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Operating System Specific Discussions => Other Operating Systems => Topic started by: save2600 on October 07, 2009, 06:14:19 PM

Title: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: save2600 on October 07, 2009, 06:14:19 PM
After spending 10 minutes searching the net (UGH!) not a single JiffyDOS resource explains what location to install the damn chip! And of course, it didn't come with instructions.

I have I.C.'s located at U3, U4 and U5. I don't really feel like playing multiple choice here! lol
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: beller on October 07, 2009, 06:22:46 PM
Perhaps Jim Brain's JiffyDos site can help.  I found a whole list of user manuals at:

http://www.jbrain.com/?s=install
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: tone007 on October 07, 2009, 06:24:44 PM
Kernel ROM, U4.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: save2600 on October 07, 2009, 06:28:21 PM
Thanks both! Didn't think Jim would have that - and his site is a pain to navigate (IMO). U4 was all I needed to know  :-)

Cheers Tone007!  I'll be sure to write how fast or not this thing is. I'm sure its old hat to you guys, but it's brand new to me. Haven't an 8-bit Commie since the 80's, nearly shat myself at how slow stuff loads into it! I thought there was something wrong with all my systems... lol
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: redrumloa on October 07, 2009, 06:31:25 PM
Get a manual, pronto! Either buy one or print one from the web. If you are going to use real floppy drives, you will need roms for them too.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: beller on October 07, 2009, 06:36:31 PM
I couldn't believe how long things took to load either when I went back to the 64.  Now I look at it as part of the "retro experience."  Ha!

Seriously,  I've gotten used to the load time, though a set of Jiffy's would be nice.  I've got a couple of Epyx Fast Load carts for those days I'm feeling the need for a booster.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: Damion on October 07, 2009, 06:37:17 PM
Standard loading times were painfully slow, even worse if you were unlucky enough to be stuck with a tape drive. Amazing how much difference JiffyDOS (or even a simple Fastload cartridge) makes.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: tone007 on October 07, 2009, 06:39:52 PM
Quote from: save2600;525002
Didn't think Jim would have that


Jim is actually authorized to distribute JiffyDOS now, whereas most other "distributors" are pirating it.

JiffyDOS is definitely nice to have with one of Jim's uIEC devices.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: save2600 on October 07, 2009, 07:13:45 PM
Quote from: tone007;525008
Jim is actually authorized to distribute JiffyDOS now, whereas most other "distributors" are pirating it.

JiffyDOS is definitely nice to have with one of Jim's uIEC devices.

Shoot, the one I just bought was from Basicwayne on ePay - out of MI. Hopefully he's legit. Looked like a professional enough kit. $25 shipped or thereabouts.

So, ummm, yeah.... just got through installing her and the switch. WOW! I'm floored. This little upgrade has got to be one of the more important mods you can do for the C64. Simply incredible. I'm aware of the function key calls - haven't used them yet, but damn does this thing load FAST now. I'm super happy with it.

And lastly, gotta tell you... since deciding to get back into the older systems, a year ago with the Atari 8-bit... nearly game for game; the graphics, sounds, text and overall "feel" of the Commodore experience BLOWS away the A8. There's a huge argument over on Atariage where some hardcore Atari people are getting into the nuts and bolts of the hardware - what it's capable of, etc. Totally missing the point. It doesn't matter what something (or somebody for that matter) is capable of - if it was never implemented, it doesn't mean a hill of beans! Every single arcade conversion I've seen/played yet between the two, the C64 wins hands down.

Bottom line: I can't believe it took me this long to get back into the C64. SID is even more awesome than I remember. Most A8 games look like Atari 2600 games compared to the C64. Single coloured sprites, thick, chunky/blocky graphics and unlike the 2600, the A8 has drab colours. Blech.

Anyone wanna buy a mint Atari XEGS after that fine endorsement? lol  I still like my A8's and (think) I will be keeping one, but...  lol
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: beller on October 07, 2009, 07:17:32 PM
I adore my 64s!

I've got a 64C with a 1571,1541-II and a 1581 connected to my 1084s.  I've also got a couple of SXs and some older 64s.  One of these days I need to get the 128 set up again!

So many computers, so little time!

Bob
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: Darrin on October 07, 2009, 07:21:56 PM
Don't forget to pick up a C64 video to S-Video cable (if you haven't already).  I can't believe how good my C128 looks on a 42" screen using the S-Video in.  :D
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: tone007 on October 07, 2009, 07:25:57 PM
Quote from: save2600;525015
Basicwayne on ePay - out of MI.


He's the biggest offender at the moment, just about everything he sells is copied/counterfeit.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: save2600 on October 07, 2009, 07:34:16 PM
Quote from: Darrin;525018
Don't forget to pick up a C64 video to S-Video cable (if you haven't already).  I can't believe how good my C128 looks on a 42" screen using the S-Video in.  :D

Yeah, I should. And I've got a real nice 1702 with that input also. I have noticed something kinda strange about the video though on my breadbox C64. Half the time you turn it on, you can see faint vertical bars - very light striping of sorts. Other half, the picture is solid blue. What gives? During games though, the faint striping seems to go away. Plenty of heat sink compound on that chip and I've left the shielding in there. And oh, I am using the a/v out with the 1702 currently.

Another quick question: what's going on inside that chip that allows the port to act so much quicker? Ditching some verification routines or something else?  

And Tone007, shoot - was afraid of that. Just my luck  :-(
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: recidivist on October 07, 2009, 09:14:16 PM
JiffyDos speeds up most disk access by 10 to 15 times by using  a replacement block of code and using all the wires in the cable.
 The story is the C64 and 1541 chips were always capable of fast operation but were slowed down because the little round DIN cable was cheap and widely available whereas the original CBM computers used a cable made only by one manufacturer who couldn't supply enough cables ,and his cables were high priced.

 If you buy nothing else for  a C64 or C128 get JiffyDos.
It is like getting a new machine.
 If you are wealthy or lucky ,get a SuperCPU and REALLY see how a C= program can fly.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: amiga92570 on October 07, 2009, 09:19:27 PM
Jiffydos is very quick, but if you are trying to archive or copy disks use opencbm or simular on a pc. That is fast. You do need a xm cable and a parallel port though.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: omnicron10 on October 07, 2009, 10:04:05 PM
Everyone knows about the Indivision from Individual Computers...

Well they are also working on Turbo Chameleon for the c64.

http://www.syntiac.com/chameleon.html

Basically it appears to be the ultimate upgrade for the c64 and I plan on getting one when it comes available.  

I have been testing the cores they have been providing to the C-one users and they are working very well.  On C-one I can switch to PAL mode as well.  Nice to have a PAL c64 in NTSC land!  A lot of cool stuff runs only on PAL c64 systems.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: T3000 on October 07, 2009, 10:10:37 PM
A shot of my JiffyDOS enabled C=64 system, RAMlink .5mb ram, a 1541, 1541II, 1581 disk drives. Use to have it running GEOS just before I found Amiga.

(http://rcfreas.com/files/C64.jpg)

Never mind the clutter in the background. ;)
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: mr_a500 on October 07, 2009, 10:24:39 PM
Quote from: save2600;525015
And lastly, gotta tell you... since deciding to get back into the older systems, a year ago with the Atari 8-bit... nearly game for game; the graphics, sounds, text and overall "feel" of the Commodore experience BLOWS away the A8. There's a huge argument over on Atariage where some hardcore Atari people are getting into the nuts and bolts of the hardware - what it's capable of, etc. Totally missing the point. It doesn't matter what something (or somebody for that matter) is capable of - if it was never implemented, it doesn't mean a hill of beans! Every single arcade conversion I've seen/played yet between the two, the C64 wins hands down.

Really? I discovered the exact opposite. Nearly every single game I used to like back then looks and sounds better on the Atari. I think there are only 2 or 3 C64 games that are worse or unavailable on Atari.

I think this is because most of the 8-bit games I liked were made in 82-84. Most of the popular C64 games were made after 1985 and by that time I was losing interest in 8-bit. After that, I moved to Amiga - which gave me that old Atari feeling of amazement that the C64 never did.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: tone007 on October 08, 2009, 02:24:28 AM
Quote from: mr_a500;525046
I think this is because most of the 8-bit games I liked were made in 82-84.


Sounds like a good reason, probably no one even knew how to use the SID for anything really great at that point.  Even Apple II games could compete before '84 (well, maybe not.)  Once the developers learned some tricks, the C64 just seemed to have higher limits than other 8 bit systems.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: marcfrick2112 on October 08, 2009, 06:39:26 AM
Quote from: tone007;525068
Sounds like a good reason, probably no one even knew how to use the SID for anything really great at that point.  Even Apple II games could compete before '84 (well, maybe not.)  Once the developers learned some tricks, the C64 just seemed to have higher limits than other 8 bit systems.

Well said Tone007....  
It's sometimes hard to compare older systems.... apples to oranges, and all that.... But after a system has been out for a while, developers/users can really push a system beyond what one might think was even remotely possible. I used to always read about things that 'couldn't be done' on a 64.... More than 8 sprites, loading from disk while music played, meh! I even messed with a ML program from Compute!, AFAIR, that let the C-64 'bi-task' (running 2 programs at once, but only 2...) Pretty impressive for the 'lowly' 64.

Just curious, tho, how does JiffyDOS compare to say, Super Snapshot cart. as far as speed, and most of all, compatabilty w/ protected software?


Save2600... First you get a 64, now JiffyDOS...  you never write or call anymore... You don't like me....

:laughing:
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: save2600 on October 08, 2009, 09:49:34 AM
Quote from: mr_a500;525046
Really? I discovered the exact opposite. Nearly every single game I used to like back then looks and sounds better on the Atari. I think there are only 2 or 3 C64 games that are worse or unavailable on Atari.

I think this is because most of the 8-bit games I liked were made in 82-84. Most of the popular C64 games were made after 1985 and by that time I was losing interest in 8-bit. After that, I moved to Amiga - which gave me that old Atari feeling of amazement that the C64 never did.

R U fricking kidding me? Do you require screen shots and/or glasses?

I don't mean to be a smart ass, but you'd have to be blind not to recognise and see the difference between the two.

Name one arcade translation (graphics and sound) that's better on the A8 than the C64.

Really quick here and from what I've played, ALL of these are leagues ahead of the A8 conversions:

Tapper
Joust
Moon Patrol
Star League Baseball
Gorf
Wizard of Wor
Space Invaders
Donkey Kong - r u flacking kidding? a comparison?!? lol
Juno First
Gyruss
Popeye
Q*Bert - another obvious one
Robotron

...even Minters shite Defender/ESB clone (revenge of mutant camels) is better on C64.

What else do you want, screen shots of both side by side? lol  That can be arranged... lol

I'm talking mostly about the sprite graphics. How they're multi-coloured. Even the 2600 in most instances has multi-colour player/missiles. In arcade conversions, seems like lazy programming techniques on the A8. Either that or the machine just wasn't cut out for it.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: jj on October 08, 2009, 11:17:47 AM
I still dont get the fuss over the C64.  Will prob get blasted here but the Amstras CPC blew it out the water.  Play a game on the C64 and then see how it should look on the amstrad cpc.  Especailly something like operation wolf.
 
What always got me was people who thought the sinclair was bettter the graphics on that machine were terrible. And some lazy coders used to do straight port to the amstrad so the graphics looked as crap.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: tone007 on October 08, 2009, 01:06:58 PM
Amstrad never made it over here, as far as I can remember. The C64 being as widespread and long-lasting in the marketplace as it was really attracted alot of attention, and due to most being familiar with it in one way or the other (owned one, played one at a friend's,) really puts it up there for people looking to go back in time a bit.  Sure, the same games were released for alot of the old machines, but a particular rendition of a game would bring back memories for someone who'd played it 20 years ago, whereas another system's version of the same game would just look like crap because it was different.
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: jj on October 08, 2009, 01:13:57 PM
I admit the Amsrtrad was very much a UK and europe machine
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: mr_a500 on October 08, 2009, 02:52:38 PM
Quote from: save2600;525087
R U fricking kidding me? Do you require screen shots and/or glasses?

I think you're the one who needs glasses. I said "Nearly every single game I used to like"... "I" as in "me". I don't give a rat's ass what you used to like. (...or whether it was an arcade conversion)

Now let's compare the games "I used to like" (...again, "I" as in "me"):

Blue Max - Atari version totally blows away C64 version
Montezuma's Revenge - better colours, nice fade effect in smoke, better movement
Ballblazer - again, better colours, better movement
Rescue on Fractalus - way better music
Centipede (5200) - no contest

I also prefer Boulderdash (1) on the Atari, but both versions are pretty similar (Atari has ugly first level though). There are others, but I'm starting to get bored. I'm sure anyone reading this is also getting bored.

Quote
Really quick here and from what I've played, ALL of these are leagues ahead of the A8 conversions:

Tapper
Joust
Moon Patrol
Star League Baseball
Gorf
Wizard of Wor
Space Invaders
Donkey Kong - r u fucking kidding? a comparison?!? lol
Juno First
Gyruss
Popeye
Q*Bert - another obvious one, r u blind?
Robotron
Robotron? Are you crazy? The Atari version has way better sound (but gameplay is equally crap). I agree that Moon Patrol and Q*bert are better on C64. I hate all those other games, so I don't care which system they're best on.

The only C64 games I care about ...mainly for nostalgia reasons (which don't exist or suck on Atari):
Spy Hunter
Battle Through Time
Time Pilot (a.k.a. Space Pilot)
Impossible Mission

...and not a game, but totally awesome: Swinth/Synth Sample

Quote
I don't mean to be a smart ass
Well, you're doing a pretty good job anyway. ;)
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: pan1k on October 08, 2009, 04:57:42 PM
Q*Bert!
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: save2600 on October 08, 2009, 05:10:16 PM
Sorry to get all heated up on you last night mr_a500. Wasn't aware until now you don't care about most of the titles I mentioned. When doing comparisons, how convenient! lol  Okay, okay, it's all good. I toned down my original post and talked about the sprites or "player/missile" graphics. Like you mentioned, there was a difference timeline wise in software. Well, same with the hardware really - so makes sense one machine would be better at doing something than another. But I wasn't talking about the past, relative to feelings of nostalgia. I'm talking about looking at most conversions (arcade or otherwise) today - side by side, which I've done. But sure, there's always going to be the exception and you have already pointed many of them out. I'll have to give the games you listed a try on both! I do have Ballblazer on the 7800 - incredible gameplay, graphics and sounds there  :-)
Title: Re: JiffyDOS chip arrived <sigh> no instructions
Post by: save2600 on October 08, 2009, 06:08:02 PM
Quote from: T3000;525043
A shot of my JiffyDOS enabled C=64 system, RAMlink .5mb ram, a 1541, 1541II, 1581 disk drives. Use to have it running GEOS just before I found Amiga.


Now that's quite the system (and mess!) lol   I too had GEOS for a short stint in the 80's. Incredible and impressive "operating system" for the time. And yeah, like you - I got an Amiga soon after. But jeez... GEOS really kept the C64 in contention as a "serious" computer, but did many people use it? I could see where people could have been happy with it for a while, but having a taste of a GUI such as that, I wonder if most quickly ditched it for an Amiga or ST? I didn't mention Mac because seems unlikely the average C64 user would go that route. Those were just really interesting times for computing in general though.