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Operating System Specific Discussions => Other Operating Systems => Topic started by: nikodr on January 20, 2011, 11:45:37 AM
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Ps3 was hacked.Sad days for sony.I now play my original games through my usb hds,i used geohots 3.55 firmware along with some other custom firmware.
Now we have the keys of geohot and we can sign any application and run it under gameos.
Since the portal of the homebrew world has been achieved on the game os of ps3 (and this time you dont need usb dongles),and since from what i can understand in the future the other os will be recovered (there is already a port of asbestos running on phat and slim ps3) here comes my question.:
When will the ps3 port of aros come?Ps3 has ppc,there is a ppc port of aros,now that we have homebrew,we have a very fast machine like that available to run amiga aros,
Would want to hear your opinions.
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I pass. I think AROS should stay on desktops. Why don't you port some of those homebrew games to AROS PPC instead.
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Ps3 was long advertized as having the otheros option to increase sales.So instead of being just a console for games it could be a productive machine.
So any port of an operating system is an option.
PS.Sony sucks as a company,for securtiy reasons they killed the otheros,but right now we can have it back.
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I pass. I think AROS should stay on desktops. Why don't you port some of those homebrew games to AROS PPC instead.
Thanks good that humans in the past do not said: I pass. I think humans should stay living in caves. Why don't we bringing here wild foods collected instead
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Ps3 was hacked.Sad days for sony.I now play my original games through my usb hds,i used geohots 3.55 firmware along with some other custom firmware.
Now we have the keys of geohot and we can sign any application and run it under gameos.
Since the portal of the homebrew world has been achieved on the game os of ps3 (and this time you dont need usb dongles),and since from what i can understand in the future the other os will be recovered (there is already a port of asbestos running on phat and slim ps3) here comes my question.:
When will the ps3 port of aros come?Ps3 has ppc,there is a ppc port of aros,now that we have homebrew,we have a very fast machine like that available to run amiga aros,
Would want to hear your opinions.
let us know when youve done it
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Remember the psp and gamecubes homebrew scene,we are just at the start,soon tons of applications will be ported and many things will be done.
Once there is an easy way to do cross compiling and port applications to the ps3 gameos (and i mean a standar way to do it under linux),i will try to find a way to port aros to ppc.Why not?
I think that is the future,to those who say that ps3 is only a gaming machine it is not.Sony advertized it -and i am saying this again- many years ago as having an otheros thing.
And in the end let's face it,users are in control.Sony tried to remove otheros,but the geohot exploits and custom firmwares enable us to do what we want to do in a machine that we payed so much money.
The closed source thing does no good in our ages.Let's hope that soon linux will be back on the ps3 in the form of a homebrew application,(now the only way to boot linux is via a programable usb dongle that runs asbestos)
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Remember the psp and gamecubes homebrew scene,we are just at the start,soon tons of applications will be ported and many things will be done.
There's a great media system for the Xbox, but other than that I can't think of a single other even modestly popular application to come out of console hacking. Sure, the self-satisfaction is probably a factor, but other than that what's the point?
I'd like to put this thought out there: the whole idea of running a desktop OS on a game console has very little traction and even less ROI.
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But dont you see?Ps3 ran linux quite well,it was advertized as an alternative game console :one that could be a serious computer too.With a keyboard and mouse and yellow dog linux it could do wonders.I even installed manually custom flash plugins (compile was horrible difficult to do).
ps3 is not only a game console.
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ps3 is not only a game console.
Yes... it is also a Blu-Ray player. :D
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But dont you see?Ps3 ran linux quite well,it was advertized as an alternative game console :one that could be a serious computer too.With a keyboard and mouse and yellow dog linux it could do wonders.I even installed manually custom flash plugins (compile was horrible difficult to do).
ps3 is not only a game console.
PS2 also ran Linux, and that didn't go anywhere. Not sure if you were around in the 80's, but practically every single console of the time had some kind of "computer expansion" - none ever took off.
The problem is a console just isn't the first place people are going to go for a computer, especially when you can just buy an actual computer (even laptops) for the same money. There's simply no advantage unless you're a poor college student, and even most of those seem to opt for laptops. I won't even get started on the warranty issues.
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PS2 also ran Linux, and that didn't go anywhere. Not sure if you were around in the 80's, but practically every single console of the time had some kind of "computer expansion" - none ever took off.
The problem is a console just isn't the first place people are going to go for a computer, especially when you can just buy an actual computer (even laptops) for the same money. There's simply no advantage unless you're a poor college student, and even most of those seem to opt for laptops. I won't even get started on the warranty issues.
Well i just believe that the homebrew revolution will change all that.
From a practical sense then there is no need to spend money on amigas or retro hobies?But we do spend large sums of money for our retro needs .Right?For the same ammount a ppc blizzard card costs one can buy a pc that is 10 times more powerful.But all is not like that.There is another kind of value here.
Ps3 is a powerful media console and gaming machine,having access to third party os like aros would not be bad.I believe if ppc ports exist and now that the ps3 is open all kind of posibilities are open.Also it is a cheap blue ray player.
Well certainly i understand now that companies like hyperion or the morphos team can't sell copies of their os on a port to ps3 as this would require an official acceptance from sony (and it would be expensive too).But for the homebrew community and for anything that goes under the linux way (that is gpl or open source) why not?Is sony going to sue us if we port aros to ps3?
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The Ps3 has always been able to run Linux and now in game mode we no longer have to worry about the hypervisor restricting access to the RSX.
Graphics should no be much more powerful.
But I wouldn't overestimate the power of the Cell processor. If you only take the PPE into account (and don't consider the extra power provided by the SPEs) than the processing power of the 3.2 Ghz Cell, because of its in order execution pipeline is actually lower than the processing power of the 1.8 Ghz 7447 (G4) in my Powermac.
I do think its a neat system and it offers a good performance/price ratio.
And since their is a PPC Linux hosted version of AROS already, it shouldn't be too hard to get AROS running on a PS3.
The only negative I see is that I can assemble an X86 AROS system for only a little more and that port is the most polished. But so what, we're hobbyist and I say if it can be done, why not?
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I would imagine for the cost of a PS3 you could buy a smilar powered computer.
Agreed XBMC being the only exception leave consoles to being consoles.
But you will probaly find some solace in lou_dias
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AROS already runs on PS3.
Install Linux then download the hosted version.
http://aros.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/nightly-download?20110120/Binaries/AROS-20110120-linux-ppc-system.tar.bz2
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Yes that can happen under linux,but now that the hypervisor no longer prohibits access to the rsx and 3d acceleration is possible i think an aros version running under gameos without the need to load linux.Wouldn't that be better?
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Yes that can happen under linux,but now that the hypervisor no longer prohibits access to the rsx and 3d acceleration is possible i think an aros version running under gameos without the need to load linux.Wouldn't that be better?
Have you got any experience writing graphics drivers for undocumented NVidia hardware??
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Have you got any experience writing graphics drivers for undocumented NVidia hardware??
Very good point Nicholas. That why I think Linux will probably be the best place to start with this. The hardware is undocumented, but not completely unknown. There are already projects underway to create 3D accelerated drivers for PS3 Linux.
Then Linux hosted AROS will show some improvement and then if some courageous soul want consider a full AROS port - we'll see.
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The gfx hardware in the ps3 is quite similar to a gf8600. Given time I dont think it'd be a huge stretch to get drivers written for it. The "problem" as I see it is the simple fact that it seems unlikely (and the responses in this thread support this idea) there'd be much interest in it. The only people who would be interested are those with a ps3 and an interest in AROS (or at best amiga os). Even then it'd be more of an interesting novelty than something a lot of people would use. For the same money or less a person could buy a significantly more powerful x86 AROS box, which is more practical to use as a desktop system, being that it actually is a desktop system :) Im just not sure how much money could be raised to get a port of AROS onto a system that is relying on a hack to a console. This isnt to say Im against the idea, but as I said it'd mostly just be an interesting novelty, which doesnt pay the cost of a developer porting AROS to it (assuming someone interested in doing so can be found at all). While I wasnt a big fan of the idea for OS4.x for ps3 either at least I saw why people might be interested a few years ago.
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Well, we know we're not going to see a port of a commercially available NG OS like AOS4 or MorphOS since that would place the developers in a precarious legal situation.
That only leaves AROS as a prospect on the PS3. I can't see enough interest to justify a native port, but it will be interesting see AROS run under Linux.
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People seem to forget one thing,the amount of ps3 sold over those years.I know that there are plenty of them out there,so i dont think that one should go out and buy it just to run aros,but one that already has it -and we are talking about milions of machines sold- could just install it.
See the difference?
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People seem to forget one thing,the amount of ps3 sold over those years.I know that there are plenty of them out there,so i dont think that one should go out and buy it just to run aros,but one that already has it -and we are talking about milions of machines sold- could just install it.
See the difference?
Are you capable of either coding the port or paying someone who is to do it?
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Are you capable of either coding the port or paying someone who is to do it?
For coding graphics drivers no.But if and when the required skd libraries for cross compiling are available to the users i will have no problem to setup the sdk and start porting it.I could use my ps3 to test the port.So while i cant code gfx driver,under linux i could try to port it.
Seriously i believe in the next months an explosion of homebrew will happen on ps3,and people are really close to bring back linux without the hypervisor reistricting access to 3d.
Nicholas if you remember : back there used to be some 3d graphics coding under linux and sony killed it with firmware updates,so i believe there are people out there that know.
Maybe we should try to find them.
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Just found this http://psl1ght.com/ this is what i have been looking for.It seems that it enables user to code programs that would run under gameos,that is a kind of sdk.I will try to install it along with anything else and try to go from there.
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Just found this http://psl1ght.com/ this is what i have been looking for.It seems that it enables user to code programs that would run under gameos,that is a kind of sdk.I will try to install it along with anything else and try to go from there.
Go for it. I don't think Nicholas was trying to discourage you. But if anyone want to try, again, why not?
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Go for it. I don't think Nicholas was trying to discourage you. But if anyone want to try, again, why not?
I am installing the sdk under ubuntu right now,since it is over 2.3 gigabytes of data it will sure take time,but it seems to install ok.After i manage to install the examples i will try to get aros on it.I take it that aros works under framebuffer if no 3d acceleration is found?While there is some 3d access i dont know if it is enough for it to run on gameos.In which aros forum should i post if need any help?
I want to do the port,if no gfx drivers are required i believe i can do the port.
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I am installing the sdk under ubuntu right now,since it is over 2.3 gigabytes of data it will sure take time,but it seems to install ok.After i manage to install the examples i will try to get aros on it.I take it that aros works under framebuffer if no 3d acceleration is found?While there is some 3d access i dont know if it is enough for it to run on gameos.In which aros forum should i post if need any help?
I want to do the port,if no gfx drivers are required i believe i can do the port.
Wow! For today, you are my hero.
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There's a great media system for the Xbox, but other than that I can't think of a single other even modestly popular application to come out of console hacking.
That depends, do you consider emulators an application? My Wii is homebrewed and I have to say it's MUCH more fun playing retro games on my Wii than on my PC. And XBMC is not the only great program of this sort. I use WiiMC all the time. There's also some cool MOD players, Shoutcast players, etc.
I'd like to put this thought out there: the whole idea of running a desktop OS on a game console has very little traction and even less ROI.
I'd agree that desktop OS's are not well suited to consoles. Consoles are entertainment systems so they're well suited to entertainment apps. However, having said that, I would not be at all opposed to having AROS on a PS3 so that I could run AMC. I'd probably also use OWB on AROS as well (yes, the PS3 browser really is worse than Amiga web browsers). I doubt I'd ever want to do wordprocessing or spreadsheets on the PS3 but, theoretically, the AROS user interface could be modified to work well with a PS3 controller on a HDTV.
It would actually be very nice to boot a PS3 into AROS with a simplied interface that displayed the weather, showed RSS and twitter feeds, showed when I had new email, etc. And where I could easily stream music/video, play slideshows, run emulators to play retro games, and do some basic webbrowsing, and perhaps play some AROS games. Why does AROS need to remain a "destop" OS? In fact, maybe a unified goal of trying to design the best "console" OS could help encourage more development in AROS.
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Wow! For today, you are my hero.
It appears that there is some problem in the ftp server of suse,and it halts when it downloads some files....damn will have to retry later...
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I would imagine for the cost of a PS3 you could buy a smilar powered computer.
Agreed XBMC being the only exception leave consoles to being consoles.
But you will probaly find some solace in lou_dias
And what solace is that supposed to be?
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Sdk installed succesfuly.I tested to make the applications included and they seem to compile ok generating the needed elf files,i also downloaded the utilities geohot used and others to make pkg files,so the next step is that i am downloading the aros source for ppc from http://aros.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/nightly-download?20110120/Binaries/AROS-20110120-linux-ppc-system.tar.bz2 once it is downloaded i will try to make a configure for a ps3 output and see what it does.
Will notify all.Let's pray this works.
EDIT: I am not trying to be a smart guy or something,i just need all the help i can get for this.I know it may sound strange to want to port aros to ps3,but if someone can help practically and offer some advice i would be glad to have it.I dont want to make you have other opinions regarding the state of ps3 if it a good console computer or something.I believe as a hobby idea it would be cool and fun to watch sony's machine to run aros :)
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As a hobby project it's well worth a try.
If you're having fun, who cares if its "worth while" to other people.
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As a hobby project it's well worth a try.
If you're having fun, who cares if its "worth while" to other people.
Thanks.Now i really need the original source code of aros,most of those ppc versions require linux,i want to do something different,i want to port it and make an executable for xmb game os,so i think i need the original sources of aros without any linux on them.
so are those the files
http://aros.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/nightly-download?20110120/Sources/AROS-20110120-source.tar.bz2 ?
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Sdk installed succesfuly.I tested to make the applications included and they seem to compile ok generating the needed elf files,i also downloaded the utilities geohot used and others to make pkg files,so the next step is that i am downloading the aros source for ppc from http://aros.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/nightly-download?20110120/Binaries/AROS-20110120-linux-ppc-system.tar.bz2 once it is downloaded i will try to make a configure for a ps3 output and see what it does.
Will notify all.Let's pray this works.
EDIT: I am not trying to be a smart guy or something,i just need all the help i can get for this.I know it may sound strange to want to port aros to ps3,but if someone can help practically and offer some advice i would be glad to have it.I dont want to make you have other opinions regarding the state of ps3 if it a good console computer or something.I believe as a hobby idea it would be cool and fun to watch sony's machine to run aros :)
This board is infamous for having 50 tools telling you not to bother and insulting you and your 5 next of kin for trying. Be prepared...
One time there was this guy named Dennis who said he could make an Amiga clone using an fpga. You should have seen how many people ended up with pie in their face. Look up "Minimig" for reference. ;-)
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Thanks.Now i really need the original source code of aros,most of those ppc versions require linux,i want to do something different,i want to port it and make an executable for xmb game os,so i think i need the original sources of aros without any linux on them.
so are those the files
http://aros.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/nightly-download?20110120/Sources/AROS-20110120-source.tar.bz2 ?
yes those are the nightly sources. tho you would be best signing up for the dev-ml and asking questions there.
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yes those are the nightly sources. tho you would be best signing up for the dev-ml and asking questions there.
Thanks for that will check it out later.It appears the sdk is installed ok,i can output any program i want and i get an elf file for ps3,i also now have the geohot utilities for making pkg files.Now i need help to setup a different configure file that would understand the ps3 sdk parameters,now this is where i need help.
I went to the people of ps1ght sdk joined irc and asked them questions,let's hope we get some answers,i will probably go to the dev-ml like you said.
If you know anyone who can help me in this please send me a message and tell me who to talk to.
Kind regards.
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Thanks for that will check it out later.It appears the sdk is installed ok,i can output any program i want and i get an elf file for ps3,i also now have the geohot utilities for making pkg files.Now i need help to setup a different configure file that would understand the ps3 sdk parameters,now this is where i need help.
I went to the people of ps1ght sdk joined irc and asked them questions,let's hope we get some answers,i will probably go to the dev-ml like you said.
If you know anyone who can help me in this please send me a message and tell me who to talk to.
Kind regards.
You've already gone in way over my head on this.
Btw - I'd like to second the sentiment that stated you shouldn't the negative comments too seriously. Good luck.
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This board is infamous for having 50 tools telling you not to bother and insulting you and your 5 next of kin for trying. Be prepared...
One time there was this guy named Dennis who said he could make an Amiga clone using an fpga. You should have seen how many people ended up with pie in their face. Look up "Minimig" for reference. ;-)
Thanks for the kind words,i will try to see what i can come up with.I now managed to build my first pkg file.So i got familiar with how to make pkg signed for geohot 3.55 firmware or unsigned for the new hacked firmwares.
Now let's hope the developers of the sdk provide some help.
:)
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http://aros.sourceforge.net/documentation/developers/porting.php#creating-a-makefile-by-hand i have been reading this and i am trying to make a new makefile by hand right now.
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Btw - I'd like to second the sentiment that stated you shouldn't the negative comments too seriously. Good luck.
3rded too. Indeed, if we all lived by sensibilities, we wouldn't have OS4.1, 4.0, AmigaOnes, Sams, etc. at all. If you're interested, go for it!
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3rded too. Indeed, if we all lived by sensibilities, we wouldn't have OS4.1, 4.0, AmigaOnes, Sams, etc. at all. If you're interested, go for it!
Or MorphOS, AROS, or FPGA projects and all legacy hardware users would be running Window. Yes, its definitely time to stop making sense.
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As someone who just purchased his first standalone Blu-Ray player for watching movies at home, I might consider the purchase of a PS3 for use in another room of the house, if it could run AmigaOS4.x, or MorphOS2.x, plus Linux, at a decent speed. The PS3 would be a better choice to run AmigaOS4.x on than a SAM440/460 price wise, plus it would have the advantage of being able to run current games on & watch Blu-Ray movies, which almost all future movie purchases will be on, or combined DVD/Blu-Ray/Digital Copy.
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http://aros.sourceforge.net/documentation/developers/porting.php#creating-a-makefile-by-hand i have been reading this and i am trying to make a new makefile by hand right now.
I doubt this will work for compiling AROS itself; it is only for programs to be run under AROS.
greets,
Staf.
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Fats i know,i downloaded aros source code from http://aros.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/nightly-download?20110121/Sources/AROS-20110121-source.tar.bz2 and i am trying to make a new configure file.I am just trying to find the options in the configs
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Good luck, nicodr! Although I don't have a PS3 myself, I think it's a wonderful idea to try and get Aros running on them. I know a few people who have PS3s who might like to run an operating system on it, and I think something like Broadway would work well on a games console.
Keep up the noble work, the Amiga community needs more people like you!
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Now that the keys have been made public it is piracy that will explode onto the PS3 scene not homebrew sadly.
Having said that the PS3 is a closed quantified architecture (required) powerful (nice to have) and cheaply available and millions installed in homes (essential). Also the PS3 should be available for at least another 8 years to buy.
I think it's worth porting AROS to PS3. It does tick all the right boxes for a closed platform, just add keyboard and mouse.
I wish you good luck my friend. If someone ports something like Blitz Basic to AROS I will even write games for it too :)
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Good luck, nicodr! Although I don't have a PS3 myself, I think it's a wonderful idea to try and get Aros running on them. I know a few people who have PS3s who might like to run an operating system on it, and I think something like Broadway would work well on a games console.
Keep up the noble work, the Amiga community needs more people like you!
Cammy thank you for your kind words.Truth is it doesn't seem easy and from the few messages i read on the aros mail list it seems a bit difficult ,but we should try.It may not be easy but with the homebrew explode on ps3 we should do some ports.
The problem now is the bootloader pkg,we need an application that can initialize the gfx hardware,sound,keyboard usb,blue ray,to make it possible to use aros.I am looking into how the petit boot manager was used to initialize linux on ps3.
There are some include files that make calls to rsx but not a complete gfx driver in the sense that we can talk to the gfx card like we do on other systems.
Good thing is that i managed to install aros under ubuntu and play with the configuration,i am also checking the configuration files that come with the sdk of ps3 to see how to create a new application.
I will play with the linux hosted version for a while and see what i can learn,then slowly i will try to target the ps3 os,we are lucky because people in the homebrew scene have been very active these days,and day by day there is always something new on the ps3 jailbreak scene.I hope sooner or later i will have to mofify the arch directory of aros and insert what is needed for the ps3.
I believe this year will be the year of revolution for ps3 and aros :)
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Now that the keys have been made public it is piracy that will explode onto the PS3 scene not homebrew sadly.
Having said that the PS3 is a closed quantified architecture (required) powerful (nice to have) and cheaply available and millions installed in homes (essential). Also the PS3 should be available for at least another 8 years to buy.
I think it's worth porting AROS to PS3. It does tick all the right boxes for a closed platform, just add keyboard and mouse.
I wish you good luck my friend. If someone ports something like Blitz Basic to AROS I will even write games for it too :)
Thank you for your kind words Digiman.Like i posted earlier to cammy it is not an easy road to do the port.But i believe soon there will be very easy.The people on the homebrew scene are very active and are releasing stuff all the time.Now that the hypervisor is not restricting access to the rsx and 3d acceleration is possible i hope that the programers behind the homebrew will post documentation how to properly initialize the gfx on ps3.There was a port of sdl by someone,there are various demos ( i saw one that uses cairo library),we are at the start.I will keep bothering those people that made that sdk for more info,and i will post at the aros mail list for help.
I really hope we can do something once the problem of gfx drivers and etc is solved.
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http://www.volny.cz/molej/ps3/index.htm
This is a port of uae for ps3 running under gameos,it has source files too.I will check them,maybe the right time has come for aros port,if i can see the way the emulated enviroment utilizes the chipset and gfx and ram and usb i can hopefully be able to start the port :)
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Great news on both counts.
Silly question but can I just put that binary ZIP file's contents on a USB stick/DVD-R and play Amiga games on my stock non-hacked PS3?
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I don't really see the point, but it can't do any arm.
The problem with the PS3 is that sooner or later, you won't be able to buy one with hackable firmware, so the AROS port will be limited to used hardware of questionable quality. Modern game consoles aren't particularly reliable.