version was AWESOME!!
"Kick off "&"Kick off 2" - does I have to explain why?
"Super off road", yeah, I still don´t I have completed it. To bad it doesn´t on any other thing that an a500.
I´ll be back!
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"Pirates!", so many hours after hours of playing. Wow, noone have made a game like that ever since. Even the C64 version was AWESOME!!
Whaaaaaat??? The C64 port of Pirates! SUCKED. It was incredibly slow, and liked to crash all the time. Not suprising, since the thing was written in BASIC!
One of the worst C64 games of all time, IMO. The Amiga version was so much better. Definitely a landmark in gaming. Not surprising, since Sid Meier was behind it.
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Ok, as I suspected I think some of you are confusing landmark games with your favourites. A sequel can't usually be a landmark, since it's just an advaned version of the first game! (In most cases, that is). Try to think genre.
I have another landmark that has never been surpassed - Audiogenic's Exile.
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Reach For the stars (first turnbased 4X game ever, available on Amiga, and I don't think anything else IIRC, the original that is)
Natural selection (rather recent PC game, its a half-life mod, the only combination FPS and RTS game that's worked well that I've ever seen)
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Theme Park! An evolution of Populous, there are countless clones of it flooding the market these days.
How about Syndicate? Has anyone mentioned that yet? I haven't played it yet, but I have a copy on order. It's supposed to be pretty excellent. I'll find out soon enough :-)
Megaball is still the best game of its type.
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I mentioned Syndicate in the first comment.
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what about tron cycles?
that was new and different
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KennyR wrote:
I mentioned Syndicate in the first comment.
Ah. So you did. I must be blind :-)
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Metal Gear solid (PSX) - Revolutionary game.
Tekken (PSX) - Best fighting game ever, with jaw-dropping visuals for the time.
Command and Conquer (PC) - More groundbreaking than Dune 2, imo.
Mario 64 (N64) - Best ever title available at a consoles launch.
Splinter Cell (XBox) - The best visuals I've ever seen in a console game.
Chicken Run (PSX) - Just because it was the first game I worked on and it felt good to see it in the shops :)
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Goal , Sensible soccer, cannon fodder
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cannon fodder definently
and little computer people
and the sims
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"One of the landmark games technically is certainly Dungeon
Master, the first real "first person" real-time game. And still
better than most of those that followed."
I agree, it made me buy a 1/2 meg expansion for my 500 just run it when it came out. Would add Falcon to the list. First flight sim I actually enjoyed.
Stew
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Metal Gear solid (PSX) - Revolutionary game.
Tekken (PSX) - Best fighting game ever, with jaw-dropping visuals for the time.
Command and Conquer (PC) - More groundbreaking than Dune 2, imo.
Mario 64 (N64) - Best ever title available at a consoles launch.
Splinter Cell (XBox) - The best visuals I've ever seen in a console game.
Chicken Run (PSX) - Just because it was the first game I worked on and it felt good to see it in the shops :)
You're missing my point, Leander. These are good games with stunning visuals, but what do they actually offer that was new and innovative at the time? Tekken is just a fighting game in the Streetfighter 2 mould - a very, very old genre. Mario 64 - another one in a long line of similar games (although now in 3D). The C&C RTS genre had already been brought to the world through Dune2. And splinter cell, though stunning, is basically just an ego-shooter.
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Yes but it doesnt have to be the first in the genre to be the best :)
I think C&C defined the RTS genre (more than Dune 2), Mario 64 defined the 3D platformer genre, it was truly innovative when it was released - nothing like it had been seen before. Tekken defined the 3D fighting genre, even though it was a rip-off of Sega's virtua fighter, they improved upon it and made it better than the original, and now when people think "3D fighting game" they usually think of Tekken. MGS and Splinter Cell are hard to categorize, they're more than just shooting games (Stealth'em-ups?) but I couldnt choose between the two. MGS because it was the first, Splinter cell because it raised the bar.
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But I didn't ask for the best games. ;-)
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Seems most people confuse "landmark" with "favourite" or "original".
I'll agree with Civilization, and add Elite, Will Crowther and Don Woods' original Adventure, Bruce and Roger Carver's Leaderboard, Wolfenstein 3D ahead of DOOM, Melbourne House's The Way of the Exploding Fist, and whatever the first wireframe 3D flight sim was called.
(plus a few others I can't think of right now) :-D
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what about karateka?
or law of the west
or those SSI TSR AD&D games?
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Pong
Frogger
Pacman
Super Mario Brothers
Chrono Trigger
>Squaresoft
Wolfenstein 3D
>Doom
Halflife
> EverQuest
Doom3(its not out yet but its leaked beta is incredible)
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KennyR wrote:
But I didn't ask for the best games. ;-)
You're right :) I did misunderstand completely, sorry :)
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Yeah. I've heard that the next version will have a special mode where you can drive over-customised Ford Fiestas whilst playing bad Garage music very loudly along Southend seafront at 5mph
:-D
How about bonus points for collecting cider-drinking underage girls?
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"Wings"
"Leisure Suit Larry"
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KennyR wrote:
Whaaaaaat??? The C64 port of Pirates! SUCKED. It was incredibly slow, and liked to crash all the time. Not suprising, since the thing was written in BASIC!
One of the worst C64 games of all time, IMO. The Amiga version was so much better. Definitely a landmark in gaming. Not surprising, since Sid Meier was behind it.
What are you talking about?? Now, cut the crap, before I start insulting! There must more than one version then, because the version I had was AWESOME. It wasn´t neither made in basic, didn´t crash, and had allmost all the features of the amiga version. Mine was original, this fact may have had influence.
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It's ironic that that old Psygnosis game, AWESOME, was far from what the title suggests.
No one has mentioned THE SETTLERS yet. It was the most complex god game of the time, and introduced a fully working economy. I still don't know how bluebyte managed to do it on the A500, although you do need 2MB to appreciate it properly.
LEGENDS OF VALOUR anyone? For the Amiga it was certainly unheard of to have textured 3D graphics in an RPG. It was playable as well, and quite immersive.
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Hmm... Weird... Not too many C64 games mentioned here?
But don't worry, I'm here to fix that :-)
-Paradroid
Shooter, that offered something different
-Wizball
Well, it IS quite original, yet playable.
Got also nice co-operative 2-player game
-Laser Squad
Quite simple yet good strategy game, I guess UFO drew a lot of
inspiration from this...
-Ultima series
(Enough said)
-Alter Ego
Classic text game of the ultimate adventure: Normal life
-Lode Runner
DEFINITELY classic
Then, a few classic coin-ops
-Wizard of Wor
Well, "basic" maze game, where you have to shoot all enemies.
If not first, it was at least among the first ones of its genre
(released in 1980)
-Marble Madness
Why didn't anyone mention this classic? Or did I just miss it...
This sure has been cloned almost too many times :-)
(released in 1984)
-Rampart
Nice and quite original game, borrowing bits from Tetris
Well, missed lots of classics most likely...
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What are you talking about?? Now, cut the crap, before I start insulting! There must more than one version then, because the version I had was AWESOME.
The version I had (which was the official one, AFAIK) was totally unplayable because it would crash at swordfights, which were too slow anyway, and come up with the
?SYNTAX ERROR IN LINE 10930
READY.
string. And I also remember the ZZAP64! review of Pirates! well - they said much the same thing and gave it about 30% or so, or even less. I haven't been able to find the review on the net (pirates is too common a word), but you'll have to take my word for it - or you could find it yourself. ;-)
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"Chaos" on the spectrum.
groundbreaking high and variative gameplaY.
rated as #1 game of all time on gamebroth,
a site that seems to have much about this thread's topic.
history:
http://www.stutaylor.freeserve.co.uk/ChaosGame/History2.htm
gamebroth:
http://www.gamebroth.co.uk/top100/5to1.htm
Ofcourse, there are several clones,
but the only clone worth worshipping
is Sean Irvine's on the miggy.
Then when you are done thanking for that,
its time to go further into modern times
where James Conwell and Sean Irvine
has built it into a giant in playability.
But I guess noone is interested in quality...
so just hurry on now! :)
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Many have touched on these, but I think in semi-chronological order the "landmark games" would be:
Colossal Cave Adventure
Space War
Pong
Rogue
Wizardry!
...all just IMO.
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Some has mentioned "Pirates". I actually think "Sea Dogs" (PC game) has redefined that genre. If you were into the original Pirates, you MUST try Sea Dogs.
Anyway, other titles to remember:
Space Crusade... Though I haven´t really seen that many games in that genre. It still rocks though ;-)
Cabal is also a real classic, but like Space Crusade, there really hasn´t been many games in the genre.
Someone mentioned "Double Dragon". I actually think "Golden Axe" was the first in this whole genre... Remember, Sega launched the game as an arcade game long before it was ported to the Amiga.
Apart from that, the following titles deserves at least an honorable mention:
Moonstone
Nitro
Lotus 2
Ports of Call
Pinball Dreams
Sword of Sodan
Wings of Fury (perhaps)
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Frontier elite 2 definitely.
not only superb gameplay,
but 100% lastability too.
I have the original boxed amiga version.
It has kewl manuals!
I don't think there is any space adventure/action game
around that can compete with this Goldie.
let alone within a single dd disk.
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How about:
3D Death Chase (the first driving game I saw)
Star Wars (vector graphics)
Driller (a 3D game)
Eric and the Floaters (for giving life to the Bomberman clones)
What about Manic Miner/Jet Set Willy?
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i want to add: 'Fairlight' on the C64 or spectrum
'isometric' type game
not sure if it was the first though...
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There were a few isometric games that I remember.
Head Over Heels
Batman (Can't remember the full name)
I know there's more, but I can't remember just now.
I was thinking about PaperBoy and King Kong being Landmark games aswell.
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Hmm...
I'm thinking of:
Fire Power?
Worms (although I'm pretty sure there was "Tanx"-like games before... But still, It was the first game with free movement in that genre...
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Tanx was out way before Worms, but Worms set a new standard of playability.
Worms still hasn't been beaten today :-D
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Not in any particular order
1 R-TYPE ( power ups galore )
2 Outrun ( the crash scene) Reviewed this one!
3 Space Harrier ( Almost 3D )
4 Star Wars ( I could feel the force and the atmosphere)
5 Wings ( still play it, still love it!!) Chocks away...
6 Pushover ( the puzzler that my friends found a group affair)
7 Worms ( a game that could make or break a friendship)
8 Time tunnel (C64.. I had imagination back then)
9 Street Fighter and variants( Never be Dhalsim)
10 Wizball (novel gameplay)
11 Target Renegade (anybody remember that?)
12 Super Mario 64 (Let's go for a wonder)
13 Cybernoid 1&2 (c64 the cheatmode was rude)
14 Shadow of the beast ( if anybody has MP3 remixes of the music Email me please!!)
15 Elite ( What can I say)
16 Mr do and the unicorns (To many coins)
17 Donkey Kong ( LCD version was cool)
18 Space invaders
19 Scramble (All versions)
20 Manic Miner ( MSX love child)
21 Double Dragon ( Dodgy but satisfying)
22 Operation Wolf ( Loved intro music)
23 Star Trek Bridge Commader (couldnt resist)
24 Time Crisis (Great PSX version)
25 Bruce Lee (1st game i ever completed on the commodore 64)
26 Tekken 2 (Love it)
I love games
:-D :-D :-D
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Any other suggestions?
Laser Squad.
Although they released similar game for other 8-bit computer (Spectrum? cant remember) long before Laser Squad. Years later they released similar (but of course much enhanced) game for MS-DOS: UFO - Enemy Unknown.
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Rebelstar Raiders...then Laser Squad.
But what about Mercenary - Escape From Targ? Had that on the Atari 800XL then Amiga and killed lots of time. Rates as number 1 on my list!