Amiga.org
Amiga computer related discussion => Amiga Gaming => Topic started by: Oldsmobile_Mike on March 29, 2017, 05:37:26 AM
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As much as I love it, one thing that's always driven me nuts about Aminet uploads is how little information people put in the readme's. ;)
http://aminet.net/package/game/strat/Wesnoth.m68k
Sounds cool, but before I waste my time to download it, does this game require a Vampire? (says "Requires 68080", LOL)
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It says it's turn based, so I doubt it needs much speed. I also doubt anyone is coding specifically for the Vampire. Give it a try.
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Doesn't look like a game 030 or even 060 could run at a decent speed.
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Lol
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A fellow from the Turkish Amiga community uploaded a video about this game.
You can check on youtube: http://youtu.be/-hPf2VqzoDA
The game is dead slow on Blizzard PPC 603e/060. I think the graphics (color depth etc.) are not optimized.
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Expect more of this, it is part of the grand master plan ;)
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Holy crap its even to slow on my 75Mhz 060 and 410Mhz PPC!!
If devs are building games and apps that seriously require hardware that is very hard to get and nonstandard it will be ugly on aminet. I think a specific section needs to be added to aminet with big bold statements about it. I did see this link in the comments for an FPU version, havent tried it. http://netsurf.baderman.net/wesnoth.fpu
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Plays great in FS-UAE on my plain macbook though, hehe :)
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Holy crap its even to slow on my 75Mhz 060 and 410Mhz PPC!!
If devs are building games and apps that seriously require hardware that is very hard to get and nonstandard it will be ugly on aminet. I think a specific section needs to be added to aminet with big bold statements about it. I did see this link in the comments for an FPU version, havent tried it. http://netsurf.baderman.net/wesnoth.fpu
Did you try running it under Trance or Petunia or just natively on the 060?
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I don't understand why this game ends up being slow though, nothing advanced about it at all.
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I don't understand why this game ends up being slow though, nothing advanced about it at all.
I'm assuming the person who compiled it didn't use Novacoder's decent SDL libs.
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Plays great in FS-UAE on my plain macbook though, hehe :)
How about scenarios with large battlefields and many enemies. I played the OS4 ports for quite some time and found that once you get to those types of scenarios the AI really bogged down my XE/G4. I started using it on Windows, first on an Althon at 1.8 and then an Intel Core2 1.8 setup. It wasn't really much better with seriously long waits between turns, I think it usually worked that I'd play my turn, switch to the A1 and do something else and check back every 5 minutes or so to see if the computer turn ended.
It's definitely been at least 6 or 7 years since I played so perhaps the main branch and any subsequent ports have become much more efficient. If not I think a 68k version will need carefully selected or specially made campaigns that don't expect too much in the way of CPU time.
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Did you try running it under Trance or Petunia or just natively on the 060?
Not sure what this is?
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Not sure what this is?
Trance would be MorphOS and Petunia would be OS4 :)
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As much as I love it, one thing that's always driven me nuts about Aminet uploads is how little information people put in the readme's. ;)
http://aminet.net/package/game/strat/Wesnoth.m68k
Sounds cool, but before I waste my time to download it, does this game require a Vampire? (says "Requires 68080", LOL)
Never mind, you can play it under Linux OS.
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Never mind, you can play it under Linux OS.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3b/Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg/300px-Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg)
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I don't know single SDL app wich is any where near to be enjoyable with real amigas.
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I don't understand why this game ends up being slow though, nothing advanced about it at all.
Because the original developer didn't design it to run fast on ghetto cpu's. There may be simple things you can do to make it quicker, or it might require massive compromises.
You're just used to developers making massive compromises for speed.
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Trance would be MorphOS and Petunia would be OS4 :)
Oh, Duh..... No I dont have any OS4 machines worth using. 4.1FE on my A4000 isnt very fast and I only have 3.9 on it now. My G5 is only used for MorphOS things.
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I don't know single SDL app wich is any where near to be enjoyable with real amigas.
Well I'll argue using a Vampire Accelerator is using a real Amiga and no different than someone shoving a 68030 Accelerator into it. It may be a FPGA, but it's really running a hardware true implementation of a 68000 processor, just has added features.
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It does sound like NovaCoder is intrested in Vampire Standalone version.
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As much as I love it, one thing that's always driven me nuts about Aminet uploads is how little information people put in the readme's. ;)
http://aminet.net/package/game/strat/Wesnoth.m68k
Sounds cool, but before I waste my time to download it, does this game require a Vampire? (says "Requires 68080", LOL)
That or a bigger graphics card than most classic Amigas has ever had plugged into their card slots and a rewritten SDL 1.2 conversion that takes advantage of the full graphics acceleration.
It runs just fine on a RasPi 2 if you want to run it cheaper and on a newer version of the code too.
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It is sad but we are witnessing the begining of just another Amiga community split heavily promoted, most notably by the apollo core team.
The FPGA branch.
It will just make sense now to aproach Aminet moderators to suggest that any 68k program that performs poorly on even a fast 68060 to be set that way.
And dont let me start on the incompatible instruction set that apollo supports that will certainly widen this breach further than it has, creating a niche in its own FPGA segment.
Divided we stand :(
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Divided we stand :(
That's how it goes when different people like different things.
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It is sad but we are witnessing the begining of just another Amiga community split heavily promoted, most notably by the apollo core team.
The FPGA branch.
It will just make sense now to aproach Aminet moderators to suggest that any 68k program that performs poorly on even a fast 68060 to be set that way.
And dont let me start on the incompatible instruction set that apollo supports that will certainly widen this breach further than it has, creating a niche in its own FPGA segment.
Divided we stand :(
Thats just stupid.... you can see the apollo core just as 68080 as they named it... sw author can state the minimum requirement in the readme so the user can decide to download or not...Performing poorly like you stated is relative.
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Thats just stupid.... you can see the apollo core just as 68080 as they named it... sw author can state the minimum requirement in the readme so the user can decide to download or not...Performing poorly like you stated is relative.
It is not stupid, it is a reality wether you like it or not, it is actually happening. It is not just a 68k cpu, it has its own instruction set, which is totally incompatible with every 68k processor.
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More divided?
The Vampire enables a large chunk of users to have similar hardware configs, as compared to the past, when you had to look high and low to get a 060 accelerator. Want a graphics card? Need to fork out alot of cash etc.
Now its all contained in small board, at a relativly pleasant price. The people purchasing them are relativly active, many that hasnt really touched their Classic machines for decades.
The A1200 I got has collected dust for ...15 years in the basement. Now its installed in my homeoffice, alongside the newly purchased A600.
I like to think the Vampire has revived a section of the Amiga population that was completely dormant. How you manage to view that as a negative is beyond me.
I see the point of the extra instruction set posing a challenge, but at the moment the only advantage we have is good performance running old classic programs. There are very few Vampire spesific programs.
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It is not stupid, it is a reality wether you like it or not, it is actually happening. It is not just a 68k cpu, it has its own instruction set, which is totally incompatible with every 68k processor.
Thats true, there are some additional instructions but same goes for the whole 68k family range. Again, if the coder decides to use specific Apollo core instructions he can make a note about it. I dont see a difference if some sw requires 060 or Apollo core aka 080. By your logic all sw should be written for 68000.
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More divided?
Maybe. People like me certainly don't want a Vampire. I don't see these as 68080 CPUs and a graphics card. I see them as FPGA computers, and I have no interest in those. I'm not alone in this.
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Maybe. People like me certainly don't want a Vampire. I don't see these as 68080 CPUs and a graphics card. I see them as FPGA computers, and I have no interest in those. I'm not alone in this.
Does the label of the hardware matter if it retains the function? I remember plenty of software I had on A500 that refused to work on my A1200, so new functionality isnt something new to the Amiga.
Alot of the demos doesnt even work on my 1200/30 with a mere 16 megs. Often they required 32 megs, or even intended for 060.
But each to their own.
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Does the label of the hardware matter if it retains the function?
What matters is what something is in relation to what you're interested in. Some people like the way old cars look, and some like the way they work.
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Maybe. People like me certainly don't want a Vampire. I don't see these as 68080 CPUs and a graphics card. I see them as FPGA computers, and I have no interest in those. I'm not alone in this.
well it's still a damn cool piece of Amiga kit and I finally got around to order mine:hammer: FPGA computer running my favourite OS & with great Amiga people behind it making it constanstly better (cough FPU) is welcome in my mancave :pint:
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well it's still a damn cool piece of Amiga kit and I finally got around to order mine:hammer: FPGA computer running my favourite OS & with great Amiga people behind it making it constanstly better (cough FPU) is welcome in my mancave :pint:
Good for you, and enjoy :)
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Although I am fully aware, that I do not have a 68080 processor in my Amiga1200 with 68030 accelerator board, I gave it a try.
After telling the script where "wesnoth.bin" is, the program did load but then stopped with the following message:
"terminate called after throwing an instance of 'std::logic_error'
what (): basic_string::_S_construct NULL not valid
Abnormal program termination"
I guess my poor AGA graphic is the reason?
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Yep, it uses sdl, which is RTG only.
Novacoder did a very basic AGA version of sdl, but its not enough for most software.
Additionally, I think the binary uses a shared library rather than static, making SDL AGA a non-option anyway.
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It is sad but we are witnessing the begining of just another Amiga community split heavily promoted, most notably by the apollo core team.
The FPGA branch.
Hey, don't mix the other FPGA systems into this mess, they are innocent!
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Speaking of splitting is rude to hear here, which sounds easy attack. This Wesnoth works on UAE, the code was thought to run on both UAE and Vampire (and use 080 only if detected). Only, i agree, the "Requires" field on Aminet is wrongly described and the readme is vague.
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Speaking of splitting is rude to hear here, which sounds easy attack. This Wesnoth works on UAE, the code was thought to run on both UAE and Vampire (and use 080 only if detected). Only, i agree, the "Requires" field on Aminet is wrongly described and the readme is vague.
Splitting is rude? How can that be? It is not an attack rather a reality.
And for the rest blame the author of that readme.
BTW, Aminet, if you havent noticed, has that split feature already implemented, and it serves that purpose fairly well. For example, just on PPC you have all these branches: OS4, MOS, PUP, and WOS. So it is nothing to make a fuss about, it is only a system made so that users can be sure that what they are getting works on their system.
@kolla
hehehe you are right :D
It should have another name.
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Well so we agree, the readme is incorrect, and about splitting i still wonder how it splits if game works on both and so any fast amiga capable, or do i understand it wrong, and we speak of fast capable amiga split, or do we speaks only for vampire ? Maybe one owner of fast a4000 / 060 / mediator / voodoo can try it and report feedback.
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Well so we agree, the readme is incorrect, and about splitting i still wonder how it splits if game works on both and so any fast amiga capable, or do i understand it wrong, and we speak of fast capable amiga split, or do we speaks only for vampire ? Maybe one owner of fast a4000 / 060 / mediator / voodoo can try it and report feedback.
http://www.amiga.org/forums/showpost.php?p=823960&postcount=7
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Ah ohh, missed that, PPC 410MHz, lol.
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well, ammx and other apollo core extensions, represent some form of split, if they are being used. im not so certain if i should be hapy about it and i share the consideration, if such software should be published under (plain) 68k label on aminet.
that said, im highly supportive of vampire/apollo in most, if not all, other aspects and happy about their progress even if i dont plan on getting one of their products to date.
it may be best trade off between compatibility and advancement, there is at disposal.
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@wawrzon
Yes some sort of yes, but Not if operated at lowlevel, for example optimized graphic driver or their SDL AMMX, or any API. Then it becomes totally transparent for the coder (with some rules).
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hehehe you are right :D
It should have another name.
It does - Apollo Core :)